SISU Appeal Judicial Review (15 Viewers)

[RoboCCFC90]

If that is the case I find myself offering credit (there's a first) to the FL...because it's given ACL a further lifeline allowing them to carry on the fight.

Lets hope so, the question is will SISU hand over that figure over to ACL and if they refuse to what's the consequences of such?

 

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[Godiva]

Lets hope so, the question is will SISU hand over that figure over to ACL and if they refuse to what's the consequences of such?

If - and as OSB has shown there could be another explanation - they fail to apply to the entry conditions the Golden Share will be taken back and the club expelled from the league.

 

[RoboCCFC90]

If - and as OSB has shown there could be another explanation - they fail to apply to the entry conditions the Golden Share will be taken back and the club expelled from the league.

Absolutely.

I don't think there is genuinely another path that the Football League can take.

 

[sky blue john]

The problem i have with this is all the legal costs will end up at ccfc door !!!!!

 

[Cheshire Sky Blue]

i do not think that means that they pay it any way, it means that before they gave Otium the share they had to agree to honour the CVA when it went through..... it is a standard clause in the Football Leagues insolvency policy.

If I am not mistaken at this stage in the proceedings the CVA had already been rejected. So the FL were ensuring that Otium stilled paid as a condition of being granted the GS. If they do not I assume the FL can withdraw the Golden share.

Didn't Seppalla threaten to tie up CCC and ACL in expensive litigation at every opportunity. Gee a bit of a >>>>>>>> this one.

 

[James Smith]

The problem i have with this is all the legal costs will end up at ccfc door !!!!!

Yeah I can see Tim announcing that the debt's gone up again mysteriously.

 

[Porkchophill]

Imagine if they spent as much time and money on rebuilding the squad and paying rent as they did in the courts and on solicitors , and administrators we mite actually have a club still ! Ahhh well silly old me always dreaming

 

[olderskyblue]

TIM: Judge, let me just read out this email trail that will prove our case.

CCC: Judge, let us read out these "missing" emails from Tim's email trail which will prove his case is a complete nonsense.

Judge: Case thrown out.....again.

 

[Porkchophill]

Tim: is there any chance we are allowed to appoint our own judge ?

 

[fernandopartridge]

Pretty sure spending £70k per year on policing Coventry City matches is a misuse of Northamptonshire CC public funds too.

How is it? The team is irrelevant, the Police are responsible for assuring public order in Northampton.

 

[fernandopartridge]

The Hedgehog Fund Approach To Property

A guide written by Ms Shadow Director

Chapter One: How to acquire property the Hedgehog Fund way

You spot a new property with plenty of opportunity for expansion, development and ultimately fat profits. One of its tenants is close to liquidation, due to overspending and mismanagement. To get a foothold in the desirable property, simply buy the tenant's business for minimal outlay.

Make extravagant promises on how you'll work hard to turn the tenant's business around. Unfortunately this requires the semblance of capital investment, so give the impression you want to help the business succeed by buying a couple of decent playing staff. After a few months you can sell these players at a profit, replacing them with lesser players. This makes the business broadly viable in the short term and without further major investment. You can also sell young players (which have cost next to nothing) to bigger businesses for 'undisclosed fees' - lovely jubbly!

Meanwhile you can concentrate on acquiring the property by a) refusing to pay rent, b) threatening to liquidate the much-loved business tenant which you own, c) causing the business to fail by being relegated to a lesser league of companies, and d) ultimately moving it to a lesser property over 30 miles away. This distresses both the property you wish to acquire, and the much-loved business you have bought. The property owners in desperation cave in to your demands and sell you the property for next to nothing. Trebles all round.

Chapter Two: How to use the courts to frustrate people who stand up to your underhand tactics

We will talk about failing to file company accounts on time and how this can help your business (especially when you're under a transfer embargo, which means in effect you have a ready made excuse for not signing playing staff) in the next chapter.

This chapter will look at how you can use legal challenges to frustrate businesses that stand in your way. Lets imagine that your landlords take exception to your reasonable action of withholding rent - they want you to uphold the rent agreement you signed, and issue a winding-up order against you. This is easily countered by waiting until the last minute and putting your own company into voluntary liquidation. A major advantage here is that you can appoint your own administrator.

By failing to submit company accounts on time (as I mentioned we'll discuss this in the next chapter) no other bidder will know what they're bidding for and what assets are available. You will therefore be able to become the preferred bidder to buy your own company. Judicial Reviews are also useful to further tie opponents in knots. Quids in - more trebles all round.

Chapter Three: Why failing to submit company accounts on time is desirable

We've already alluded to one advantage here (the 'transfer embargo') yet there are many more. Imagine you have some serious assets in one of your companies, which just happens to be the one threatened by a winding up order. By not submitting accounts on time you can obfuscate matters, while claiming 'beneficial ownership' of assets and making vague statements like saying the accounts are 'in a mess'. This will hopefully confuse all the..............................................................................................................................


etc etc ad nauseam

All that effort for 2/10

 

[Fedupskybluesfan]

so they are still getting 590k I've said all along appletons numbers didn't make any sense. Is is just another in a long line of very misleading things from him that strangely always have seemed to favour sisu.

So what your saying is they got back all their monies owed and still decided to go against CVA and put CCFC Ltd into liquidation and get us 10pts deducted.
Hope all the ACL fans are happy now.

 

[ohitsaidwalker king power]

So what your saying is they got back all their monies owed and still decided to go against CVA and put CCFC Ltd into liquidation and get us 10pts deducted.

Maybe that alone suggest that the decision to not accept the CVA was more than just a decision based on finances and that protecting an asset funded by the citizens of Coventry was the primary motive of those who unanimously voted to reject it?

 

[supergonk]

It is illegal to defy a court order, but when it suits their purpose sisu do just that. The high court ruled that they should pay the rent they owed in full; sisu refused.
Now they want the legal system to act on their behalf, despite being told they have no grounds to pursue this issue.
Is this more smoke and mirrors to keep the fans attention from what is going on in private?

 

[duffer]

So what your saying is they got back all their monies owed and still decided to go against CVA and put CCFC Ltd into liquidation and get us 10pts deducted.
Hope all the ACL fans are happy now.

Actually, they didn't get all of their money. Even assuming the FL enforced the CVA terms, it's still just a proportion of what they are actually owed - and it offers them very little compared to the true value of the lease.

I wonder even ACL even knew about this clause - it seems to have come direct from the FL to Bob Ainsworth.

I'd be surprised if ACL ever sees this money in any case. The FL will backtrack after SISU refuse to pay, claiming either a misunderstanding or a need to exercise further 'discretion' so that we can fulfil our fixtures.

 

[Godiva]

Maybe that alone suggest that the decision to not accept the CVA was more than just a decision based on finances and that protecting an asset funded by the citizens of Coventry was the primary motive of those who unanimously voted to reject it?

It was never a financial decision. I am not sure what they hoped to achieve and I am equally not sure if they think they achieved what they hoped. Maybe it was all about having a thourough investigation into the ccfc limited accounts and the possible illegal shifting of assets?

 

[Godiva]

Actually, they didn't get all of their money. Even assuming the FL enforced the CVA terms, it's still just a proportion of what they are actually owed - and it offers them very little compared to the true value of the lease.

I wonder even ACL even knew about this clause - it seems to have come direct from the FL to Bob Ainsworth.

I'd be surprised if ACL ever sees this money in any case. The FL will backtrack after SISU refuse to pay, claiming either a misunderstanding or a need to exercise further 'discretion' so that we can fulfil our fixtures.

Wouldn't the FL demand proof that the funds were paid to Appeltons account? In that case I don't think sisu can refuse to pay.

 

[duffer]

Wouldn't the FL demand proof that the funds were paid to Appeltons account? In that case I don't think sisu can refuse to pay.

I don't know - honestly, who does? Did anyone expect that the bond would be as low as £1m, and not even paid upfront or held in escrow.

Would it really be a surprise if they let this slip as well?

 

[James Smith]

I don't know - honestly, who does? Did anyone expect that the bond would be as low as £1m, and not even paid upfront or held in escrow.

Would it really be a surprise if they let this slip as well?

Nope as it's probably at the discretion of the board - again.

 

[Godiva]

I don't know - honestly, who does? Did anyone expect that the bond would be as low as £1m, and not even paid upfront or held in escrow.

Would it really be a surprise if they let this slip as well?

I have no idea if a bond of £1m is low or not - but failing to demand the money secured in an escrow account is simply not good enough.
Having said that, I would imagine that the transfer of the Golden Share is a different matter and that the entry conditions by the FL will be enforced to the letter.
When they approved the groundshare there was not nearly the focus and pressure on the FL as when they awarded the GS.

 

[rondog1973]

Agreed. No one wants them here, but what if that's all there is? I would rather they sell the Arena to SISU if they continue to own CCFC and not to Haskell.

You must be crazy! Surely, with their motive exposed, you wouldn't want them any where near our club. You could offer the better the devil argument, but Haskell would have to be one evil Mofo to exceed the crimes of these Bastards.

 

[RoboCCFC90]

You must be crazy! Surely, with their motive exposed, you wouldn't want them any where near our club. You could offer the better the devil argument, but Haskell would have to be one evil Mofo to exceed the crimes of these Bastards.

No I am not.

Okay so what's the alternative, dwindling attendances, less interest in the club, staying in Northampton for a period of 3-5 years if to return to a stadium in the City at all, continuing relegation of the Football Club through the leagues and loss of identity of CCFC..

It's all good a lot of people mentioning a Phoenix Club, but I support Coventry City FC and I could never feel the love and affection that I do for this club.

Yes it seems a disastrous option to allow SISU to purchase the Arena, but given the above alternatives what would you suggest?

 

[Snozz_is_god]

No I am not.

Okay so what's the alternative, dwindling attendances, less interest in the club, staying in Northampton for a period of 3-5 years if to return to a stadium in the City at all, continuing relegation of the Football Club through the leagues and loss of identity of CCFC..

It's all good a lot of people mentioning a Phoenix Club, but I support Coventry City FC and I could never feel the love and affection that I do for this club.

Yes it seems a disastrous option to allow SISU to purchase the Arena, but given the above alternatives what would you suggest?

Robo, Just suppose SISU got there hands on the Ricoh, what do you think they would do next?

 

[leicesterskyblue]

No I am not.

Okay so what's the alternative, dwindling attendances, less interest in the club, staying in Northampton for a period of 3-5 years if to return to a stadium in the City at all, continuing relegation of the Football Club through the leagues and loss of identity of CCFC..

It's all good a lot of people mentioning a Phoenix Club, but I support Coventry City FC and I could never feel the love and affection that I do for this club.

Yes it seems a disastrous option to allow SISU to purchase the Arena, but given the above alternatives what would you suggest?

Thats the problem though, they're holding fans to emotional ransom. The best way to stop kidnappings for ransom is to never ever pay a ransom, so it makes it too much of a risk for no gain, same deal here, dont give in and once they've sunk all their debts into the club and raped and pillaged for all we're got they'll go. I don't see how we as fans can stop it, but we can speed it up and get it over with through NOPM, and hope that ACL have done the right thing in forcing a High Court hearing via liquidation, and that somebody comes in to mop up what's left and get us going again.

 

[Mick Scoop]

The longer this goes on the more I mistrust Sisu, I don't believe they ever wanted CCFC just the Ricoh and now that ship has sailed they are stuck with a football club haemorrhaging money at an alarming rate and floundering at every turn. I hope I am wrong but it would not surprise me if they lumped all their debt on Otium/CCFC and folded walking off with Sisu intact and debt free and Coventry without a football club, I'm normally an optimistic type of person but fear this is all going to end badly..............Just sayin

 

[Godiva]

Thats the problem though, they're holding fans to emotional ransom. The best way to stop kidnappings for ransom is to never ever pay a ransom, so it makes it too much of a risk for no gain, same deal here, dont give in and once they've sunk all their debts into the club and raped and pillaged for all we're got they'll go. I don't see how we as fans can stop it, but we can speed it up and get it over with through NOPM, and hope that ACL have done the right thing in forcing a High Court hearing via liquidation, and that somebody comes in to mop up what's left and get us going again.

Someone on here suggested sisu=Keyser Söze but your post suggest that it's actually the fans who 'are' Keyser Söze (who killed his own family when they were taken hostage).

 

[DilliGaFmother]

"It also reveals for the first time that ACL can still expect a £590,000 return on the Sky Blues rent non-payment and cancellation of the Ricoh lease - even though CCFC Ltd is now heading for liquidation."

It didnt say that in the BA letter yesterday at all.

Appleton said if it went to liquidation ACL would recive a fraction of a penny in the £

Remember True Sky Blue telling everyone here that Sisu would re-new their application, a lot of you here called him all the names under the sun and told him he didnt know what he was talking about. Read the article Sisu ARE re-newing there application which the coventry telegraph are calling 'like an appeal' it is not an appeal, an appeal against judicial review can be made to the court of appeal or the supreme court. its simply a renewal with amended grounds.

OSB - how many years left on the lease di sisu have? i think you have your sums wrong, the lease is not closed or ended for a start, the company in administration has been removed from debt to the lease by going into administration. The local Authority chose not to accept the only offer in town - hence putting the club in 10 minus on the table (only the council can be blamed for that). however if the club do owe ACL as you allude to the whole period left on the lease would be owed by the club. Hence the clubs reasoning in taking administration themselves?

if there were 15 years left for say £1 million rent per year the club would have been liable for the full £15 million. Im not saying thats why they went into admin but if there were many years left ( i do not know ) it is a common practice for companies to go into admin to avoid the debt left on the lease.. Admin is the only way to end a commercial lease early, unless there is a break clause - which i wont go into.

 

[TurkeyTrot]

No I am not.

Okay so what's the alternative, dwindling attendances, less interest in the club, staying in Northampton for a period of 3-5 years if to return to a stadium in the City at all, continuing relegation of the Football Club through the leagues and loss of identity of CCFC..

It's all good a lot of people mentioning a Phoenix Club, but I support Coventry City FC and I could never feel the love and affection that I do for this club.

Yes it seems a disastrous option to allow SISU to purchase the Arena, but given the above alternatives what would you suggest?

So just because you list some alternatives then those are the only alternatives to consider?

 

[RoboCCFC90]

Robo, Just suppose SISU got there hands on the Ricoh, what do you think they would do next?

Two things;

> Either Sell (Most preferable)
> Try to recoup the investment they have input to CCFC.

 

[RoboCCFC90]

So just because you list some alternatives then those are the only alternatives to consider?

Obviously not, but what other choices are there, shall we continue protesting which is falling on deaf ears and allow the club to stay in Northampton or should we hope that ACL and SISU come to some agreement and allow us to return to Coventry and the Ricoh Arena?

 

[rondog1973]

No I am not.

Okay so what's the alternative, dwindling attendances, less interest in the club, staying in Northampton for a period of 3-5 years if to return to a stadium in the City at all, continuing relegation of the Football Club through the leagues and loss of identity of CCFC..

It's all good a lot of people mentioning a Phoenix Club, but I support Coventry City FC and I could never feel the love and affection that I do for this club.

Yes it seems a disastrous option to allow SISU to purchase the Arena, but given the above alternatives what would you suggest?

Go to the ground and start again. SISU have proved they have absolutely no interest whatsoever in CCFC, who knows what they would have planned for the Ricoh. The dwindling attendances that you speak of will only continue with them at the helm.

 

[RoboCCFC90]

Go to the ground and start again. SISU have proved they have absolutely no interest whatsoever in CCFC, who knows what they would have planned for the Ricoh. The dwindling attendances that you speak of will only continue with them at the helm.

Okay so lets say we go to the bottom and start again, do you reckon we can do a Wimbledon and come all the way up? I am not sure it's possible.

Of course they will but playing in Northampton doesn't help that, of course the attendances compared to last season would have been lower this season had we stayed at the Ricoh, but it still would be beneficial for CCFC to be at the Ricoh in some sort of capacity then not.

 

[TurkeyTrot]

Obviously not, but what other choices are there, shall we continue protesting which is falling on deaf ears and allow the club to stay in Northampton or should we hope that ACL and SISU come to some agreement and allow us to return to Coventry and the Ricoh Arena?

I don't think for one minute protests are falling on deaf ears. I think the protests are making a few people very uncomfortable.
We need to get Coventry back in Coventry. That is the first battle. What comes next will be decided by the fans.
But one things for sure, threats and counter threats of litigation don't help anyone.

 

[Godiva]

I don't think for one minute protests are falling on deaf ears. I think the protests are making a few people very uncomfortable.
We need to get Coventry back in Coventry. That is the first battle. What comes next will be decided by the fans.
But one things for sure, threats and counter threats of litigation don't help anyone.

I agree with what you say ... but what protests are there against ccc or ACL? Surely they need to feel equal pressure too?

 

[rondog1973]

Okay so lets say we go to the bottom and start again, do you reckon we can do a Wimbledon and come all the way up? I am not sure it's possible.

Of course they will but playing in Northampton doesn't help that, of course the attendances compared to last season would have been lower this season had we stayed at the Ricoh, but it still would be beneficial for CCFC to be at the Ricoh in some sort of capacity then not.

Wimbledon FC or AFC Wimbledon? Regardless, yes I do. Smaller clubs such as the Wombles, Newport and Chester have all reinvented themselves and are surely healthier for it. With a bit of momentum behind us, I don't see why we can't become (eventually) a force to be reckoned with again.