General Election 2019 thread (16 Viewers)

[CCFCSteve]

Also pretty stark that the only labour leader to win an election in 40 years is Blair, who most people despise.

To be fair to Blair it was the iraq war and his behaviour (money grabbing) post office that have lead to that public view. From memory he did have a positive impact especially early stages.

Just seen some of Johnsons speech, where he was quite magnanimous about the labour heartland vote, recognising it might not stick with them forever.

 

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[clint van damme]

This is where the disconnect between members and voters has been highlighted. Does Corbyn stay around to try and ensure his successor will follow his path?
How damaging will the fight for the future direction of the Labour Party be?

good question, potentially very.
If someone can come to prominence and pull the factions together then the party's got itself a good leader.

 

[clint van damme]

It isn’t it’s just nonsense

U.S. Health Care Industry Seeks Growing Share of U.K.’s System

 

[Johnnythespider]

He wasn't until he got into bed with the right wingers to win power.

hence the hope... but also the concern. He's not a principled politician, but hopefully the old habits take precedence over the new allies.

His brother didn't turn his back on him for nothing, if he comes back onto the scene it might indicate a softening in his position, I'm not holding my breath

 

[fatso]

My only hope domestically (and internationally, to an extent) is that with a relatively big majority, he can sack off the right wingers and revert to 'old' Boris.

I'd love to see labour purge itself of the extreme left wingers, labour has become the socialist party thanks to momentum, maybe we can see a more centralist political future from now on.

 

[Grendel]

Labour constantly blaming Brexit is not going to help them though as I said yesterday - walk in the middle of a busy road and you get run over.

The reality is though even in many marginal seats where remain was strong they have been massacred and in fact without the Brexit Party they would have been a lot worse. In coventry they clung on despite fighting an arrogant campaign with dire candidates

The extreme policies were met with derision - if labour think (as I believe they will) that socialism is a popular pill they will be chocking for many many years

 

[tisza]

good question, potentially very.
If someone can come to prominence and pull the factions together then the party's got itself a good leader.

by definition will it have to be a compromise candidate?

 

[CCFCSteve]

One silver lining for me is the collapse in the Lib Dem vote. Never forgiven them for 2010 and Swindon’s hubris brought us to this point so her being personally affected by the bloodbath is poetic justice. Also those that thought they could jump ship from party to party missing out is good news, glad we don’t need to hear from the likes of Chukka again.

Johnson can now do whatever he wants, I wonder if this will mean he softens a bit as no longer in tow to the ERG.

Bye bye Scotland though.

The Lib Dem’s missed a massive opportunity in this election !

Mentioned earlier in response to NW that Johnson isn’t hard right and ERG will be under better control with a majority. Reshuffle will be interesting. With hindsight Johnsons previous cabinet picks were the correct people for the correct time (it meant he could demonstrate support for his deal as he had key brexiteers signing up to it)

I still hope Scotland remains part of the U.K.. I’m still not convinced it will good for the Scots, let alone the rest of the U.K. I’ve also mentioned the Salmond case previously. Ultimately though, with Brexit and Scotland being strong remain, whoever was in power the SNP vote was likely to stay strong. An independence vote was guaranteed in this parliament under a Labour/SNP coalition it isn’t currently although pressure will obviously increase

 

[Grendel]

U.S. Health Care Industry Seeks Growing Share of U.K.’s System

Not privatisation and not anything like the absurd costs that imbecile Barry Gardiner was trying to claim

 

[Alan Dugdales Moustache]

The switch from unionist to nationalist, along with a border somewhere in the Irish Sea, gives momentum.

Still, I'm sure there's a plan and it'll all be ok!

A demond a rekynt nyyy ! No surrender. Baaaaaastards !

 

[Grendel]

Johnson has been asked when he’s getting Brexit done. He said later and first his getting breakfast done

lol

 

[CovInEssex]

Labour need to get out of London and move more centre. With a majority like that it's probably going to be 10 years of BoJo.

 

[richnrg]

Johnson has been asked when he’s getting Brexit done. He said later and first his getting breakfast done

lol

like him or loathe him, he's good entertainment -(even when fed lines) - e.g "Corbyn neutral"

 

[chiefdave]

Also pretty stark that the only labour leader to win an election in 40 years is Blair, who most people despise.

Be interesting to see what direction they go in. Certainly some hard choices for them coming up.

Mentioned before that recently I've considered not voting, something I've not considered in the past. Just feel like I'm running out of options. If Labour were to go back to the Blair years and offer up Tory-lite that would be another option off the list.

 

[Mcbean]

the East coast main lines most successful period over the last 20 years was when it was taken back in to public ownership, (I think 2009 - 2013 but could be wrong).
We have bailed out its failing franchisees with public money on more than one occasion, the arguments against don't add up.
I don't think everything should be nationalised in the same way I don't think everything should be privatised, but as the example above proves, both can have their place. It's about practicality not ideology.

I agree - But others I couldn’t see that working

One silver lining for me is the collapse in the Lib Dem vote. Never forgiven them for 2010 and Swindon’s hubris brought us to this point so her being personally affected by the bloodbath is poetic justice. Also those that thought they could jump ship from party to party missing out is good news, glad we don’t need to hear from the likes of Chukka again.

Johnson can now do whatever he wants, I wonder if this will mean he softens a bit as no longer in tow to the ERG.

Bye bye Scotland though.

and maybe N Ireland ?

 

[chiefdave]

His reshuffle will be interesting NW. As many have tried to say, at heart he is relatively liberal (Osborne, who I have little time for, was saying last night that johnson is not a big advocate of small state either) yet others have tried to paint the picture that he’s a hard right, austerity loving politician...this is not the case.

I don't hold much hope that Johnson's personal preference will come through. He's repeatedly shown himself to be happy to switch his view on a whim.

My hope is that there are now moves to try and unite a bitterly divided country. The reshuffle could give an indication of that, if there is to be any sort of olive branch the likes of Patel and Rees-Mogg need to be out of the picture. Not very confident that will be the case.

 

[Grendel]

Scotland won’t go independent it’s just nonsense - under the terms of the Belfast treaty Ireland can have a referendum but again will likely stay put

 

[Ricketts]

Ah - apologies, it paled due to the small 't'. Tories should have a capital 'T' - like you afforded all the others.

So maybe it is your own struggle not mine?

Sent from my SM-G935F using Tapatalk

I am ot sure about that. Probably due to the Labour party’s obsession to destroy grammar schools to the level down the education system.

Tories is a shorthand term for Conservatives and I don’t think it should be capitalised any differently than you wouldn’t capitalise ‘socialists’ or ‘lefties’.

Anyway it was a great night for the country and democracy. Quite astounded just how many people can’t say that.

 

[Deleted member 5849]

It isn’t it’s just nonsense

Looks like we get a chance to test whether it is...

 

[CCFCSteve]

like him or loathe him, he's good entertainment -(even when fed lines) - e.g "Corbyn neutral"

I hope we see a bit more of the real Johnson now so people can make a proper decision on him, good or bad. He was obviously kept well out of the way as he had a major fuck up in him !

Personally I don’t think he’s the evil right winger he’s been made out to be by some (lily and stormzy)...loose with the truth, possibly, very ‘political’ but I get the feeling deep down he’s not anywhere near as bad as he’s been made out to be by some commentators.

 

[CCFCSteve]

Looks like we get a chance to test whether it is...

Exactly NW. If he fucks over the public and NHS he’ll quite rightly be voted out next time

 

[Grendel]

Corbyn was a car crash Johnson didn’t even get out of first gear in the election - looking at those lining up to take over from Corbyn could be a long time in the tumbleweed

 

[tisza]

Mentioned earlier in response to NW that Johnson isn’t hard right and ERG will be under better control with a majority. Reshuffle will be interesting. With hindsight Johnsons previous cabinet picks were the correct people for the correct time (it meant he could demonstrate support for his deal as he had key brexiteers signing up to it)

I still hope Scotland remains part of the U.K.. I’m still not convinced it will good for the Scots, let alone the rest of the U.K. I’ve also mentioned the Salmond case previously. Ultimately though, with Brexit and Scotland being strong remain, whoever was in power the SNP vote was likely to stay strong. An independence vote was guaranteed in this parliament under a Labour/SNP coalition it isn’t currently although pressure will obviously increase

Reshuffle inevitable as there will need to Cabinet/ministerial representation for these "new" Northern seats.
Scottish independence isn't black and white. An assumption that Scotland can remain in EU is up for debate. Also the practicalities of how free trade and movement could happen in Scotland when there are already so many issues over the nature of an Irish border.

 

[Earlsdon_Skyblue1]

Let's face it, they are all shit.

Trying to ignore Brexit was always going to turn out to be a silly move one day, but it also boils down to the opposition of Boris just being even worse than him.

Hopefully today is the day politics in the UK has a wake up call and pulls itself together. It's been a shambles for too long.

 

[Deleted member 5849]

Personally I don’t think he’s the evil right winger he’s been made out to be by some (lily and stormzy)...loose with the truth, possibly, very ‘political’ but I get the feeling deep down he’s not anywhere near as bad as he’s been made out to be by some commentators.

The main issue I've always had with him is his decision making is what's best for him rather than the country, and I've never thought that about, well... any Prime Minister before, whether I've agreed with them or not.

Evil right winger? Nope. But prepared to sell out to evil right wingers if to his advantage? Yup. Hell, he'd buddy up with Corbyn if he thought it was a vote winner!

 

[clint van damme]

Not privatisation and not anything like the absurd costs that imbecile Barry Gardiner was trying to claim

They're not going to go straight to an American style system are they?
They're greedy but they're not stupid

 

[Grendel]

They're not going to go straight to an American style system are they?
They're greedy but they're not stupid

It’s not happening

 

[clint van damme]

by definition will it have to be a compromise candidate?

I'd say so but who that will be I'm not sure.

 

[Deleted member 5849]

Corbyn was a car crash Johnson didn’t even get out of first gear in the election - looking at those lining up to take over from Corbyn could be a long time in the tumbleweed

This result will give more weight to Blair when he re-enters the debate mind you. I don't think it's as straightforward as it could be, although it probably needs the politicians to be as cynical as the Conservatives and make a deal among themselves over who can win an election, before putting it to the members.

 

[shmmeee]

@shmmeee where you at my friend? Crying all ya socialist tears away hahahahahahahahaha

Morning Dom. Labour needed the kick up the arse and I hope they learn the right lessons.

Been asking my Brexit mates in my group chat for something to feel positive about this morning. They have come up with “we might get trade deals in ten to twenty years” and “remainers are upset”. Any advance?

Future is yours now. What you going to do with it?

 

[skybluegod]

As much as most Labour supporters avoid it, the party is so out of touch.

As a young man, someone who believes in the democratic vote and who values sound long-term planning, there was only one party who I could vote for and that was the conservatives. Was that because of their amazing manifesto or their like-able candidates no. It was because they didn't need to be good they just needed to be better than the alternative which is clear that is what they are. Which is wrong but sadly the truth.

The claim that Labour is for the working class is absolute bollocks. On paper yes. In reality anyone with business sense could see that that their polices would have a terrible affect on so many lives. Increasing minimum wage is great, but would only lead to mass redundancy/businesses going bust. I know for a fact our business had to create a business case for the impact of it and it would have led to almost a third of the company being at risk.

Did I like Labour's policies? A number of them yes. Did i agree with them? No. If i took a view about what i wanted for the next 5 years then Labour wins handsdown. If i took a view of the next 40 years of working life and where I want to be in terms of career progression and where i want the economy to be, then the party wasn't for me. I believe in bringing people up tot he same level not bringing the richest down. That doesn't make sense to me. The solution is to make other people's lives worse, to make someone else's better how is that equal? It should be about the underlying reasons as to why people are in a lower class financially etc.

Finally, and as others have said- the lack of of a stance on Brexit is embarrassing. What Corbyn was doing wasn't leadership and he put himself in a position where it was impossible to win, he was never going to get the leave vote, and the Lib dems were going to get the devoted remain voters. As much as people say 'vote for policy' you don't you vote for people you vote for a leader, and in reality there was two options, Corbyn was the worst out of all of the parties for me let alone just the conservatives.

 

[Grendel]

Morning Dom. Labour needed the kick up the arse and I hope they learn the right lessons.

Been asking my Brexit mates in my group chat for something to feel positive about this morning. They have come up with “we might get trade deals in ten to twenty years” and “remainers are upset”. Any advance?

Future is yours now. What you going to do with it?

Oh dear

 

[tisza]

For those suggesting yesterday is the beginning of Scottish independence worth noting the SNP share of the vote was still the same % as that voted to leave in the 2014 referendum - 45%.

 

[shmmeee]

This result will give more weight to Blair when he re-enters the debate mind you. I don't think it's as straightforward as it could be, although it probably needs the politicians to be as cynical as the Conservatives and make a deal among themselves over who can win an election, before putting it to the members.

Blairism would lose as well. The reason I voted Corbyn in 2015 was the Blairites were even further out of touch. Everything was just “high tech jobs will save us”.

We need some old Labour values mixed with Blairite economics I reckon.

 

[chiefdave]

Scottish independence isn't black and white. An assumption that Scotland can remain in EU is up for debate. Also the practicalities of how free trade and movement could happen in Scotland when there are already so many issues over the nature of an Irish border.

Would be interesting to see the campaign if there were another referendum given that last time it was based on 'better together' and staying in the EU!

Don't think the EU would be beyond bending the rules to somehow allow Scotland to stay in on current terms, eg: keep the pound, although they'd have to balance that with concerns about the likes of Gibraltar and Catalan.

Wasn't that far back that leaving the EU and the breaking of the UK would have been dismissed as ridiculous but not, while its not imminent, it doesn't seem quite so crazy.