Munich another shooting (15 Viewers)
- Thread starter Captain Dart
- Start date
Nick
Administrator
As I said months ago, it isn't just about the people who actually need help, it is the people who don't who take advantage.
Going off topic for a moment, but interesting article re Mother Teresa her who was certainly no Saint -
www.timesofindia.com/world/uk/Mother-Teresa-saint-of-the-media-controversial-study-says/articleshow/18760028.cms
Figure of speech to be fair!
Grendel
Well-Known Member
I'm sure this mans name was Paul and the only reason he did it was because of frustration at being refused entry to the music festival.
Captain Dart
Well-Known Member
No worries, martcov will be along in a minute to sympathise with his terrible predicament, the poor little thing was probably bullied at school.
kdrinkell
Well-Known Member
Well I did not need six months and btw I did say innocents on both sides FFS,and yes I do hope we don't need help from others as I know for a fact if the shoe was on the other foot Europe would treat us differently just look at the Eurovision for a glimpse of that.
CCFC Germany
Active Member
No, he did it because he was suicidal an being treated for mental illness...
Nick
Administrator
Why do people keep excusing them and putting everything down to mental illness? they are millions of people with mental illness, they don't fill a bag with explosives and nails and set it off in public.
3 attacks in a week isn't it now from Migrants in Germany?
D
Deleted member 5849
Guest
Nobody is escusing 'them' (the choice of 'them' itself is... interesting). However, the shopping centre one sees some remarkably lazy generalisations in order to fit into a world view that says it's all to do with a refugee crisis, and ISIS v the West
That particular one... wasn't.
To make it so, and draw generalised conclusions from it, is highly disturbing, doesn't actually look at whatever issues there are, and polarises.
To link that particular episode with today's would be utter madness. If were doing that then what we're doing is we're using the acts of individuals to create a world view that is rather warped. Also, to leap on the bad things that happen from individuals, I hope we will highlight *all* the disturbing things that individuals do through the world. The compartmentalising into a vast cavernous space of 'us' v 'them' in a broad sweep of what's black and white is what helps to cause issues as much as anything else.
That is *not* excusing, and it is lazy to do so. Bad people should be punished, the same as good people should be rewarded.
Nick
Administrator
Them was aimed at the people carrying out attacks like this. I am not sure why it is interesting to put myself in a different bracket to somebody (whether they are white, black, pink, purple or green) who would fill their bag with explosives, go at a pregnant woman in the street with an axe or attack people on trains.
Yes, there are bad people all over the world. I don't think anybody would deny that, but it is pointless rolling that out after every attack.
Nobody says "every refugee is dangerous", it will be more of a case of how many of them are actually refugees and how many just want a free pass. The latest guy was denied Asylum, but was there anyway. The one with the axe in the street was known for violent attacks, but free to roam about.
Munich: kid was born in Germany. Mental problems. Admired mass shootings- including the right wing racist Brevik. Nothing to do with race or religion. ( or Merkel )
Reutlingen: guy fell in love with Polish girl who rejected him as she had a boyfriend. Nothing to do with religion or race. ( not a terrorist ).
Ansbach: seems to be terror attack. Guy here for 2 years - nothing to do with Merkel's 'wir schaffen es'. Was also in a clinic for mental problems.
Was suicidal.
So. There you are 'defended them' by pointing out facts. Sorry if the facts don't fit your agenda.
What I am pointing out is that people here are following a band wagon. Everything is Merkel's fault which just isn't true. We have always taken refugees because we are obliged to e.g. Under the Geneva convention.
Every fucked up dickhead with Arabic, Turkish or Iranian roots proves that all people from the Region are Potential terrorists - according to this theory.
What crap. This is getting worse. We are off the EU now because some people think we're sailing off into a bright future. Blaming Merkel is still cool, but now we are bringing in Eurovision as proof that everyone is against us.
Yes. For example politics. Being sick or in love with someone who rejects you and resulting to violence doesn't qualify you as a terrorist, or football fans attacking Nick at an away game is also not a terrorist attack although it may be terrifying.
No. It is 2. one was Born in Germany.
Nick
Administrator
I wasn't even talking about the Munich one...
1. The train attacks last week
2. The Axe Attacks on the woman
3. This bomb attack
These people might well have mental illness, but when you openly invite hundreds of thousands of people in from a different culture where they go about their daily stuff differently it is going to cause issues isn't it? I am nowhere near saying that every refugee is causing trouble before anybody starts trying to make out I am racist.
Them was aimed in this case at 3 people of a different colour/ race. 2 at least were known to be mentally ill. You could have talked about treatment or better diagnosis- but we and you are talking about refugees. The tenor of many here is that refugees are bad- look! another bit of evidence. The truth is that in the first 2 cases these things happen far too often in the 'native' population, but we are not all counted as bad because of it.
CCFC Germany
Active Member
Just like thousands with a domestic passport. What makes those a lesser "thread" ?
Astute
Well-Known Member
They should have let him in. Then he wouldn't have tried to kill anyone I suppose
So he was a Syrian refugee. And Germany saved him. Yes great news for those on here that live in Germany. They will say that open borders are the way to go.
But look at it as a neutral for once. He was a failed asylum seeker. He had been allowed to stay while there is unrest in Syria. But was told that he would have to go back once things settle down. So he decides to kill himself and as many others as he could. But if you mention this those of us that live in Germany will call you a racist.
Nick
Administrator
Ah ok, I just don't see the logic in "there are already sex offenders and dangerous people here, why bother checking and stopping people who may also be from coming into the country".
We have had refugees for years because of various agreements. That is not 'openly inviting people '. The humanitarian crisis caused by wars that Germany didn't actively take Part in, resulted in people living in their own shit in Budapest. Merkel said she would take them to avoid a calamity. That sent a message which was interpreted as an Open invitation by desperate people- and a load of chancers. She did not invite as many people as possible to come to Germany - that is a 'leaver' lie from Farage which people like to believe as it fits their agenda.
Being a Western democracy and having a constitution which guarantees Human rights has some negative consequences. The alternative could be far worse though.
Nick
Administrator
What agenda do you speak of? It is almost like you want to call anybody who doesn't agree with you a racist?
They should have let him in. Then he wouldn't have tried to kill anyone I suppose
So he was a Syrian refugee. And Germany saved him. Yes great news for those on here that live in Germany. They will say that open borders are the way to go.
But look at it as a neutral for once. He was a failed asylum seeker. He had been allowed to stay while there is unrest in Syria. But was told that he would have to go back once things settle down. So he decides to kill himself and as many others as he could. But if you mention this those of us that live in Germany will call you a racist.
No. But if you say it is Merkel's policy to send failed asylum seekers back when things are better, then you may get criticism from leavers who fell for the lie that Merkel invited as many People as possible to come and live in Europe.
Astute
Well-Known Member
You couldn't be any more right however much you try.
I was accused of being racist for wanting to close our borders to everyone in the EU so we could choose who to let in. And that the less allowed in from the EU the more we could allow in from the rest of the world. But it was a racist comment somehow and I still haven't worked it out.
The agenda is 'refugees are bad' Merkel is a 'fucking idiot' and 'will get fried'.
Read the thread. Plenty of spin directing the debate away from the facts - especially about Munich. Even BoJo was condeming it as terrorism before the facts were out. Others on here were claiming it was a muslim targeting other muslims.
Astute
Well-Known Member
What a load of crap. So who said what then?
Nick
Administrator
Nope, there are millions of refugees who genuinely need help. There are many who will come in and integrate and be part of the new country.
However, without proper screening and policies it won't work. For example the bloke with the axe, known to the police for violence. He should have been kicked out and blacklisted.
Astute
Well-Known Member
Or how about you always standing up for decisions made by the EU and Germany. You continually try to deflect the facts on the trouble that open borders cause. And if anyone disagrees with you they are either racist or heartless.
kdrinkell
Well-Known Member
Ignore him
Astute
Well-Known Member
Sorry but I can't ignore such biased rubbish.
Yes we should help. But that doesn't mean a free ticket for everyone who wants one. And those with mental health problems should be watched carefully at least to make sure that everyone else are a lot more safer. It isn't good enough to be able to say that deaths and murders were down to mental health problems so are not a problem.
I agree entirely that if they Break the law they should be punished and, if possible, sent home. But.., the home countries don't want them in most cases. The system here is slowly catching up and sorting people out.
Nick
Administrator
Exactly!
People are coming from countries where they have seen all sorts of messed up stuff, they have grown up with it being the norm to see murder and violence. When you put them into a country where that isn't the norm it will cause issues won't it sometimes?
Is it their fault if they have mental issues, of course not. It still doesn't mean it's ok to throw them into the community to crack on. Especially if they are already known, to allow them to carry on.
Nick
Administrator
The home countries don't want the criminals, surely that says something? What happens then?