Ricoh or Butts ? (1 Viewer)

revenue from non match days

apprently it will be more than 72k we made last season

I'm not a business head, but I'm assuming the Ricoh rent is unsustainable somewhat?

sky blue john said:

Sorry am i missing something

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The answer to this is always yes

We need to see the business plan for both options. As yet we don't have one for either so it's currently an impossible question with no answer.

ajsccfc said:

The answer to this is always yes

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We are all missing something!

skybluetony176 said:

We need to see the business plan for both options. As yet we don't have one for either so it's currently an impossible question with no answer.

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Won't stop people though. Do a poll.

I'm softening a little from my stance of not going next season, so I'm missing sense and a number of brain cells still to be determined in the summer. It's like having a drug addiction except it's all comedown

trevelfarandwide said:

I'm not a business head, but I'm assuming the Ricoh rent is unsustainable somewhat?

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IMO its less to do with the rent, even if you assume we could get a new deal at the same rent, and more to do with the rapidly spiralling costs and poor treatment of the club and its fans.

Rent is only part of the cost of playing at the Ricoh. Also people need to stop falling into the trap of comparing the rent now to before we left. Its not comparing like with like.

hill83 said:

Won't stop people though. Do a poll.

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Mark me down as a definite NO please. Until I change my mind on a whim, at which point iI'll be a definite YES.

Esoterica said:

Mark me down as a definite NO please. Until I change my mind on a whim, at which point iI'll be a definite YES.

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Got a spare pen?

I've tried not reading into this saga as I'm getting bored of it now. From what I have seen are the Wasps struggling as it is?

Surely this is just another tactic by SISU to try and get hold of a percentage in the Ricoh ownership maybe?

Like I said I've not been reading much into it so I might be wrong...

It's just Sisu/TF playing politics using 'our' club as canon fodder.
He can't mention details as the carrot CRFC are following becomes a banana skin for them.

hill83 said:

Got a spare pen?

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I've no idea where my PEN IS..

The only thing on SISU agenda is recouping the money lost through JR2, hoping Wasps go bust and they can buy the Ricoh at a bargain.
Everything else is a smokescreen or bullshit. Call it what you will.
They will run CCFC at breakeven whatever happens.
NOPM will result in long term League 2 or worse. Increased revenues in next two years, might see us back in League 1

tom88 said:

I've tried not reading into this saga as I'm getting bored of it now. From what I have seen are the Wasps struggling as it is?

Surely this is just another tactic by SISU to try and get hold of a percentage in the Ricoh ownership maybe?

Like I said I've not been reading much into it so I might be wrong...

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CCFC will never get into anywhere while SISU are in charge be it the Ricoh or the Butts.
If I read it right that's what all parties are already saying.
Wasps are playing a waiting game 'probably' already negotiating with a third party/FL waiting to pick the moment.
Looking more like that moment will be liquidation or if we are lucky administration

chiefdave said:

IMO its less to do with the rent, even if you assume we could get a new deal at the same rent, and more to do with the rapidly spiralling costs and poor treatment of the club and its fans.

Rent is only part of the cost of playing at the Ricoh. Also people need to stop falling into the trap of comparing the rent now to before we left. Its not comparing like with like.

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Indeed, I overlooked that.

My U grade in GCSE Business Studies was well deserved.

hill83 said:

Won't stop people though. Do a poll.

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You took part in it :cigar:

italiahorse said:

Wasps are playing a waiting game 'probably' already negotiating with a third party/FL waiting to pick the moment.

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I hadn't even given that a thought but you might just be right.

chiefdave said:

IMO its less to do with the rent, even if you assume we could get a new deal at the same rent, and more to do with the rapidly spiralling costs and poor treatment of the club and its fans.

Rent is only part of the cost of playing at the Ricoh. Also people need to stop falling into the trap of comparing the rent now to before we left. Its not comparing like with like.

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It's about a bunch of different people all trying to do what's best for other organisations. In doing so they are making decisions that affect CCFC negatively.
Wasps doing what's best for Wasps
SISU doing what's best for SISU (not as some are misguided on her what's best for CCFC)
Council what's best for the whole City
Jon Sharpe what's best for CRFC.

What would be best for CCFC would be. For Tim FIsher and Joy Seppalla to completely step away from CCFC. Both not have anything to do with CCFC.
2 new people come in with complete control. One with ties to the City itself and football. One with good general business pedigree but also good football business pedigree.
SISU should drop the legal action.

Then leave these two people to build a mutually beneficial relationship with Wasps and ant the council in every single area. Stadium, marketing, metchandise, physios everything.

That would be what is best for CCFC. It won't happen unfortunately and we get to debate about new stadiums, developing The Butts. Non of which will happen whilst the club is slowly getting destroyed.

It really does need Tim and Joy to completely step away and the legal action to be dropped.

dongonzalos said:

It's about a bunch of different people all trying to do what's best for other organisations. In doing so they are making decisions that affect CCFC negatively.
Wasps doing what's best for Wasps
SISU doing what's best for SISU (not as some are misguided on her what's best for CCFC)
Council what's best for the whole City
Jon Sharpe what's best for CRFC.

What would be best for CCFC would be. For Tim FIsher and Joy Seppalla to completely step away from CCFC. Both not have anything to do with CCFC.
2 new people come in with complete control. One with ties to the City itself and football. One with good general business pedigree but also good football business pedigree.
SISU should drop the legal action.

Then leave these two people to build a mutually beneficial relationship with Wasps and ant the council in every single area. Stadium, marketing, metchandise, physios everything.

That would be what is best for CCFC. It won't happen unfortunately and we get to debate about new stadiums, developing The Butts. Non of which will happen whilst the club is slowly getting destroyed.

It really does need Tim and Joy to completely step away and the legal action to be dropped.

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I can understand Fisher stepping down but how can Seppalla ? She owns Sisu and CCFC.
No, until Sisu walk away nothing will change.

italiahorse said:

CCFC will never get into anywhere while SISU are in charge be it the Ricoh or the Butts.
If I read it right that's what all parties are already saying.
Wasps are playing a waiting game 'probably' already negotiating with a third party/FL waiting to pick the moment.
Looking more like that moment will be liquidation or if we are lucky administration

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Who exactly would Wasps be negotiating with, what sort of third party? as the evidence of this is nil apart from your opinion. So genuinely what exactly does that mean in your honest opinion? as I see a Rugby club whose business plan is falling short.

sky blue john said:

So the plan is to play the Ricoh off against the Butts to get the best rental deal?
Making as much noise as possible about it so we won't notice Ryton being sold off!

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Why would Wasps allow SISU to play them off for the best rental deal? People like Italia tell us they don't need us as tenants so why would they be bothered.
They also will not enter into negotiations until legal action is dropped, so how exactly can you play off with someone who doesn't want to deal with you.

There seems to be a misconception on here that the Wasps are in the shit and SISU are waiting for them to go bust.
The 3 accountants in the telegraph who analysed the accounts all came to the same conclusion.
The bond payback schedule was over ambitious and would need to be restructured.
The profit/loss income trend was all going in the right direction and looks very healthy.
Wasps are holding all the aces here and have told SISU to fuck off unless they drop the court case.
SISU (Tim Fisher) is now lauding the fact that they want to keep CCFC in Coventry and want 'positive involvement' from the council because they are completely up shit creek with nowhere to play and no money and no intention to build somewhere to play.
CRFC are already laying down terms for negotiations as they know SISU are on their knees.
I can't see a deal between CRFC and CCFC happening when CRFC have stated they won't deal with SISU who own CCFC!!!!!

italiahorse said:

I can understand Fisher stepping down but how can Seppalla ? She owns Sisu and CCFC.
No, until Sisu walk away nothing will change.

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I didn't say she should step down she should step away.
What is Dermot Coleman's view on CCFC. We don't know because he stays out of it. Joy should now do the same and allow two new people who can build relationships. However this could only happen in the back of dropping the legal action.
I think now even if the legal action was dropped Wasps and the Council would still struggle dealing with Tim and Joy.
Tim made a comment saying he stepped aside for a bit and that didn't work so he came back.
Am I right in thinking that when he stood aside we came back to the Ricoh then only just missed out on the play offs. Waggot started to build a relationship with Wasps
Then he came back and others left and we are now just about relegated to division 4 and no one is talking to us?

Moff said:

Why would Wasps allow SISU to play them off for the best rental deal? People like Italia tell us they don't need us as tenants so why would they be bothered.
They also will not enter into negotiations until legal action is dropped, so how exactly can you play off with someone who doesn't want to deal with you.

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Unfortunately I think you are both right.
Its SISU's and Mr Fishers trademark standard negotiating stance. Unfortunately like the Council were misjudged on how they would respond to such negotiating tactics.
The same is happening again with Wasps. They won't back down either. CCFC will end up the ones getting hurt again, unfortunately.

Moff said:

Who exactly would Wasps be negotiating with, what sort of third party? as the evidence of this is nil apart from your opinion. So genuinely what exactly does that mean in your honest opinion? as I see a Rugby club whose business plan is falling short.

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It's just something that has been passed onto me. They also mentioned names (that I know) but it's pointless expanding on it because and the end of the day, it's just a Chinese whisper.
It does however give me a few clues in guessing what Wasps plan might be.
But at the end of the day its just a guess like most the stuff we discuss on here.

wasps should just give ccfc shar eof revenue and we stay on as tenants

they think because they have evil council with them they can bully us

dongonzalos said:

Am I right in thinking that when he stood aside we came back to the Ricoh then only just missed out on the play offs.

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Assume he was referring to Anderson who tried to draw a line under past actions and start talks only for Wasps to pull out of talks regarding the Ricoh and CSF to pull out of talks regarding HIggs.

Anderson, after he had left, commented that he was looking to take over a club. You could speculate that is why he was here. Had negotiations been successful we might have seen the end of SISU.

italiahorse said:

It's just something that has been passed onto me. They also mentioned names (that I know) but it's pointless expanding on it because and the end of the day, it's just a Chinese whisper.

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If nobody talked about Chinese Whispers this place would be very quiet! Might as well just post what you've been told.

Moff said:

Why would Wasps allow SISU to play them off for the best rental deal? People like Italia tell us they don't need us as tenants so why would they be bothered.
They also will not enter into negotiations until legal action is dropped, so how exactly can you play off with someone who doesn't want to deal with you.

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I'm not sure if I have said that Wasps don't want CCFC here.
I think they want this settled one way or the other but I would say that they will benefit more from us being at the Ricoh.
I would also suggest CCFC would be better off staying at the Ricoh.
I believe things like Stadium sponsorship is on hold until CCFC are settled. I would also say stadium sponsorship will be more if CCFC are there.
The art is to get a mutually beneficial deal that is a 'win win' for both parties. Sharing stadium sponsorship deals and advertising etc
Also the higher CCFC go up the league the bigger the rent but also the bigger the 'cut'.
I'm hoping the TF rhetoric is just to increase the bargaining position but I see the court case as a block rather than another bargaining chip.

chiefdave said:

If nobody talked about Chinese Whispers this place would be very quiet! Might as well just post what you've been told.

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Can I just say it's awkward?