Andy Thorn: This is the worst period of my career. (1 Viewer)

If the new board are serious with what they want to do (even though the fans don't want what they are suggesting) and maintain championship football, the first act would be removing Thorn as manager,

He never was the answer and never will be, just a good few games and the cheap option!

Lord_Nampil said:

If the new board are serious with what they want to do (even though the fans don't want what they are suggesting) and maintain championship football, the first act would be removing Thorn as manager,

He never was the answer and never will be, just a good few games and the cheap option!

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lmao, no, the first thing they should do is increase the budget, so we can actually have proper competition within the team and being able to field a proper championship team. Only then will we be able to get out of the relegation zone without relying on other teams to enter administration.

you trust Thorn then??

Every ones moaning about the team that he brought in and how there not good enough, so why would you trust him with buying players in January??

I didnt want him last season i wanted the guy who went to Bristol City a few weeks ago and with the same squad look where they are now, think they have got more points since he has been in charge than we have got all season! hes only been there a month and a half!

You can give AT millions and yes he may or may not be able to spot a player, however that does not mean he is astute enough to be a manager and have enough tactical knowledge about him to get us out of the mess were in, it just has not worked for him move him back to scout.
The other side of the coin is people think he should stay on because he has not been given time or the resources etc etc, ok lets say, he stay's as manager sisu give him money to spend, the team still keep losing it makes no differance what so ever to the performances on the pitch the team still play safety first football and rarely venture into the opposition half for fear of a nose bleed, it will be sisu's fault for not seeing that after (however long he's been manager) that he had an appailing record and yet give him money to spend on players.
Now I am not sticking up for sisu but I feel time has come for a change in the manager and harrison has to go as well, keep AT as scout fine, but surely what harm can it do to get a new manager in what's to lose? Oh AT's a nice bloke and it's not his fault it's sisu's for not giving him money.
Sorry don't give a monkey's if he's a nice bloke, being nice does not put points on the table, he is not getting the commitment out of the players, time to go AT or thats another thing I will blame sisu for for not changing manager when it's bleeding obvious he has not got what it takes to sort the shower of shit out that cross that white line on a match day

Lloyd said:

lmao, no, the first thing they should do is increase the budget, so we can actually have proper competition within the team and being able to field a proper championship team. Only then will we be able to get out of the relegation zone without relying on other teams to enter administration.

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I really don’t understand why Thorn’s still getting the sympathy vote. This team of ours should not be bottom of the league. Granted were not a top 10 team but weren’t certainly not a bottom of the league team.

Thorn is inept and he is the main reason why were where we are. He’s not the sole reason but he is the main reason.

I have no confidence in him whatsoever.

Becasue it's another arrow in the sisu out campaign that it's not thorns fault it's sisu's.
Maybe so but under any other circumstances fans would be wanting thorns head to roll for the abysmal record and way we are performing so to me it makes no differance the records is still appailing and the performances are abysmal and it has also took him this long to realise were in the shit and have clear the air talks with the players, no shit it's your worse time in your career well this is turning into my worst time as a supporter of CCFC because you and these players as well as sisu are taking my/our club down so admit you can't do the job and step aside to give the club a fighting chance of survival if you love it that much.

I don't think there's any doubt on this one! I think he's proved he certainly can spot players.

ICHAN said:

....and yes he may or may not be able to spot a player...

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torchomatic said:

I don't think there's any doubt on this one! I think he's proved he certainly can spot players.

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Cody McDonald proves that point.

I think we should realise AT was given the chance to be manager,he obviously took it hoping it would of turned out better,I blame Sisu for a manager on the cheap and have no ill feeling to AT as hes a scout all said and done.

Thing is torch there is rumours that ranson and others may have signed/wanted some of the players we signed so there is doubt there in my opinion.

okay, so I go to work, and say that i need a powerful computer to do graphics design, my boss tells me they can only afford a computer that can do half the job and if it breaks i can't replace it unless its free and i can't repair it unless its free. When the computer breaks, i cant replace it, my client then moans at me because i didnt do their job, i relate this back to my bosses and they say there is nothing they can do.

WHAT DO I DO?! This is the position thorn is in. some people on this forum just don't get that. Do I believe given the resources Thorn will get us in the top half? No. Not this season, If he's given the resources do I think he can still get us out of the relegation zone? Yes I do.

Our fans are always quick to judge and call for the managers head everytime theres a run of bad form, has happened every season I've supported this club. It's ridiculous, you're as bad as those who were calling for Wengers head at Arsenal.

Hurrah! .

Lloyd said:

okay, so I go to work, and say that i need a powerful computer to do graphics design, my boss tells me they can only afford a computer that can do half the job and if it breaks i can't replace it unless its free and i can't repair it unless its free. When the computer breaks, i cant replace it, my client then moans at me because i didnt do their job, i relate this back to my bosses and they say there is nothing they can do.

WHAT DO I DO?! This is the position thorn is in. some people on this forum just don't get that. Do I believe given the resources Thorn will get us in the top half? No. Not this season, If he's given the resources do I think he can still get us out of the relegation zone? Yes I do.

Our fans are always quick to judge and call for the managers head everytime theres a run of bad form, has happened every season I've supported this club. It's ridiculous, you're as bad as those who were calling for Wengers head at Arsenal.

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LeamingtonBootBoy said:

Cody McDonald proves that point.

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Remain to be convinced he 's an AT signing ,Or a boardroom deal involving no cash and juke in some way ,we should find out if he plays this weekend now KD's @ Andy's shoulder.

Lloyd said:

Our fans are always quick to judge and call for the managers head everytime theres a run of bad form, has happened every season I've supported this club. It's ridiculous, you're as bad as those who were calling for Wengers head at Arsenal.

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Don't think they have been quick Lloyd personally think they have been slow because if there was not the distraction of the sisu protest AT would have been feeling a lot more fan pressure than he has of that I am certain, I have never called for a manager to be sacked and have maintained that players hold responsibility, however results do not lie, this team should have more backbone, more fight, more fire in there bellys and be able to grind and fight for more points than they have got, so who is to blame for that?
Wenger is a differant situation altogether he has been there years and developed some of the greatest young footballers and has Arsenal playing football the way it should be played, so how you can compare a few fans wanting AT to be gone to the gooner fans who wanted arsene's head in my opinion is silly.

Yeah let's get another manager in, this is what the club needs, let's change the manager again and again like we have done for the last 10yrs.
In fact let's change the manager every 3 or 4 games co's after all the players always get a boost when a new manager comes in and start playing well. will soon be top of the league and in the prem if we do that. It makes ya wonder why all the top teams don't do it.

Of course Andy Thorn feels down, he's Coventry thru and thru, he took ver the job co's thought he could do better than the last few clowns we had as manager and because he loves Coventry City.

Let's look at the bigger picture for a moment instead of just singling out Thorn.
The troubles started way before Thorn took over as manager, why do you think Ranson resigned? Co's he could see what was happening to the club, it was a sinking ship then. We sold Scott Dann and Danny Fox two of the best players to be seen at City for years, he put up with that even thou he advised SISU not to sell them, then they sold Thomas Connor or so he thought to Liverpool.

We lost three of our best players in the summer, King, Westwood and Gunnarsson followed by Ben Turner at the start of the season. We got two keepers in on free transfers and a bargain basement forward in Cody, what do you expect the manager to do with no with no funds to strengthen the squad with every half decent asset we had sold underneath him (Juke will more than likely be sold in the January transfer window).

We haven't been a good side in the Championship for the last 10yrs and we have finished nearer the bottom than the top in most of them. The players Andy Thorn has been left with aren't good enough so how on earth do you expect Coventry City to be anywhere other than we are now.

You don't get better by selling your best assets and replacing them with bargain basement players.

Yeah Andy Thorn might have made a few tactical errors here and there but who don't, if nobody made any tactical errors and everyone played perfectly every game the game we love would become very dull and boring.

This is not down to Andy Thorn, this is down to SISU who have ruined our club.

ICHAN said:

Don't think they have been quick Lloyd personally think they have been slow because if there was not the distraction of the sisu protest AT would have been feeling a lot more fan pressure than he has of that I am certain, I have never called for a manager to be sacked and have maintained that players hold responsibility, however results do not lie, this team should have more backbone, more fight, more fire in there bellys and be able to grind and fight for more points than they have got, so who is to blame for that?
Wenger is a differant situation altogether he has been there years and developed some of the greatest young footballers and has Arsenal playing football the way it should be played, so how you can compare a few fans wanting AT to be gone to the gooner fans who wanted arsene's head in my opinion is silly.

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im not saying AT is without blame mate, but you can't sell ice to the eskimos and you can't expect our team to go out and beat a team who has more depth than us. Players need rotating to keep things fresh, its not just tactics, but players get found out too, little skills they do etc. we play the same team every week unless we have injuries, and then we bring in someone from the accademy. You can't do that! tell me a successful club who has the same lack of depth we do.

I honestly believe another manager won't be our salvation, only investment can save us now.

The situation at arsenal was that more and more fans were frustrated that Wenger hadn't won a trophy in years and their form at the beginning of the season was shocking, a lot of supporters wanted him out because of this. But he managed to get things to turn around once his key players regained fitness. Unfortunately Thorn doesn't have that option. He can only rely on his youngsters.

ICHAN said:

Wenger is a differant situation altogether he has been there years and developed some of the greatest young footballers and has Arsenal playing football the way it should be played, so how you can compare a few fans wanting AT to be gone to the gooner fans who wanted arsene's head in my opinion is silly.

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I think you have answered your own question if you read it again. Thorn needs time and money.

Wenger took over Arsenal when they were top of the league too.

Lloyd said:

okay, so I go to work, and say that i need a powerful computer to do graphics design, my boss tells me they can only afford a computer that can do half the job and if it breaks i can't replace it unless its free and i can't repair it unless its free. When the computer breaks, i cant replace it, my client then moans at me because i didnt do their job, i relate this back to my bosses and they say there is nothing they can do.

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Difference is, before this point you'd have a decent track record in graphics design though right? As opposed to only taking it up for the first time a few weeks before having spent the previous few years finding where to get Photoshop on the cheap for the company.

That's where the question marks over Andy Thorn are justifiably being raised.

Isn't this the only period of his career?

At least managerially :facepalm:

CCFC said:

Isn't this the only period of his career?

At least managerially :facepalm:

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LOL that is quite true and a very apt smiley too!!

ajsccfc said:

Difference is, before this point you'd have a decent track record in graphics design though right? As opposed to only taking it up for the first time a few weeks before having spent the previous few years finding where to get Photoshop on the cheap for the company.

That's where the question marks over Andy Thorn are justifiably being raised.

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In this analogy does not the employer completely overide the technicians ability too deliver the product regardless of his prior experience ,replace the equiptment for players and in actual fact the managers ability to effect things are overidden as the tacit signal from on high is ,get on with it ,costs are the be all and end all

Bloodnut1964 said:

Let's look at the bigger picture for a moment instead of just singling out Thorn.
The troubles started way before Thorn took over as manager, why do you think Ranson resigned? Co's he could see what was happening to the club, it was a sinking ship then. We sold Scott Dann and Danny Fox two of the best players to be seen at City for years, he put up with that even thou he advised SISU not to sell them, then they sold Thomas Connor or so he thought to Liverpool.

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Ranson put money in and managed the club by investing in players he thought could be part of a promotion team. But SISU were very wary of spending money, blocked many of his attempts to sign players and occasionally sold them when the debts accumalated.

They had 2 conflicting methodologies, eventually SISU said 'no more money' took control and sacked Ranson. They are now doing it their way, which means cutting costs till it hurts, selling assets to cover any shortfall in revenue & no more money coming into the club (unless they can find a mug to put it up at his own risk). They aim to get back to break even or better, after which they will sell at a profit. They only see a balance sheet, they don't care about the club, the community or the city.

That is how I understand it.

Were not going to get investment though we all know that.
However I have nothing what so ever against Thorn as a person as I do not know him.
Yes changing a manager every year is not the way to get stability in the team again I agree.
However I do not want us to be relegated as I am sure no-one does if you support cov.
That is why I want a change, Try anything to get out of this rut we are in, and if that is by changing the manager so be it, as I have said I have never called for a manager to be sacked and the players need to hold there hands up and take some of the blame, as to what happens on the pitch.
However they are unsackable more's the pity for some of them.
Surely playing a settled team is better than chopping and changing every week lloyd, and yes I agree the bench and team are threadbare and I do not know anyone who would argue with that.
But there is no fight in the team, we are in a relegation battle there is no questioning that, and yet you would have thought that every player would be busting a gut and fighting for the cause, but this does not seem to be happening why?
Surely sisu can not be blamed for there being no fighting spirit in the team, the experianced players should be leading by example and dragging the younger players kicking and screaming until the final whistle.
Our lack of concentration and fitness towards the final quater of an hour is not improving and teams know this, and at the end of a match we will more than likely concede if they put preessure on us as a team, if the team were fighting tooth and nail through out the game then yes they are going to be knackered but there is no team spirit there, I will not hark on about 87 but the reason we won the final was because of the total belief those players had, they fought for everything, they were nowhere near spurs as far as skill was concered but they beat them because of the pure determination they had as a team and were not going to roll over and have there belly's tickled by waddle and the like.

Lloyd said:

okay, so I go to work, and say that i need a powerful computer to do graphics design, my boss tells me they can only afford a computer that can do half the job and if it breaks i can't replace it unless its free and i can't repair it unless its free. When the computer breaks, i cant replace it, my client then moans at me because i didnt do their job, i relate this back to my bosses and they say there is nothing they can do.

WHAT DO I DO?! This is the position thorn is in. some people on this forum just don't get that. Do I believe given the resources Thorn will get us in the top half? No. Not this season, If he's given the resources do I think he can still get us out of the relegation zone? Yes I do.

Our fans are always quick to judge and call for the managers head everytime theres a run of bad form, has happened every season I've supported this club. It's ridiculous, you're as bad as those who were calling for Wengers head at Arsenal.

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You keep bringing up lack of investment. Yes we all would like millions for the manager to spend but we haven’t so that irrelevant.
What is relevant he can’t get the best out of this crop of players. Were 7 points adrift, for me personally this team should not be 7 points adrift.

Thorn has had over 30 games in charge and the past 10 games his managerial skills have been VERY questionable. In terms of players selection, tactics, post match analysis, comments in the paper, the list is endless.

He has run out ideas already and still persists in this diamond which is clear for all to see isn’t the answer.
Take off you hatred for SISU glasses and purely look at Thorn. What good has he done since been in charge? For the exception of his honeymoon period.

My own opinion is that Thorn should never have got the job in the first place, and he's proved quite admirably that he is not a manager.
To me its quite simple and my two points on why Thorn has to go are these.
1. Wether you have 11 bad players,11 decent players or 11 great players a manager should get any of those teams to go onto a football pitch and fight,hussle,and show commitment to the cause. Its fairly clear by most on here that Thorn can not get any of these emotions out of his team
2. The style of football is down to the Manager alone, no-one else. I would say 90% of people on here are clearly not happy with the style of constant defensive, sideways and non threatening football. As i say if he feels that we are good enough player wise to survive comfortably, then surely it is down to the style of football not working,again down to one person and one person alone, that we are 7 points adrift of safety, in the first week of december,not even half way through a season, and he is the manager Andy Thorn.

The Rev

Nail on the head Rev,

I keep hearing the word entertaining football. Its bollox. Yes we play neat ineffective football but its not exciting edge of your seat stuff.

ICHAN said:

Were not going to get investment though we all know that.
However I have nothing what so ever against Thorn as a person as I do not know him.
Yes changing a manager every year is not the way to get stability in the team again I agree.
However I do not want us to be relegated as I am sure no-one does if you support cov.
That is why I want a change, Try anything to get out of this rut we are in, and if that is by changing the manager so be it, as I have said I have never called for a manager to be sacked and the players need to hold there hands up and take some of the blame, as to what happens on the pitch.
However they are unsackable more's the pity for some of them.
Surely playing a settled team is better than chopping and changing every week lloyd, and yes I agree the bench and team are threadbare and I do not know anyone who would argue with that.
But there is no fight in the team, we are in a relegation battle there is no questioning that, and yet you would have thought that every player would be busting a gut and fighting for the cause, but this does not seem to be happening why?
Surely sisu can not be blamed for there being no fighting spirit in the team, the experianced players should be leading by example and dragging the younger players kicking and screaming until the final whistle.
Our lack of concentration and fitness towards the final quater of an hour is not improving and teams know this, and at the end of a match we will more than likely concede if they put preessure on us as a team, if the team were fighting tooth and nail through out the game then yes they are going to be knackered but there is no team spirit there, I will not hark on about 87 but the reason we won the final was because of the total belief those players had, they fought for everything, they were nowhere near spurs as far as skill was concered but they beat them because of the pure determination they had as a team and were not going to roll over and have there belly's tickled by waddle and the like.

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i didn't mean we should completely shuffle the team every week, but playing certain players week in, week out without rotation (because we don't have a proper backup for them) is our main concern, if Keogh got injured for instance, who would be able to cover him as well how he plays? No one is the answer.

i don't remember seeing any proper "fight" in our team for a few years, one or 2 games i've seen it in the past few seasons, then those with the fighting drive got sold or injured...

i've said it before, AT is not faultless, but right now, given the resources of his position, any manager who took over would be in the same position.

CUS Wyken said:

You keep bringing up lack of investment. Yes we all would like millions for the manager to spend but we haven’t so that irrelevant.
What is relevant he can’t get the best out of this crop of players. Were 7 points adrift, for me personally this team should not be 7 points adrift.

Thorn has had over 30 games in charge and the past 10 games his managerial skills have been VERY questionable. In terms of players selection, tactics, post match analysis, comments in the paper, the list is endless.

He has run out ideas already and still persists in this diamond which is clear for all to see isn’t the answer.
Take off you hatred for SISU glasses and purely look at Thorn. What good has he done since been in charge? For the exception of his honeymoon period.

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statistics are manipulated and very rarely tell the truth in a given situation.

what has AT been given since he was put in charge? Our team were always going to be battling for relegation as soon as we found out that 4 First team players werent going to be here. and those first team players are now playing in the first team of "better" clubs.

You're asking AT to forge a sword and then telling him he doesn't have any metal to work with unless he melts down his armour.

(I'm sorry for all these metaphors, but I feel compelled to).

wingy said:

In this analogy does not the employer completely overide the technicians ability too deliver the product regardless of his prior experience ,replace the equiptment for players and in actual fact the managers ability to effect things are overidden as the tacit signal from on high is ,get on with it ,costs are the be all and end all

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That's why it's a poor analogy. A talented graphic artist still needs a minimum spec to do his job. A talented manager however could and should avoid throwing away the points we have with the players we have.

There's little to suggest Thorn is a good manager.

The Reverend Skyblue said:

My own opinion is that Thorn should never have got the job in the first place, and he's proved quite admirably that he is not a manager.
To me its quite simple and my two points on why Thorn has to go are these.
1. Wether you have 11 bad players,11 decent players or 11 great players a manager should get any of those teams to go onto a football pitch and fight,hussle,and show commitment to the cause. Its fairly clear by most on here that Thorn can not get any of these emotions out of his team
2. The style of football is down to the Manager alone, no-one else. I would say 90% of people on here are clearly not happy with the style of constant defensive, sideways and non threatening football. As i say if he feels that we are good enough player wise to survive comfortably, then surely it is down to the style of football not working,again down to one person and one person alone, that we are 7 points adrift of safety, in the first week of december,not even half way through a season, and he is the manager Andy Thorn.

The Rev

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i seem to remember a lot of people complaining about Boothroyds style of play when we were in the playoffs, then we lost the backbone of our team due to injury and wasn't able to recover. Fans don't always know best, if they did they'd be managers, not just fans.

I agree. The blame the manager/sack the manager cycle has to stop. Look where it's got us. What progress have we made since sacking Adams? Dowie? Coleman? Boothroyd? Nowhere. It would be the same if we got rid of AT. It's SISU that are the problem, they are the ones who have hamstrung him.

I think the fans will get there way though and he'll be sacked. Then they'll moan about his replacement on appointment or wait until he's lost a few and then moan about him then. And so on and so forth...

Lloyd said:

statistics are manipulated and very rarely tell the truth in a given situation.

what has AT been given since he was put in charge? Our team were always going to be battling for relegation as soon as we found out that 4 First team players werent going to be here. and those first team players are now playing in the first team of "better" clubs.

You're asking AT to forge a sword and then telling him he doesn't have any metal to work with unless he melts down his armour.

(I'm sorry for all these metaphors, but I feel compelled to).

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ajsccfc said:

That's why it's a poor analogy. A talented graphic artist still needs a minimum spec to do his job. A talented manager however could and should avoid throwing away the points we have with the players we have.

There's little to suggest Thorn is a good manager.

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it doesn't matter how much talent you've got if you don't have the equipment.

But we have had this for years lloyd but that was not what I was getting at and it was not a go about squad depth or anything like that(sorry if you thought it was)
My main point was fighting spirit, the players have not got it, they have no desire forget skill etc it is down to fighting for survival and beleiving that they can do it,motivation,growing some nuts and putting your body on the line for the team, for the club, for the fans but it is not there and this is down to management and training.
How can we know that changing a manager will not bring this desire back into the group of players unless we try?
If we stick with Thorn weather we like it or not is only going one way and that is down, ok we get relegated with a differant manager but if we are going to go down then at least lets go down fighting not whimpering.

Lloyd said:

it doesn't matter how much talent you've got if you don't have the equipment.

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The current 'equipment' has had us in positions to earn a lot more points than we have this season, and while the opposing manager has adapted his side this we've come up short time and time again in this department.

Where is the evidence of Thorn's talent that allows people to say it's purely a money thing? To even suggest that nobody could do better with the same squad than a recently-converted scout is amazing.