Can anyone explain how this is not a terrorist attack? (1 Viewer)

Grendel

Well-Known Member

Earlsdon_Skyblue1

Well-Known Member
It means nothing.

There are countless attacks and terrorist incidents that take place that are just getting brushed under the carpet. Look at that woman who got stabbed in London when 3 women were shouting 'Allah, Allah'. - Not reported as a terrorist incident.

The Berlin Christmas market lorry attack was not actually recorded as an Islamic terrorist incident btw.
 

Gazolba

Well-Known Member
If perpetrated by a terrorist, it's a 'terrorist attack', if not, it isn't.
Of course either way it causes terror, but that is not the definition of a terrorist attack.
 

Sky Blue Pete

Well-Known Member
Dictionary completely disagrees with you as well

terrorist
ˈtɛrərɪst/
noun
  1. 1.
    a person who uses unlawful violence and intimidation, especially against civilians, in the pursuit of political aims.
    "four commercial aircraft were hijacked by terrorists"
    synonyms: bomber, arsonist, incendiary; More
 

SkyblueBazza

Well-Known Member
Dictionary completely disagrees with you as well

terrorist
ˈtɛrərɪst/
noun
  1. 1.
    a person who uses unlawful violence and intimidation, especially against civilians, in the pursuit of political aims.
    "four commercial aircraft were hijacked by terrorists"
    synonyms: bomber, arsonist, incendiary; More
And the article cleary indicates that the man in question was apprently doing his violence for personal reasons...so that answers your first question

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SkyblueBazza

Well-Known Member
Anybody using violence as a means of making a point is ultimately a terrorist in my eyes.

I guess the big difference in common parlance is some loner acting randomly on a whim/rant as opposed to a carefully considered, planned action by one or more over a prolonged period.

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shmmeee

Well-Known Member
The legal definition of terrorism in the UK is:

(1)In this Act “terrorism” means the use or threat of action where—

(a)the action falls within subsection (2),

(b)the use or threat is designed to influence the government or an international governmental organisation or to intimidate the public or a section of the public, and

(c)the use or threat is made for the purpose of advancing a political, religious, racial or ideological cause

(2)Action falls within this subsection if it—

(a)involves serious violence against a person,

(b)involves serious damage to property,

(c)endangers a person’s life, other than that of the person committing the action,

(d)creates a serious risk to the health or safety of the public or a section of the public, or

(e)is designed seriously to interfere with or seriously to disrupt an electronic system.

So I suppose without an overarching cause or hope to change government action, it's just mindless violence.

Jo Cox's murder hasn't really been dubbed as terrorism that much but that was!

Mair was charged under terrorism laws and the case is in with all the jihadis on the CPS terrorism page.
 

Otis

Well-Known Member
Incident last night. Allegedly it is said that a 'white man' drove into a group of Muslims near Finsbury Park and a lot of Muslim people are a bit angry that it's not been labelled yet as a terrorist incident.

I don't quite get the anger here because it is still really early days and other incidents haven't always been immediately declared terrorist incidents anyway either and besides that it is a lot easier to come to the conclusion when people are going down the street and shouting 'God is great' and 'this is for Islam' etc.

There is also a recognised profile of attacker in many of these cases and there have been cases where Muslims have killed Muslims as well.

I am sure this will quickly be labelled a terrorist incident, but it is still really early on and I don't quite get the 'minority, not treated the same' outrage coming from some.
 

Otis

Well-Known Member
And besides, it HAS already been declared as a 'potential terrorist attack.'
Apparently the van driver involved when apprehended was shouting 'kill me, kill me,' so maybe some mental health problem involved too.
 

shmmeee

Well-Known Member
And besides, it HAS already been declared as a 'potential terrorist attack.'
Apparently the van driver involved when apprehended was shouting 'kill me, kill me,' so maybe some mental health problem involved too.

Anyone who kills others has mental health issues. And he was shouting "kill all Muslims" according to reports.

Right wing terror is as much of a threat as Islamic terror. We need to start cracking down on hate preachers like Farage and Hopkins. Take their British citizenship from them. All right wingers should be on a watch list just in case. I'm sure there are "moderate" right wingers but they really need to be policing their own community. Enough is enough.
 

Otis

Well-Known Member
Anyone who kills others has mental health issues. And he was shouting "kill all Muslims" according to reports.

Right wing terror is as much of a threat as Islamic terror. We need to start cracking down on hate preachers like Farage and Hopkins. Take their British citizenship from them. All right wingers should be on a watch list just in case. I'm sure there are "moderate" right wingers but they really need to be policing their own community. Enough is enough.
Agree, right wing terror is as much a threat.

I was watching at 4 am and there was no mention then of 'kill all Muslims.'

Very conflicting reports were coming out. First it was there were 3 men with a van, now it seemingly was just one and there were also reports of another white man in the street threatening with a pole.

Confusion reigns, which is of course to be expected.
 

shmmeee

Well-Known Member
Agree, right wing terror is as much a threat.

I was watching at 4 am and there was no mention then of 'kill all Muslims.'

Very conflicting reports were coming out. First it was there were 3 men with a van, now it seemingly was just one and there were also reports of another white man in the street threatening with a pole.

Confusion reigns, which is of course to be expected.

Yeah standard confusing info at first. I just woke up and heard it on the radio. They mentioned more people there at one point I thought but I was still groggy.
 

Macca

Well-Known Member
Anyone who kills others has mental health issues. And he was shouting "kill all Muslims" according to reports.

Right wing terror is as much of a threat as Islamic terror. We need to start cracking down on hate preachers like Farage and Hopkins. Take their British citizenship from them. All right wingers should be on a watch list just in case. I'm sure there are "moderate" right wingers but they really need to be policing their own community. Enough is enough.

This should be standard for any hate preaching.

Not sure there is a right wing community as such so could be tricky.

Whilst this is as appalling as every other terrorist attack I would imagine it's different in many ways
 

Nick

Administrator
Only just seen this, so it's a white fella who has done it as revenge for the other terror attacks by carrying out a terror attack?

He's the same as the Britain first guy, a terrorist if so.
 

Macca

Well-Known Member
Only just seen this, so it's a white fella who has done it as revenge for the other terror attacks by carrying out a terror attack?

He's the same as the Britain first guy, a terrorist if so.

Cycle of tit for tat violence.
Well thanks to this prick, the next one will be a whopper
 

Otis

Well-Known Member
Only just seen this, so it's a white fella who has done it as revenge for the other terror attacks by carrying out a terror attack?

He's the same as the Britain first guy, a terrorist if so.
Yep.

It was on the cards to happen I think . Always someone out there with a touch of xenophobia likely to do a revenge attack. :(
 

Nick

Administrator
Cycle of tit for tat violence.
Well thanks to this prick, the next one will be a whopper

What better way to display outrage at killing and harming innocent by people than to do exactly the same.

It's not as if he has found some extremists and killed them.
 

Kingokings204

Well-Known Member
What better way to display outrage at killing and harming innocent by people than to do exactly the same.

It's not as if he has found some extremists and killed them.

Oh yes it's disgusting and wrong. But I would say anyone who wants to kill another person regardless of issues and race and religion etc is not mentally there. It's not meant to make sense.
 

covcity4life

Well-Known Member
its so stupid though. revenge on who exactly? muslim faith did not decide to do terror attacks on britain after all.

RIP to the victims and lets hope the killer gets names and shamed and thrown in jail. no mental health loopholes.
 

bringbackrattles

Well-Known Member
Can't say I'm shocked at hearing about this attack. It was on the cards that a revenge incident would happen.. We're living in dangerous times and anything can happen at any time and anywhere. Unfortunately there's people who want a civil war either against Muslims or anything they see as an enemy.
 

Nick

Administrator
Looks like he has been arrested on attempted murder as the bloke who died was already ill and being treated?

Not sure if true or not.
 

Macca

Well-Known Member
Can't say I'm shocked at hearing about this attack. It was on the cards that a revenge incident would happen.. We're living in dangerous times and anything can happen at any time and anywhere. Unfortunately there's people who want a civil war either against Muslims or anything they see as an enemy.

Whoever it is and whoever it is against the motive is the same. To create division and civil war. This bloke, Manchester, London Bridge whatever. What scares me is this mug has probably just signed the death warrant of dozens of people by upsetting people who know how to do the job properly. One amateur dickhead causing actual harm to innocent people and setting up harm for others
 

SkyblueBazza

Well-Known Member
Revenge attacks = Jihadi victory doesn't it.
Global Islamic war against infidels or something to that effect...fight back in revenge attacks just in flames more Muslims and Britain's of a thus far peaceful stance

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covcity4life

Well-Known Member
not much wall to wall media coverage compared to other terror attacks. heck a silver printer cartridge thread is above this one as i type this.

sad world we live in.
 

Nick

Administrator
Not sure why people are so eager to play the race stuff about it, the bloke is a terrorist as bad as people from ISIS no matter on his colour. People outraged that it isn't labelled as terrorism the minute the news came out, neither were Manchester and London.

The bloke will / should be locked up on a terror charge the same as the guy who killed Jo Cox. Doesn't matter about his colour etc.

Not sure what another thread being above this proves?
 

covcity4life

Well-Known Member
there is no playing race stuff

it just seems apparent that less people care when its solely muslim victims. no one is talking about it at work etc, very different to past ones. hey maybe its my workplace. others can say if they think its no different. would love to hear opinions

if people disagree thats fine, just my observations thats all.

i never mentioned terrorism label at all.
 

Liquid Gold

Well-Known Member
RIP to those affected.

Fucking mugs the lot of them, anybody who carries out attacks on innocent people is such a prick. What this guy probably doesn't realise is that he's doing exactly what ISIS want us to do. They want division in society and this will be an easy recruiting tool.

We need to lock up all the muslim hate preachers and lock up all the British hate spewers too.
 

Macca

Well-Known Member
there is no playing race stuff

it just seems apparent that less people care when its solely muslim victims. no one is talking about it at work etc, very different to past ones. hey maybe its my workplace. others can say if they think its no different. would love to hear opinions

if people disagree thats fine, just my observations thats all.

i never mentioned terrorism label at all.

The London one was hardly discussed at my place to be fair immune to it to a degree other people as well who condone it in a way at my place too.

Maybe scale too? In terms of drama and casualties. I reckon if it would have been Manchester magnitude would be more talk

After that fire last week I think we are becoming more immune to this country falling in line with the rest of a pretty awful world
 

wingy

Well-Known Member
not much wall to wall media coverage compared to other terror attacks. heck a silver printer cartridge thread is above this one as i type this.

sad world we live in.
There is covcity4life, all morning.
I've been watching but haven't been anywhere today to gauge others opinion.
I think the Imam deserves huge credit for diffusing the mood in the immediate aftermath.
You may have a point in the likely level of empathy in the general population but I've no reason to believe that to be deliberate, nor in a reversed position.
 

covcity4life

Well-Known Member
The London one was hardly discussed at my place to be fair immune to it to a degree other people as well who condone it in a way at my place too.

Maybe scale too? In terms of drama and casualties. I reckon if it would have been Manchester magnitude would be more talk

After that fire last week I think we are becoming more immune to this country falling in line with the rest of a pretty awful world

Good point about magnitude.

1 death is wayyyy too much i shud make that clear but yes thankfully he didnt get as many victims as he aimed for.
 

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