ACL - played hardball and lost! (2 Viewers)

mrtickle · Aug 2, 2013

What have ACL gained from this? They forced admin issue and then due to not signing CVA have caused us to be liquidated, the very thing they said they wanted to avoid. Now we have No club playing in the City and possible 15 point deduction if not worse.

I blame SISU just as much, however the council started the admin game.

The real losers are us Fans. A bad day to be a football fan.

ccfcway · Aug 2, 2013

plenty of losers but no-one wins !

jimmyhillsfanclub · Aug 2, 2013

Every loser wins.....ask Nick Berry

Sky Blue Dal · Aug 2, 2013

mrtickle said:
What have ACL gained from this? They forced admin issue and then due to not signing CVA have caused us to be liquidated, the very thing they said they wanted to avoid. Now we have No club playing in the City and possible 15 point deduction if not worse.

I blame SISU just as much, however the council started the admin game.

The real losers are us Fans. A bad day to be a football fan.

I seem to remember it was SISU who played hardball. Refusing to pay rent and knocking back every new revised rent offered to them by ACL and now the latest one too. So who has been playing hardball. Get a grip!!

ccfcway · Aug 2, 2013

the winner will take it all, just ask Abba

mrtickle · Aug 2, 2013

Yes, lots of tax payers out of pocket. Everything seems to go the way sisu want. Half expect council to lose its case over alledged illegal funding of ACL and SISU to get the club Ricoh on the cheap.

hill83 · Aug 2, 2013

Sky Blue Dal said:
I seem to remember it was SISU who played hardball. Refusing to pay rent and knocking back every new revised rent offered to them by ACL and now the latest one too. So who has been playing hardball. Get a grip!!

Here we go.

*settles in*

Nsgdm1 · Aug 2, 2013

If they had signed it you would still have had no club playing in the City because if SISU would not sign the last lease deal to enable CVA to be signed then there is no chance they would sign any without any incentive to.
ACL must think that there is some benefit to not signing because despite what some may think ,them and their lawyers are clever buisinessmen and turning down £590000 is not something you do lightly ,what that benefit is and the reasons for turning it down remain to be seen ,believe me they would not have done it out of spite.

mrtickle · Aug 2, 2013

Sky Blue Dal said:
I seem to remember it was SISU who played hardball. Refusing to pay rent and knocking back every new revised rent offered to them by ACL and now the latest one too. So who has been playing hardball. Get a grip!!

Yes but Sisu are well known for that. If council had not been so stubborn over rent for last few years maybe we would still be playing in Cov. If you don't think ACL are just as complicit in our downfall then you have rose tinted glasses on.

Steve.B50 · Aug 2, 2013

Another sad day for our once great club.

Nick · Aug 2, 2013

Haven't ACL now lost out on a wad of money and get nothing?

What was Keys on about when he said SISU had been outwitted by cleverer people, what was that?

CovisGod · Aug 2, 2013

It wasn't ACL or SISU singularly playing hardball that put the club in the situation it's in. It was a mixture of nobody giving a shit about the club and it's future except the fans. All of the powers at be are to blame, none of them could run a piss up in a brewery and us the fans are the ones left in the mire,

Fuck the lot of them

covcity4life · Aug 2, 2013

ccfcway said:
plenty of losers but no-one wins !

100% correct

but yes the OP is also right, ACL played around with cov like we were a toy and now they have broken us

scum

Sky Blue Dal · Aug 2, 2013

mrtickle said:
Yes but Sisu are well known for that. If council had not been so stubborn over rent for last few years maybe we would still be playing in Cov. If you don't think ACL are just as complicit in our downfall then you have rose tinted glasses on.

I did not say that ACL did not play a part, but I am damn sure that SISU accelerated the downfall of CCFC. The recent rent offer they were given was to good to be true but they threw it back in ACL/Higgs face. It showed us all that they were only after our Arena complex, CCFC was always second fiddle with to SISU from the day they became our owners. My man..I am not the one wearing tinted glasses here.

mattylad · Aug 2, 2013

mrtickle said:
What have ACL gained from this? They forced admin issue and then due to not signing CVA have caused us to be liquidated, the very thing they said they wanted to avoid. Now we have No club playing in the City and possible 15 point deduction if not worse.

I blame SISU just as much, however the council started the admin game.

The real losers are us Fans. A bad day to be a football fan.

They did what they feel is in their best interest which is to keep the club out of the hands of Otium for as long as possible. I am not saying it will be an ultimately succesful tactic but its the one they have chosen. Dont forget that this has also cost SISU millions more in lost debt than it has ACL.

duffer · Aug 2, 2013

mrtickle said:
Yes but Sisu are well known for that. If council had not been so stubborn over rent for last few years maybe we would still be playing in Cov. If you don't think ACL are just as complicit in our downfall then you have rose tinted glasses on.

It's never been about the rent. The rejection of the latest offer proves that. The rent strike was never about trying to find an acceptable rent, it was about distressing ACL.

No negotiation with SISU was ever done by them in good faith. If you can't see that then you're probably too blind to need to worry about glasses of any shade.

What were ACL supposed to do when faced with a tenant unwilling to either pay or negotiate honestly, one who was absolutely determined to ruin your business so that they could pick it up for themselves?

Anyway, I've got work to do. Surely this argument's been done enough times now.

mrtickle · Aug 2, 2013

Sky Blue Dal said:
I did not say that ACL did not play a part, but I am damn sure that SISU accelerated the downfall of CCFC. The recent rent offer they were given was to good to be true but they threw it back in ACL/Higgs face. It showed us all that they were only after our Arena complex, CCFC was always second fiddle with to SISU from the day they became our owners. My man..I am not the one wearing tinted glasses here.

I wear sky blue glasses my friend. I wouldn't piss on sisu, ACL or CCC if any of them were on fire. I just think that ACL have tried to be clever and it results in CCFC and the fans being losers. They wanted in admin to avoid liquidation but they have effectively voted for that now. There lack of flexibility on income streams (not profit) means liquidation was always the likely outcome. I don't like the way sisu do business but a bit of research by ACL would have shown this would happen.

Tax plays lose and fans lose. I don't even think Sisu win.

James Smith · Aug 2, 2013

mrtickle said:
Yes but Sisu are well known for that. If council had not been so stubborn over rent for last few years maybe we would still be playing in Cov. If you don't think ACL are just as complicit in our downfall then you have rose tinted glasses on.

Yes the rent was far too high and ACL should have spoted that but......Maybe if SISU hadn't walked away from the Higgs we would own half of ACL by now? Maybe if SISU had negotiated and not just gone on a rent boycott then maybe the council might have been willing to sell their share in ACL to their by then partners? Maybe if SISU had taken the last offer that seemed to offer us a far better deal than we will get at Northampton. Maybe if they hadn't buggered us under FFP next season by taking us to Sixfields. Maybe if SISU hadn't been hell bent on getting the Ricoh* on the cheap then we wouldn't be in this position.Maybe if SISU cared about the supporters (their customers FFS) then we wouldn't be in this position.

*and I now think they wanted the freehold not a long lease based on what has been said on here in the last week or so.

James Smith · Aug 2, 2013

mrtickle said:
I wear sky blue glasses my friend. I wouldn't piss on sisu, ACL or CCC if any of them were on fire. I just think that ACL have tried to be clever and it results in CCFC and the fans being losers. They wanted in admin to avoid liquidation but they have effectively voted for that now. There lack of flexibility on income streams (not profit) means liquidation was always the likely outcome. I don't like the way sisu do business but a bit of research by ACL would have shown this would happen.

Tax plays lose and fans lose. I don't even think Sisu win.

So the offers that included the ACL share of F&B + cross invoicing were worse deals than we're likely to be getting at Sixfields?

longjohnskyblue · Aug 2, 2013

No chance sisu getting the arena. Even if the council lose (which I doubt very much) they will simply buy the share of the arena ACL own ! Then it will either be housing (jobs for local builders), or more probably convert to a pure exhibition ala O2 / NIA. This will bring in corporate sponsorships.

Sisu wouldn't be able to assign administrators for the stadium as they will have no influence, as they aren't even tenants anymore. All they have is a confirmed mass exodus of fans, a protracted legal bid, guaranteed relegation for at least one season. Add to that protests from environmental campaigners, fans of the club - the list goes on and on.

Sisu win, but will lose massively in the long run. The fans have lost massively

Wm65 · Aug 2, 2013

Today acl should hang their heads in shame - their behaviour is beyond reprehensible , shameful behaviour by acl and sisu - disgusted.

mrbluesky87 · Aug 2, 2013

covcity4life said:
100% correct

but yes the OP is also right, ACL played around with cov like we were a toy and now they have broken us

scum

Be quiet, if you need to use the word Scum, it should be aimed at SISU.

blueflint · Aug 2, 2013

mrtickle said:
Yes, lots of tax payers out of pocket. Everything seems to go the way sisu want. Half expect council to lose its case over alledged illegal funding of ACL and SISU to get the club Ricoh on the cheap.

dont you ever read any posts on here tax payers not necessarily losing out its not over yet. SISU not guaranteed to win ACL could be playing a blinder just wait and see i hope coventry city win its all we have left to hope for

blueflint · Aug 2, 2013

Wm65 said:
Today acl should hang their heads in shame - their behaviour is beyond reprehensible , shameful behaviour by acl and sisu - disgusted.

why should ACL hold its head in shame they offered a decent rent at £400.000 and then even better at 150.000 come on engage your brain

blueflint · Aug 2, 2013

mrtickle said:
I wear sky blue glasses my friend. I wouldn't piss on sisu, ACL or CCC if any of them were on fire. I just think that ACL have tried to be clever and it results in CCFC and the fans being losers. They wanted in admin to avoid liquidation but they have effectively voted for that now. There lack of flexibility on income streams (not profit) means liquidation was always the likely outcome. I don't like the way sisu do business but a bit of research by ACL would have shown this would happen.

Tax plays lose and fans lose. I don't even think Sisu win.

still harping on about income streams they were never really relevant m8 think about it

Sky Blues · Aug 2, 2013

Let's see what ACL's next move is - they must have had a reason for turning down the CVA. I'm interested to know what it is.

Warwickhunt · Aug 2, 2013

Dont give a Fuck who is to blame! Where's my £14million? Why are we facing council cuts to services? and SISU can wipe there arses with £7.9Million the debt cos its just been liquidated and they dont have face a inquisition about it because ACL forced it and not them - They are shrewd business men/women who do this for a living and ACL were trying to play them at their own game and lost. The FL will issue the Golden Share to SISU because if not they will get a litigation set on them by SISU if they don't. The FL are just as culpable in this and the rest of football will regret this particualr Pandora's Box being opened believe me.

Warwickhunt · Aug 2, 2013

blueflint said:
why should ACL hold its head in shame they offered a decent rent at £400.000 and then even better at 150.000 come on engage your brain

And what conditions were applied to these offers? if you dont know how can you make a judgement?

James Smith · Aug 2, 2013

Warwickhunt said:
Dont give a Fuck who is to blame! Where's my £14million? Why are we facing council cuts to services? and SISU can wipe there arses with £7.9Million the debt cos its just been liquidated and they dont have face a inquisition about it because ACL forced it and not them - They are shrewd business men/women who do this for a living and ACL were trying to play them at their own game and lost. The FL will issue the Golden Share to SISU because if not they will get a litigation set on them by SISU if they don't. The FL are just as culpable in this and the rest of football will regret this particualr Pandora's Box being opened believe me.

I thought that with liquidation came an investigation and I wonder who has the most to fear from that?

mrtickle · Aug 2, 2013

Actually it is worse as they are stuck with no chance of recovery. If and it is a big if, they do build a ground they income streams will be vital. The other big if is will the club recover. I don't think people realise how important income is to FFP.

mrtickle · Aug 2, 2013

Warwickhunt said:
Dont give a Fuck who is to blame! Where's my £14million? Why are we facing council cuts to services? and SISU can wipe there arses with £7.9Million the debt cos its just been liquidated and they dont have face a inquisition about it because ACL forced it and not them - They are shrewd business men/women who do this for a living and ACL were trying to play them at their own game and lost. The FL will issue the Golden Share to SISU because if not they will get a litigation set on them by SISU if they don't. The FL are just as culpable in this and the rest of football will regret this particualr Pandora's Box being opened believe me.

I agree. The big losers however are us fans. The council have no place in owning a football stadium, it was a recipe for disaster.

mrtickle · Aug 2, 2013

blueflint said:
dont you ever read any posts on here tax payers not necessarily losing out its not over yet. SISU not guaranteed to win ACL could be playing a blinder just wait and see i hope coventry city win its all we have left to hope for

Yes, as everything they've done before has worked. This just smacks of desperation.

James Smith · Aug 2, 2013

mrtickle said:
Actually it is worse as they are stuck with no chance of recovery. If and it is a big if, they do build a ground they income streams will be vital. The other big if is will the club recover. I don't think people realise how important income is to FFP.

Oh I realise how vital the income streams are and I think Young Timothy does too, the problem is I can't see how moving to Sixfields is an improvement under FFP over the last offer at the Ricoh.

mrtickle · Aug 2, 2013

blueflint said:
still harping on about income streams they were never really relevant m8 think about it

The whole thing is about income streams. Well never get promoted if we can't buy players due to funds being capped by FFP. I do however think sisu are trying to get the Ricoh on the cheap but if council had been more flexible this may have been avoided. Why do people think its okay for a 3rd party to make money of match day sales.

mrtickle · Aug 2, 2013

James Smith said:
Oh I realise how vital the income streams are and I think Young Timothy does too, the problem is I can't see how moving to Sixfields is an improvement under FFP over the last offer at the Ricoh.

Because it frees them from lease. Any new negotiation can lead to demand of income. Worst case, they go to Northampton and build a new stadium but I hope it doesn't happen. I can see ACL struggling without the club.

ACL - played hardball and lost! (2 Viewers)

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