Brainstorm (1 Viewer)

covrugby · Jun 5, 2016

Deleted member 5849 said:
You seem to have missed the what's done is done bit.

Anyway, had there been a decent protest organised then, I'd have been there if possible but... what's done is done. One could argue neither CCFC nor CRFC especially encouraged a form of protest, with their statements, but should we not protest because we didn't 18 months ago? Isn't that rather counter-productive?

For info, the last year has seen me working so unable to attend, but I have toddled down to CRFC occasionally over the years. My Dad... far more than me. Was a regular at Coundon Road through the 70s, travelled away too. One of the major CRFC players of the time used to get the tickets, as there was a connection.

Not, of course, that I have to justify. I just find it slightly odd that you would bang on about no protest 18 months ago, so let's let Wasps walk over the two major clubs too. There are many opportunities that have been lost over the years, but we can do nothing about the past, only the future.

I'm not banging on about 18 months ago .... I simply make the point that you weren't interested in CRFC 18 months ago or any time since until your academy has gone tits up and you then become interested in CRFC. like I've said several times (and funnily enough nobody has commented) if you had got a great deal from Wasps this week you wouldn't be worried about CRFC.

I think it's great you should raise awareness to what's going on but don't suddenly involve CRFC because it suits you and because you didn't get what you want from Wasps.

peeler · Jun 5, 2016

covrugby said:
Personally my form of action at the time was to engage in dialogue with various people and seek answers to questions.

I don't see that CRFC have benefitted, a few more people turn up at games and there are promises from Wasps about the future with player loans etc but that all remains to be seen.

Coventry RFC are big part of the City of Rugby scheme, which if and when it takes off will undoutdly benefit them along with Coventry Bears and all grassroots rugby throughout the city.

Deleted member 5849 · Jun 5, 2016

covrugby said:
I'm not banging on about 18 months ago .... I simply make the point that you weren't interested in CRFC 18 months ago or any time since until your academy has gone tits up and you then become interested in CRFC.

Not really true.

covrugby · Jun 5, 2016

peeler said:
Coventry RFC are big part of the City of Rugby scheme, which if and when it takes off will undoutdly benefit them along with Coventry Bears and all grassroots rugby throughout the city.

A big IF it takes off .... We will see

RegTheDonk · Jun 5, 2016

OK, lets say then that there is no justification for WASPs wanting the legal action to stop as they are not party to any action. Put aside the fact that IF SISU won vs CCC, there may be a knock on effect to them/ACL.

So, they are now using excuse (background noise) to back away from a long term commitment with CCFC, while on the face of it, trying to appease the Coventry public. Fisher et al have been doing this for years with total bullshit ideas of building a stadium, just to try an exert pressure on the other side. Maybe WASPs are simply adopting SISUs game.

covrugby · Jun 5, 2016

Nick said:
The question about an off the cuff comment that is clearly not actually arranging to smash anything up which you felt the need to sign up and complain about?

Yes, ok then.

As I said, go back to your holiday any action or anything involved crfc would obviously be cleared with them first.

I didn't sign up to complain about the posts .... I signed up to challenge the suggestions of you guys suddenly becoming interested in CRFC because of problem with your academy when you haven't been interested before and it now suits you.

I'm sure the powers that be in CRFC would say yes to you Nick .... Does that make it right ?

Grendel · Jun 5, 2016

dongonzalos said:
Wasps have said they have paused negotiations over the distraction of the legal action.
Chris Anderson has said he doesn't know enough about the legal situation to comment on that, but as far as he is aware Wasps are not been sued.
The last time the fans were polled around 90% said its time to drop the legal action.
After the absolute ahniliated moon in JR1 it is time to get negotiating.
All sides need pressure for various reasons
SISU to agree to legal action getting dropped if deal can made.
Wasps to finish the negotiations for both academy and main team.
Council give us suitable land if a deal is not possible.

Simple as that.

Any issues with the above you are putting your own personal agenda over the future of CCFC.

CET: "have Wasps put any restrictions on the deal such as dropping legal action"

Chis Anderson: NO

Grendel · Jun 5, 2016

covrugby said:
I didn't sign up to complain about the posts .... I signed up to challenge the suggestions of you guys suddenly becoming interested in CRFC because of problem with your academy when you haven't been interested before and it now suits you.

I'm sure the powers that be in CRFC would say yes to you Nick .... Does that make it right ?

Oddly you seem a lot more interested in people looking an anti wasps strategy than very much else.

Nick · Jun 5, 2016

covrugby said:
I didn't sign up to complain about the posts .... I signed up to challenge the suggestions of you guys suddenly becoming interested in CRFC because of problem with your academy when you haven't been interested before and it now suits you.

I'm sure the powers that be in CRFC would say yes to you Nick .... Does that make it right ?

People have mentioned crfc many times before. There's nothing sudden about it.

I said myself the other week I was going to try and get to some games next season, before the academy news came out.

Ill expect some more new users to sign up today I guess, especially as this thread is linked on the wasps forum

Deleted member 5849 · Jun 5, 2016

RegTheDonk said:
Maybe WASPs are simply adopting SISUs game.

...which is surely a reason to protest it.

covrugby · Jun 5, 2016

Grendel said:
Oddly you seem a lot more interested in people looking an anti wasps strategy than very much else.

Grendel I'm all for an anti Wasps strategy .... You seem to be putting effort into that .... I just don't like the idea of involving people like me when it suits you.

Grendel · Jun 5, 2016

covrugby said:
Grendel I'm all for an anti Wasps strategy .... You seem to be putting effort into that .... I just don't like the idea of involving people like me when it suits you.

I haven't asked you to be involved.

You can stay at home in Malta or wherever you live.

covrugby · Jun 5, 2016

Nick said:
People have mentioned crfc many times before. There's nothing sudden about it.

I said myself the other week I was going to try and get to some games next season, before the academy news came out.

Ill expect some more new users to sign up today I guess, especially as this thread is linked on the wasps forum

Nick, just going to games is a completely different thing to coming down in numbers (which probably wouldn't happen anyway) to raise awareness of your academy problems. I've known many CCFC supporters over the years and still do who come to watch and enjoy a beer or two that's not the issue.

What has being linked to the Wasps forum got to do with anything ?

covrugby · Jun 5, 2016

Grendel said:
I haven't asked you to be involved.

You can stay at home in Malta or wherever you live.

You are involving me if you turn up at CRFC simply because of your academy problems but wouldn't have done otherwise.

Grendel · Jun 5, 2016

covrugby said:
Nick, just going to games is a completely different thing to coming down in numbers (which probably wouldn't happen anyway) to raise awareness of your academy problems. I've known many CCFC supporters over the years and still do who come to watch and enjoy a beer or two that's not the issue.

What has being linked to the Wasps forum got to do with anything ?

Out of interest what attracted you to this thread on a coventry city forum.

It's a title that wouldn't make the content very obvious.

covrugby · Jun 5, 2016

Grendel said:
Out of interest what attracted you to this thread on a coventry city forum.

It's a title that wouldn't make the content very obvious.

Nothing attracted me ..... But Its hardly rocket science ..... A simple search on things related to my Rugby club will find this forum .... CRFC, Butts Park, Coventry Rugby etc etc etc .... Is that a problem ?

dongonzalos · Jun 5, 2016

Grendel said:
CET: "have Wasps put any restrictions on the deal such as dropping legal action"

Chis Anderson: NO

David Armstrong

“What we found difficult was, as those conversations progressed, concluding on any arrangement of that sort while the various legal actions and judicial reviews were still going on.

“We decided that we wouldn’t conclude the conversation at that point in time. This was during the time when various appeals were going on at the Court of Appeal.

“I’m not a lawyer but you can’t ignore the volume of comment about it. We felt it was difficult to conclude on a long-term arrangement while all that was still going on. But we had made very good progress

"There were still a few to agree, though I can’t go into the details of what but it was a discussion conducted in a very conductive and cooperative manner over several meetings between Chris and I.”

Chris Anderson

Can you understand why there might be difficulty over negotiations while there is legal action ongoing from CCFC’s owners?

"In any negotiations, there are obstacles to finding agreement. Sometimes that’s over the issues at hand, sometimes those have to do with the parties involved.

"I really don’t know enough about the issues to address the legal angle - please correct me if I’m wrong, but if I understand correctly, Wasps are not the defendants in any of the proceedings."

So technically they haven't said stop the legal proceedings
They have said negotiations can't happen whilst the legal proceedings are going on.
Now I know you can sometimes be a bit a slow Grendel but I don't think even you can't work out that, that means if the legal action stops the negotiations can conclude.

Now I know why I am happy for the legal action to be sacrificed.
1) it is nothing to do with CCFC
2) like JR1 in my opinion it is going nowhere.
3) one party in the saga is saying it is what stopping them from signing a deal that secures the future if my football Club.

What I find a bit strange is why would a Coventry City Fan care about not dropping a legal action that doesn't affect there club. Where there is a chance if it is dropped the club's future is secure.
(Very strange)

Nick · Jun 5, 2016

covrugby said:
Nothing attracted me ..... But Its hardly rocket science ..... A simple search on things related to my Rugby club will find this forum .... CRFC, Butts Park, Coventry Rugby etc etc etc .... Is that a problem ?

Totally understable.

Apart from the fact you haven't read any of the threads about the butts move etc. Only this one, one about the higgs and sisu and the one about creating awareness.

So I guess the only problem is that you signed up on here to read about your rugby club, but have only read about protests and the higgs centre and not the ones about the move to the butts etc or the others concerning cov rugby. Only reading the same ones that are discussed on the wasps forum.

(Unless of course you log out to read those, then back in again for others. Which would be weird)

Otis · Jun 5, 2016

dongonzalos said:
David Armstrong

“What we found difficult was, as those conversations progressed, concluding on any arrangement of that sort while the various legal actions and judicial reviews were still going on.

“We decided that we wouldn’t conclude the conversation at that point in time. This was during the time when various appeals were going on at the Court of Appeal.

“I’m not a lawyer but you can’t ignore the volume of comment about it. We felt it was difficult to conclude on a long-term arrangement while all that was still going on. But we had made very good progress

"There were still a few to agree, though I can’t go into the details of what but it was a discussion conducted in a very conductive and cooperative manner over several meetings between Chris and I.”

Chris Anderson

Can you understand why there might be difficulty over negotiations while there is legal action ongoing from CCFC’s owners?

"In any negotiations, there are obstacles to finding agreement. Sometimes that’s over the issues at hand, sometimes those have to do with the parties involved.

"I really don’t know enough about the issues to address the legal angle - please correct me if I’m wrong, but if I understand correctly, Wasps are not the defendants in any of the proceedings."

So technically they haven't said stop the legal proceedings
They have said negotiations can't happen whilst the legal proceedings are going on.
Now I know you can sometimes be a bit a slow Grendel but I don't think even you can't work out that, that means if the legal action stops the negotiations can conclude.

Grendel said:
CET: "have Wasps put any restrictions on the deal such as dropping legal action"

Chis Anderson: NO

Does make me laugh this place, it really does.

All to quick to point out that Anderson says 'no' about restrictions on the deal, but then when David Armstrong says they want CCFC at the Ricoh, people choose not to believe him.

And please just don't focus on this one point, there is cherry picking aplenty going on all over the place on here. When it suits stuff is chosen to be believed and when it doesn't suit it's not.

Just seemingly depends on whether something suits people's arguments or not.

Is the stance that we believe nothing that Wasps say and then sometimes some thing's that Sisu do?

The Penguin · Jun 5, 2016

Otis said:
Does make me laugh this place, it really does.

All to quick to point out that Anderson says 'no' about restrictions on the deal,' but then when David Armstrong says they want CCFC at the Ricoh, people choose not to believe him.

And please just don't focus on this one point, there is cherry picking aplenty going on all over the place on here. When it suits stuff is chosen to be believed and when it does suit it's not.

Just seemingly depends on whether something suits people's arguments or not.

Sent from my Hudl 2 using Tapatalk

Personally I'm taking the approach that everyone involved in this sorry saga is full of shit and the truth is somewhere in between, as is usually the case in propaganda wars.

Otis · Jun 5, 2016

The Penguin said:
Personally I'm taking the approach that everyone involved in this sorry saga is full of shit and the truth is somewhere in between, as is usually the case in propaganda wars.

Yep. Me too.

Don't get why people were getting a tad annoyed over some of us not jumping up and down for joy over the Butts, despite this being Sisu involved and the failures on promises they have given us.

Best to treat it all with suspicion.

Grendel · Jun 5, 2016

dongonzalos said:
David Armstrong

“What we found difficult was, as those conversations progressed, concluding on any arrangement of that sort while the various legal actions and judicial reviews were still going on.

“We decided that we wouldn’t conclude the conversation at that point in time. This was during the time when various appeals were going on at the Court of Appeal.

“I’m not a lawyer but you can’t ignore the volume of comment about it. We felt it was difficult to conclude on a long-term arrangement while all that was still going on. But we had made very good progress

"There were still a few to agree, though I can’t go into the details of what but it was a discussion conducted in a very conductive and cooperative manner over several meetings between Chris and I.”

Chris Anderson

Can you understand why there might be difficulty over negotiations while there is legal action ongoing from CCFC’s owners?

"In any negotiations, there are obstacles to finding agreement. Sometimes that’s over the issues at hand, sometimes those have to do with the parties involved.

"I really don’t know enough about the issues to address the legal angle - please correct me if I’m wrong, but if I understand correctly, Wasps are not the defendants in any of the proceedings."

So technically they haven't said stop the legal proceedings
They have said negotiations can't happen whilst the legal proceedings are going on.
Now I know you can sometimes be a bit a slow Grendel but I don't think even you can't work out that, that means if the legal action stops the negotiations can conclude.

He said no -end of discussion.

Instead of trying to divert attention from the subject matter start a thread and see who joins in

martcov · Jun 5, 2016

covrugby said:
You are involving me if you turn up at CRFC simply because of your academy problems but wouldn't have done otherwise.

Point taken - by me. But now we are involved, is there common ground for some sort of joint protest? Or are Rugby fans generally happy with Wasps being here?

dongonzalos · Jun 5, 2016

Grendel said:
He said no -end of discussion.

Instead of trying to divert attention from the subject matter start a thread and see who joins in

Why would you prefer to see legal action stay on the agenda that does not benefit the club. Over the possibility of it getting dropped so A deal can be concluded that secures the future of the club?

Deleted member 5849 · Jun 5, 2016

martcov said:
Point taken - by me. But now we are involved, is there common ground for some sort of joint protest? Or are Rugby fans generally happy with Wasps being here?

This is what I donb't get with covrugby's whole schtick.

We should have protested earlier, so let's not do so now.

dongonzalos · Jun 5, 2016

Deleted member 5849 said:
This is what I donb't get with covrugby's whole schtick.

We should have protested earlier, so let's not do so now.

He seems to feel that most people don't really give a shit about Cov Rugby Club. That they just use it as a handy stick because they are pissed off about CCFC and if we got a great deal out of Wasps tomorrow and slowly CRFC started to slide out of existence we wouldn't been seen for dead.
I kind of get his point to be fair to him.

Deleted member 5849 · Jun 5, 2016

dongonzalos said:
He seems to feel that most people don't really give a shit about Cov Rugby Club. That they just use it as a handy stick because they are pissed off about CCFC and if we got a great deal out of Wasps tomorrow and slowly CRFC started to slide out of existence we wouldn't been seen for dead.
I kind of get his point to be fair to him.

I'm sure that applies to some, but is unfair to tar everyone with that. Even if some do hold that view, sometimes getting help out of necessity is no bad thing. The enemy of my enemy is my friend, and all that.

And if that's his view, then surely we can agree that we have to fight for CCFC and CRFC ahead of Wasps, whatever deal is or isn't reached down the line?

Grendel · Jun 5, 2016

Otis said:
Does make me laugh this place, it really does.

All to quick to point out that Anderson says 'no' about restrictions on the deal, but then when David Armstrong says they want CCFC at the Ricoh, people choose not to believe him.

And please just don't focus on this one point, there is cherry picking aplenty going on all over the place on here. When it suits stuff is chosen to be believed and when it doesn't suit it's not.

Just seemingly depends on whether something suits people's arguments or not.

Is the stance that we believe nothing that Wasps say and then sometimes some thing's that Sisu do?

Given that wasps have before said they'd never move from around London, said they'd be extinct if they didn't, said they'd redevelop the land as part of the purchase agreement, said they'd build a training complex somewhere In Warwickshire to create jobs, said they'd work closely with coventry rugby club - yes on second thoughts in sure what they've said is true.

dongonzalos · Jun 5, 2016

Deleted member 5849 said:
I'm sure that applies to some, but is unfair to tar everyone with that. Even if some do hold that view, sometimes getting help out of necessity is no bad thing. The enemy of my enemy is my friend, and all that.

And if that's his view, then surely we can agree that we have to fight for CCFC and CRFC ahead of Wasps, whatever deal is or isn't reached down the line?

That makes sense but I think he duvet want it ruining his rugby match experience.
Maybe a joint protest else where would be more suitable or not during their match
We seemed very keen not to have protests during our matches I seem to recall

Deleted member 5849 · Jun 5, 2016

dongonzalos said:
That makes sense but I think he duvet want it ruining his rugby match experience.

I've never been particularly keen on a protest during a CRFC match... bar people turning up to theirs rather than Wasps'. Would have thought he'd be all for that...

(FWIW though, I'd have had protests during our matches at Sixfields too. Got to make things visual)

chiefdave · Jun 5, 2016

Deleted member 5849 said:
I've never been particularly keen on a protest during a CRFC match... bar people turning up to theirs rather than Wasps'

I don't think anyone is proposing to disrupt a CRFC game are they? Just to turn up in large numbers to add our support and make a point about the impact of Wasps arrival on the cities existing teams.

Nick · Jun 5, 2016

chiefdave said:
I don't think anyone is proposing to disrupt a CRFC game are they? Just to turn up in large numbers to add our support and make a point about the impact of Wasps arrival on the cities existing teams.

I certainly wouldn't suggest disrupting it, it would be going to support the city's team wouldn't it? That would be the action.

chiefdave · Jun 5, 2016

Nick said:
I certainly wouldn't suggest disrupting it, it would be going to support the city's team wouldn't it? That would be the action.

Thats what I thought we were talking about. And then hopefully some CRFC fans coming to one of our games. Show that the clubs that have been in the city over 100 years are united.

Generally Midfield · Jun 5, 2016

I know I'm new to posting but isn't this thread supposed to be about protest ideas? There must be plenty like me who are up for it if someone gets things started. People mention the trust but they are neutral. Seem to be some top people on here so surely someone can take a lead!

dongonzalos · Jun 5, 2016

Nick said:
I certainly wouldn't suggest disrupting it, it would be going to support the city's team wouldn't it? That would be the action.

So no protests about Wasps just sell out CRFC?

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