New Labour Leader (15 Viewers)

[Grendel]

I can tell you one thing for certain, I'm not being Diane Abbott!

Given his lack of ability to understand what the data in front of him means that’s Shmmee all day long

 

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[Sky_Blue_Dreamer]

I can tell you one thing for certain, I'm not being Diane Abbott!

I'll tell you three things for certain, I'm not being Diane Abbott!

 

[shmmeee]

'Red side' wouldn't have me. They'd see me as a traitor for not voting for Corbyn in either of his two elections.

Jess Phillips it is then

 

[shmmeee]

I hear what you say, but I’m concerned that momentum’s supporters along with the trade union mafia will come together to elect another hard left leader who is willing to dance to their tune, deals get done behind closed doors to guarantee support, and another Corbyn stooge could sell total disaster n 5 years time.

If we get Rebecca Long-Bailey you’ll know that’s happened. I honestly can’t tell which way it’ll go right now. I think there’s a large chunk of Momentum that aren’t as hard left as the leadership and have just had their first taste of political reality. Also Starmer has positioned himself well by working with Corbyn.

 

[SkyblueBazza]

Wait this is fun

Fatso is Boris
G is Mogg
Bazza is David Davis
Westcountry is the other dude with the silly blond hair

On the red side

Ian is Starmer
Dreamer is Richard Burgon

Not sure who Astute is

Yes Jeremy. You have all the right qualities. Out of step, no grasp on reality & a loser

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[Brighton Sky Blue]

Yes Jeremy. You have all the right qualities. Out of step, no grasp on reality & a loser

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Oh come now, that’s not very nice. Don’t cut too deep x

 

[Brighton Sky Blue]

I can tell you one thing for certain, I'm not being Diane Abbott!

Tell you what Baz can cross party lines and do the Diane

 

[Brighton Sky Blue]

I’m never Michael Fabricant,More like Jacob:woot:

You both claim to be in the West Country but I only believe one

 

[Astute]

I could ask why you are constantly having a go at the likes of schmeee, BSB, Tony etc on here having a go at Johnson but leave the likes of Dom, Grendel etc relatively unscathed in comparison? Your criticism of Corbyn and the Labour party on here made me surprised to find out you were traditionally a Labour supporter and not only that that you'd vote Labour or no-one.

Maybe it's that starting point that you've ended up being incredibly disappointed with the direction Labour has taken and so notice their errors etc more. I'm coming from the other direction - I was far more likely to vote Tory in my younger days and saw it as the party of opportunity if you work hard. Maybe that was my own naivety but policies which prop up the rich and powerful is not providing opportunity and maybe I notice that more.

You are chatting shite and get backed up by the usual crew.

Or would you like to find just one time I have had a go at anyone for having a go at Boris. Of course not. You are one of several who makes things up then gets backed up by the same people time after time. Why not ask thise you quote if I have disagreed with them. Of course you won't. But I do. I don't pull anyone up for their views. But I pull people up for incorrect information. And they do the same to me. The names you come out with are not like the group of happy clappers you are in that never say anything against each other even though you can be so clearly wrong at times.

And yet again this post will be ignored or twisted by the same people. Then the same thing will be said yet again even though it is a lie.

 

[Astute]

If we get Rebecca Long-Bailey you’ll know that’s happened. I honestly can’t tell which way it’ll go right now. I think there’s a large chunk of Momentum that aren’t as hard left as the leadership and have just had their first taste of political reality. Also Starmer has positioned himself well by working with Corbyn.

Someone has positioned themself well by working with Corbyn? That could go either way.

We need to get back to basics. Walk before we can run. Not offer the world but offer what is needed by the people in need. Protect what improves lives.

We need to move away from present policies. Out with the old And change direction? Complete clear out?

Starmer has always been my choice although most disagreed with me. But he hasn't been tainted by what has been going on. He has kept in the background.

Interesting times ahead?

 

[Sick Boy]

It has to be Starmer for me

 

[shmmeee]

Clive Lewis


I’m standing to be Labour leader so the truth can be heard | Clive Lewis

Ex-soldier, fan of PR and quite left wing but not Corbynite.

Pros: Young, black, decent back story

Cons: punches walls, loses friends, “on your knees bitch”

 

[Sick Boy]

View attachment 13729

Clive Lewis
View attachment 13730

I’m standing to be Labour leader so the truth can be heard | Clive Lewis

Ex-soldier, fan of PR and quite left wing but not Corbynite.

Pros: Young, black, decent back story

Cons: punches walls, loses friends, “on your knees bitch”

No thanks, it’d just hand more power to the Momentum lot who I think are largely to blame for where the party is now.

 

[shmmeee]

Someone has positioned themself well by working with Corbyn? That could go either way.

We need to get back to basics. Walk before we can run. Not offer the world but offer what is needed by the people in need. Protect what improves lives.

We need to move away from present policies. Out with the old And change direction? Complete clear out?

Starmer has always been my choice although most disagreed with me. But he hasn't been tainted by what has been going on. He has kept in the background.

Interesting times ahead?

Well his first job is to convince the membership so that’s why working with Corbyn works in his favour.

I like Starmer, not been massively impressed by his pitch so far but I think he realises he’s got to get the membership first.

I am worried he’s too Remainer for a post Brexit Britain, but we’ll see.

 

[Astute]

Well his first job is to convince the membership so that’s why working with Corbyn works in his favour.

I like Starmer, not been massively impressed by his pitch so far but I think he realises he’s got to get the membership first.

I am worried he’s too Remainer for a post Brexit Britain, but we’ll see.

To me it doesn't matter what their outlook on Brexit is as long as they have been truthful in what they have said and not gone on constant rants on the subject.

When Corbyn goes we need to move direction. Most people....even Corbyn....admit that his plan....or whoever came out with it...... was wrong. So why does the next leader have to be onside with Corbyn?

And even someone with the intelligence to be able to rip an idiot apart with words would be a major bonus. If Brexit is ever done Boris will be stuck for something to say. We would then have our best chance of getting voted in since Bliar.

 

[chiefdave]

To me it doesn't matter what their outlook on Brexit is as long as they have been truthful in what they have said and not gone on constant rants on the subject.

When Corbyn goes we need to move direction. Most people....even Corbyn....admit that his plan....or whoever came out with it...... was wrong. So why does the next leader have to be onside with Corbyn?

And even someone with the intelligence to be able to rip an idiot apart with words would be a major bonus. If Brexit is ever done Boris will be stuck for something to say. We would then have our best chance of getting voted in since Bliar.

Agreed, Brexit should really be a non-issue by the next election anyway so who cares if someone was leave or remain. I don't buy into all this traitor rubbish. A good chunk of the population voted remain and there's no reason they shouldn't have had their view represented in parliament.

Seeing Starmer go up against Johnson in PMQs would be entertaining I think. Can see him making light work of Johnson.

He seems the obvious candidate but my concern is he's played his cards so close to his chest nobody really knows what he'd be like as leader and if he'd go down the Blair path.

Of course the membership may decide they want to go down a Blairite road but if they do they will lose some of their current support, the calculation would then be would they attract enough people who voted for other parties this time round to more than offset that.

 

[Sky_Blue_Dreamer]

You are chatting shite and get backed up by the usual crew.

Or would you like to find just one time I have had a go at anyone for having a go at Boris. Of course not. You are one of several who makes things up then gets backed up by the same people time after time. Why not ask thise you quote if I have disagreed with them. Of course you won't. But I do. I don't pull anyone up for their views. But I pull people up for incorrect information. And they do the same to me. The names you come out with are not like the group of happy clappers you are in that never say anything against each other even though you can be so clearly wrong at times.

And yet again this post will be ignored or twisted by the same people. Then the same thing will be said yet again even though it is a lie.

That's your perception of your position. \It's not mine. When you talk about things being twisted, you're twisting what I've said to suit your own perception of what you think I'm doing.

 

[shmmeee]

Agreed, Brexit should really be a non-issue by the next election anyway so who cares if someone was leave or remain. I don't buy into all this traitor rubbish. A good chunk of the population voted remain and there's no reason they shouldn't have had their view represented in parliament.

Seeing Starmer go up against Johnson in PMQs would be entertaining I think. Can see him making light work of Johnson.

He seems the obvious candidate but my concern is he's played his cards so close to his chest nobody really knows what he'd be like as leader and if he'd go down the Blair path.

Of course the membership may decide they want to go down a Blairite road but if they do they will lose some of their current support, the calculation would then be would they attract enough people who voted for other parties this time round to more than offset that.

I really think all this talk of which faction is putting the cart before horse.

Start from getting elected:

- Who is our voter coalition? Look at polling data, which seats are winnable with which voters
- What do those voters value? Lots of data around this again
- Where do our values align? Put together a strong offer on this and lead with it
- Where do they not? What’s a compromise position we can come to? Must be defendable in interviews but also reassure those unsure of us
- Which leader polls well with the public and can argue this case?

Ive heard none of this mentioned in the discussions I’ve seen. Just navel gazing about which thin sliver of left wing thought does each person subscribe to.

It’s not about not being left wing. As an example take nationalisation. Instead of offering to nationalise everything that moves day one, start small, show it works, then move on later to the case for more areas.

There are some things (trident, patriotism) that may not align with a lot of Labour voters but are the price the British voters charge for entry.

Basically the Blairism I believe in is facing outwards towards voters, not inwards towards ourselves. The Tories win because they focus on winning. They aren’t any less right wing for it. And basic democracy is if the majority of people don’t agree you don’t do it, instead you work towards changing their mind while reassuring them. Look at the effort put into denigrating the BBC for years before they finally pull the trigger likely this parliament to get rid. Ten years ago the public would never have accepted that, but here we are.

 

[Astute]

That's your perception of your position. \It's not mine. When you talk about things being twisted, you're twisting what I've said to suit your own perception of what you think I'm doing.

I know what my position is. I am sitting in France with my wife and kids. My wife and kids live in France. I spend a quarter of my time in France. Yet I get idiotic comments from people like yourself frequently who keep making things up.

I need Brexit to fail to make things easy. But that doesn't mean that I have to look at anything with a bias. If you look at something with a bias you end up knowing what the result will be and getting it totally wrong. Just like Labour were going to catch up with the Tories....

 

[Astute]

I really think all this talk of which faction is putting the cart before horse.

Start from getting elected:

- Who is our voter coalition? Look at polling data, which seats are winnable with which voters
- What do those voters value? Lots of data around this again
- Where do our values align? Put together a strong offer on this and lead with it
- Where do they not? What’s a compromise position we can come to? Must be defendable in interviews but also reassure those unsure of us
- Which leader polls well with the public and can argue this case?

Ive heard none of this mentioned in the discussions I’ve seen. Just navel gazing about which thin sliver of left wing thought does each person subscribe to.

It’s not about not being left wing. As an example take nationalisation. Instead of offering to nationalise everything that moves day one, start small, show it works, then move on later to the case for more areas.

There are some things (trident, patriotism) that may not align with a lot of Labour voters but are the price the British voters charge for entry.

Basically the Blairism I believe in is facing outwards towards voters, not inwards towards ourselves. The Tories win because they focus on winning. They aren’t any less right wing for it. And basic democracy is if the majority of people don’t agree you don’t do it, instead you work towards changing their mind while reassuring them. Look at the effort put into denigrating the BBC for years before they finally pull the trigger likely this parliament to get rid. Ten years ago the public would never have accepted that, but here we are.

Just simplify things.

A leader with no skeletons in the closet. One that speaks loud and clear. One that doesn't have mates or ex partners from 30 to 40 years ago promoted to top positions but give them to those with the most ability.

Just these few points alone would make Labour much more agreeable to the public.

Then less left wing. Voters will need to be enticed back from the Tories. And being the total opposite of the Tories most probably won't work unless they fuck up big time.

 

[SkyblueBazza]

Oh come now, that’s not very nice. Don’t cut too deep x

;-)

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[SkyblueBazza]

Tell you what Baz can cross party lines and do the Diane

Only on weekends

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[Brighton Sky Blue]

;-)

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Love it when you treat me rough

 

[Ian1779]

I'll tell you three things for certain, I'm not being Diane Abbott!

But if you were - you’d still be infinitely more competent than Dominic Raab.

 

[shmmeee]

Poll from the Labour subreddit. Trends very young and Corbynite there for reference. Gives me some hope:

 

[chiefdave]

Poll from the Labour subreddit. Trends very young and Corbynite there for reference. Gives me some hope:

What happened to the cult of Corbyn then? Assuming it is Starmer, and it seems his to lose at the moment, wonder who he would go for as deputy. Does he pick Long-Bailey or Raynor to keep the left happy or go with someone more mainstream.

 

[Ian1779]

What happened to the cult of Corbyn then? Assuming it is Starmer, and it seems his to lose at the moment, wonder who he would go for as deputy. Does he pick Long-Bailey or Raynor to keep the left happy or go with someone more mainstream.

Does he even get a pick? I know we do as members but is he involved? I also seem to remember talk of having 2 at the last conference.

 

[shmmeee]

I just hope Nandy gets a prominent role. Her analysis post Brexit has been spot on.

Saw this the other day and while she lacks charisma for leadership, she’s clearly got great intellect and empathy.

 

[chiefdave]

Does he even get a pick? I know we do as members but is he involved? I also seem to remember talk of having 2 at the last conference.

No idea, I read that Long-Bailey and Raynor was a joint leader and deputy bid so assumed they picked. Maybe they elect a leader then do the whole thing again for deputy. Suppose that is more democratic but it drags things out.

 

[Ian1779]

No idea, I read that Long-Bailey and Raynor was a joint leader and deputy bid so assumed they picked. Maybe they elect a leader then do the whole thing again for deputy. Suppose that is more democratic but it drags things out.

I was assuming they would happen at the same time. Wasn’t a member for the vote in 2015.

 

[Astute]

Poll from the Labour subreddit. Trends very young and Corbynite there for reference. Gives me some hope:

View attachment 13738

Some good news at last. Someone who would have me at the front of the queue to vote for again.

 

[Astute]

What happened to the cult of Corbyn then? Assuming it is Starmer, and it seems his to lose at the moment, wonder who he would go for as deputy. Does he pick Long-Bailey or Raynor to keep the left happy or go with someone more mainstream.

You would hope that it would be someone who wants similar policies to go through. Otherwise we could have problems before we even get started. After the last few years of infighting we need to unite.

 

[Deleted member 5849]

I was assuming they would happen at the same time. Wasn’t a member for the vote in 2015.

The deputy leader gets elected too. Usually they seem to like to balance it out, so if the leader is centrist, they go old-school (think Prescott to Blair) or if the other way round, they go a bit centre (think Healey to Foot, or even Watson to Corbyn).

 

[shmmeee]

No idea, I read that Long-Bailey and Raynor was a joint leader and deputy bid so assumed they picked. Maybe they elect a leader then do the whole thing again for deputy. Suppose that is more democratic but it drags things out.

Both at the same time assuming it’s like 2015

 

[shmmeee]

The deputy leader gets elected too. Usually they seem to like to balance it out, so if the leader is centrist, they go old-school (think Prescott to Blair) or if the other way round, they go a bit centre (think Healey to Foot, or even Watson to Corbyn).

Believe it or not but Watson wasn’t really seen as centrist in 2015, I voted Corbyn/Watson mostly because of his record fighting Murdoch and (at the time) the pedo thing. Obviously the second didn’t work out so well.

It was only once he started working against Corbyn that the membership got annoyed.