JR Verdict Thread (11 Viewers)

[labrax]

It's quite possible this verdict might influence the Football League's stance. It does appear during these proceedings the new stadium has been put on the back burner which was partly used to convince the Football League to issue the Golden Share initially. Will be interesting to see how quick now SISU push on in their effort to build a new stadium.

 

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[Sub]

It's quite possible this verdict might influence the Football League's stance. It does appear during these proceedings the new stadium has been put on the back burner which was partly used to convince the Football League to issue the Golden Share initially. Will be interesting to see how quick now SISU push on in their effort to build a new stadium.

Wouldnt hold your breath on the FL doing anything to help CCFC or its fans

 

[play_in_skyblue_stripes]

Got to love in the ccfc website..."we believe it was unlawful" however the judge said it wasn't lol are they for real?[/QUOTe

Totally agree, might be verging almost to contempt of court.

 

[kevinleftpeg]

Of course not, but you can see that they are digging in their heels already. We're already a year down the line with the "new stadium" malarky, so this could drag on for a few more years yet.

But at least CCC won, eh? Woo hoo!

Torchy- With the greatest respect it is the owners who dragged everyone else into this. Do not lose sight of WHO is responsible for this whole debarcle.

 

[oldskyblue58]

Surely the loan can be paid off early if required? ACL have previously paid lump sums off the capital so its not unheard of.

The valuations given were for ACL not the stadium surely?

So from that statement ......... is it time to put up or shut up on the "new stadium". Where is it going to be ?

 

[torchomatic]

I don't. It was SISU and to a lesser extent CCC and ACL.

Torchy- With the greatest respect it is the owners who dragged everyone else into this. Do not lose sight of WHO is responsible for this whole debarcle.

 

[Deleted member 5849]

Surely the loan can be paid off early if required? ACL have previously paid lump sums off the capital so its not unheard of.

The valuations given were for ACL not the stadium surely?

So from that statement ......... is it time to put up or shut up on the "new stadium". Where is it going to be ?

It is.

Perhaps this is where we *should* be hardball.

They say it's absolutely a new stadium. Charitably, you could say sites for it haven't been revealed until this JR gets out the way. If real however, you'd assume those sites are ready to go.

So... to be charitable to *them*, they have a couple of months to reveal the site of the stadium (as this is now the absolute of what will happen) or we the fans accept the club is no more?

 

[letsallsingtogether]

Sisu got the decision they wanted they knew they couldn't win it now give them carte Blanche to do as they please.
They can finally move the team away as was their plan all along then blame others for there decision.

As for crowing justice needs to be done if the council were wrong then they needed to pay.

As for walking away on that point you are right Sisu won't walk away, but will move us away. Unfortunately for Coventry City that decision will result in the majority of fans walking away

We have already lost the CCFC we started supporting and loved all those years ago,

As in any divorce there is always another love around the corner, sorry but this whole situation no matter who is to blame it is making us more bitter no matter what side of the fence you are on.

Not really, you all crowing about this decision thinking SISU are just going to walk away somehow? Makes oblivion even closer and you dont see it you blind twats.

 

[sky blue john]

Its simple whichever way the result went justice has been served.
Sisu have been proved in a court of law wrong in their claims !!
What the future holds anyone's guess is as good as mine. The same could have been said if Sisu had won.

 

[tisza]

Is the debt burden so huge for ACL considering the period of the loan? Debt burden v. Asset utilisation is a different issue.

 

[Deleted member 5849]

Its simple whichever way the result went justice has been served.
Sisu have been proved in a court of law wrong in their claims !!
What the future holds anyone's guess is as good as mine. The same could have been said if Sisu had won.

Fuck me, do I really have to like one of your posts?!?

 

[dadgad]

Wouldnt hold your breath on the FL doing anything to help CCFC or its fans

Yes, but one of their (the FL''s) reasons for not getting involved was the legal dispute - which has now been removed.
Indeed today's judgement supports their own guidelines. There has never been a justifiable reason for Sisu to move the club beyond a 35 mile radius from the Ricoh or play in a town that doesn't bear its name.
This was obvious before the JR and must be doubly obvious now.
There can be no hiding place for the FL's gutless performance.

 

[letsallsingtogether]

Fuck me Northern its been nearly a year now as for charitable, bollocks they don't know the meaning of the word and sorry if it is permanently outside of Cov then to me and thousands of others the club WILL BE NO MORE!!

It is.

Perhaps this is where we *should* be hardball.

They say it's absolutely a new stadium. Charitably, you could say sites for it haven't been revealed until this JR gets out the way. If real however, you'd assume those sites are ready to go.

So... to be charitable to *them*, they have a couple of months to reveal the site of the stadium (as this is now the absolute of what will happen) or we the fans accept the club is no more?

 

[covcity4life]

sisu lose and ccfc look set for another year in northampton

i now understand the celebrations.

 

[Deleted member 5849]

Fuck me Northern its been nearly a year now as for charitable, bollocks they don't know the meaning of the word and sorry if it is permanently outside of Cov then to me and thousands of others the club WILL BE NO MORE!!

But the thing is, if a site is actually revealed... people can deal in certainties.

If they reveal right on the edge then sure you'll have your view, I'll have mine... but we can make our own minds up and go our separate ways. If it's in a mental place, then we all make our minds up and things become a lot easier!

But it does need a time limit that's not tomorrow, to allow them to tie up loose ends on any land purchase an' all that.

But... it does have to happen... or not now really, doesn't it?

Then we can all move on...

 

[WiganSkyBlue]

From CCFC website

"Coventry City Football Club and its owners' primary objective remains building a long-term future...
The Judgement by Hickinbottom J, that the Council's (CCC) decision to provide a £14.4 million loan to private stadium management company Arena Coventry Limited (ACL) was not an unlawful subsidy, is unfortunate.

The football club and its owners believe that the loan, which exceeded the value of the stadium by almost 200%, was neither lawful nor in the interests of the supporters, taxpayers, stadium operators or the Club.


ACL will now remain burdened with debt for the next 43 years, removing any prospect of a long term return to the stadium by the Club. With this level of debt there is no realistic prospect of any sports franchise or ACL being able to generate sufficient revenue to be commercially viable.

We will apply for leave to appeal this decision. Now, more than ever, the new stadium is the only viable commercial option. The owner's primary objective remains building a long term sound financial platform for the future growth of the Club.



Read more at http://www.ccfc.co.uk/news/article/...e-one-300614-1706394.aspx#41EbaWJXDMO6oR46.99

What about the short term???

Might be a clue here that they return to the Ricoh show the potential and sell on.

We can but dream.

 

[Sub]

Yes, but one of their (the FL''s) reasons for not getting involved was the legal dispute - which has now been removed.
Indeed today's judgement supports their own guidelines. There has never been a justifiable reason for Sisu to move the club beyond a 35 mile radius from the Ricoh or play in a town that doesn't bear its name.
This was obvious before the JR and must be doubly obvious now.
There can be no hiding place for the FL's gutless performance.

Firstly somebody in the FL will have to grow a spine and get us back home either for good or while they build their magical stadium it is what is best for the fans and that should be the main concern of the FL

 

[sw88]

How can anyone bring ahead a court case and then not bother showing up for the result?

As for any appeal, I will be very pissed off if they continue this charade any longer!!!

 

[Ian1779]

Yes, but one of their (the FL''s) reasons for not getting involved was the legal dispute - which has now been removed.
Indeed today's judgement supports their own guidelines. There has never been a justifiable reason for Sisu to move the club beyond a 35 mile radius from the Ricoh or play in a town that doesn't bear its name.
This was obvious before the JR and must be doubly obvious now.
There can be no hiding place for the FL's gutless performance.

Ground shares have happened before and will again. The FL agreed to it - no matter whether we like it or not. And realistically the only groundsharing options were Northampton or Walsall as the Butts was a non starter.

The only way now the FL can intervene is if they are not happy with the progress the club in relation to a new stadium. IF (and I say with baited breath) a new stadium is really going to happen then SISU are going to have to move now on this and start getting some tangible evidence out in the public domain and to the FL.

 

[ccfcmustang]

game over.

 

[Sub]

The judge dismissed Sisu's claims on ground one and three of his judgment, and prevented them from taking further action to recover damages in ground two.

Looking at the issue of 'state aid' in ground one, Justice Hickinbottom concluded: “I do not consider that the council's loan to ACL was state aid.
Ground one consequently fails.”

Ground two analysed whether the council had taken into account material considerations when agreeing to make the loan to ACL.
The judge took into account seven key matters when making his decision and concluded: “I do not consider there is any arguable force in any of the seven discrete elements of ground two.”

The judge's analysis of ground three - Sisu's claim that the council acted 'irrationally' - was brief and stated that: “It clearly cannot survive my findings in relation to other grounds, particularly those in respect of state aid.”

http://www.coventrytelegraph.net/news/coventry-news/coventry-city-owners-sisu-lose-7344735

 

[italiahorse]

Do SISU now have to pay the councils costs?

No CCFC do !!

 

[italiahorse]

Of course not, but you can see that they are digging in their heels already. We're already a year down the line with the "new stadium" malarky, so this could drag on for a few more years yet.

But at least CCC won, eh? Woo hoo!

They never won anything. All they did was not loose FFS

 

[letsallsingtogether]

But we have waited a fucking Year if they really cared and if they did have 3 sites why not let the fans decide?
Northern at the end of the day they really don't give a fuck or understand the fans.
They still believe they can do as they please and we will all come running. Sorry but we are not all that stupid!! look how many followed them to Northampton then watch and see the club finally die when they build there new shed in Warwickshire.

We Went to those forums what was it Labo said?????

But the thing is, if a site is actually revealed... people can deal in certainties.

If they reveal right on the edge then sure you'll have your view, I'll have mine... but we can make our own minds up and go our separate ways. If it's in a mental place, then we all make our minds up and things become a lot easier!

But it does need a time limit that's not tomorrow, to allow them to tie up loose ends on any land purchase an' all that.

But... it does have to happen... or not now really, doesn't it?

Then we can all move on...

 

[italiahorse]

LMFAO !!!!
So let me get this right. They still value 113 million piece of real estate & development land at 7 million ?
They will appeal but they have moved on to build the new stadium ?
What jokers !!!

No there are 2 values here. ACL they value at £7M and the stadium they have not published their value. People still getting confused on this key fact.

 

[italiahorse]

I don't. It was SISU and to a lesser extent CCC and ACL.

Your stuck with CCC surely?

 

[italiahorse]

sisu lose and ccfc look set for another year in northampton

i now understand the celebrations.

Sisu's choice. They may have to reconsider now that their play for the Ricoh on the cheap is over.

 

[James Smith]

Sisu got the decision they wanted they knew they couldn't win it now give them carte Blanche to do as they please.
They can finally move the team away as was their plan all along then blame others for there decision.

Whilst that's a possibility it's not guaranteed and I would be surprised if Sisu had gone ahead with the proceedings knowing that they were very unlikely to win. I'm hoping that this provides the stimulus for either concrete (pun not intended) news about the new stadium or future talks on a return to the Ricoh.

As for crowing justice needs to be done if the council were wrong then they needed to pay.

As for walking away on that point you are right Sisu won't walk away, but will move us away. Unfortunately for Coventry City that decision will result in the majority of fans walking away

Again you don't know that they are going to move us away and anything could happen. What we need is for the footballing authorities to get tough and require more work on the new stadium, like the potential location.

We have already lost the CCFC we started supporting and loved all those years ago,

As in any divorce there is always another love around the corner, sorry but this whole situation no matter who is to blame it is making us more bitter no matter what side of the fence you are on.

I do agree with that though.

 

[Chipfat]

Didn't ML state if Sisu lose the court case he would run down the M1 naked!!! Well Mark please start to run but don't fucking come back....It's about time Sisu hired someone with an idea about talking openly, honestly and without spin and concentrated on Option A, because no matter what the judge says this new stadium is not really an option to Sisu...

 

[oldskyblue58]

Will the club or CT be putting up links to the full text of the judgement?

 

[shmmeee]

Amount of back-pedalling in this thread makes me chuckle. A Sisu win wouldn't bring is home either.

So what now? More of the same?

Do we think Joy is mental enough to actually build a stadium?

 

[Moff]

Do we think Joy is mental enough to actually build a stadium?

No, but she is mental

 

[dadgad]

Ground shares have happened before and will again. The FL agreed to it - no matter whether we like it or not. And realistically the only groundsharing options were Northampton or Walsall as the Butts was a non starter.

The only way now the FL can intervene is if they are not happy with the progress the club in relation to a new stadium. IF (and I say with baited breath) a new stadium is really going to happen then SISU are going to have to move now on this and start getting some tangible evidence out in the public domain and to the FL.

Exactly! And as we know that the "new stadium" was a lie the FL have every reason to ask Sisu to return the club to the Ricoh.
Pressure should be applied on these wankers to enforce the guidelines they purport to uphold.

 

[Deleted member 5849]

Do we think Joy is mental enough to actually build a stadium?

Again, we might be about to find out!

Problem is I can see the sporting reasons to build one... but not the financial ones!

Where's Godiva when I need a financial reason? S/he's the only one to come up with one, but buggered if I can remember what it was!

 

[sky blue john]

No there are 2 values here. ACL they value at £7M and the stadium they have not published their value. People still getting confused on this key fact.

IH,
I'm aware of this fact are Sisu ?
Or are they trying to deceive ?