Tims latest missif (4 Viewers)

[Captain Dart]

... to CCC planning.

Can't help but think that he is doing his damnedest to trap CCC either into admitting something they shouldn't have done or admitting to not having done something they ought to have done.

http://www.ccfc.co.uk/documents/dear-mr-russell144-3283190.pdf

He's also trying to get someone else to organise something CCFC should be taking the initiative on.

 

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[Nick]

He is asking about the stuff sport England wanted I think, the info they wanted in writing too.

It comes across (opinion only) as if he thinks it isn't possible at the higgs so is trying to get them to admit it by keep going on about sport England

 

[chiefdave]

Tim's on a roll now, that's another excellent letter and raises some serious questions which I'm sure the CT will be following up on :angelic:

Said before that there's a reason the plans have been split into two and we're starting to see why now.

 

[Captain Dart]

Tim's on a roll now, that's another excellent letter and raises some serious questions which I'm sure the CT will be following up on :angelic:

Said before that there's a reason the plans have been split into two and we're starting to see why now.

Tim's already had his answer.. so he will get a polite rebuff.
http://www.coventrytelegraph.net/news/coventry-news/drop-legal-action-relationship-can-11762740
"Coventry City Council leader George Duggins insists the authority will not get involved in talks over Coventry City’s Academy - and repeated his call for the club’s owners to drop ongoing legal action against the council."

 

[TheRoyalScam]

Publishing the letter for public consumption on the CCFC website makes it appear more for political points scoring/posturing than a reply to a private email.
Could I just remind everyone of statements in 'The Way Forward':
1) To have a fully integrated football model with the Academy being a cornerstone of the club model.
2) CCFC is moving towards the fully integrated football model whereby there is no longer a silo model in which Academy and the first team group rarely work together.
3) ...for the long term, it remains the club’s ambition to own its own stadium.
Here's the article: http://www.ccfc.co.uk/news/article/the-way-forward-coventry-city-020115-2177171.aspx

 

[Nick]

People keep going on about the way forward document, maybe we should just refer to wasps wanting to stay in London every time the academy is mentioned?

It's as if it's a method to divert.

Could refer back to the council conditions of sale too?

 

[Captain Dart]

People keep going on about the way forward document, maybe we should just refer to wasps wanting to stay in London every time the academy is mentioned?

Like you keep going on about half the revenues being offered for £24M.. I smell hypocrisy.

 

[stupot07]

Publishing the letter for public consumption on the CCFC website makes it appear more for political points scoring/posturing than a reply to a private email.
Could I just remind everyone of statements in 'The Way Forward':
1) To have a fully integrated football model with the Academy being a cornerstone of the club model.
2) CCFC is moving towards the fully integrated football model whereby there is no longer a silo model in which Academy and the first team group rarely work together.
3) ...for the long term, it remains the club’s ambition to own its own stadium.
Here's the article: http://www.ccfc.co.uk/news/article/the-way-forward-coventry-city-020115-2177171.aspx

1) and 2) are already happening aren't they? Other than single site integrated training base.

3) would pretty much be the long term aim of any owner of the football ckhb

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[Nick]

Like you keep going on about half the revenues being offered for £24M.. I smell hypocrisy.

Yes, which is why it would have put buyers off when discussing the past and talking about why other teams have been more attractive. I'm not saying they are available now...

Still, we can all refer back to wasps wanting to stay in London as enough reason for things to not go ahead right?

 

[Captain Dart]

Yes, which is why it would have put buyers off when discussing the past. I'm not saying they are available now...

What you continually imply is that an unverified rumour about a ridiculous informal offer was ever on the table, I'm sure it wasn't, just as sure as Tim Fishers statements about land deals being complete in a few weeks were total bollocks.

 

[Nick]

What you continually imply is that an unverified rumour about a ridiculous informal offer was ever on the table, I'm sure it wasn't, just as sure as Tim Fishers statements about land deals being complete in a few weeks were total bollocks.

Still, you can just keep waving that statement about to excuse anybody else of blame with regards to the academy.

Still never got a reply to my pms.

 

[SkyBlueCharlie]

If we ignore all of the 'you said, we said' rubbish (difficult for some I know) as far as I can see Mr Fisher is offering a meeting during week beginning 19th September. That at least is a positive step forward.

 

[Nick]

If we ignore all of the 'you said, we said' rubbish (difficult for some I know) as far as I can see Mr Fisher is offering a meeting during week beginning 19th September. That at least is a positive step forward.

Yep, it's there in black and white.

There is no pulling out of that is there?

 

[SkyBlueCharlie]

Yep, it's there in black and white.

There is no pulling out of that is there?

Nope...unless they can find someone else to blame. It's certainly better than 'three weeks'.

 

[Captain Dart]

If we ignore all of the 'you said, we said' rubbish (difficult for some I know) as far as I can see Mr Fisher is offering a meeting during week beginning 19th September. That at least is a positive step forward.

If you read it carefully he is asking CCC who have already said they won't get involved who should arrange a meeting involving Wasps & Sport England and CSF.
He is asking the wrong people, he needs to sort this out with Wasps, Sport England and CSF. Nothing will happen unless he asks them, is it too hard to pick up the phone?

 

[fernandopartridge]

Tim's already had his answer.. so he will get a polite rebuff.
http://www.coventrytelegraph.net/news/coventry-news/drop-legal-action-relationship-can-11762740
"Coventry City Council leader George Duggins insists the authority will not get involved in talks over Coventry City’s Academy - and repeated his call for the club’s owners to drop ongoing legal action against the council."

The council cannot ignore its obligations as the local planning authority.

 

[Captain Dart]

The council cannot ignore its obligations as the local planning authority.

An agreement to share facilities isn't anything to do with planning.

 

[fernandopartridge]

An agreement to share facilities isn't anything to do with planning.

Well it could be, the council has powers to add conditions to planning applications doesn't it.

 

[dongonzalos]

If we ignore all of the 'you said, we said' rubbish (difficult for some I know) as far as I can see Mr Fisher is offering a meeting during week beginning 19th September. That at least is a positive step forward.

I like the fact it's the club proposing dates.
I don't like the tone of the letter. The little bits to the words of the effect of
I am sure that an over sight, I am sure you can explain that.
Not really setting a great tone for the meetings.
However this is to CCC who don't really need to be there.
Other than I suppose giving planning advice

 

[skybluetony176]

It's a good letter and I'm glad the club are persueing this line. It's a shame that many of these points weren't raised in the planning approval meeting but maybe that was the point. Either way it's a good move and I look forward to the response from the council and wasps and see where sports England take it. The response from sports England is key here I feel.

 

[chiefdave]

I am sure that an over sight, I am sure you can explain that.

Seems fairly polite to me. There's now things that have been requested by other organisations in addition to the club that Wasps & CSF have not provided. It also seems that some of this information has been passed to the council.

To me that raises questions but Fisher seems to have taken the restrained approach.

 

[dongonzalos]

Seems fairly polite to me. There's now things that have been requested by other organisations in addition to the club that Wasps & CSF have not provided. It also seems that some of this information has been passed to the council.

To me that raises questions but Fisher seems to have taken the restrained approach.

I am sure if he takes whatever unrestrained approach, you want him to.
Things would go swimmingly. I always tend to find if I need someone's help as long as I have a bit of a pop at them. They will always come up trumps for me.

It's good he has done the letter as we can see he is saying he wants talks.
However CCC are not the critical people in this.
So let's try picking up the phone and phoning the people you need in the meeting and arrange it.
If they fed use ask for an interview with CET.

 

[stupot07]

I can't see why any cov fan would have an issue with this letter.....but then I remebered we have Don....

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[dongonzalos]

I can't see why any cov fan would have an issue with this letter.....but then I remebered we have Don....

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I can't see why any Cov fan would not want the club to just get on with the negotiations ASAP and contact the correct people.

 

[stupot07]

I can't see why any Cov fan would not want the club to just get on with the negotiations ASAP and contact the correct people.

We all do, but we want it done properly and that means open and honest and transparent which is why it is vital ALL parties including Sport England, FA and FL get around the table.

The letters etc are all about documenting that wasps, the council and CSF arent following proper procedures ie. Being upfront and honest with the club and more importantly thr statutory body, Sport England about the impact of the planning application which therefore impacts on the validity of the planning decision.

Much better that than a behind closed doors meeting between ccfc, CSF and wasps and they feed the club bullshit, tell everyone everything's dandy then turnaround and blame the club when they double cross us.

Far more chance of safeguarding the academy by following the process, not sure why you're so keen to avoid doing it properly.

You never know, sport england might say no to wasps application and swimming pool.

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[dongonzalos]

We all do, but we want it done properly and that means open and honest and transparent which is why it is vital ALL parties including Sport England, FA and FL get around the table.

The letters etc are all about documenting that wasps, the council and CSF arent following proper procedures ie. Being upfront and honest with the club and more importantly thr statutory body, Sport England about the impact of the planning application which therefore impacts on the validity of the planning decision.

Much better that than a behind closed doors meeting between ccfc, CSF and wasps and they feed the club bullshit, tell everyone everything's dandy then turnaround and blame the club when they double cross us.

Far more chance of safeguarding the academy by following the process, not sure why you're so keen to avoid doing it properly.

You never know, sport england might say no to wasps application and swimming pool.

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So the letters will help getting on with the negotiations quicker and improve the chances of them been successful.
If only that was true Stu, as a Cov fan I know this letter will not do that.
One it isn't sent to the correct people and secondly the sarcastic nature of some of the comments.
As a Cov fan I want it sorted quick time for the sake of the academy. I know a little about negotiation especially when you are dependant on others and you don't hold the Ace.
So as a Cov fan I do have an issue with this letter and if getting a quick resolution for CCFC was more important then trying to get one over on Wasps or CCC as a Cov fan you would too.

 

[stupot07]

So the letters will help getting on with the negotiations quicker and improve the chances of them been successful.
If only that was true Stu, as a Cov fan I know this letter will not do that.
One it isn't sent to the correct people and secondly the sarcastic nature of some of the comments.
As a Cov fan I want it sorted quick time for the sake of the academy. I know a little about negotiation especially when you are dependant on others and you don't hold the Ace.
So as a Cov fan I do have an issue with this letter and if getting a quick resolution for CCFC was more important then trying to get one over on Wasps or CCC as a Cov fan you would too.

This is about planning process and obligations, it needs to be documented and neither the council, wasps or CSF have followed due process.

This needs sorting properly. Wasps and CSF will have no choice but to negotiate on this as its what Sport England will insist on.

I am glad we're challenging thr planning decision constructively. The planning meeting was nearly a month ago and wasps/CSF/council have still not provided the information to Sport England as requested. What have they got to hide? The only reason o can see is thah they are worried they can't offer the facilities that sport england will want expect them to provide with us, given they were instrumental in the initial planning approval 10-12 years ago.

Even Tony who Is about anti sisu as you get agrees with this letter.

Wasps don't hold all the aces, they will have to get it rubber stamped by sport england and that will likely mean providing facilities to safeguard the academy.

Let's get it done properly, get all of the people round the table and let's do it in an open and transparent manner, or are you against Sport England, FA and FL being there?

I'll leave you to moan on and push all blame onto the club, it's what you're best at.

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[albatross]

People keep going on about the way forward document, maybe we should just refer to wasps wanting to stay in London every time the academy is mentioned?

It's as if it's a method to divert.

Could refer back to the council conditions of sale too?

This is not about the actions of WASPS or CCC or CSF or ACL any more than you or I should be judged by the actions of others. My posts have been very critical of SISU but I have consistently said that they should be judged by their action with regards to them being the custodians of CCFC. I don't care that SISU are a hedge fund or investment fund, I don't care that they wanted to make tens of millions in profit from the sale of the club.that is their prerogative, what I do care about is CCFC.

What I will judge them on is how they look after CCFC and their loyal supporters (customers), continually referring to the actions of other parties are largely irrelevant, SISU and SISU alone are responsible for the club. So far they have been an utter disgrace

 

[albatross]

This is about planning process and obligations, it needs to be documented and neither the council, wasps or CSF have followed due process.

This needs sorting properly. Wasps and CSF will have no choice but to negotiate on this as its what Sport England will insist on.

I am glad we're challenging thr planning decision constructively. The planning meeting was nearly a month ago and wasps/CSF/council have still not provided the information to Sport England as requested. What have they got to hide? The only reason o can see is thah they are worried they can't offer the facilities that sport england will want expect them to provide with us, given they were instrumental in the initial planning approval 10-12 years ago.

Even Tony who Is about anti sisu as you get agrees with this letter.

Wasps don't hold all the aces, they will have to get it rubber stamped by sport england and that will likely mean providing facilities to safeguard the academy.

Let's get it done properly, get all of the people round the table and let's do it in an open and transparent manner, or are you against Sport England, FA and FL being there?

I'll leave you to moan on and push all blame onto the club, it's what you're best at.

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I dont think this is a constructive path, if anything it is obstructive. Dialogue is constructive, SISU have been extremely delinquent on that from for many years. Only now are they making conciliatory noises. Too little too late.

The letter only seems to focus on the self interest of CCFC, their academy. Sport England have a much wider brief and if we are looking at the loss of a couple of pitches on Site A that are then available on Site B with greater sport benefits to the wider community (including a 50m pool after the olympics) , then I don't hold out much hope for this line of appeal. Its just posturing prior to the review and potential damages that they will look to recoup

 

[dongonzalos]

This is about planning process and obligations, it needs to be documented and neither the council, wasps or CSF have followed due process.

This needs sorting properly. Wasps and CSF will have no choice but to negotiate on this as its what Sport England will insist on.

I am glad we're challenging thr planning decision constructively. The planning meeting was nearly a month ago and wasps/CSF/council have still not provided the information to Sport England as requested. What have they got to hide? The only reason o can see is thah they are worried they can't offer the facilities that sport england will want expect them to provide with us, given they were instrumental in the initial planning approval 10-12 years ago.

Even Tony who Is about anti sisu as you get agrees with this letter.

Wasps don't hold all the aces, they will have to get it rubber stamped by sport england and that will likely mean providing facilities to safeguard the academy.

Let's get it done properly, get all of the people round the table and let's do it in an open and transparent manner, or are you against Sport England, FA and FL being there?

I'll leave you to moan on and push all blame onto the club, it's what you're best at.

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Can these points be made
Without the 'I am sure you can explain this or I am it's just an over sight' type of comment at the end of them that is likely to get people backs up

I thought SISU are not the club or is that just when it suits?

hey ho as chief dave says thank god the Tim Fisher write such a restrained letter.

 

[stupot07]

Can these points be made
Without the 'I am sure you can explain this or I am it's just an over sight' type of comment at the end of them that is likely to get people backs up

I thought SISU are not the club or is that just when it suits?

hey ho as chief dave says thank god the Tim Fisher write such a restrained letter.

I think you'll find the letter is signed by Tim Fisher on behalf of thr CCFC board, not sisu. In fact sisu aren't mentioned in the letter, it has nothing to do with sisu. However, in the context of me using that term in relation to Tony (sorry Tony), I meant people who hate sisu and therefore disagree with everything the club does, because they see it as sisu. Tony (like all of us) doesn't like the owners, but believes this is a good letter and one that focuses on the planning process and obligations.

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[dongonzalos]

I think you'll find the letter is signed by Tim Fisher on behalf of thr CCFC board, not sisu. In fact sisu aren't mentioned in the letter, it has nothing to do with sisu.

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You mentioned them and my anti SISU views then said I blame the club for everything

You never answered me is it possible to make those points in the letter without the snippets that will get people's backs up?
Sometimes you have to take the blinkers off stu and stop letting your anti CCC and anti Wasps attitude clould every opinion you have.

Like the other day when I was explaining to you why I don't think SISU would head to Northampton again.
You had it pegged down as some attempt to put all the blame on the club again.
Very bizzare and a tad worrying.
Sometimes things are just as they are abd nit a blame game.
That letter had a better chance of success without the sarcasm
That's a simple fact of life (even from s 'Cov fan' )

 

[stupot07]

You mentioned them and my anti SISU views then said I blame the club for everything

Yeah, you hate sisu and are then extremely negative of everything the club do. I can can differentiate between sisu and the club, many can't.

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[skybluebeduff]

Well Tim has failed on this one too according to Simon Gilbert.

http://www.coventrytelegraph.net/news/coventry-news/wasps-plan-redevelop-home-coventry-11831656

 

[skybluebeduff]

He even struggles with a microphone in that video, the guy really is a waste of wage.