Sick Boy
Super Moderator
It is connected to the club you tedious old goat. Trying to sweep it all under the carpet because you can't defend your precious council?
Council admits Ricoh Arena was not sustainable without CCFC (12 Viewers)
- Thread starter SimonGilbert
- Start date
It is connected to the club you tedious old goat. Trying to sweep it all under the carpet because you can't defend your precious council?
skybluetony176
Well-Known Member
A) I haven't tried to defend the Council, it is what it is. Even AL has put her hand up.
B) Why don't you and the rest of the idiots who want to supress all talk of SISU form a group? You could call yourselves " We are SISU's personal suppressors". WASPS for short.
C) When is the fact that there is only now one party involved in the ongoing demise of CCFC going to hit you? When it's too late is my guess.
As CCFC fans our only focus from hereon in should be SISU.Anything else is letting our club down.
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rupert_bear
Well-Known Member
We are almost in the bottom 4 of a shit league, losing games from winning positions, a hapless manager talking constant garbage, no players coming in despite promises and we are still talking, council, ACL, Wasps, none of which will score one goal, earn one point or make one iota of difference to our current league position or plight, ffs! will you all wake up and smell the coffee.
Sick Boy
Super Moderator
There is no supression of talk about sisu, only the paranoid anndroids like yourself actually believe it. There is certainly attempts at supressing any anti-council sentiment by council apologists such as yourself.
Both sisu and the coin cil have contributed to the demise of the club, how you cannot see it is mind boggling.
skybluetony176
Well-Known Member
No? Then why do we get you and the rest of WASPS calling me boring when I talk about SISU? Why do you and the rest of WASPS divert any thread that talks about SISU's failings?
I can see it. But you may as well be talking about how selling Dion Dublin contributed to the clubs demise. It changes sweet FA. It's one parties show now. I suggest you come to terms with that and disband WASPS. Anything less is letting your club down.
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Sick Boy
Super Moderator
My heritage isn't Anglo-Saxon mate.
Wasps are our landlords, so they have a lot to do with the club.
skybluetony176
Well-Known Member
But you're not discussing club / landlord relationship and negotiations of what happens when the 2 + 2 year rental agreement runs out are you?
Sick Boy
Super Moderator
No offence but it's obvious that you are trying to divert attention away from the council and it's pathetic. Have you contacted Simon Gilbert to complain? Do you think that he shouldn't have bothered writing the article. Sisu and ccc's conduct in all of this is going to have ramifications for the club for decades.
skybluetony176
Well-Known Member
You mean SG and the CT who according to you and WASPS is a council mouth piece?
You can accuse me of what you like it don't change what's happened and its clearly easier for you to talk about than what happens next to the club and who's responsible for that. Good luck with that.
Mary_Mungo_Midge
Well-Known Member
Sweep under the carpet? Ah, smoking gun time again. Thank goodness I can refer back to the findings of successive independent judges with regards where true blame lies
rupert_bear
Well-Known Member
For fuck sake Sick Boy ain't you got some decorating to do ?
Sick Boy
Super Moderator
I think sisu are terrible owners but I've never let it cloud my judgement to the extent that you seem to have let it.
Do you think it's acceptable that AL lied?
Do you not think she has in some way contributed to the bleak the future that the club finds itself in?
If Sisu had ended up with the Ricoh we would have seen the back of them a lot sooner. Now we are stuck with them for god known how long. Yet some seemed to rejoice that ccc sold the stadium to Wasps.
Sick Boy
Super Moderator
It's interesting that Fisher gets pulled up on his bullshit yet many seem to excuse blatant lies by other parties.
Mary_Mungo_Midge
Well-Known Member
Sick Boy is right. If only CCC had given in to the demand for Average League One rent, which then led to the rent strike, and the move to Sixfields; we'd be okay. Oh, wait a minute....
Sick Boy
Super Moderator
Nah off to Brighton in a bit with the missus so you'll have a break soon.
Sick Boy
Super Moderator
The actions of sisu were pathetic but in no way does it make the council's actions acceptable.
Still, if the council had agreed to reduced the rent when Paul Fletcher was here then maybe we could have avoided all of this.
Mary_Mungo_Midge
Well-Known Member
Again, the Judicial Review judge also stated that he saw no concerns with ACL as a going concern. In possession of exactly the same data Lucas had. So to an extent he agreed with her. Who has ever independently corroborated Fisher's claims?
Mary_Mungo_Midge
Well-Known Member
No it wouldn't. As they really wanted unfettered freehold access, didn't they?
Do you have a little 1 man protest about EVERYTHING?
Why bring up the JR? The materials discussed there was from a point in time when the club played there.
AL's statement was from when the club was gone. Two different 'de facto' scenarios.
But as the accounts show, ACL did not make a profit without the club, so it seems both AL and the judge got it wrong.
Mary_Mungo_Midge
Well-Known Member
Sorry Godiva, the JR judge's comments relate to the time of the CCC loan to ACL, doesn't it? And his comments relate to the financial health at that time and moving forwards. Think about it.
The loan was sanctioned in January 2013, right in the middle of the rent strike, amidst talk of the move to Walsall and other grounds. The judge would have had to take this into consideration with his thinking and projections. Have to
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D
Deleted member 5849
Guest
Although not independent, Anne Lucas seems to be corroborating some of them just at the moment.
Mary_Mungo_Midge
Well-Known Member
When I read her views on franchise sport, I think she's independent of her own sanity. But on this one, there is some thinking that's not too far removed from the view she took at the time - even if it was latterly questionable
lordsummerisle
Well-Known Member
Should not Wasps now repay the loan in full to CCC, and arrange their own financing?
I believe that a large part of the judgment in the JR was that CCC were justified in giving the loan to ACL in order to protect their investment from a predatory hedge fund?
Now that CCC have nothing to do with ACL shouldn't all risk be on the owners of ACL, not local taxpayers?
I believe that a large part of the judgment in the JR was that CCC were justified in giving the loan to ACL in order to protect their investment from a predatory hedge fund?
Now that CCC have nothing to do with ACL shouldn't all risk be on the owners of ACL, not local taxpayers?
lordsummerisle
Well-Known Member
You seem to be inferring that the court was presented with misleading information concerning the financials of ACL by CCC in order to help their case in the JR.
I raised that in a previous post. Why didn't the council make sure the loan was repaid as part of the deal? It's an unnecessary risk, but it could be down to Wasps not having the funds (owner unwilling to provide the resources/banks unwilling to take the risk) due to Wasps own financial troubles.
Which again leads to the question: Did the council evaluate Wasps business plan? If yes, then we come full circle as it just seems they are very poor in analysing business plans and do risk assessment.
skybluetony176
Well-Known Member
You don't seem to have let this fact take part in your judgment so off course it hasn't clouded it.
Yes Ann Lucas got caught telling an untruth, yes that's wrong that she did it but yes she had the grace to put her hands up and admit that when the council mouth piece called her on it.
Tell me what has Mr Fisher said since FOI's have called his statements about progress of the new ground? That's right "A big announcement about the new ground will be made in the new year". But don't concern yourself about that will you. It's only our clubs future.
How the fuck would SISU have ended up with the Ricoh? They've had 7years to propose a deal like Wasps have yet they haven't. Clearly that was a deal that could be done. Negotiation by litigation failed.
skybluetony176
Well-Known Member
Has Fisher admitted his bullshit is bullshit? If/When he does I look forward to seeing make as many post's condemning his behaviour as you have on this thread. I can't see that happening thought, you and the rest of WASPS will just keep diverting back to this story I'm sure.
I'll entertain your last statement of fact a little while. Blatant lies (plural) care to name them?
skybluetony176
Well-Known Member
They should set this as a precedent. David Cardoza would have to pay the loan straight back to NTC for the ground development's at sixfields. That'll teach him for getting involved with SISU.
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lordsummerisle
Well-Known Member
Well they did propose a deal that was better for CCC and Higgs than was received from Wasps.
chiefdave
Well-Known Member
If, when Fisher first said the rent was too high and ACL were reliant on CCFC to be a viable business, CCC and Higgs had turned round and said you can have ACL for under £6m and we'll extend the lease by 200 years we might be in a very different position now. But that would have meant CCC and Higgs telling the truth and as we've seen in the last few days they seem to struggle with that.
MMM you're the only one who keeps banging on about the judge. The point here is that CCC lied, on numerous occasions, to the people of Coventry about the status of ACL.
chiefdave
Well-Known Member
Absolutely agree with that. We're told that private lenders would have no issue lending tens of millions to a company losing millions a year to fund another company also making a loss. Why not do that then and replace the money which has been shown to be taxpayers money despite the council at the time of the loan insisting it wasn't.
With a loan there is always some risk, no matter how small, so CCC have risked taxpayers money. What if in 12 months time Wasps decide they've got it wrong and move another 100 miles putting ACL into administration in the process. Who pays back the taxpayers money then. An unlikely scenario perhaps but not an impossible one.
bigfatronssba
Well-Known Member
Haha
Covstu
Well-Known Member
To think that CCC are out of the picture now is naïve. Any talk about a new ground in Coventry means SISU and CCC have to cross paths again so all of this discussion about telling truths are relevant from a credibility perspective. At the moment we cannot trust both parties as far as we can throw them