Germany *again* (7 Viewers)

duffer

Well-Known Member
With apologies for the lengthy rant, I get a bit pissed off with the whole "hang-em-and-flog em" knee jerk suggestions to stop kids carrying knives. On its own, it simply doesn't work.

I'll let you do your own research, but when you think about it calmly you'll realise that a lot of kids are carrying knives because they're scared of becoming victims of violence. That's children scared of other children, and children scared of adults.

Whatever solution you want to come up with has to acknowledge that fact first, because just locking a few of them up for longer won't change anything.

In Scotland, they've had good results with a far more rounded approach, treating it as a public health issue. That, of course, costs money and time, and doesn't provide red meat for the Daily Mail.

In the meantime, here's a thought. In the cities (and county lines in particular), knife crime is driven by gangs, with adults exploiting children into becoming expendable couriers and soldiers in petty but deadly turf wars or respect 'beefs'.

If you're buying drugs from these scum-sucking fuckers (I can think of no other words for an adult who exploits a child), and plenty of people are, then to me, you're part of the problem.

Sorry again for going on - as a parent with a soon to be teenage son, there's not much that worries me more than this.

 

CovValleyBoy

Well-Known Member
If we had a Southport riots police & judiciary response to those carrying knives.
Immediate prison it would be a start.
Send 50 the first week & so on.
It can be done if the government wishes it.
 

Captain Dart

Well-Known Member
Meanwhile yesterday there was a knife attack in Plymouth and today 4 stabbed near an Asda in Croydon.
 

shmmeee

Well-Known Member
With apologies for the lengthy rant, I get a bit pissed off with the whole "hang-em-and-flog em" knee jerk suggestions to stop kids carrying knives. On its own, it simply doesn't work.

I'll let you do your own research, but when you think about it calmly you'll realise that a lot of kids are carrying knives because they're scared of becoming victims of violence. That's children scared of other children, and children scared of adults.

Whatever solution you want to come up with has to acknowledge that fact first, because just locking a few of them up for longer won't change anything.

In Scotland, they've had good results with a far more rounded approach, treating it as a public health issue. That, of course, costs money and time, and doesn't provide red meat for the Daily Mail.

In the meantime, here's a thought. In the cities (and county lines in particular), knife crime is driven by gangs, with adults exploiting children into becoming expendable couriers and soldiers in petty but deadly turf wars or respect 'beefs'.

If you're buying drugs from these scum-sucking fuckers (I can think of no other words for an adult who exploits a child), and plenty of people are, then to me, you're part of the problem.

Sorry again for going on - as a parent with a soon to be teenage son, there's not much that worries me more than this.


I get what you’re saying but the first step according to that article was tripling sentences for carrying a knife and carrying out a lot of stop and search which seems to be what a lot of people are asking for.

The next step was identifying them and letting them know they had been identified. The “public health” angle gets a lot but much of this was just solid visible police work.

Admittedly this is followed up by housing, education and employment support and getting them to realise the consequences of their actions.

Carrot and stick seems a fair way of describing it.
 

SBT

Well-Known Member
And now a car runs into a crowd of trade unionists in Munich - supposedly an attack from an Afghan asylum seeker. Police say the suspect was known to them for theft and drug offences - if that’s all true, I can only ask what the hell was he still doing in the country?
 

shmmeee

Well-Known Member
And now a car runs into a crowd of trade unionists in Munich - supposedly an attack from an Afghan asylum seeker. Police say the suspect was known to them for theft and drug offences - if that’s all true, I can only ask what the hell was he still doing in the country?

Seeking asylum?
 

Marty

Well-Known Member
And now a car runs into a crowd of trade unionists in Munich - supposedly an attack from an Afghan asylum seeker. Police say the suspect was known to them for theft and drug offences - if that’s all true, I can only ask what the hell was he still doing in the country?

Probably liked the local nuggets.
 

PVA

Well-Known Member
There's a photo that shows a mangled pram on the floor, horrible to see.

Seems to be no deaths so far, let's hope it stays that way.
 

Otis

Well-Known Member
It's just a whole new can of worms using a vehicle isn't it. So little can be done about it too.

Major events can have barricades, but smaller group gatherings and just cars driving down streets in a town centre, but then mounting the pavement in order to just drive at people? What can you do about that?

It's awful isn't it.
 

rob9872

Well-Known Member
It's just a whole new can of worms using a vehicle isn't it. So little can be done about it too.

Major events can have barricades, but smaller group gatherings and just cars driving down streets in a town centre, but then mounting the pavement in order to just drive at people? What can you do about that?

It's awful isn't it.
Not sure what the answer is. You could argue for bollards etc, but they'll likely move onto sporting events or something else with crowds and less protection. Almost impossible to police. I guess we should be thankful at being cars and not HGV's which are less accessible, but applications to learn should now perhaps be monitored closely.
 

Nick

Administrator
Not sure what the answer is. You could argue for bollards etc, but they'll likely move onto sporting events or something else with crowds and less protection. Almost impossible to police. I guess we should be thankful at being cars and not HGV's which are less accessible, but applications to learn should now perhaps be monitored closely.

I think if somebody is going to use a car to drive into a crowd of people, they aren't going to be that arsed if they have a license or not.
 

rob9872

Well-Known Member
I think if somebody is going to use a car to drive into a crowd of people, they aren't going to be that arsed if they have a license or not.
Oh of course totally agree, but I meant in terms of them being less accessible and I'd like to think if someone is interested in buying who isnt from a business it would raise a few flags.
 

shmmeee

Well-Known Member
So not an asylum seeker and no criminal record. Feel like there’s an opposing phrase needed for “if it sounds too good to be true it probably is” here. Seems crazy an asylum seeker with a criminal record was allowed to wander about and it turns out it was.
 

rob9872

Well-Known Member
I'm sure that's comforting to the families of the victims.

I feel the same way about those desperate to prove that it's just an ordinary Joe as I do to the racists and Islamophobes who try to always look for blame where it isn't.

The focus every single time should be on the victims and their families.

Absolutely ok to hate on the perpetrator, but hate them for being that and nothing more or less.
 

Earlsdon_Skyblue1

Well-Known Member
So not an asylum seeker and no criminal record. Feel like there’s an opposing phrase needed for “if it sounds too good to be true it probably is” here. Seems crazy an asylum seeker with a criminal record was allowed to wander about and it turns out it was.

Where are you seeing this?

From BBC:

The suspect - named locally as 24-year-old Farhad N - came to Germany in 2016, according to reports. He had his asylum application rejected, but his deportation was suspended.

Munich car attack: Suspected attacker named locally as counter-terrorism police take over investigation
 

chiefdave

Well-Known Member
Where are you seeing this?

From BBC:

The suspect - named locally as 24-year-old Farhad N - came to Germany in 2016, according to reports. He had his asylum application rejected, but his deportation was suspended.

Munich car attack: Suspected attacker named locally as counter-terrorism police take over investigation
He arrived in Germany in 2016 and although his application for asylum was turned down he was allowed to stay in Germany and had a valid residence and work permit.

The Munich prosecutor confirmed to reporters that Farhad N had been living in Germany legally.
And when they initially said known to police it seems that may be because he worked security
Herrmann said initially that the suspect had been known to police but later explained that he had previously worked as a store detective and had been a witness in several cases of shoplifting.
 

Earlsdon_Skyblue1

Well-Known Member
He arrived in Germany in 2016 and although his application for asylum was turned down he was allowed to stay in Germany and had a valid residence and work permit.

The Munich prosecutor confirmed to reporters that Farhad N had been living in Germany legally.
And when they initially said known to police it seems that may be because he worked security

What a shambles, if anything that makes it worse. Looks like there is a key bit of information missing:

The man's asylum application was rejected, but he had not been forced to leave due to security concerns in Afghanistan and he was in Germany legally with a work permit.


All that confirms really is that the system is a joke. (We already knew that).
 

shmmeee

Well-Known Member
What a shambles, if anything that makes it worse. Looks like there is a key bit of information missing:

The man's asylum application was rejected, but he had not been forced to leave due to security concerns in Afghanistan and he was in Germany legally with a work permit.

All that confirms really is that the system is a joke. (We already knew that).

Just going off the (BBC ironically) news on the radio that said he didn’t have previous convictions and was working with a permit.
 

Captain Dart

Well-Known Member
A 23-year-old Syrian man went on a stabbing spree near the Drau Bridge in Villach, Austria, injuring four and killing a 14-year-old boy. A food delivery driver intervened by hitting the attacker with his car, stopping the assault. One suspect is in custody, others may be on the run.
 

wingy

Well-Known Member
Shoot to kill philosophy or keep taking the hit on society, keep asking questions, keep killing or put them out of their misery, which may instigate more, but it would be a deterrent of sorts!
 

ccfc922

Well-Known Member
I am very surprised that German people put up with all of this (mass immigration and terror attacks) Historically, they're a strong nation and I'm amazed they've let Merkel do the whole open arms shite.
 

rob9872

Well-Known Member
I am very surprised that German people put up with all of this (mass immigration and terror attacks) Historically, they're a strong nation and I'm amazed they've let Merkel do the whole open arms shite.
How though? They have many land borders. We can't stop it with water in between so they've got no chance.
 

ccfc922

Well-Known Member
How though? They have many land borders. We can't stop it with water in between so they've got no chance.

Their politicians not doing an impressive of Steve McClaren beckoning would be a start?

Poland seem to manage it, and they're similar geographically.
 

rob9872

Well-Known Member
That's true about Poland, but also not as affluent so less desire to go there. In fact lots of poles have headed to Germany too as they have here for better opportunities.
 

ccfc922

Well-Known Member
That's true about Poland, but also not as affluent so less desire to go there. In fact lots of poles have headed to Germany too as they have here for better opportunities.

I might be wrong, but I think alot of Poles are going back?

I think there's less desire for "asylum seekers" to go to Poland, because they're not inviting them and offering hotels, money and clothes for them to come like ourselves and Germany etc.
 

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