Can/should the FL intervene? (3 Viewers)

skybluetony176 · Jul 6, 2014

I was thinking about the outstanding £560k that SISU owe ACL and I was thinking that the FL could use this payment as a make weight in our club returning home?

ACL want the payment and it's pretty clear that SISU are going to do everything in there power to not pay it or pay as little as possible. So what's stopping the FL using this payment to broker a deal to bring our club home? Instead of going directly into the ACL coffers it could go into an escrow as security, ACL make a temporary 3year rental offer with a share of revenue and at the end of the 3years if no permanent solution has been come to it can stay in escrow while another temporary deal is sought. If sisu default on the rent ACL can draw it down to cover it. Most importantly the FL can say if a deal can't be done then the £560k is payable with immediate effect to ACL or they withdrawn the golden share and the club is expelled from the league?

Seems to me that by not paying the £560k sisu have inadvertently given some power to the FL to get this mess sorted. Question is, are the FL smart enough to realise this?

sky blue zam · Jul 6, 2014

Can they do something? In my opinion, yes they can. Will they do anything? In my opinion, they ain't got the bollocks they were born with

chiefdave · Jul 6, 2014

Its very very simple for the FL, just enforce their own rules regarding the location of member clubs. Tell our owners that Coventry City have to play in Coventry. That's not getting involved in any specific dispute as they are not saying it has to be the Ricoh.

13.4 Ground sharing will only be approved at the discretion of the Board. The Board will not generally approve any ground-sharing arrangement where the club plays its matches outside the conurbation, as defined by the Board, from which the Club takes its name or with which it is otherwise traditionally associated.

martcov · Jul 6, 2014

The FL is a club owners association and acts in their best interests. It may claim "real football for real fans", but that is only a clever marketing slogan.

The only things that would make the football league take action against an owner would be the threat of the government deciding enough is enough and actually wanting to legistate, or maybe falls in attendances or advertising revenues as a result of a general disaffection of fans.

They may be trying to save their image profile behind the scenes to prevent this happening, but they certainly won't be putting fans before owners. We can only hope that they "persuade" Joy to fall into line - i.e. pay up - before more fans reaction and government rumblings force them to deduct points - again.

Kingokings204 · Jul 6, 2014

It's 590k just so we are all clear.

Can the FL intervene? Yes

Will the FL intervene? No

shmmeee · Jul 6, 2014

chiefdave said:
Its very very simple for the FL, just enforce their own rules regarding the location of member clubs. Tell our owners that Coventry City have to play in Coventry. That's not getting involved in any specific dispute as they are not saying it has to be the Ricoh.

BRB off to buy season ticket at the Butts/Memorial Park for next season.

Cheshire Sky Blue · Jul 6, 2014

sky blue zam said:
Can they do something? In my opinion, yes they can. Will they do anything? In my opinion, they ain't got the bollocks they were born with

Just on an anatomical note. The football league was never born with a pair of bollocks, so your statement is difficult to relate too. They were also born spineless, gutless witless and brainless. Other than that I 100% agree with you.:facepalm::claping hands:

Chipfat · Jul 6, 2014

They will only take action on 2 counts in my opinion, firstly they gave the hint in the only thing they have been negative about towards Sisu, that's falling crowds at Sixfields. And why TF issued the radio interview about not being about 1 person or parties this is about the fan's, well he didn't care when moving to NTFC.

Secondly the Coventry area now being used by the FL, can be used by fan's to send a petition in saying they will not attend in the Coventry area, only in Coventry. This will see that what they are trying to save with Sisu doesn't work even with this new stadium outside the city, they are worried about viable clubs completing fixtures.. No fans, no revenue, no business plan and no future may see them start to get closer to pushing the issue..

So don't go Sixfields for a couple of games walk out if you have bought a ST after 34 mins and stand with those on the hill to show the FL we are together for a greater purpose.. And let the FL know outside Cov or in the Coventry area is not good enough and will be the same as staying at Northampton. I don't blame, accuse or ridicule anyone who goes in NTFC, i just think they need to stand with the majority of fans to get us back home, as we all want the same.. So supporting the boys today may cost supporting the club in the future..

Lastly if the FL state they are happy with Cov in Bedworth or Nuneaton then let the fans know, so a decision can be made by us if starting a new club in the Ricoh is the fans only way of getting a Coventry club back. No matter how hard this decision maybe it's becoming clear the current club is getting harder for me to call my own. It seem's to be Sisu's and the FL at the to decide what is best for us. Currently they are the worst two parties involved in this whole mess, 1 it's proved to act's improper with no morals and the other doesn't act at all...

Deleted member 5849 · Jul 6, 2014

shmmeee said:
BRB off to buy season ticket at the Butts/Memorial Park for next season.

Indeed.

What they can't (and shouldn't) intervene in is a commercial dispute.

What they should be able to do however, is use the stick, carrot and everything besides to reassure us there is a plan to resolve said dispute in whatever form that takes!

stupot07 · Jul 6, 2014

chiefdave said:
Its very very simple for the FL, just enforce their own rules regarding the location of member clubs. Tell our owners that Coventry City have to play in Coventry. That's not getting involved in any specific dispute as they are not saying it has to be the Ricoh.

Unfortunately the FL board have already used their discretion and allowed them to play outside Coventry, they aren't going to change their mind unless they believe the build is not going to happen. And we don't know what bs they have been feeding them.

Unfortunately there is only one ground in Coventry that has football league status, and it ain't the Butts, so in effect they would be saying it has to be the Ricoh.

Butts only holds 4k, football league grounds for existing members had to be a minimum of 5k.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk - so please excuse any spelling or grammar errors

Ian1779 · Jul 6, 2014

skybluetony176 said:
I was thinking about the outstanding £560k that SISU owe ACL and I was thinking that the FL could use this payment as a make weight in our club returning home?

ACL want the payment and it's pretty clear that SISU are going to do everything in there power to not pay it or pay as little as possible. So what's stopping the FL using this payment to broker a deal to bring our club home? Instead of going directly into the ACL coffers it could go into an escrow as security, ACL make a temporary 3year rental offer with a share of revenue and at the end of the 3years if no permanent solution has been come to it can stay in escrow while another temporary deal is sought. If sisu default on the rent ACL can draw it down to cover it. Most importantly the FL can say if a deal can't be done then the £560k is payable with immediate effect to ACL or they withdrawn the golden share and the club is expelled from the league?

Seems to me that by not paying the £560k sisu have inadvertently given some power to the FL to get this mess sorted. Question is, are the FL smart enough to realise this?

I guess the problem lies in the fact that we have had zero information from the liquidator. SISU claim that they have put money in the ESCROW account to cover the payment. Has the liquidation now been officially completed? What stage is the process at if not.

I can't fathom why a) the FL don't come out and say yes the money is with the liquidator and we are satisfied that legal process is continuing towards completion b) why Appleton has not come out and clarified the situation.

I think your idea is pretty good.. but the lack of clarity on where we are at makes things really difficult. ACL say the haven't got their money, SISU claim they've handed it over to the ESCROW account and the middle man is telling us nothing.

Obviously if they had accepted the CVA in the first place we wouldn't have this problem...

(Before anyone starts.. that was an attempt at humour... gallows humour but none the less...)

sky blue john · Jul 6, 2014

chiefdave said:
Its very very simple for the FL, just enforce their own rules regarding the location of member clubs. Tell our owners that Coventry City have to play in Coventry. That's not getting involved in any specific dispute as they are not saying it has to be the Ricoh.

Exactly !
Also if the fl have been fed the same bull as us. This bullshit has been thrown out of court and proven as lies !!

SkyBlueSid · Jul 6, 2014

The FL gave the club 3 years to get back to the city, with two possible one-year extensions if there had been unavoidable delays as long as the process was progressing. That's how I understood it, anyway.

It would seem perfectly plausible for the FL to demand progress details to establish whether the 3-year target has any possibility of being met. They should be doing that now. We have no land, no plans submitted, nothing.

It is common sense that, once land is purchased, plans need to be drawn up and submitted to seek planning permission. Given that there will be objections and probably an enquiry, that could take up most of the remaining 2 years, even if the land was bought this week and the application submitted by the end of the month. Which they won't be.

So we will be 3 years down the line and not a brick laid. That timescale clearly flies in the face of what the FL allowed the club to do. If they had any balls whatsoever they would be telling the club that they have failed in their undertaking, and that if the club does not start at the Ricoh in August they will not be starting.

This is why I have no confidence that the League will ever act properly, nor will they ever insist on a return to the City. They are utterly useless.

mrtrench · Jul 6, 2014

This money belongs to ACL. If you were ACL wouldn't you be pretty cross if money that belongs to you went into escrow instead? Escrow is typically used for money that will be paid contingent upon another event where the parties do not trust each other.

Nick · Jul 6, 2014

mrtrench said:
This money belongs to ACL. If you were ACL wouldn't you be pretty cross if money that belongs to you went into escrow instead? Escrow is typically used for money that will be paid contingent upon another event where the parties do not trust each other.

Why do you care so much about acl? I'm only fussed of we lose points

CCFC PimpRail · Jul 6, 2014

Cheshire Sky Blue said:
Just on an anatomical note. The football league was never born with a pair of bollocks, so your statement is difficult to relate too. They were also born spineless, gutless witless and brainless. Other than that I 100% agree with you.:facepalm::claping hands:

I doubt very much that they have been duped to this extent before, and can only act based on past decisions with other clubs in a similar situation for fear of getting battered in court...

I think they were naive to grant a 3 year term, possibly in the belief that building a new stadium quickly would be in the club's best interest, perhaps this should have been a year to show the ball is rolling and then another two to get it done instead of three years to show you have brought some land and got planning permission.

I thought they'd make ccfc more of an example to show how mismanaged clubs that don't file accounts are tolerated whats the point with chasing f&b revenue when you won't even say what your revenues are...?

Deleted member 5849 · Jul 6, 2014

CCFC PimpRail said:
I thought they'd make ccfc more of an example to show how mismanaged clubs that don't file accounts are tolerated whats the point with chasing f&b revenue when you won't even say what your revenues are...?

The problem is, once one league club folds there's a very real danger it'll set off a domino effect. Football clubs survive as much because of the belief they don't die, as opposed to any real rational reasons.

So it probably is in the members' best interests to have the club in Northampton and hope for the best.

Hobo · Jul 6, 2014

My biggest gripe, is the 1 million pound bound to relocate back to Coventry. It should have been up front not retrospective. They made a non league club pay up front so they set their own bar. Why were SISU different? Already threatened them with legal action over the golden share is my guess?

mrtrench · Jul 6, 2014

Hobo said:
My biggest gripe, is the 1 million pound bound to relocate back to Coventry. It should have been up front not retrospective. They made a non league club pay up front so they set their own bar. Why were SISU different? Already threatened them with legal action over the golden share is my guess?

I thought that this was in escrow. If so - they have paid up front.

shmmeee · Jul 6, 2014

Ian1779 said:
I can't fathom why a) the FL don't come out and say yes the money is with the liquidator and we are satisfied that legal process is continuing towards completion b) why Appleton has not come out and clarified the situation.

I can take a stab at:

a) they couldn't give a shit

and

b) he couldn't give a shit

Grendel · Jul 6, 2014

In surprised Tony is worried. According to him after the last JR defeat sisu would be broke and come crawling back.

Some more intelligent observers of course thought otherwise....

skybluefred · Jul 6, 2014

Ian1779 said:
I guess the problem lies in the fact that we have had zero information from the liquidator. SISU claim that they have put money in the ESCROW account to cover the payment. Has the liquidation now been officially completed? What stage is the process at if not.

I can't fathom why a) the FL don't come out and say yes the money is with the liquidator and we are satisfied that legal process is continuing towards completion b) why Appleton has not come out and clarified the situation.

Appleton is the Administrator-- Thankfully we are not yet in the grasp of a Liquidator.

martcov · Jul 6, 2014

Grendel said:
In surprised Tony is worried. According to him after the last JR defeat sisu would be broke and come crawling back.

Some more intelligent observers of course thought otherwise....

You being one of the more intelligent ones.... I do agree with you though, that the JR defeat won't break SISU ( or rather Arvo who is bank rolling SISU in this case ). I think that, if.... they don't get leave to appeal, there will be some ramifications in the SISU camp.

Plan A (or B or C - whichever it was ) will be dead. A hefty damages bill will not happen. The 50 million already invested will look very wobbly. The stadium project will not be financed without the anticipated damages ( no, I don't know, but am assuming damages running into millions would have helped - if there ever was a plan to build a stadium, which I doubt. ).

They ( SISU ) have to have a team talk - they are 3:0 down at half time. Heads must surely roll. Joy cannot let this side show effect her overall reputation. Investors may otherwise pull out.

What is the next move? Maybe we should wait and see if they can appeal - that will postpone the eventual defeat - before we make any assumptions ( yes, I assuming they are defeated, but only based on what we have seen up 'til now ).

martcov · Jul 6, 2014

skybluefred said:
Ian1779 said:

I guess the problem lies in the fact that we have had zero information from the liquidator. SISU claim that they have put money in the ESCROW account to cover the payment. Has the liquidation now been officially completed? What stage is the process at if not.

I can't fathom why a) the FL don't come out and say yes the money is with the liquidator and we are satisfied that legal process is continuing towards completion b) why Appleton has not come out and clarified the situation.

Appleton is the Administrator-- Thankfully we are not yet in the grasp of a Liquidator.

Click to expand...

Yes, but any news on the Liquidation and why it is not going forward?

dadgad · Jul 6, 2014

Maximum publicity underlining the FL's brainless and gutless performance and highlighting the plight of fans unable to watch their club in CV6 is the way to go.

The best way of achieving this is an empty Sixfields.

cloughie · Jul 6, 2014

Nick said:
Why do you care so much about acl? I'm only fussed of we lose points

why do you care so much about sisu that you are happy for them not to pay a legal debt that if not payed could mean that the golden share is revoked and CCFC are denied league status?

Grendel · Jul 6, 2014

cloughie said:
why do you care so much about sisu that you are happy for them not to pay a legal debt that if not payed could mean that the golden share is revoked and CCFC are denied league status?

Is any of the above factual or a desire in your tiny mind?

cloughie · Jul 6, 2014

Grendel said:
Is any of the above factual or a desire in your tiny mind?

Condition of the golden share and admin was pay it . but facts don't concern you ......

drivel as usual from you

SkyBlueHomer · Jul 6, 2014

dadgad said:
Maximum publicity underlining the FL's brainless and gutless performance and highlighting the plight of fans unable to watch their club in CV6 is the way to go.

The best way of achieving this is an empty Sixfields.

Your right but will never happen.

Genuine question to those who will insist on going to sixfields, what will it take for you to see what approximately 80% of fans that went to home games at the Ricoh can see?
For me the priority is seeing us play in Coventry. SISU out? Well thats another battle for another day.

Nick · Jul 6, 2014

cloughie said:
why do you care so much about sisu that you are happy for them not to pay a legal debt that if not payed could mean that the golden share is revoked and CCFC are denied league status?

That was the bit where I put I only really care if it means loss of points or getting kicked out of the league. Otherwise I couldn't give a shit if acl get money or not, the same as if sisu make money. Just the club...

SkyblueBazza · Jul 6, 2014

chiefdave said:
Its very very simple for the FL, just enforce their own rules regarding the location of member clubs. Tell our owners that Coventry City have to play in Coventry. That's not getting involved in any specific dispute as they are not saying it has to be the Ricoh.

Personally I don't think they can actually do anymore - other than publicly state their disapproval at goings on, take points off us again, give a hefty fine or expel us from the FL.
They have used their "discretion" as referred to in the rule you've posted. The FL cannot say you MUST play at the Ricoh there are commercial deals & money exchanging hands. Bit like the council cannot tell you where to do your grocery shopping based on distance from your home - you may prefer to go elsewhere because your overall shop costs less at the supermarket 10miles further.
As for insisting we play in Coventry the Ricoh is the only realistic option (currently lol) in the area...so would fans have happily gone in their droves to Bescot Stadium or St. Andrews had a deal been struck for ground sharing there? I reckon more would have than go to Sickfields but for many of us the principle would be stronger than the urge to support the owner's tactics.

PUSB

Grendel · Jul 6, 2014

SkyBlueHomer said:
Your right but will never happen.

Genuine question to those who will insist on going to sixfields, what will it take for you to see what approximately 80% of fans that went to home games at the Ricoh can see?
For me the priority is seeing us play in Coventry. SISU out? Well thats another battle for another day.

You do realise dadgad thinks all coventry fans who went to the Ricoh are worms don't you?

Voice_of_Reason · Jul 7, 2014

skybluetony176 said:
I was thinking about the outstanding £560k that SISU owe ACL and I was thinking that the FL could use this payment as a make weight in our club returning home?

ACL want the payment and it's pretty clear that SISU are going to do everything in there power to not pay it or pay as little as possible. So what's stopping the FL using this payment to broker a deal to bring our club home? Instead of going directly into the ACL coffers it could go into an escrow as security, ACL make a temporary 3year rental offer with a share of revenue and at the end of the 3years if no permanent solution has been come to it can stay in escrow while another temporary deal is sought. If sisu default on the rent ACL can draw it down to cover it. Most importantly the FL can say if a deal can't be done then the £560k is payable with immediate effect to ACL or they withdrawn the golden share and the club is expelled from the league?

Seems to me that by not paying the £560k sisu have inadvertently given some power to the FL to get this mess sorted. Question is, are the FL smart enough to realise this?

Yes, the Football League now has every reason to take action following the High Court Judgement and the Judge's observations about SISU'S managent. To continue supporting SISU the Football League will now appear to be condoning SUSU'S miss-management and it's decision to move to Northampton when there was no reason to do so. Evidence now suggests the Football Leage might possibly consider SISU are "unfit persons" to continue managing CCFC. I feel that pressure should now be applied on the Football League to take action, not only by us as individuals, but by groups, the media, MPs's and maybe even the legal profession.

_brian_ · Jul 7, 2014

Voice_of_Reason said:
Yes, the Football League now has every reason to take action following the High Court Judgement and the Judge's observations about SISU'S managent. To continue supporting SISU the Football League will now appear to be condoning SUSU'S miss-management and it's decision to move to Northampton when there was no reason to do so. Evidence now suggests the Football Leage might possibly consider SISU are "unfit persons" to continue managing CCFC. I feel that pressure should now be applied on the Football League to take action, not only by us as individuals, but by groups, the media, MPs's and maybe even the legal profession.

I feel an email coming on*!!!

(*This is not a euphemism! LOL!)

dadgad · Jul 7, 2014

Voice_of_Reason said:
Yes, the Football League now has every reason to take action following the High Court Judgement and the Judge's observations about SISU'S managent. To continue supporting SISU the Football League will now appear to be condoning SUSU'S miss-management and it's decision to move to Northampton when there was no reason to do so. Evidence now suggests the Football Leage might possibly consider SISU are "unfit persons" to continue managing CCFC. I feel that pressure should now be applied on the Football League to take action, not only by us as individuals, but by groups, the media, MPs's and maybe even the legal profession.

Agreed.
I believe the FL had every justification for forcing a return to CV6 BEFORE the JR.
Now that is over the "fabricated" legal impediment has been removed.
The truth is the FL are utterly without principle - a bit like Grendull

Can/should the FL intervene? (3 Viewers)

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