Court Case Thread! June 2018 (12 Viewers)

[Nick]

Because the valuation on the sale was made when it was empty. And if the sale never went ahead the arena would have stayed empty.

Not good news for us. But there is nothing we can do about it.

I know there isn't much we can do about it but it wasn't empty when the council voted on whether they should even sell it or not.

 

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[robbiekeane]

can anyone give me a 5 bullet point summary of latest developments please

 

[Nick]

can anyone give me a 5 bullet point summary of latest developments please

1. Joy has said she was targetted by a Council PR Campaign
2. SISU said everything was one transaction
3. Council bloke said he would understand that but Higgs were involved too
4. SISU said they want Wasps to pay loads of money to the council, if not they would have half the stadium
5. Didn't learn anything "new" or what the "new evidence" seemed to be. Pretty boring.

 

[Deleted member 5849]

can anyone give me a 5 bullet point summary of latest developments please

• Astute argues with Grendel
• Grendel Argues with Astute
• Astute argues with Nick
• Nick argues with Astute
• Various people ask for summaries of what's been happening

 

[stevefloyd]

Can we designate someone to post a different thread just summarising whats happened, save reading through pages of shite

 

[robbiekeane]

1. Joy has said she was targetted by a Council PR Campaign
2. SISU said everything was one transaction
3. Council bloke said he would understand that but Higgs were involved too
4. SISU said they want Wasps to pay loads of money to the council, if not they would have half the stadium
5. Didn't learn anything "new" or what the "new evidence" seemed to be. Pretty boring.

Thanks mate

 

[ccfcrob]

Fuck me this is depressing.

You always do this.

Why cant we all just get along.

WONT SOMEBODY PLEASE THINK OF THE CHILDREN !!!!!

 

[jordan210]

Looks like the Honeymoon of last season is over and we are back to bickering with each other

 

[block16]

Rather just have updates on here from somebody that actually knows the score than usual suspects that ALWAYS post making it really hard to find actual information

 

[clint van damme]

Lost another pint

I actually wanted a quick summary of the court case as I'm too lazy to read up on it.

I want to sleep with Beyoncé but neither has any realistic chance of happening.

 

[Colin Steins Smile]

Prediction - the case will conclude this morning and the learned judges will provide their decision in "x" weeks time. The outcome will be that SISU/CCFC will lose again and they will look for another court to appeal to .....ultimately the European Court. In the interim there will be civil case taken against WASPS to increase the pressure on them.
Or am I being cynical??? I just hope the season starts soon, so we can be distracted by whats on the field.

 

[fernandopartridge]

I maybe wrong but the way i see it civil action against wasps or council is only an option if sisu win the JR.

Welcome back John, hope you're well. Did you enjoy Wembley?

 

[fernandopartridge]

How would you value the extended lease anyway?
You couldn't base it on current tennants look at ccfc. A yearly contract who is to say we will be playing at the ricoh next year never mind when the extended portion of the lease starts.

ACL if struggling could have applied to extend its lease at the Ricoh to make itself more attractive to a takeover, particularly if Higgs wanted out.

 

[Nick]

ACL if struggling could have applied to extend its lease at the Ricoh to make itself more attractive to a takeover, particularly if Higgs wanted out.

It would also mean credit would be easier to get so that they could get better terms doesn't it?

 

[Grendel]

It would also mean credit would be easier to get so that they could get better terms doesn't it?

Yes it would.

 

[djr8369]

So the crux of the argument seems to be how can the valuation be based on the arena having a short lease if once you’ve purchased ACL you can simply extend the lease without cost and effectively add value?

What was the scenario SISU were offered, was it different to what Wasps were offered?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[Nick]

 

[Colin Steins Smile]

ACL if struggling could have applied to extend its lease at the Ricoh to make itself more attractive to a takeover, particularly if Higgs wanted out.

To extend the lease - would the Higgs Charity be required to provide any funding?

 

[matesx]

I want to sleep with Beyoncé but neither has any realistic chance of happening.

sleep with her???!

i wanna shag her mate

 

[wince]

So the crux of the argument seems to be how can the valuation be based on the arena having a short lease if once you’ve purchased ACL you can simply extend the lease without cost and effectively add value?

What was the scenario SISU were offered, was it different to what Wasps were offered?

I think that's about right , however the lease was owned 50/50 with the council and his charity , both party's had to agreed to the sale or it was no deal , SISU had fell out with the charity leaving the council to find someone they and the charity could deal with , the problem seems to be why was it so secret, I think its been explained that the council did not have to take the highest money offer only , there are other factors that can come into play

 

[Nick]

Another half day maybe needed!

 

[fernandopartridge]

To extend the lease - would the Higgs Charity be required to provide any funding?

The council is arguing that money isn't necessarily an important factor so not necessarily. The lease could have been extended for very little or even with the expectation of some sort of peppercorn rent.

 

[fernandopartridge]

Blimey, Leveson enquiry II

 

[Nick]

 

[duffer]

Might just be me, but those most recent phrases from the judge make me think that he feels there is a case to answer here. It's certainly not as open and shut as some seem to think, imho.

 

[Nick]

Valuation
James Goudie QC, representing Coventry City Council, is speaking again now.

He is dealing with criticisms made by Sisu’s QC that KPMG did not provide an independent market valuation of the asset and that it valued the asset in isolation.

He says the KPMG report details the scope of the work the valuers undertook.

Mr Goudie says KPMG were doing a number of things and “while they were doing some things that were not a valuation...does not take away from the fact that one of the things they were doing was a valuation”.

Live: Day two of Ricoh Arena row in Court of Appeal

 

[Fletch]

I think that's about right , however the lease was owned 50/50 with the council and his charity , both party's had to agreed to the sale or it was no deal , SISU had fell out with the charity leaving the council to find someone they and the charity could deal with , the problem seems to be why was it so secret, I think its been explained that the council did not have to take the highest money offer only , there are other factors that can come into play

Charity Commission legislation is quite clear regarding investment and it is the duty of the trustees to seek a maximum return, If Sisu's offer was more in financial terms than Wasps they have arguably failed their duties as trustees of registered charity, a preference over who they deal with does not come into it.

 

[Nick]

 

[fernandopartridge]

Charity Commission legislation is quite clear regarding investment and it is the duty of the trustees to seek a maximum return, If Sisu's offer was more in financial terms than Wasps they have arguably failed their duties as trustees of registered charity, a preference over who they deal with does not come into it.

They posted a load of waffle on their website about not dealing with SISU

 

[Nick]

"Singular lack of interest"
Mr Goudie is asked by Lord Justice Leveson if the judges should pay any attention to the fact that the claimants had shown interest in buying the stadium.

He says the claimants interest was an “interest of a very different nature because of their existing licence at the stadium”.

He adds: “As far as that was concerned although there was a good deal of general knowledge on what their approach was...there really had been a singular lack of interest shown.”

 

[fernandopartridge]

Council's argument seems a bit mixed up. Is the QC implicitly admitting that they might have done wrong, but it doesn't matter because the claimant hadn't made an offer anyway?

 

[Deleted member 5849]

Might just be me, but those most recent phrases from the judge make me think that he feels there is a case to answer here. It's certainly not as open and shut as some seem to think, imho.

I can't see it.

Much as I'd like to, I can't see it.

 

[ccfcway]

has Leveson used VAR yet ?

 

[Nick]

 

[Nick]

Wasps' offer exceeded valuation
Mr Goudie says Wasps’ ultimate offer exceeded KPMG’s first valuation.

He said: “We say the fact KPMG was conducting an official market valuation...Is sufficient to dispose of the particular criticism that they didn’t provide an independent market valuation.”

State aid
Mr Goudie says rules around state aid state that a public authority will not grant state aid if it first obtains an independent market valuation and then sells in line with that market valuation.

He says that is “exactly what the council did in this situation”.

Surely they just say "Here's the valuation KPMG gave us, here's what Wasps paid" ?