ACL Statement (12 Viewers)

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grego_gee

grego_gee

New Member
Where is this hysteria comming from? We already have accounts up to 2011 anyway, documents from 2008 can have zero relevence to arguments of asset movements after the last accounts were filed !

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GaryPendrysEyes

GaryPendrysEyes

Well-Known Member
grego_gee said:
Where is this hysteria comming from? We already have accounts up to 2011 anyway, documents from 2008 can have zero relevence to arguments of asset movements after the last accounts were filed !

:pimp:
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They aren't accounts though are they.... So your point is irrelevant.
 
Skybluerevolution (Pt2)

Skybluerevolution (Pt2)

New Member
grego_gee said:
Where is this hysteria comming from? We already have accounts up to 2011 anyway, documents from 2008 can have zero relevence to arguments of asset movements after the last accounts were filed !

I think it has to do with ownership, roles and responsibilities within the companies, I am guessing they have been changed at some point (legally or otherwise), therefore showing some wrong doing (probably) I can only find a 10 page document so not sure if there is more to come...
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N

Noggin

New Member
grego_gee said:
Where is this hysteria comming from? We already have accounts up to 2011 anyway, documents from 2008 can have zero relevence to arguments of asset movements after the last accounts were filed !

:pimp:
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Because Appleton allegedly spent weeks and weeks looking for the Golden share when it's location should have been known from the start. These minutes also back up the accounts that show the players were and should be in limited something constantly denied by Tim Fisher. This also confirms what we have always known is that when Tim Fisher says limited was a non trading subsidy. Not only is what he is false but he knows it too.
 
grego_gee

grego_gee

New Member
Noggin said:
Because Appleton allegedly spent weeks and weeks looking for the Golden share when it's location should have been known from the start. These minutes also back up the accounts that show the players were and should be in limited something constantly denied by Tim Fisher. This also confirms what we have always known is that when Tim Fisher says limited was a non trading subsidy. Not only is what he is false but he knows it too.
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Nah, its 2008. proves nothing at all in relation to 2013.

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S

Skyblue4u

New Member
Why are ACL suddenly saying they care about the fans? Agree with most of it but leave us fans out of your squabbles
 
P

procdoc

Well-Known Member
I really hope someone from SISU's end does time for fraud or something. I said from the beginning that Appleton was a crook, I might be proved right
 
italiahorse

italiahorse

Well-Known Member
Skyblue4u said:
Why are ACL suddenly saying they care about the fans? Agree with most of it but leave us fans out of your squabbles
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If this document is correct then we need to know when the assets changed over.

As the document stands Ltd had Players, registrations, golden share etc all within it. Effectively the football club all in one place.

If that was the case the bidding process would have been more straight forward. Did Appleton have documents to show these assets changed over lawfully?

Watch this go ......
 
grego_gee

grego_gee

New Member
PWKH said:
Statement from the Board of Arena Coventry Limited
"The Board of Arena Coventry Limited is extremely disappointed by the Football League's decision yesterday evening relating to Coventry City Football Club. There are many more questions to be asked now of both the Joint Administrator Paul Appleton and Football League itself.

“That both these parties appear to have been complicit in allowing a company which has refused to pay its debts and fallen into administration, to then buy itself back with little or no consequence, beggars belief. The overwhelming majority of Sky Blues fans and indeed football fans in general are appalled by these actions.
"We are incredulous at The Football League’s continued disregard for its own regulations thus far in this saga. The Football League needs to protect its own credibility and refer this whole matter to the Football Association for review. Everyone associated with the game in this country will respect a Football Association judgement. We urge the Football League to make this referral as quickly as it was able to make a decision yesterday.

“We have also seen during the last 24 hours the emergence, via an independent website of documents, which appear to make a mockery of Mr Appleton’s supposedly lengthy hunt for Football League Golden Share. These documents show also that far more than the Golden Share lay in Coventry City Football Club Limited, which was also the location of the players, manager, gate revenues and everything else associated with the Football Club.
“If these documents are authentic, then those Directors of the Football Club present at the Coventry City Football Club (Holdings) Limited Board meeting in March 2008 need to speak out. Sky Blues fans need those Directors to explain how they think the purposes of Coventry City Football Club Limited and Coventry City Football Club (Holdings) Limited later became blurred.

"ACL originally acted to prevent the threat of liquidation of the Club issued by the current chief executive officer of Coventry City Football Club, Tim Fisher. ACL has since been working as hard as possible to keep Coventry City playing in Coventry and on a sound financial footing. Mr Fisher has also now chosen to make factually inaccurate public statements relating to the meeting attended by Joy Seppala as well as ACL Board members on Thursday 25 July. It is interesting to note Mr Fisher’s failure to mention Ms Seppala’s verbal statement during this meeting, made in the presence of her own lawyers that the only circumstance in which the Club would return to the Ricoh would be upon SISU assuming full ownership of the venue without any negotiation on purchase price. Ms Seppala also stated at this meeting her intention to continue to threaten ACL and its shareholders with expensive litigation at every possible opportunity. Perhaps the fact that Mr Fisher was not himself present at this meeting has distorted his view of what was really discussed.

“People can make their own minds up where blame for this upsetting situation lies. It is clear however that the actions of both Mr Appleton and the Football League should be scrutinised by Sky Blues fans, other football supporters representative groups, the media, the Football Association and Parliament. The liquidation process allows for detailed investigation of the failed business and we will be watching carefully to ensure this is carried out in an appropriate manner in the case of Coventry City Football Club Limited. We hope also that because of the questions being asked by supporters and other stakeholders about his actions, Mr Appleton will allow new, independent liquidators to investigate the actions of the Company and officeholders if the Company does go into liquidation, which we note has still not been publicly confirmed.”
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Sorry Peter, that's not worth the paper its written on.
you have made no points of any merit.

:pimp:
 
D

dongonzalos

Well-Known Member
PWKH said:
Statement from the Board of Arena Coventry Limited
"The Board of Arena Coventry Limited is extremely disappointed by the Football League's decision yesterday evening relating to Coventry City Football Club. There are many more questions to be asked now of both the Joint Administrator Paul Appleton and Football League itself.

“That both these parties appear to have been complicit in allowing a company which has refused to pay its debts and fallen into administration, to then buy itself back with little or no consequence, beggars belief. The overwhelming majority of Sky Blues fans and indeed football fans in general are appalled by these actions.
"We are incredulous at The Football League’s continued disregard for its own regulations thus far in this saga. The Football League needs to protect its own credibility and refer this whole matter to the Football Association for review. Everyone associated with the game in this country will respect a Football Association judgement. We urge the Football League to make this referral as quickly as it was able to make a decision yesterday.

“We have also seen during the last 24 hours the emergence, via an independent website of documents, which appear to make a mockery of Mr Appleton’s supposedly lengthy hunt for Football League Golden Share. These documents show also that far more than the Golden Share lay in Coventry City Football Club Limited, which was also the location of the players, manager, gate revenues and everything else associated with the Football Club.
“If these documents are authentic, then those Directors of the Football Club present at the Coventry City Football Club (Holdings) Limited Board meeting in March 2008 need to speak out. Sky Blues fans need those Directors to explain how they think the purposes of Coventry City Football Club Limited and Coventry City Football Club (Holdings) Limited later became blurred.

"ACL originally acted to prevent the threat of liquidation of the Club issued by the current chief executive officer of Coventry City Football Club, Tim Fisher. ACL has since been working as hard as possible to keep Coventry City playing in Coventry and on a sound financial footing. Mr Fisher has also now chosen to make factually inaccurate public statements relating to the meeting attended by Joy Seppala as well as ACL Board members on Thursday 25 July. It is interesting to note Mr Fisher’s failure to mention Ms Seppala’s verbal statement during this meeting, made in the presence of her own lawyers that the only circumstance in which the Club would return to the Ricoh would be upon SISU assuming full ownership of the venue without any negotiation on purchase price. Ms Seppala also stated at this meeting her intention to continue to threaten ACL and its shareholders with expensive litigation at every possible opportunity. Perhaps the fact that Mr Fisher was not himself present at this meeting has distorted his view of what was really discussed.

“People can make their own minds up where blame for this upsetting situation lies. It is clear however that the actions of both Mr Appleton and the Football League should be scrutinised by Sky Blues fans, other football supporters representative groups, the media, the Football Association and Parliament. The liquidation process allows for detailed investigation of the failed business and we will be watching carefully to ensure this is carried out in an appropriate manner in the case of Coventry City Football Club Limited. We hope also that because of the questions being asked by supporters and other stakeholders about his actions, Mr Appleton will allow new, independent liquidators to investigate the actions of the Company and officeholders if the Company does go into liquidation, which we note has still not been publicly confirmed.”
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This was the planet ACL were on for those asking yesterday.

Also on Sky News today an independent expert was disgusted by the fact that The FL only deducted ten points and seem to side with a hedge fund putting itself millions into debt then it was allowed to buy itself.
 
N

Noggin

New Member
deanocity3 said:
the FL said the golden Share was in LTD and it was, the trouble is Sisu never told The FL that they had moved everything else into holdings,the FL said LTD should have held the players registrations,but sisu moved them and never told FL
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It's not legal to move assets out without paying the going rent for those assets though especially if you leave the debts and then move to administration. I'm not saying this is whats happened but the evidence we see very much suggests that and if it wern't true it would have been very easy to show.
 
N

Noggin

New Member
yes the last set that have been known about for ages and Fisher was questioned on them at the forums but ducked the questions
 
grego_gee

grego_gee

New Member
The last statement says nothing! its just crying!

ACL's first statement gave their reasons for rejecting the CVA and landing the club with a 10pt deduction.

(ACL)
This decision was based on ACL's twin aims: first, to keep Coventry City Football Club playing in Coventry; and second, to ensure that Coventry City Football Club is financially viable for the next few years and beyond.
This last point is especially important

How exactly do you see those two points working peter?

:pimp:
 
B

Brighton Sky Blue

Well-Known Member
Page 5 of that document talks about an intention to shut the academy down altogether in the medium term-was Ranson really that incompetent?
 
italiahorse

italiahorse

Well-Known Member
grego_gee said:
The last statement says nothing! its just crying!

ACL's first statement gave their reasons for rejecting the CVA and landing the club with a 10pt deduction.

(ACL)
This decision was based on ACL's twin aims: first, to keep Coventry City Football Club playing in Coventry; and second, to ensure that Coventry City Football Club is financially viable for the next few years and beyond.
This last point is especially important

How exactly do you see those two points working peter?

:pimp:
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By not agreeing the CVA did all the debt not leave the club and various SISU funds take the hit?
If signed would the club via Optium not have picked up the amount paid to clear Ltd debts?
Surely ACL have cleared CCFC debt. Heroes?
No wonder TF is pi$$ed off.
 
grego_gee

grego_gee

New Member
italiahorse said:
By not agreeing the CVA did all the debt not leave the club and various SISU funds take the hit?
If signed would the club via Optium not have picked up the amount paid to clear Ltd debts?
Surely ACL have cleared CCFC debt. Heroes?
No wonder TF is pi$$ed off.
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I think there was a post on another thread saying SISU would write off 60m if the CVA was signed, only £30m if not. I could be remembering the figures wrong.

:pimp:
 
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J

Jack Griffin

Guest
Listen from 8 mins as OSB exposes SISU's machinations
[video=youtube;OVg4bIXWGaI]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OVg4bIXWGaI[/video]
 
Sky Blue Kid

Sky Blue Kid

Well-Known Member
We hope also that because of the questions being asked by supporters and other stakeholders about his actions, Mr Appleton will allow new, independent liquidators to investigate the actions of the Company and officeholders if the Company does go into liquidation, which we note has still not been publicly confirmed.”...........................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................So this is what was meant when the MP said "Be prepared to stand aside Mr Appleton."
 
S

SkyblueBazza

Well-Known Member
Sky Blue Kid said:
We hope also that because of the questions being asked by supporters and other stakeholders about his actions, Mr Appleton will allow new, independent liquidators to investigate the actions of the Company and officeholders if the Company does go into liquidation, which we note has still not been publicly confirmed.”...........................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................So this is what was meant when the MP said "Be prepared to stand aside Mr Appleton."
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The words "We hope...Mr Appleton will allow new, independent liquidators"...Mr Appleton will say "No" - is that the end of that story?
 
oldskyblue58

oldskyblue58

CCFC Finance Director
Just to spell it out as to the point ACL are making

130 years ago the football club was born.It was incorporated in one single company known as "The Coventry City Football Club Ltd"

In 1995 that company was split in to two CCFC Ltd and CCFCH Ltd. CCFC Ltd acquired the trade of being the football club known as CCFC. That included player registrations and the golden share in CCFC Ltd not CCFC H. That is confirmed in the company Memorandum & Articles

19/02/08 SISU took over the club following due diligence by their accountants BDO. The structure and purpose of CCFC Ltd and CCFC H Ltd remained as set up in 1995

The minutes disclosed on 200% blog show that the directors and representatives of SISU reviewed that basis, seemingly agreed to keep that basis and were aware of what assets were where (ie player contracts and golden share in CCFC Ltd), In fact one of the documents clearly states exactly that and not only that indicates that such a set up was how they would continue to operate from 2008 onwards.

Clearly accounts audited by BDO were prepared on exactly that basis until 31/05/11 signed off June 2012. The administrator even indicated that basis in his first report for 2012 figures. In deed if the share or player registrations or contracts were to be in any other company or entity it would require a formal request from the company to and written authority from the Football League (per their regulations). It also implicitly confirms that the directors and owners knew that those items were in CCFC Ltd from 2008 onwards

fast forward to 2013 apparently the contracts are no longer in CCFC Ltd and the golden share is nowhere to be found. Yet the directors and owners knew exactly where they were in 2008, knew that the golden share required the registrations and contracts to rest with it.

the details in 2008 have relevance to 2013 because unless there was written authority from the FL then the players, trade and golden share should be in CCFC Ltd.

some questions
- is there authority from FL at any time since 2008 to transfer the players to CCFC H ?
- If there was no authority who was complicit intentionally or not in the splitting of the players contracts from golden share (the split is a key to the success of the SISU plan) ?
- if no authority then the Football League could be seen to being part of a scheme that prejudices the rights of the creditors of CCFC so did they know?
- could all this be viewed as a scheme by the owners to remove assets to the detriment of creditors?
- Is the administrator aware of these directors minutes and what was the reasoning of any actions he took or did not take in relation to them?

there are many other questions

In Summary
the 2008 minutes may well be important if they prove the directors of the SBS&L group companies knew in 2008 that the football share, players and trade were in CCFC Ltd and that there was no authority from the FL to trade the Club by another entity since that time. Which could mean that assets have been transferred out and not included in the administration and the administration process is therefore flawed. So yes the minutes could well relate to the events in 2013.

Have SISU relied on a flawed registration system at the Football League? - which could leave the Football League open to some serious questions about their governance and some hefty financial liabilities.
Did the people involved know what they were doing?
Did the administrator follow any of this information through?
If that was the case is the decision to give Otium the share valid?

It could lead to some very serious consequences if the ACL view is correct. Would guess this will need to be decided in court

Just to be clear this is what I understand is the ACL thinking in this. I am not making any allegations against any party involved
 
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cloughie

cloughie

Well-Known Member
grego_gee said:
I think there was a post on another thread saying SISU would write off 60m if the CVA was signed, only £30m if not. I could be remembering the figures wrong.

:pimp:
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You think?
well you are obviously thick , ill informed or just a wum

The debt was moved from CCFC ltd to other sisu companies Skyblue sports and leisure etc

And as for the 200% statement it confirms the last accounts filed with companies house that you choose to ignore
 
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