General Election 2019 thread (29 Viewers)

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SkyblueBazza

Well-Known Member
Monners said:
From experience, if you follow the advice and call the out of hours/non emergency NHS line (or whatever it is called), they will advise you to go to A&E with a child of that age. The same with an elderly relative.
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Which tends to suggest some poor unfortunate over-stressed, over-worked member of staff somewhere near the coal-face will eventually take the rap rather than one of their many managers

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theferret

Well-Known Member
Otis said:
Revisited this, ferret, because you are a poster I always have a lot of respect for, bit the simple fact seems to be that this boy was taken in with suspected pneumonia, so to say 'he was in with flu and wasn't given a bed because, well he had flu', cheapens the incident.

Do you know for certain he was used as a political prop? That would indeed be a pretty low thing to do, but from what I can see, a lot of this accusatory stuff has apparently come from internet trolls.
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To be fair, this seems to be the most complete account: 'It was chaos': Shocking photo shows Leeds four-year-old with suspected pneumonia forced to sleep on floor of LGI due to lack of beds

I think people should make up their own mind really. I don't think the parents should be demonised, because I don't think this was a stunt, but equally I don't like the way this was cynically spun and and used politically by hyenas in the media. What it boils down to is that a sick child was made to vacate their bed when a more urgent case came in because there was a lack of beds, which apparently was during the busiest period for the A&E department in 3 years.

There is a legitimate story here about NHS funding, but it didn't warrant the pile on and attempts to pin this on Boris personally. Stories of long waits in A&E and a lack of beds during peak times have been around throughout my life, regardless of what government is in power. I have been there myself, my son suffered from severe asthma as a toddler and we made regular visits. Very rarely were we offered a bed. The worst experience was when we lived in Spain and I had to hold my son in my arms for 9 hours while he struggled to breathe. It is not nice and this kid in Leeds was clearly poorly with flu and tonsillitis.

I don't like how these things are put in the face of politicians as though they are personally responsible, it adds nothing to the discussion. I am sure people died in hospital waiting rooms under Blair and Brown, and it would have been grossly unfair to blame them personally. There is a legitimate discussion to be had, but this was all used a bit cynically in my opinion. I hope the lad is recovering.
 
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SkyblueBazza

Well-Known Member
Brighton Sky Blue said:
No I want both parties held to the same scrutiny. They quite clearly aren’t
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I think there are many Tories that cry foul on the same point though tbh.

Labour want the Tories scrutinised but only on the areas they feel their policy really identifies with people. They don't want to be scrutinised themselves though...and vice-versa

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Otis

Otis

Well-Known Member
theferret said:
To be fair, this seems to be the most complete account: 'It was chaos': Shocking photo shows Leeds four-year-old with suspected pneumonia forced to sleep on floor of LGI due to lack of beds

I think people should make up their own mind really. I don't think the parents should be demonised, because I don't think this was a stunt, but equally I don't like the way this was cynically spun and and used politically by hyenas in the media. What it boils down to is that a sick child was made to vacate their bed when a more urgent case came in because there was a lack of beds, which apparently was during the busiest period for the A&E department in 3 years.

There is a legitimate story here about NHS funding, but it didn't warrant the pile on and attempts to pin this on Boris personally. Stories of long waits in A&E and a lack of beds during peak times have been around throughout my life, regardless of what government is in power. I have been there myself, my son suffered from severe asthma as a toddler and we made regular visits. Very rarely were we offered a bed. The worst experience was when we lived in Spain and I had to hold my son in my arms for 9 hours while he struggled to breathe. It is not nice and this kid in Leeds was clearly poorly with flu and tonsillitis.

I don't like how these things are put in the face of politicians as though there are personally responsible, it adds nothing to the discussion. I am sure people died in hospital waiting rooms under Blair and Brown, and we would have been grossly unfair to blame them personally. There is a legitimate discussion to be had, but this was all used a bit cynically in my opinion. I hope the lad is recovering.
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Yep, on first viewing, that does seem to be fair and balanced reporting.
 
Otis

Otis

Well-Known Member
SkyblueBazza said:
I think there are many Tories that cry foul on the same point though tbh.

Labour want the Tories scrutinised but only on the areas they feel their policy really identifies with people. They don't want to be scrutinised themselves though...and vice-versa

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All politicians should be scrutinised and need to be.

I wish there was more scrutiny instead of all the bunkum we are constantly dished up.
 
bezzer

bezzer

Well-Known Member
Astute said:
Just remember if you take anything out that isn't your tax free 25% it counts as income. So you could work part time and get taxed on it all depending how much you take out each year. And you also don't have to take out any or all of your 25% in one go. You could take out 10% and another 15% at a later date. Or leave it all in and only 75% of what you take out is taxable. The problem with that is the fees you will most probably pay. Half a % on 150k is £750 a year. Doesn't sound a lot. But 10 years is 7.5k.
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The SIPP I'm likely to invest in has flat rate charges for the initial investment (£10 per month) and the an additional £10 per month when drawdown is actioned. Percentage charges on large pots are very expensive, hence my advisor advising on a flat rate.
As for tax, my reduced hours and any income I take would be on the same rate I'm on now. But with a tax-free lump sum I doubt I'd need to touch my SIPP until I'm 60+
 
stupot07

stupot07

Well-Known Member
Deleted member 5849 said:
People will believe what they want to...
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Its ridiculous. I've already posted on here where the story came from. As if some parent has given their child the flu, gone to A&E, hoped for it to be busy, have a ridiculous wait and not be given bed, just so they can take a 2 second picture of the kid on the floor all for a political advantage.

This blaming of the parent is a dead cat to take away from how inept Boris was yesterday.



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Sky_Blue_Dreamer

Sky_Blue_Dreamer

Well-Known Member
chiefdave said:
More dodgy behaviour from the Conservatives today. Claiming Labour a Labour activist attacked Hancock. Of course this was unquestioningly reported on by the likes of Kuenssberg and Peston before anyone remembered mobile phones exist and have cameras in them. Predictably the whole thing was captured and turned out to be untrue. Kuenssberg and Peston forced to apologise but of course the damage is already done. Does nobody in the media fact check anymore?



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Kuennesburg has definitely not come across as impartial during this election campaign, and has shown poor journalistic ability in her reporting. But of course the BBC is a commie/leftie propaganda machine........
 
Grendel

Grendel

Well-Known Member
Sky_Blue_Dreamer said:
Kuennesburg has definitely not come across as impartial during this election campaign, and has shown poor journalistic ability in her reporting. But of course the BBC is a commie/leftie propaganda machine........
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Rubbish she is totally impartial and that’s why you don’t like her
 
Grendel

Grendel

Well-Known Member
Also I suggest to the guy on Five Live in the afternoons whose a walking advert for the Labour Party
 
Sky_Blue_Dreamer

Sky_Blue_Dreamer

Well-Known Member
Otis said:
BBC News - General election 2019: Boris Johnson's bad day shows election not over
Johnson's bad day shows election not over
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When does he have a good day?

If he wasn't leader they'd have locked him up in the same place they've put JRM so they can recite Greek poetry and conjugate Latin verbs together like a posh boys version of a special educational needs class.
 
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theferret

Well-Known Member
clint van damme said:
I do, just wanted to hear the opinion of someone who appears to have been taken in by it.
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Everyone seems to be suffering from some sort of collective amnesia. Back in 2010 we were told exactly what was going to happen. The IFS told us, pretty much every think-tank from left or right told us, the Tories told us, Labour said they would out-do Thatcher in how deep they would cut (direct quote from Labour chancellor), and we were told it would hurt for two parliaments. That is exactly what has happened. Where is the mystery? That we now have record employment levels, record tax take, earnings are rising and the cost of borrowing is low, the shackles are coming off. To question why the spending promises in this campaign were not implemented over the last 9 years displays complete political illiteracy.

Of course, there is much you can be critical of if you wish. Where the cuts were implemented, how deep they went, how we could have invested more in infrastructure and other specific areas to stimulate growth. Fine, but we had 8 years of austerity because that's exactly what everyone was promising.
 
Otis

Otis

Well-Known Member
The whole system needs a shake-up.

If we had some sort of proportional replacement system I would vote Green.

Wasted vote on Thursday though.
 
Sky_Blue_Dreamer

Sky_Blue_Dreamer

Well-Known Member
olderskyblue said:
I know. It’s a disgrace. My old ma in law fell and broke her hip back in 2008, and was stuck in a bed in a corridor for 5 hours before being seen. Fooking tories. Oh wait, labour were in power, and had been since 1997...,

in the last 4 months, been a regular visitor to Walsgrave and rugby hospitals, and apart from a similar A&E experience, (and parking issues) I have to say the service has been excellent. Wife has been seen within minutes of her appointment times, as have I.
nurses docs etc all very good, and kind.

From my point of view, the service was better than it used to be. . Appreciate this is a very short survey (2 people), but at least I know this is true, and not some fake bollocks to get all heated about.
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But as you say it's the A&E rather than pre-arranged appointments when you had a problem. A&E is where it's most likely to be critical to be seen quickly and given treatment.

Myself and my sister have had to go to the hospital a number of times in the last couple of years, all but once on pre-arranged appointments. The A&E appointment I was seen after around 2.5hrs, and my GP had phoned ahead to tell them I was coming in. The staff have been excellent, but waiting times etc have been hit and miss. Some appointments have been on time, others have been between 45mins-2hrs late. She had an operation and we had to be at the hospital at 7:30am. 4pm in the afternoon we were told it'd been cancelled and she had to wait another 3 months before it was rescheduled. But I do know others who've had it worse, one especially at the eye clinic.
 
clint van damme

clint van damme

Well-Known Member
theferret said:
Everyone seems to be suffering from some sort of collective amnesia. Back in 2010 we were told exactly what was going to happen. The IFS told us, pretty much every think-tank from left or right told us, the Tories told us, Labour said they would out-do Thatcher in how deep they would cut (direct quote from Labour chancellor), and we were told it would hurt for two parliaments. That is exactly what has happened. Where is the mystery? That we now have record employment levels, record tax take, earnings are rising and the cost of borrowing is low, the shackles are coming off. To question why the spending promises in this campaign were not implemented over the last 9 years displays complete political illiteracy.

Of course, there is much you can be critical of if you wish. Where the cuts were implemented, how deep they went, how we could have invested more in infrastructure and other specific areas to stimulate growth. Fine, but we had 8 years of austerity because that's exactly what everyone was promising.
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there are lies regarding public spending in the first few paragraphs of the 2010. tory manifesto. Or maybe I've got that wrong and it's just my political illiteracy at play.
 
hill83

hill83

Well-Known Member
The woman who posted the lie that the kid lying on the floor in hospital was staged is now saying her account was hacked.

giphy.gif


Never seen anything like it. The internet truly is a blessing and a curse.
 
Otis

Otis

Well-Known Member
Otis said:
BBC News - General election 2019: Ads are 'indecent, dishonest and untruthful'
Election ads: 'Indecent, dishonest and untruthful'

31 incidents of dishonesty. It has to stop.
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For the Conservatives, it said that 88% (5,952) of the party's most widely promoted ads either featured claims which had been flagged by independent fact-checking organisations including BBC Reality Check as not correct or not entirely correct.

That is a disgrace.
 
Otis

Otis

Well-Known Member
hill83 said:
The woman who posted the lie that the kid lying on the floor in hospital was staged is now saying her account was hacked.

giphy.gif


Never seen anything like it. The internet truly is a blessing and a curse.
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What I can't get my head round, is how CC4L's account seemingly gets hacked every single day and for 24 hours at a time.
 
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Sky_Blue_Dreamer

Sky_Blue_Dreamer

Well-Known Member
theferret said:
Of course, some criticism of Israel is labelled anti-semitism when it is not. That is entirely valid. Equally, some stuff has gone way beyond legitimate criticism though.
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It does work both ways. Some are using anti-semitism to hide legitimate criticism of Israeli policy behind. Others are using legitimate criticism of Israeli policy to hide their anti-semitism behind.
 
M

Monners

Well-Known Member
Otis said:
The whole system needs a shake-up.

If we had some sort of proportional replacement system I would vote Green.

Wasted vote on Thursday though.
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Same here Otis. I do in local and EU (ha!) elections, and want to vote for them in this one - but I live in a marginal seat, and Johnson and his cronies have pissed me off so much that I am going all so called tactical (which is pretty negative really). Hay ho
 
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