Awaiting a call from Mr Tim Fisher (5 Viewers)

Deleted member 5849 · May 18, 2014

Grendel said:
Richardson I'm pretty sure one season got some player of the season votes. He was very popular.

He was, and tbf I bought into it as much as the next man.

That said, even today, at least I can see what he was trying to do. In the fine sporting margins, the question would always be if we'd stayed up, would we have just ended up with even more debt or... could he have maybe seen his plans through and leveraged us up another level of competitiveness in the end?

If we're looking to personalise villains of those years, I'd far rather throw my darts at Robinson.

TurkeyTrot · May 18, 2014

Deleted member 5849 said:
He was, and tbf I bought into it as much as the next man.

That said, even today, at least I can see what he was trying to do. In the fine sporting margins, the question would always be if we'd stayed up, would we have just ended up with even more debt or... could he have maybe seen his plans through and leveraged us up another level of competitiveness in the end?

If we're looking to personalise villains of those years, I'd far rather throw my darts at Robinson.

At the time of the "arena 2000" project I couldn't believe that fans were sucked in, initially it was never going to be Coventrys home ground, it was designed as the new wembley. We would never had played there with it's retractable roof, pitch and 60 odd thousand capacity but he had a vision that nearly paid off. Unlucky with relegation and running out of money, who knows what might have happened. (That post almost makes me look like a fan of his! For the record I'm not !)

Deleted member 5849 · May 18, 2014

TurkeyTrot said:
At the time of the "arena 2000" project I couldn't believe that fans were sucked in, initially it was never going to be Coventrys home ground, it was designed as the new wembley. We would never had played there with it's retractable roof, pitch and 60 odd thousand capacity but he had a vision that nearly paid off. Unlucky with relegation and running out of money, who knows what might have happened. (That post almost makes me look like a fan of his! For the record I'm not !)

The original proposals were 40-45k. Ambitious, but at least warranted moving (what we ended up with didn't have enough of an 'upgrade' to deserve it IMNSHO. We ended moving just for the sake of moving) The whole project was leveraged up once there was a contest for a new Wembley site (which was always going to go to Wembley wasn't it) in an effort to disguise the fact we'd actually run out of money to sort it ourselves, and we needed a way out.

TurkeyTrot · May 18, 2014

I think back to Leicester and their situation when they went into admin. (Not too dissimilar than our own when SISU took over) yes they had some rocky years but nothing like where we are. The Leicester fans don't have many kind words to say about the previous owners and even when they had that mad man in charge they held him responsible for all their woes.
I'd love to know how much SISU have actually invested in the Club, I'm talking real proper pound notes, (and yes include loads if it's from a bank or a parent company as long as it's been real money) we could probably have an idea then what they require to walk away. Because regardless on your views of SISU the situation at the moment is the club is worth very little if anything. SISU ain't gonna walk away with losses of X amount until the fight is lost and for that I don't blame them one bit.
Maybe it needs a big boys chat from a fan group along the lines of "you don't want to be here, we don't want you here, how much do you want for the club and where do you get that figure from" try to get a figure then agree to support the club, generating more cash and success until someone offers that amount. Bit like the Dublin transfer I dunno, it sounds daft but this whole situation is daft.

wal3590 · May 18, 2014

"Do you feel any regret at all moving from the Ricoh? Surely it has put the club in a much worse position financially, I know we didn't get much match day revenues from the Ricoh and you said this would affect FFP rules but surely we are much worse off now as shirt and merchandise salest sales are way down and you get much much less ticket sales. Because of the move you have possibly permanently lost a generation of fans and even old fans for IF we ever return to Coventry? Has the move really been worth all the hassle? Surely paying the rent at the Ricoh would have given you a much bigger scope to negotiate a new rate or even a purchase of the ground?
Lee
"

Just sent this to Tim and Mark, just a few of my thoughts. Wondered whether you guys agree...

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

limoncello · May 18, 2014

wal3590 said:
"Do you feel any regret at all moving from the Ricoh? Surely it has put the club in a much worse position financially, I know we didn't get much match day revenues from the Ricoh and you said this would affect FFP rules but surely we are much worse off now as shirt and merchandise salest sales are way down and you get much much less ticket sales. Because of the move you have possibly permanently lost a generation of fans and even old fans for IF we ever return to Coventry? Has the move really been worth all the hassle? Surely paying the rent at the Ricoh would have given you a much bigger scope to negotiate a new rate or even a purchase of the ground?
Lee
"

Just sent this to Tim and Mark, just a few of my thoughts. Wondered whether you guys agree...

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Top, top emailing Lee. Here's a thought though: maybe they don't really give a fuck about the short-term finances? Maybe they're looking a bit more into the future. In fact, I've just emailed Tim and Mark.

"Hi Tim and Mark, hope you are well. I've been relentlessly pondering about things and I was just wondering if maybe you're looking a bit more long-term than short-term vis-a-vis the current situation. Best wishes, Tony."

dongonzalos · May 18, 2014

limoncello said:
Top, top emailing Lee. Here's a thought though: maybe they don't really give a fuck about the short-term finances? Maybe they're looking a bit more into the future. In fact, I've just emailed Tim and Mark.

"Hi Tim and Mark, hope you are well. I've been relentlessly pondering about things and I was just wondering if maybe you're looking a bit more long-term than short-term vis-a-vis the current situation. Best wishes, Tony."

What so you think the long term plan is?

lewys33 · May 19, 2014

I love the "long-term" argument when deciding on whether we should rent at sixfields or the Ricoh ........

Astute · May 19, 2014

Short term plan? Long term plan?

I just want to know if they have any sort of plan.

wal3590 · May 19, 2014

wal3590 said:
"Do you feel any regret at all moving from the Ricoh? Surely it has put the club in a much worse position financially, I know we didn't get much match day revenues from the Ricoh and you said this would affect FFP rules but surely we are much worse off now as shirt and merchandise salest sales are way down and you get much much less ticket sales. Because of the move you have possibly permanently lost a generation of fans and even old fans for IF we ever return to Coventry? Has the move really been worth all the hassle? Surely paying the rent at the Ricoh would have given you a much bigger scope to negotiate a new rate or even a purchase of the ground?
Lee
"

Just sent this to Tim and Mark, just a few of my thoughts. Wondered whether you guys agree...

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Marks reply:

Lee,
I very much regret having to leave the Ricoh and will do everything possible to get the club back there. There was sadly no way to play there last season as ACL used the administration process to keep us out: they made up this nonsense of "Limited" vs. "Holdings" as a basis to refuse to recognise us as the club and would only discuss arrangements to play at the Ricoh with Appleton (who didn't have any players). I kept trying to get them to talk and they refused each time.
If the club goes back as ACl's tenant, it will go bust in less than 2 years (as it did before). The rental model with no access to match-day revenues doesn't work. Why won't they sell the Ricoh to the club at a fair, independently-assessed price? They don't have a better use for it other than to host streaking contests which demeans the city.

A week ago last Thursday we tried again to get the council to come back to the table. They refused.

I'm an independent director of the club, not an employee of SISU. I have no financial interest in any particular outcome, I just want to get the club playing in its own stadium in Coventry. Please help me get the council back to the table.
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Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

ajsccfc · May 19, 2014

Streaking contests?

martcov · May 19, 2014

wal3590 said:
Marks reply:

Lee,
I very much regret having to leave the Ricoh and will do everything possible to get the club back there. There was sadly no way to play there last season as ACL used the administration process to keep us out: they made up this nonsense of "Limited" vs. "Holdings" as a basis to refuse to recognise us as the club and would only discuss arrangements to play at the Ricoh with Appleton (who didn't have any players). I kept trying to get them to talk and they refused each time.
If the club goes back as ACl's tenant, it will go bust in less than 2 years (as it did before). The rental model with no access to match-day revenues doesn't work. Why won't they sell the Ricoh to the club at a fair, independently-assessed price? They don't have a better use for it other than to host streaking contests which demeans the city.

A week ago last Thursday we tried again to get the council to come back to the table. They refused.

I'm an independent director of the club, not an employee of SISU. I have no financial interest in any particular outcome, I just want to get the club playing in its own stadium in Coventry. Please help me get the council back to the table.
Sent from my BlackBerry®

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Is this real?

The CCFC Ltd stuff wasn't invented. ACL had a rental contract with CCFC Ltd. The invention was the redundant property company which was in administration and the administrator was Appleton ( chosen by SISU ). He was the appropriate contact person. We will never know why he ( CCFC Ltd in administration ) had no players as SISU won't tell us.
If ML wants to get back to the Ricoh he should 1. stop this bullshit 2. drop the JR 3. announce the will of SISU to enter negotiations with CCC without preconditions and 4. make an offer for the Higgs share at around the 5,5 m which they were recently prepared to accept. Easy really.

dongonzalos · May 19, 2014

Please ask him how can the council damage SISU if they accept a rental deal whilst building the new stadium.

sky blue john · May 19, 2014

So if CCFC would be bust inside two years playing at the Ricoh with a minimum of 10k fans. How long would it take CCFC to go bust at Sixfields with 1.5k fans ??????

duffer · May 19, 2014

wal3590 said:
Marks reply:

Lee,
I very much regret having to leave the Ricoh and will do everything possible to get the club back there. There was sadly no way to play there last season as ACL used the administration process to keep us out: they made up this nonsense of "Limited" vs. "Holdings" as a basis to refuse to recognise us as the club and would only discuss arrangements to play at the Ricoh with Appleton (who didn't have any players). I kept trying to get them to talk and they refused each time.
If the club goes back as ACl's tenant, it will go bust in less than 2 years (as it did before). The rental model with no access to match-day revenues doesn't work. Why won't they sell the Ricoh to the club at a fair, independently-assessed price? They don't have a better use for it other than to host streaking contests which demeans the city.

A week ago last Thursday we tried again to get the council to come back to the table. They refused.

I'm an independent director of the club, not an employee of SISU. I have no financial interest in any particular outcome, I just want to get the club playing in its own stadium in Coventry. Please help me get the council back to the table.
Sent from my BlackBerry®

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

If the club would go bust in two years at the Ricoh under a rental deal, with crowds of (say) 10,000 plus, then how are they going to survive at Northampton with 2,000 or less.

Maybe someone ought to tell the FL, because clearly the plan sold to them by Otium is false if ML's statements above are to be believed.

And if SISU want the Council to come back to the table, then surely they need to start by dropping the JR. You can't really negotiate with someone who is taking you to court...

wal3590 · May 19, 2014

martcov said:
Is this real?

The CCFC Ltd stuff wasn't invented. ACL had a rental contract with CCFC Ltd. The invention was the redundant property company which was in administration and the administrator was Appleton ( chosen by SISU ). He was the appropriate contact person. We will never know why he ( CCFC Ltd in administration ) had no players as SISU won't tell us.
If ML wants to get back to the Ricoh he should 1. stop this bullshit 2. drop the JR 3. announce the will of SISU to enter negotiations with CCC without preconditions and 4. make an offer for the Higgs share at around the 5,5 m which they were recently prepared to accept. Easy really.

If you mean are the emails genuine, then yes 100%. Mark Labovitch seems to have no fear of slagging people off. Tim is cc'd in all the emails but seems to have gone very quiet

dongonzalos · May 19, 2014

sky blue john said:
So if CCFC would be bust inside two years playing at the Ricoh with a minimum of 10k fans. How long would it take CCFC to go bust at Sixfields with 1.5k fans ??????

Completely mathematically wrong isn't it

Astute · May 19, 2014

wal3590 said:
Marks reply:

Lee,
I very much regret having to leave the Ricoh and will do everything possible to get the club back there. There was sadly no way to play there last season as ACL used the administration process to keep us out: they made up this nonsense of "Limited" vs. "Holdings" as a basis to refuse to recognise us as the club and would only discuss arrangements to play at the Ricoh with Appleton (who didn't have any players). I kept trying to get them to talk and they refused each time.
If the club goes back as ACl's tenant, it will go bust in less than 2 years (as it did before). The rental model with no access to match-day revenues doesn't work. Why won't they sell the Ricoh to the club at a fair, independently-assessed price? They don't have a better use for it other than to host streaking contests which demeans the city.

A week ago last Thursday we tried again to get the council to come back to the table. They refused.

I'm an independent director of the club, not an employee of SISU. I have no financial interest in any particular outcome, I just want to get the club playing in its own stadium in Coventry. Please help me get the council back to the table.
Sent from my BlackBerry®

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Maybe if they called it a day to all this stupid litigation things could move on. Who would like to talk to someone that keeps doing so?

So it is still all about the freehold then. Oh well, another season in Northampton is on the way. What a joke our club has become. So it looks like he is after us to demonstrate until they get what they want. And our club needs the freehold? Does he think we are thick? Especially as Timothy told us it wouldn't be owned by our club.

If we have a rental agreement with access to revenue and a low rent it would be just as good as the freehold to our club. If you have the freehold you would also have to pay for the upkeep of the site. This is much more than doing it for our club.

And I like the line of helping them get CCC back to the table. I wonder why talks broke down last time? Why does he try to make out that it is either a rental agreement like before when much more has been offered since?

I just hope that Higgs are willing to try again. And that SISU will try to do things properly for once. Can't see it myself though.

Mary_Mungo_Midge · May 19, 2014

sky blue john said:
So if CCFC would be bust inside two years playing at the Ricoh with a minimum of 10k fans. How long would it take CCFC to go bust at Sixfields with 1.5k fans ??????

Agreed. This sort of crap annoys me; which ever side it comes from in this row. If ACL could be pressured to offer a clear, unconditional rent offer - such as that it's alleged went before the Football League - that would permit the club to play in Coventry; until the Judicial Review process is completed, or new stadium built, then I'd like to see how the relationship between revenues and expenditure stacked up. Because continued use of the Northampton option is what will kill the club, in so many ways.

And again, the club do not need to 'own the Ricoh'. It needs a long lease, with fair rents, and access to it's own incomes. An unencumbered freehold, that nobody is prepared to pay anything for, is ever liable to be a stumbling block to any agreement that effectively rules discussion out. It's all rhetoric, duplicity and oneupmanship; and frankly, I'm sick to the back teeth of it

sky blue john · May 19, 2014

Unless its a rental deal I would prefer CCC, Acl & Higgs to hold out until Sisu give up and sell.
I do hold CCC partially responsible for approving Sisu in the first place. But who is to say the Manhatton group or whatever they were called would have been ant better.

wal3590 · May 19, 2014

[h=3]mark.labovitch[/h]

09:42 (8 minutes ago)

to me

"I don't deal in "so called facts", Lee, just the truth. Ask any of the fans I've met - I produce hard, black-and-white evidence for any fact I mention.
I'd really prefer to speak on the phone and/or meet up in person than e-mailing. You can call me any time, day or evening."

Looks like that is the end of that until I get to ring him

shmmeee · May 19, 2014

wal3590 said:
mark.labovitch

09:42 (8 minutes ago)

to me

"I don't deal in "so called facts", Lee, just the truth. Ask any of the fans I've met - I produce hard, black-and-white evidence for any fact I mention.
I'd really prefer to speak on the phone and/or meet up in person than e-mailing. You can call me any time, day or evening."

Looks like that is the end of that until I get to ring him

Great, call him and ask for black and white documentary evidence of when him and Fisher started moving assets out of Ltd and into Holdings.

Then ask for the black and white evidence of a council conspiracy.

Then ask him for the black and white evidence that we will have the finance forum he promised.

Then call him a c**t.

wal3590 · May 19, 2014

I'm not too sure at what stage Labovitch was been brought in? Anybody know? Had more board member transfers than playing squad transfers the last few years.

Astute · May 19, 2014

wal3590 said:
mark.labovitch

09:42 (8 minutes ago)

to me

"I don't deal in "so called facts", Lee, just the truth. Ask any of the fans I've met - I produce hard, black-and-white evidence for any fact I mention.
I'd really prefer to speak on the phone and/or meet up in person than e-mailing. You can call me any time, day or evening."

Just a shame he only mentions his own facts and not factual answers to all the proper questions we have.

dongonzalos · May 19, 2014

wal3590 said:
I'm not too sure at what stage Labovitch was been brought in? Anybody know? Had more board member transfers than playing squad transfers the last few years.

He left working for Tony Blair Sept 2011 to join us I think......

If i recall It created a bit if a stir as he had only been with Blair's company for a year and people were questioning the sharp harp exit at the time. Don't think anything came out of it though.

bradwellskyblues · May 19, 2014

mark labovitch and tim fisher will speak to fans on the phone and discuss pretty much anything,they cannot be criticised for that,a friend of mine a fan for 60 years has had 2 long chats with ml and i have had a very good chat with tf,neither my friend or i have changed our positions but then neither have they .

wal3590 · May 19, 2014

"Lee, I'm in Cov around 2 days a week (though not this week). I'd love to meet up.

Re. the forum, I'm waiting for CWR's management to get back to me with their preferred date and availability of one of their presenters to chair it. If they don't confirm this by today (they've kept me waiting a bit), I'll go ahead without them. I'll keep you posted. Mark"

I think I've pulled... haha!

ajsccfc · May 19, 2014

It's good that they're willing to speak to people, I think this is preferable to those fan forums that just end up like town hall meetings with people shouting over each other and rabble-rousing as you've got more chance of getting a point across in smaller numbers. I assume all the answers are flim-flam and hoojamaflip either way, mind you.

dongonzalos · May 19, 2014

wal3590 said:
"Lee, I'm in Cov around 2 days a week (though not this week). I'd love to meet up.

Re. the forum, I'm waiting for CWR's management to get back to me with their preferred date and availability of one of their presenters to chair it. If they don't confirm this by today (they've kept me waiting a bit), I'll go ahead without them. I'll keep you posted. Mark"

I think I've pulled... haha!

That's fair enough can't criticise him for taking phone calls, emails and arranging this forum. (When it happens) To be fair Clive Eakin was ridiculously dismissive of it on the radio. To the extent he would not entertain even asking the question is it going to happen as he decided it wouldn't. So it is good to see (if correct) it is in CWR's court to get their arse into gear.

I wonder if Mark Labovitch would be happy to come in here in the meantime.

He seems happy to speak so what's the difference with emails and phone calls to individuals and a fans forum to speaking to thousands of fans on here?

ajsccfc · May 19, 2014

I think him posting on here would be incredibly ill-advised. PWKWWKWH gets a bit of a free ride but still enough anonymous jabs, this guy would get the full savosdad barrage and then some.

wal3590 · May 19, 2014

I think he wants to do it over the phone or face to face so comments can't be recorded, jsut in case he says something he shouldn't. To be fair I can't knock the bloke so far but knock going to judge him totally until I meet him.

Astute · May 19, 2014

dongonzalos said:
I wonder if Mark Labovitch would be happy to come in here in the meantime.

Don't think it would be a good idea myself. The majority of the posts would be people calling him a c**t.

dongonzalos · May 19, 2014

Astute said:
Don't think it would be a good idea myself. The majority of the posts would be people calling him a c**t.

For that though he would just ignore them and most of us would tell that person to stop been such a dick whilst we are trying to get some information.

dongonzalos · May 19, 2014

ajsccfc said:
I think him posting on here would be incredibly ill-advised. PWKWWKWH gets a bit of a free ride but still enough anonymous jabs, this guy would get the full savosdad barrage and then some.

Like I say we have moderators to police that. Also the majority of us should be able to tell the odd idiot to shut up.
Also do you really think his feelings will get hurt?

covcity4life · May 19, 2014

whats fishers email?

i would like a chat with him.

Awaiting a call from Mr Tim Fisher (5 Viewers)

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