Coventry City fans to discuss possibility of supporter-led takeover (2 Viewers)

[clint van damme]

What about the bit where the speaker said you can pretty much forget Championship when it was fan owned?
What about the bit where it was said somebody was a troll because they were unhappy about players being sold to break even at a fan owned club?
What about the bit where the supporters direct guy pretty much echo'd the things Fisher says about needing to be break even?
What about when the SD guy said that the trust need to distance themselves and be professional? (he didn't say they weren't now, but that was confirmed just after by the Trust anyway).
What about the bit where the Pompey guy (I think it was) said that things need to be taken on board from fans even if not agreed with?


Plenty of other bits.

You should get involved Nick, I agree with some of your criticisms, (I'm not a member of the trust), but one thing I took away from tonight is they need as many people as possible and a wide range of opinions need to be canvased.
The Pompey guy kept stressing the fan unity angle and it's one of the main things I took away from tonight. They had a large number off splinter groups when they started and it took a while to get them together.

 

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[I was eleven in 87]

Think Fisher knows who he is so would be straight out with it before it had started.

Oh cmon let's try and be positive and give him the chance to ask the question and not write it off before the question is asked. I know I'm getting ahead of myself here!!

 

[skybluetony176]

If you're prepared to chuck a grand in for a share I'm sure you'd buy a season ticket but doesn't that make the assumption that 7000 people would buy a share?

It's actually more than 7000 fans that own shares in Portsmouth. Not all are owned by individuals, some are owned by syndicates of fans as not all fans have a £1000 laying around to buy a share so some fans clubbed together to buy a share between them.

 

[Nick]

Oh cmon let's try and be positive and give him the chance to ask the question and not write it off before the question is asked. I know I'm getting ahead of myself here!!

To be fair you need to at least think like him or think about his move before he makes it surely and make sure you rule out any chance of him getting out of something?

 

[letsallsingtogether]

Moz was on the phone to Fisher on Saturday, yes he isn't "strictly" SISU but how much of it was discussed with him? Fisher has offered a fans forum that was rejected, take him up on it and at least put things learnt from supports direct to him?

Trust this Trust that Moz this Moz that Jan said this.
I can see where this thread is going also Nick.

 

[Monkeyface]

I haven't missed it, I have just watched it?

That's not the same as being there and contributing is it? Whether you like it or not you run this site so should use it responsibly... to just sit at home making click bate comments isn't in the best interests of the fans.

 

[skybluetony176]

David Johnson said it didn't he? Saying how it was a way to get the club if they weren't going to sell.

People said about a boycott and everybody on the stage is sat there nodding with it.

Dave Johnson talked about it in one sentence and it was in response to a question from the floor. It was also pointed out by the floor that there's no need to organise a boycott as SISU TF are doing a perfectly good job of organising it all by themselves and that is what the panel were nodding in agreement with.

No one is organising a boycott of season tickets. It's an organic response by fans to what is happening at the club. Why you're trying to spin it any other way is mind boggling.

 

[Nick]

Trust this Trust that Moz this Moz that Jan said this.
I can see where this thread is going also Nick.

Yeah, down the same route that if you don't like constructive feedback or criticism you pipe up and the same old lines will be reeled out rather than actually listening and discussing it.

 

[Nick]

That's not the same as being there and contributing is it? Whether you like it or not you run this site so should use it responsibly... to just sit at home making click bate comments isn't in the best interests of the fans.

What's a click bait comment?

I'd say I'm much more constructive than empty back pats and cheers because somebody says something about Tim Fisher.

 

[skybluetony176]

I'm not sure how you can be there and not pick up on a push to boycott.

Because there isn't one. Simple as. It was barely talked about in comparison to everything else that was said.

 

[Nick]

Dave Johnson talked about it in one sentence and it was in response to a question from the floor. It was also pointed out by the floor that there's no need to organise a boycott as SISU TF are doing a perfectly good job of organising it all by themselves and that is what the panel were nodding in agreement with.

No one is organising a boycott of season tickets. It's an organic response by fans to what is happening at the club. Why you're trying to spin it any other way is mind boggling.

Was it in response to the floor this morning also? Just a massive co-incidence I guess?

You do realise they don't have to actually say "EVERYBODY BOYCOTT" because that would be even more stupid. However, keep saying about administration because of a boycott and the chance to pick the club up is a massive hint isn't it, even suggesting that would be a bit naughty.

 

[Irish Sky Blue]

So what have I missed to do with being able to pick the club up in admin, then asking how many people are renewing season tickets and talking about boycotts?

Tell me why I am wrong to get that impression?

It's more relevant than listening to what pompey did, when it's a completely different situation to ours.

The supporters direct is saying you need to have a good relationship with the club, meanwhile trust members sit there firing digs.

Both the speakers have pretty much ruled out the championship under fan ownership, they have said how it needs to be break even. A guy got called a troll because he was moaning about players being sold and not understanding the club need to break even.

Just come back in from the meeting. The talk of boycotts came from people in the crowd, not from the guys on the stage. Should the meeting have been censored so that CCFC fans present couldn't give their views? Also the call to ask for a show of hands as to who were current season ticket holders ( about 75% of those there) and who would not be buying a season ticket next season, came from the floor not the Trust board. It was also mentioned that the Trust had tried on several occasions to engage with Sisu about the possibility of selling the club but all approaches had been angrily rebuffed through solicitors and through Fisher at the SCG. ( Requests were apparently made politely, again through a solicitor) and was not about the Trust buying the club but the general concept of selling the club.

 

[Nick]

Just come back in from the meeting. The talk of boycotts came from people in the crowd, not from the guys on the stage. Should the meeting have been censored so that CCFC fans present couldn't give their views? Also the call to ask for a show of hands as to who were current season ticket holders ( about 75% of those there) and who would not be buying a season ticket next season, came from the floor not the Trust board. It was also mentioned that the Trust had tried on several occasions to engage with Sisu about the possibility of selling the club but all approaches had been angrily rebuffed through solicitors and through Fisher at the SCG. ( Requests were apparently made politely, again through a solicitor) and was not about the Trust buying the club but the general concept of selling the club.

Who said anything about the crowd? I'm talking about the guy on the stage who has insinuated the same thing twice today?

Can people really not see how dangerous even insinuating that is when they would be the ones trying to by it on the cheap? The same as the trust on TV calling for administration last time.

I've also mentioned other points so I am not saying this was what the whole meeting was about, nobody has replied to those yet though

 

[cloughie]

Fan ownership is a great concept but I really struggle to see how we can do it with the unique position we are in. Hopefully the Trust have a workable plan they can share with us.

The Portsmouth fans played a big part in rescuing their club and fair play to them for that but it is vastly different to our situation.

They purchased out of administration and the FL openly stated they would only issue the golden share to a bid involving the trust despite other, higher, bids being made.

The administrator took the former owner to court and got the ground for £3m, the local council then loaned the club the money to buy it.

A local property developer (a Spurs fan so not even a supporter) put in a large amount in return for the club requesting the council remove a usage restriction on land belonging to the club adjacent to Fratton Park, they then sold that land to him and its now a Tesco.

At the point of the takeover they were also still due £9m in parachute payments.

Despite all that and the fans raising £2m they only briefly had majority ownership. Not long afterwards they had to dilute their 51% as more money was needed.

And as you say after that and having over 12K season ticket holders they still can't get out of L2.

Can anyone realistically see us getting 12K for a game, let alone in season tickets, for a third season in L2?


Thing that immediately jumps out to me is £1.2m hospitality income. Anyone who has been to Fratton Park will tell you how poor their facilities are and how unsuitable they are for generating non-matchday income. Really highlights one of the big issues we face.

So to sum up so far:
We need a willing seller;
Important for the Trust to maintain a good relationship with the owner / chairman;
Important to have a council supportive of the football club;
Club would need to run at break even;
Wouldn't be able to compete above L1 / L2 level as clubs spend too much money.

It all sounds very much like the same things Fisher says and gets blasted for.

The trust plan appears to be, and I hope I've got this very wrong, to drive the club into administration, pick it up for next to nothing with no debt and then suddenly there will be 20K in the ground the next week.

We've been down the road of trying to force a change through administration and it failed spectacularly and we know people will turn up for one offs but they don't turn up the next week.

 

[cloughie]

So to sum up so far:
We need a willing seller;
Important for the Trust to maintain a good relationship with the owner / chairman;
Important to have a council supportive of the football club;
Club would need to run at break even;
Wouldn't be able to compete above L1 / L2 level as clubs spend too much money.

It all sounds very much like the same things Fisher says and gets blasted for.

The trust plan appears to be, and I hope I've got this very wrong, to drive the club into administration, pick it up for next to nothing with no debt and then suddenly there will be 20K in the ground the next week.

We've been down the road of trying to force a change through administration and it failed spectacularly and we know people will turn up for one offs but they don't turn up the next week.

Seems you are deluded or couldn't hear properly but you was definitely not there

 

[Nick]

Seems you are deluded or couldn't hear properly but was definitely not there

Which bit is deluded?

 

[Nick]

One positive was CJ sorting the periscope etc :emoji_thumbsup:

 

[letsallsingtogether]

Just come back in from the meeting. The talk of boycotts came from people in the crowd, not from the guys on the stage. Should the meeting have been censored so that CCFC fans present couldn't give their views? Also the call to ask for a show of hands as to who were current season ticket holders ( about 75% of those there) and who would not be buying a season ticket next season, came from the floor not the Trust board. It was also mentioned that the Trust had tried on several occasions to engage with Sisu about the possibility of selling the club but all approaches had been angrily rebuffed through solicitors and through Fisher at the SCG. ( Requests were apparently made politely, again through a solicitor) and was not about the Trust buying the club but the general concept of selling the club.

Yes funny they all missed that when the Trust approched Sisu to talk they were rebuffed but are then criticised by people for not wanting to talk.

 

[Nick]

Yes funny they all missed that when the Trust approched Sisu to talk they were rebuffed but are then criticised by people for not wanting to talk.

We don't know what the approach was do we to be able to judge it? Isn't that old news from last year?

When you say criticized for not wanting to talk do you mean people mentioning the trust turning down fisher's offer of a fans forum and that when they talk on the phone but then keep saying "talk to us" in open letters and stuff? It's a valid point isn't it?

Did you miss the SD guy saying it should be professional from the trust and completely away from any sort of protests etc and then Moz get excited about "giving Seppalla a valentines present"?

Do people really not realise that just gives Fisher ammo to go off on a tangent? That's not me saying Moz can't have an opinion, of course he can. When somebody drafted in as an expert says to try to keep a good relationship (yes, I am not saying SISU do that. I am saying the Trust should "be the bigger man") you don't then sit there and start throwing silly digs about straight after that SISU and Fisher will just reel off as even more reason not to bother.

 

[Monkeyface]

What's a click bait comment?

I'd say I'm much more constructive than empty back pats and cheers because somebody says something about Tim Fisher.

You use this site in the same way the Telegraph use theirs, to get as many comments as possible. I disagree, your comments are nearly always to contrary to the general consensus, or at least they seem that way to me. And I think you do it just to increase traffic... just like you're doing now I guess!

But leaving that to one side, you still have a responcibilty to the fans and the club to report and interact effectively. Use this forum to get inside the Trust and reflect the alternative views.

 

[ccfcchris]

Stop taking the easy option Nick of sitting back and slagging people off. Do the hard thing and get involved and try and find solutions.

 

[letsallsingtogether]

Who said anything about the crowd? I'm talking about the guy on the stage who has insinuated the same thing twice today?

Can people really not see how dangerous even insinuating that is when they would be the ones trying to by it on the cheap? The same as the trust on TV calling for administration last time.

I've also mentioned other points so I am not saying this was what the whole meeting was about, nobody has replied to those yet though

Well if you are on about David then he is the chair of the protest group not on the Trust Board.

 

[Ian1779]

So any chance of a plan forthcoming?

 

[Irish Sky Blue]

Thing is though, you listen to Jan pushing it and he talks about the Championship and then the Premier League but then you listen to the speakers and they pretty much rule out the Championship, never mind the Premier League because of the money there. The scenarios they have explained pretty much say you are limited, so the only difference there is going to be is communication with the fans which can only go so far (although it would be very welcome). Players will still need to be sold to balance the books.

The big difference would be having people in charge of the club who have it's best interests at heart. Do you think the Pompey supporters would go back to the days when their club was run by faceless money men ? They now have the choice of the way forward and who they might allow to invest in their club in future.

 

[cloughie]

If the trust are listening to the people they had along to the meeting as experts then they need to greatly distance themselves from protests and boycott (anyone else notice Moz get JHW and SBT mixed up at the end, doesn't give a big impression of separation). Need to work on repairing the relationship with Fisher and Sepalla so that civil talks can be held, even if just an informal chat. And need to work out what could be a viable exit strategy for SISU that the Trust has a realistic chance of being able to achieve.

To the supporters they need to put forward a viable plan for running the club should fan ownership be obtaining. I'm not talking cashflow forecasts and every little detail, just a general overview of how the major obstacles will be overcome. We don't want to end up in a position where fans are chucking a grand in thinking we'll be in the PL in 3 or 4 years. It has to be made very clear how fan ownership will work and what is possible. And of course is it a stopping point to getting a new owner.

They plainly said they were not advocating boycotts and also said that they were working on plans ref viable fan ownership etc

are you thick or what, how can they present something they are working on , not finalised.
But then it was mentioned that there will always be the fans who knock every effort the trust do . the pompey guy had the same problem before they did it.

 

[Nick]

Stop taking the easy option Nick of sitting back and slagging people off. Do the hard thing and get involved and try and find solutions.

Where have I slagged anybody off or not been constructive with anything said?

I've spent plenty of time thinking of ideas, ones to help unite the fans and while I obviously don't expect people to always agree with me and do everything I say I kind of give up when they get flat out ignored. (mostly anyway).

 

[cloughie]

http://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/p04nw4hd

2 hours 11 in.

David Johnson going on about a boycott as a scenario as the fans buying the club because they can pick the club up via administration.

Pretty much the same thing as insinuated tonight.

no he never said have a boycott stop lying the fans are voting with there feet next season they don't need to be told by anyone other than their own mind /decision

 

[Broken Hearted Sky Blue]

You're being selective about what conversations you're covering and then you're quoting sound bites of the conversations you're interested in.

O

 

[Nick]

no he never said have a boycott stop lying the fans are voting with there feet next season they don't need to be told by anyone other than their own mind /decision

I didn't say he did say "have a boycott" did I? Stop lying.

 

[dongonzalos]

For me now I'd like to see something from the Trust to outline the major scenarios. Buying from SISU, buying from admin and liquidation. What is required for each and what as supporters we could expect to be the outcome.

There's no way the fans are buying off SISU without some serious investment from wealthy fans so we need to know if they exist and are prepared to basically gift their money or are we just waiting for SISU to put us into administration at some point down the line.

If the clubs not going into admin you have to give SISU an exit strategy. For example Ryton was said to be worth £8m for housing wasn't it. You could say to SISU give us the club and you keep Ryton. Ask the council for a loan to build training facilities to complement those at Warwick Uni, so we'd basically own the same as we do now but also have use of their facilities for the academy. Then pressure can be put on Wasps to give us a better deal as we are potentially fan owned.

Something like that and you might get SISU's interest.

I thought Ryton was worth 2 million and there is 8 million debenture on it?

 

[Irish Sky Blue]

I think also is to have 1 voice as a spokesperson. You have David Johnson saying 1 thing, Jan saying about the Premier League, statements on the website etc. It needs some PR and for things to go through others before statements are given out.

David Johnson of The Jimmy Hill Way, Jan from the Trust. Two different organisations. As the guy from Portsmouth said protest leading organisation needs to be separate from the Trust.

 

[cloughie]

That's not the same as being there and contributing is it? Whether you like it or not you run this site so should use it responsibly... to just sit at home making click bate comments isn't in the best interests of the fans.

probably scared to go, only because of embarrassment

 

[Nick]

David Johnson of The Jimmy Hill Way, Jan from the Trust. Two different organisations. As the guy from Portsmouth said protest leading organisation needs to be separate from the Trust.

I agree, it should be completely distanced which I have also mentioned.

 

[Nick]

probably scared to go, only because of embarrassment

Embarrassment of what?

 

[Broken Hearted Sky Blue]

I pressed the wrong thing here.
Anyway wasn't at the meeting also didn't listen to it. It's all bollocks anyway no more protests from me will go to hill Saturday for a bit of nostalgia then that's it. We are never going to get even part fan ownership of CCFC the will is not there anymore. The sooner that people realise this the better.