Brighton Sky Blue
Well-Known Member
Interesting watching Question Time where the Tory MP called Starmer's plans more radical than Truss, just after a Financial Times person said substantively they're not dissimilar to Jeremy Hunt's
Do you want to discuss boring politics? (10 Viewers)
- Thread starter mrtrench
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fernandopartridge
Well-Known Member
It's nonsense and it's exactly the same narrative that'll under pin the savage austerity of Sunak
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Labour are currently polling 20-30+ points ahead of Tories. This is based pretty on competency with a bit more compassion which is obviously the right strategy at the moment so why change it ?!*
The only way I can see Labour fucking this up is all of a sudden coming up with a load of radical/transformative policies that scare a proportion of the electorate into sticking with what they know….however shit they are
ultimately they need appeal to the whole country. They can also do more transformative stuff once in power and after economy etc has stabilised
*if Sunak wins, Labour will probably have to up it’s game/offer more rather than just focus on competency. However there’s challenging economic times ahead, inflation/energy prices and likely increased unemployment on way as well as potential divisions in the Tory party still, so I’d imagine just being seen as a safer, sensible, competent pair of hands will be enough to win next election barring a significant global event/improvements pre GE
shmmeee
Well-Known Member
Did you miss the recent PM who spooked the markets and lasted less time than a lettuce?
shmmeee
Well-Known Member
I think the right angle is going to be “why is this very rich man not getting his very rich mates to pay for the mistake his other mates made?”
Labour need some serious proposals on taxing the very wealthy that Sunak will find hard to argue against thanks to being one of the very wealthy.
fernandopartridge
Well-Known Member
Are you suggesting that actual investment is the same as tax cuts for the very rich?
fernandopartridge
Well-Known Member
The premise of the post I responded to was that Sunak had no chance of winning
Yeah, I agree. He’s very unlikely to win, I was just saying Labour moving too far away from what they have been doing might open the door a little
skybluetony176
Well-Known Member
I think we all realise that we’re in the shit and will all have to pay. The difference between the Tories and Labour is Labour plan to make dealing with that shit fairer. Actual windfall tax on windfall profits, closing tax loopholes including non dom status and charity status for private education. The fact is picking up the cost of the mess the country is in will be fairer under Labour than it will the Tories and that’s enough.
shmmeee
Well-Known Member
Im saying radical economics may not go down well. I think the first term Labour are going to have to show they aren’t mental. They’re going to have to balance day to day spending, which was the issue with the tax cuts. So they’ll need to find extra revenue from somewhere if they don’t want austerity.
Yeah, that will be the angle of attack, especially if inflation continues so the public are squeezed even more. Any decision to not support people will be met with ‘he doesn’t understand what it’s like to be us’
It will be interesting to see how he combats that.
ps theres no doubt in my mind that Johnson will be planning a return if/when Tories lose next election
shmmeee
Well-Known Member
I think what will do for Johnson is that under Sunak it’s the “red wall” seats they’re mostly likely to lose. Saw some research this morning showing it’s the more left economically voters that Johnson brought in who are deserting them.
A lot of Johnson’s power base was the 2019 intake that owed him their seats, outside of them it’s the headbanger rump. I think if there’s a landslide Labour victory, the seats that are left won’t produce MPs that would back Johnson. Could be wrong though, I’ve not don’t the hard yards looking at actual seats.
fernandopartridge
Well-Known Member
Balancing day to day spending just removes private sector surpluses - it doesn't make any sense in trying to recover the economy. Making such promises will make doing anything useful very difficult and provide an open goal to the Tories come 2029. This is the deficit shown as a % of GDP over the last 25 years, you can pretty much track declining public services with the deficit aside from the covid year.
Agreed. Sunaks not stupid though and if he’s not in the pockets of the right (I don’t think so but I was a bit concerned when some came out early to support him) he might try to address this argument.
Major balancing act whoevers in charge. They desperately need us to be as/if not more competitive for businesses but need cash from somewhere
I’ve heard that Sunak is less ideologically driven on Brexit which, if true, may help solve some of the issues
shmmeee
Well-Known Member
Sure. But if they get in and propose massive unfunded day to day spending then the markets will rightly or wrongly react badly. And everyone will go “I knew Labour were as bad as Truss” and that’ll be that.
Doesnt mean they can’t make a big difference, just that they won’t be able to spend what they could have two months ago.
Best case scenario (for party not country) is Sunak gets in and goes full Osbourne on austerity, meaning big changes can be made without having to go too mental the other way.
Brighton Sky Blue
Well-Known Member
I haven't seen recent polling but I imagine Johnson himself would be under big pressure in a Greater London constituency. Target it and chances are he'd be gone.
shmmeee
Well-Known Member
That’s actually a very fair point under that scenario Johnson wouldn’t be an MP so his support is moot
Brighton Sky Blue
Well-Known Member
Seems to have gone down well-find some of the comments praising ‘Tory lite’ a bit vomit inducing but there we are
Grendel
Well-Known Member
Sky_Blue_Dreamer
Well-Known Member
I agree. If they went full-on it'd just lead to more chance of a Tory government getting back in much quicker.
I think during times of hardship and recession the better way out of that is investment by the state to create the jobs and demand rather than cutting spending. Ye, it would likely require borrowing but ultimately spending cuts do anyway as well as you end up with fewer jobs so less people paying in and more people taking out.
Brighton Sky Blue
Well-Known Member
I think he would fancy a lifetime of being paid 6 figure sums to stuff his face
Grendel
Well-Known Member
He’s commanding £150 grand for an hours speech - he will earn far more not being an MP than being one
shmmeee
Well-Known Member
This is a good start for a super wealthy tax proposal: Millionaires call on governments worldwide to ‘tax us now’ | Davos | The Guardian
Would raise £43bn a year. Which is roughly what the size of the hole Truss opened up in the budget is I think.
Would raise £43bn a year. Which is roughly what the size of the hole Truss opened up in the budget is I think.
Brighton Sky Blue
Well-Known Member
Sums up the state of this country
skybluetony176
Well-Known Member
Isn’t it strange that Mordaunt is still struggling to get her numbers to grow despite their apparently now being 102 up for grabs. It’s almost as if Boris lied about having the exact number required before pulling out. You would have thought that the Boris cult would be piling on Mordaunt to make sure it goes to the membership where she’s likely to beat Sunak.
Maybe theres a few less loyal nutters than expected. Having said that, I’m sure I heard Dorries calling for a GE as Sunak hasn’t got a mandate. I presume in the hope that the Tories lose and this hastens the return of her hero….if she doesn’t lose her seat in the meantime
Any heard anything from Jacob ‘Borisorbust’ Rees Mogg ?
skybluetony176
Well-Known Member
Only problem with that Boris isn’t looking likely to win his current seat so there’s a fair chance he won’t be in opposition. More importantly it works on the assumption that Boris would be willing to put the hard work in that’s required to be an opposition leader.Maybe theres a few less loyal nutters than expected. Having said that, I’m sure I heard Dorries calling for a GE as Sunak hasn’t got a mandate. I presume in the hope that the Tories lose and this hastens the return of her hero….if she doesn’t lose her seat in the meantime
Any heard anything from Jacob ‘Borisorbust’ Rees Mogg ?
D
Deleted member 5849
Guest
She's leaving the commons herself at the next election.Maybe theres a few less loyal nutters than expected. Having said that, I’m sure I heard Dorries calling for a GE as Sunak hasn’t got a mandate. I presume in the hope that the Tories lose and this hastens the return of her hero….if she doesn’t lose her seat in the meantime
Any heard anything from Jacob ‘Borisorbust’ Rees Mogg ?
D
Deleted member 5849
Guest
He's probably right. I could get behind it as long as we used it to spend on the minions too... but I'm not holding out much hope for that. Looking forward to more 'efficiency savings'.
Dame Nadine ?
D
Deleted member 5849
Guest
Aye. Wants to write more books
