Belief? At what point do you think we lost ours? (2 Viewers)

[Otis]

Just listening to 5 Live talking about Leicester and to fans and ex players etc. and so much of their success is being put down to belief. The confidence and belief to think you will win and are invincible.

I recall Dalglish saying the same about Blackburn when they won the league. Belief was their biggest asset.

We seemed to be very confident and had that belief ourselves.

Just wondering, can anyone pinpoint a defining moment when that belief was suddenly lost to us this season? Any one game, or did it just erode away over time.

Walsall at home maybe? And/or Burton?

Against Walsall we were winning and I think the players and TM thought we were strong enough to hold out for the win. Walsall had loads of possession and were really coming at us, but weren't creating any real clear cut chances.

I think that late equaliser knocked a lot of stuffing out of us, so, the Walsall game perhaps?

The Burton game we started off strongly, but the minute that first goal went in following Phillips' insane giveaway the match was lost. Our heads dropped and we looked a beaten side from that moment, so Burton perhaps?

Any one particular game you think, or just an erosion over a period of time?

Personally, if I were to pinpoint it to one game I would say Burton. As soon as we went 1-0 down it felt like we had been transported back to the Pressley and Thorn era where we looked clueless and beaten and with no answer.

The lack of fightback in that Burton game was a massive concern to me and then of course, in the last home game against Scunthorpe, it was truly boys against men.

What does everyone think? I am sure belief has formed a big part of what Walsall and Burton have done this season.

 

---

[I_Saw_Shaw_Score]

Oldham at home conceding in the 94th minute to a side who had lost 8 on the bounce didn't help.

With the 2 weeks before that the 2 massive errors allowing Donny 2 goals in the 2-2 up here.

Those were 4 points dropped.

Between those 2 was the farce at Sheffield United.

Those 3 games may have started the cycle of 'same old city' with our own errors and ridiculously bad officiating at Sheff, then everything since is the early season 'feel good factor' unwinding.

 

[JimmyHillsbeard]

When Vincelot shaved his beard

 

[wingy]

Barnsley at home.

 

[Otis]

Barnsley at home.

This season, or last?

 

[Covstu]

Barnsley at home proved we could score despite having a poor defence but that luck was going to run out at some point. Walsall and burton were the two games for me where we could have made a statement to the league but failed, don't get me wrong I thought we should have won the Walsall game but it looked like it knocked the stuffing out of the players.
our fate is down to the manager and his team to pick up this more than capable team and get their tails back up. I don't feel we have lost the season, just a little derailed at present.

 

[1ccfc]

Who said that we had lost belief?

 

[stevefloyd]

Hmmm not 100% sure i guess the Burton game when we just seem to fold is when i started doubting but it may have been when our unbeaten home record went... 1 thing i am 100% certain of is i am sitting in a hide in Scotland taking photos of Kingfishers and its bleeding freezing cold pusb

 

[Otis]

Who said that we had lost belief?

Well, maybe we haven't, but you would surely have to say it certainly looks like we have.

There was no belief from the moment we went 1-0 to Burton and there was a total lack of belief against Scunthorpe.

Leicester are winning because they believe they will win every game. This is what lots of people are saying, that belief can take you a long, long way.

When you are beaten easily the obvious thing is to question that belief.

If we still have that belief why have we lost the last three games SO badly?

 

[stevefloyd]

Hear hear ......

 

[Hobo]

No, I don't think we have lost belief. Too many games left.

 

[skybluetony176]

When Vincelot shaved his beard

Definitely. That was a Samson and Delilah moment if ever there was one.

 

[skybluetony176]

Being serious for a moment, a couple of good back to back results and we'll be flying again. Just hoping we don't have to wait to long.

 

[shy_tall_knight]

Do you think the new players have installed belief in the team. Do any of the players believe when MAF comes on the pitch he will score or Hunt actually beat an opposition player rather than himself, do they believe Bigi will pass to his own players or Ramage actually defend. I thought beleif or confidence was shot against Scunny but having picked on the new additions I think Ricketts and RCC are the biggest cause of our collapse in form. Ricketts to me has gone from being a solid leader to looking slow and indecisive.

 

[1ccfc]

I agree with Hobo. Also it depends on what you think you have "lost belief" in. Are we talking automatic promotion? Tough job agreed, but still lots of points to play for. Play-offs? Well we're still in the top six! Management? TM still has my support. Or the players? Yes a few bad results but lets see how they finish the job. I can't believe some fans are saying they have lost belief whilst we are 5th with 51 points to play for.

 

[Otis]

No, I don't think we have lost belief. Too many games left.

But those games are in the future, we can't have lost belief in games we haven't played yet. I am talking about having lost belief for now, at this moment.

Not saying this is now it for the rest of the campaign, just that at the moment we seemingly have no belief.

 

[Otis]

I agree with Hobo. Also it depends on what you think you have "lost belief" in. Are we talking automatic promotion? Tough job agreed, but still lots of points to play for. Play-offs? Well we're still in the top six! Management? TM still has my support. Or the players? Yes a few bad results but lets see how they finish the job. I can't believe some fans are saying they have lost belief whilst we are 5th with 51 points to play for.

See my reply to Hobo. I am talking about now, at this moment in time. The last three games we seemed to have lost belief in being able to win football matches.

Of course with a win tomorrow that belief might be instilled again. No-one can deny that, that being unbeaten at home record must have given us great belief we could win every home game, or at least not get beaten. Don't think it is any coincidence that the minute we lost the first one at home, the next one immediately followed after it.

Think our confidence was severely dented going into the Scunthorpe match. Very little belief on show that day at all. Wasn't at Southend, so can't comment on that one.

Anyway, we just don't seem to have the belief we had earlier in the season. That could change in one single game, so am not talking about promotion or play-offs or the next 6 games to come, I am talking about the here and now.

Leicester have Man City away today and Arsenal away next week. I dare say that if they were to lose both those their confidence would be severely dented and that belief will have been chipped away somewhat.

I have not lost belief at all. I am talking about the team and now, right now, not for the rest of the campaign.

 

[clint van damme]

Well, maybe we haven't, but you would surely have to say it certainly looks like we have.

There was no belief from the moment we went 1-0 to Burton and there was a total lack of belief against Scunthorpe.

Leicester are winning because they believe they will win every game. This is what lots of people are saying, that belief can take you a long, long way.

When you are beaten easily the obvious thing is to question that belief.

If we still have that belief why have we lost the last three games SO badly?

They've also got some bloody fantastic players! (unfortunately).

 

[Hobo]

But those games are in the future, we can't have lost belief in games we haven't played yet. I am talking about having lost belief for now, at this moment.

Not saying this is now it for the rest of the campaign, just that at the moment we seemingly have no belief.

Your post read like we had lost belief in our ability to achieve our objectives for the season and was there a defining moment when that happened.

Of course you can have lost belief in future games. That is why so many teams went to Old Trafford and lost in the Ferguson years. Teams had lost the game in their head before they walked on the pitch.

If you meant when we have lost belief in an individual game that is different. Walsall away and Burton at home when the second goal went in.

 

[stupot07]

Oldham at home conceding in the 94th minute to a side who had lost 8 on the bounce didn't help.

With the 2 weeks before that the 2 massive errors allowing Donny 2 goals in the 2-2 up here.

Those were 4 points dropped.

Between those 2 was the farce at Sheffield United.

Those 3 games may have started the cycle of 'same old city' with our own errors and ridiculously bad officiating at Sheff, then everything since is the early season 'feel good factor' unwinding.

Agreed with this.

Not sure why everyone is mentioned the Burton and Walsall games, the poor run has been the last 11 games not just the last 3

Being serious for a moment, a couple of good back to back results and we'll be flying again. Just hoping we don't have to wait to long.

Agreed Tony, they kept saying on the radio post match last week that 1 will not will turn things around, I disagree we need to a little run of 2-3 wins in 3-4 games as we've had isolated wins (port vale and Crewe) which ended up more as blips than a catalyst. Go on a little run confidence and momentum will change. Just needs to happen soon otherwise we're going to fall out the top 6 the rate we're going.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk - so please excuse any spelling or grammar errors

 

[rupert_bear]

We have 17 games to play we are more than capable of winning atleast 10 we just need to get that one elusive victory and I think we will be up and running.

As to the point we may have lost that bit of belief I would say that Oldham equaliser, so unexpected, a costly error to boot had we came back the next week with a good win maybe we could of shrugged it off but with a run of defence injuries too we haven't really got it together since. But we ain't adrift that much, Burton have lost 2 of their last 3 A lot to play for.

 

[Calista]

Weirdly enough I was concerned about the performance at home to Gillingham. Yes we’d had a brilliant purple patch in the first half and stuck four past them, which was so much fun. But we were frighteningly poor in the second half. People said afterwards that it was understandable to “take our foot off the pedal”, but for me there was more to it. And when you look at it, we’ve only won twice in the subsequent 11 matches.

So maybe not a loss of belief – more an unjustified belief that we only have to turn up to beat teams in this league?

 

[rupert_bear]

What will be interesting is if TM introduces. Slight change in the way we play. If he plays Henderson and Armstrong together I think he will have to, then could it be one out and out winger 3 in midfield ? The one up top hasn't worked for weeks, that ain't down to Armstrong, if he gets in another wide player in the Ryan Kent maybe he will stick with the lone front man

 

[Otis]

They've also got some bloody fantastic players! (unfortunately).

Yes, very true. Belief only takes you so far.

But then you have to say, we too have some very good players for the level we're at, or at least should be!

Fleck, Murphy, Cole, Armstrong, JOB, Ricketts, Maddison, Vincelot.

When you look at the likes of Burton, you have to ask yourself do they have better individual players and the answer would probably have to be no. Are they a better team though? Yep, without any shadow of a doubt!

A very good team needs some good players, yes, but they also need to have spirit, fight, belief, be organised, have a strong defence and have a system that works week in week out.

We at the moment have the players, but we don't have the team.

 

[Skybluebrummie]

The day Ryan Kent got recalled.....

 

[Otis]

Your post read like we had lost belief in our ability to achieve our objectives for the season and was there a defining moment when that happened.

Of course you can have lost belief in future games. That is why so many teams went to Old Trafford and lost in the Ferguson years. Teams had lost the game in their head before they walked on the pitch.

If you meant when we have lost belief in an individual game that is different. Walsall away and Burton at home when the second goal went in.

This is what I was asking. Sorry if my post was read wrongly. I thought I had made it clear. I simply said when did we lose that belief we had earlier in the season? Nowt about games to come. Just on the back of three defeats, where the effort was not at an acceptable level.

And it's different the Man U scenario. Anyone can fail to have belief in a single game due to who you are playing against. If you were in the Premier you are going to fancy your chances much more against Newcastle or Villa away than you are are going to Man City or Arsenal.

We have had three games in a row now where we have seemed shot and unfortunately, no disrespect to Scunthorpe, but they are not Man U and we were at home.

 

[Lord_Nampil]

This is what I was asking. Sorry if my post was read wrongly. I thought I had made it clear. I simply said when did we lose that belief we had earlier in the season? Nowt about games to come. Just on the back of three defeats, where the effort was not at an acceptable level.

And it's different the Man U scenario. Anyone can fail to have belief in a single game due to who you are playing against. If you were in the Premier you are going to fancy your chances much more against Newcastle or Villa away than you are are going to Man City or Arsenal.

We have had three games in a row now where we have seemed shot and unfortunately, no disrespect to Scunthorpe, but they are not Man U and we were at home.

i think we judge to see if that is true from tomorrow!

we have signed 3 players since last Saturday which has made us stronger in defence and attack, lets see now if we have the belief we can win games again! Preston had a very simular run last January, won exactly a year ago against us after a 7 game run without a win....

 

[bringbackrattles]

I know we are supposed to dislike Leicester and I've been getting stick in the pub for saying I think they're great for football,and I reckon they will win the title. But without belief in themselves they wouldn't be where they are,you need it along with talent and hard work. Is belief the same as confidence ? I'd say it is but winning does half help !

 

[chiefdave]

and I reckon they will win the title.

They're never going to have a better chance to win the league than this.

 

[chiefdave]

After Arsenal next week they haven't got another game against a top 5 team until Man Utd which is their third from last game. They could have the league won by then!

 

[st john]

After Gillingham was definitely the turning point IMO, I think it's mainly pressure with some of the players caused by losing top spot and falling down the league, this has made every game a must win, and I think that has got to some of the team. In truth our initial decent was a combination of sloppy play, injuries, bad luck, and some appalling official decisions.

Pressure affects everyone differently, some can psyche themselves up for individual games and some handle it week in week out without it affecting their form. That's why TM has added some thirty something "been there done that" players IMO, and that's why I think Henderson could be such a good signing, he certainly don't lack bottle, and could be a similar player to us as Dennis Wise was from the point of view of adding steel.
Read this
http://www.nottinghampost.com/Notti...us-Henderson/story-20719069-detail/story.html

 

[shmmeee]

Post Gillingham at home. Though I think it was the opposite of lack of belief. Players started talking about promotion and then we were crap. I think a few got a bit cocky.

 

[PTA]

For me Sheffield away. That result really demotivated me.

 

[Gazolba]

In one word: Goal-keeper. I think the belief started high until we all realized Burge was not good enough. Then belief surged again when RCC came in and kept all those clean sheets. Then as soon as the run of clean sheets ended and the defensive players realized RCC was not good enough either, belief evaporated.

 

[Londonccfcfan]

Just listening to 5 Live talking about Leicester and to fans and ex players etc. and so much of their success is being put down to belief. The confidence and belief to think you will win and are invincible.

I recall Dalglish saying the same about Blackburn when they won the league. Belief was their biggest asset.

We seemed to be very confident and had that belief ourselves.

Just wondering, can anyone pinpoint a defining moment when that belief was suddenly lost to us this season? Any one game, or did it just erode away over time.

Walsall at home maybe? And/or Burton?

Against Walsall we were winning and I think the players and TM thought we were strong enough to hold out for the win. Walsall had loads of possession and were really coming at us, but weren't creating any real clear cut chances.

I think that late equaliser knocked a lot of stuffing out of us, so, the Walsall game perhaps?

The Burton game we started off strongly, but the minute that first goal went in following Phillips' insane giveaway the match was lost. Our heads dropped and we looked a beaten side from that moment, so Burton perhaps?

Any one particular game you think, or just an erosion over a period of time?

Personally, if I were to pinpoint it to one game I would say Burton. As soon as we went 1-0 down it felt like we had been transported back to the Pressley and Thorn era where we looked clueless and beaten and with no answer.

The lack of fightback in that Burton game was a massive concern to me and then of course, in the last home game against Scunthorpe, it was truly boys against men.

What does everyone think? I am sure belief has formed a big part of what Walsall and Burton have done this season.

Great point Otis. belief is massive, I'm not sure it's lost just yet.

Theres only Burton in this league who seem to have unwavering belief.

You cant point at any particular game where it was/may have lost that edge. But definately the amount of changes in personnel hasn't helped. We should be regularly playing the nucleus of the squad from the beginning of the season. That got us to this position.