Alternative to a New Stadium (8 Viewers)

[chiefdave]

You know things are desperate when we're rehashing ideas Bryan Richardson came up with!

It sounds great as a post on a forum but what we're really saying is open a successful business, in an area no employee of the club has any expertise in, and make enough money to offset any negative impact of not owning a stadium.

Lets be honest a hell of a lot of business fail and a whole bunch more don't make much. Going down this route there would be as much chance of the football club having to put money in as there would be us gaining out of it.

As I understand it there is an area by the Ricoh known as the "Leisure land"

Just looked this up and it looks like it could be part of the land car park C is on. Isn't that now owned by the council and earmarked for future hotel development?

 

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[bigfatronssba]

No it hasn't, so we can neither support the idea nor dismiss it fully.

Personally, I can't see a long term future at the Ricoh now, whoever our owners. At some point Wasps will change the seats, and the rebranding will be complete.


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Let me put it another way then, something along the lines that the OP is talking about would cost far less to construct than a new stadium in Rugby.

 

[stupot07]

Let me put it another way then, something along the lines that the OP is talking about would cost far less to construct than a new stadium in Rugby.

It might well do, but as Dave rightly says would also have a greater chance of being a failure. At least if the stadium goes tits up, there's more chance of a rich owner coming in snapping both the stadium and the club up.

Btw I'm not supportive of a new stadium in rugby, just outside the city yes, 20 miles away and in another town. no thanks.


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[skybluetony176]

The rent adjustment is the key though isn't it?

To gain commitment long term what would that be?

The reality for the club is it is in no bargaining position and every year the club stay and the short term deal gets shorter the more desperate they will become. It is perfectly believable that wasps would prefer to wait and view the situation in two or three years. They could of course look also to secure other partners who may offer a better deal than the football club to them.

So let me get this right. You're now saying that the club aren't the only show in town? What changed? You've gone from 1show to 3

 

[martcov]

You know things are desperate when we're rehashing ideas Bryan Richardson came up with!

It sounds great as a post on a forum but what we're really saying is open a successful business, in an area no employee of the club has any expertise in, and make enough money to offset any negative impact of not owning a stadium.

Lets be honest a hell of a lot of business fail and a whole bunch more don't make much. Going down this route there would be as much chance of the football club having to put money in as there would be us gaining out of it.



Just looked this up and it looks like it could be part of the land car park C is on. Isn't that now owned by the council and earmarked for future hotel development?

are there employees that have experience in building new stadiums? I think the new stadium idea, from what we ( don't ) know at the moment, seems unviable. Has TF ever engaged a company to come up with alternative ideas - e.g. for an investment around the Ricoh? Or why don't SISU have a meeting with Wasps and the council with no preconditions and try and find a way of investing in, say, hotels at favourable conditions. I would have thought that everyone agrees that developing the area around the Ricoh could benefit all parties.

 

[chiefdave]

are there employees that have experience in building new stadiums?

No there aren't, I would assume that is why CBRE have been involved as they are vastly experienced at that kind of project. You would struggle to find a company who would come in and manage starting a successful business for you while you take all the cash so it would mean employing more staff. Successful business people come at a cost and with no guarantee they can repeat their success and thats my point. It's sounds easy writing it on here saying 'why don't they just open a new business that makes loads' but its not that easy and there is a big risk of failure.

 

[oldskyblue58]

You know things are desperate when we're rehashing ideas Bryan Richardson came up with!

It sounds great as a post on a forum but what we're really saying is open a successful business, in an area no employee of the club has any expertise in, and make enough money to offset any negative impact of not owning a stadium.

Lets be honest a hell of a lot of business fail and a whole bunch more don't make much. Going down this route there would be as much chance of the football club having to put money in as there would be us gaining out of it.



Just looked this up and it looks like it could be part of the land car park C is on. Isn't that now owned by the council and earmarked for future hotel development?

I think there is a second area too

So we are saying that because they own a stadium they will suddenly have the necessary skills and finance to manage and exploit exactly the same types of income stream?

We are really only discussing the where because where ever it is will need skilled managers brought in and runs the risk of requiring further finance.

The income streams must work otherwise what is all the fuss about. It could be a separate business but it doesnt have to be

You bring expertise in. Whether thats to run a separate site or to run a stadium. The costs allocation or base are not going to be dissimilar

 

[Mary_Mungo_Midge]

The deal would not be sustainable in the Championship or above!

Gross revenue of ALL income streams from wholly owned stadium 364 days a year the only answer long term, FIFA FP rules.

Is that what Swansea have then?

 

[chiefdave]

So we are saying that because they own a stadium they will suddenly have the necessary skills and finance to manage and exploit exactly the same types of income stream?

Not at all. However the way it is being talked about on here is why not just start up a business that can generate a large, presumably 7 figure, profit if only SISU could be bothered to start up some random business. Starting any business has risks and can be a potential black hole for money, if it was that easy to make large returns everyone would be at it!

To me it presents big challenges either way. If it fails its more money that doesn't go to the club, or even worse more debt. And that all comes with no benefit. If we built a stadium even if the prop co was considered to be a failure or money losing at least we would have an asset that adds value to the club and makes us a more attractive takeover target.

If this business is a success it presents other issues. People regularly expressed concern in the past about someone coming in just to get their hands on the Ricoh. If we own a successful business is there not a danger that we might be a target for a takeover by someone who is only interested in that successful business and not the football club.

And of course there's the issue of what would be allowed under FFP. It strikes me as something that makes a great soundbite but isn't really practical to bring to fruitian.

 

[Grendel]

So let me get this right. You're now saying that the club aren't the only show in town? What changed? You've gone from 1show to 3

You need a better script writer Tony.

Propping up a failed managenent company at £1.3 million a year and being asked £6 million for not even a controlling interest is for sure the only game in town.

 

[Jack Griffin]

No there aren't, I would assume that is why CBRE have been involved as they are vastly experienced at that kind of project. You would struggle to find a company who would come in and manage starting a successful business for you while you take all the cash so it would mean employing more staff. Successful business people come at a cost and with no guarantee they can repeat their success and thats my point. It's sounds easy writing it on here saying 'why don't they just open a new business that makes loads' but its not that easy and there is a big risk of failure.

With SISU so far failure has been guaranteed.

 

[shmmeee]

No there aren't, I would assume that is why CBRE have been involved as they are vastly experienced at that kind of project. You would struggle to find a company who would come in and manage starting a successful business for you while you take all the cash so it would mean employing more staff. Successful business people come at a cost and with no guarantee they can repeat their success and thats my point. It's sounds easy writing it on here saying 'why don't they just open a new business that makes loads' but its not that easy and there is a big risk of failure.

You realise you are literally arguing against the entire business case as put by Seppala don't you?

What was the quote? "I've no idea what I'm doing and that's exciting" or something similar.

OPs ideas is flawed for the same reason Joys is. It's far from a guarantee that any extra non match day revenue generating businesses will be profitable. However the alternative is where we are no, so...

 

[skybluetony176]

The rent adjustment is the key though isn't it?

To gain commitment long term what would that be?

The reality for the club is it is in no bargaining position and every year the club stay and the short term deal gets shorter the more desperate they will become. It is perfectly believable that wasps would prefer to wait and view the situation in two or three years. They could of course look also to secure other partners who may offer a better deal than the football club to them.

You need a better script writer Tony.

Propping up a failed managenent company at £1.3 million a year and being asked £6 million for not even a controlling interest is for sure the only game in town.

You need a consistent script writer. So now we're the only show in town again?

 

[ecky]

Or why don't they build two pubs around the ground one for away fans one for home fans get in a company to run it and keep the profits from both ccfc and wasps fans using them. I like the point you make. The thing I don't understand is if you were looking to have a conference or concert why would people use sisus stadium and not the ricoh

We could call the new pubs fisherspoons or the slug & Waggott?
Any more ideas?

 

[skybluetony176]

We could call the new pubs fisherspoons or the slug & Waggott?
Any more ideas?

The Fisher & Ferkup

The Golden Share

The Smoking Gun

The Queen of Debt's Head

Waggoters

The Hay Waggott

Waggottisaspoon

 

[Sky Blue Kid]

The only way any of these suggestions will work is if SISU leave. We all know (With exception of RFC and friends) that the name SISU is toxic. No investors in their right minds will touch us with the proverbial barge pole. I've gradually come round to the idea of a new stadium is the way forward, but it will never happen under SISU ownership. The Ricoh albeit a beautiful Arena, is bitterly tainted with the odour of our owners. I'd much rather CCC buid a new stadium and rent it to new owners for a peppercorn rent with a shared profit making scheme that keeps all parties happy. We all have dreams and aspirations, mine happens to be without the stench of SISU being around it.

 

[Ashdown]

I've been mulling over this for a while so thought I'd throw it out and see if this sounds like a viable option for Sisu.

The rent at The Ricoh is, by all accounts an excellent deal for Sisu and the football club - there are no outgoings beyond the rent and even a small incoming in the form of a split of money on match days. The only problem with this is that they can't make any money for the club for the remaining days of the year. I think this is a valid and prominent issue, but perhaps not one that deserves the cost, disruption, and controversy that building a new stadium would bring.

But why not build a small arena or conference centre instead and continue playing at The Ricoh paying the small matter of 100k a season?

This would keep a steady flow of cash coming in and if they wanted to they could even turn it into a Coventry City FC complex by combining it with a training ground and academy etc.

Or alternatively organise and manage some events/concerts/exhibitions having paid a nominal extra fee to the landlords for usage !? They won't though, they're compulsive incompetent liars who have moved the goalposts at every opportunity. As I said before though if 'Godiva' is correct and they are receiving management fees from their investors for holding a load of worthless debt then they'll just continue as is.......Cut/fail/Cut/fail/Cut/fail !!