DO NOT boo the knee (4 Viewers)

Otis · Aug 21, 2021

Deleted member 5849 said:
For someone who continuously defends the players' playing performance, you aren't half insulting to their intelligence.

I mean, fancy accusing the players of lying when they say they're making an anti racist gesture, and that's that.

That's the bit I don't get. The players have come out and categorically stated that their stance has nothing to do with BLM and is purely about equality and anti-racism.

They couldn't have been clearer. That is their stance. So if anyone does think there is some intrinsic link to the BLM and Marxism, they are calling the players liars.

It's as clear as day the reason they adopted it and are deploying it.

Do we stop wearing and waving the St. George flag because some right wing extremist groups have embraced it and use it for political means?

I am glad however that Marcus has said he won't boo. No-one is compelled to clap or applaud, but at least he isn't booing. It's something at least.

clint van damme · Aug 21, 2021

peace ndlovu said:
Either you're not on Twitter or you are being disingenuous.
There is a well-worn barrage of insults churned out when people don't agree with right-wing perspectives.
It does help to provide a character judgement toolkit though...
Uses "snowflake" as an insult = you might be a c**t
Uses "bedwetter" as an insult = you're probably a c**t
Uses "woke" as an insult = you're definitely a c**t

I use the term bedwetter and I'm not right wing, though I am a c**t.

MacReady · Aug 21, 2021

peace ndlovu said:
Either you're not on Twitter or you are being disingenuous.
There is a well-worn barrage of insults churned out when people don't agree with right-wing perspectives.
It does help to provide a character judgement toolkit though...
Uses "snowflake" as an insult = you might be a c**t
Uses "bedwetter" as an insult = you're probably a c**t
Uses "woke" as an insult = you're definitely a c**t

I haven’t got the faintest idea what you’re talking about but I’m not on Twitter or any social media platform apart from Instagram where I follow paranormal stuff. I don’t post abuse or nasty comments even if don’t agree with someone. Maybe I don’t see the bigger picture because I’m not on social media but Twitter (from what I hear) seems vile from all sides of the political spectrum so I stay away.

Deleted member 5849 · Aug 21, 2021

Otis said:
That's the bit I don't get. The players have come out and categorically stated that their stance has nothing to do with BLM and is purely about equality and anti-racism.

They couldn't have been clearer. That is their stance. So if anyone does think there is some intrinsic link to the BLM and Marxism, they are calling the players liars.

It's as clear as day the reason they adopted it and are deploying it.

Do we stop wearing and waving the St. George flag because some right wing extremist groups have embraced it and use it for political means?

I am glad however that Marcus has said he won't boo. No-one is compelled to clap or applaud, but at least he isn't booing. It's something at least.

The flag is an excellent example. So are poppies tbh. Some decide to steal their meaning for far right symbolism, but that diminishes them for the majority if you let that view of a minority win. Doesn't mean every bugger who wears a poppy, flies a George Cross is a fascist! Picking Lyle Taylor as an example why taking the knee should be booed would be as crazy as deciding to boo players for wearing a poppy, because James McClean doesn't feel able to! They are perfectly entitled not to take part in a form of protest / memorialisation they feel uncomfortable with... but there's a very big difference between that, and actively booing that event.

So, the least we can expect is to respect that the players are taking the knee for the right reasons, and let them get on with it without interference.

mark82 · Aug 21, 2021

MacReady said:
Yes. And it’s sad that we see it everywhere - against poc and on boards like this.

Personally I think it's perfectly ok to take issue with people booing an anti-racism gesture, and point out that the act of booing could be considered racist itself. If that makes me a liberal lefty or a snowflake I'm perfectly happy with that. At least I know my moral compass is pointing in the right direction.

MacReady · Aug 21, 2021

mark82 said:
Personally I think it's perfectly ok to take issue with people booing an anti-racism gesture, and point out that the act of booing could be considered racist itself. If that makes me a liberal lefty or a snowflake I'm perfectly happy with that. At least I know my moral compass is pointing in the right direction.

Not what I was implying. Not sure where this obsession with lefty liberal snowflake comes into it either - nothing in my comment has even mentioned that - clearly you have some thing going on that creates that in your mind and you clearly didn’t read my post post before this that points out I’m on the left too. My comment wasn’t aimed at people booing it, it was people trying to constructively explain their thoughts on it and being jumped on. I just like hearing all opinions is all. Even if I don’t always like them!

procdoc · Aug 21, 2021

marcusp said:
Says the man who is sat at home pulling one off over a picture of Corbyn and shouting racist at anyone who dares disagree with your narrow minded point of view.
for someone who is apparently so perfect and understanding you seem to enjoy stereotyping people based on your own prejudice and banging away on the keyboard with abuse. Now fuck off you twat

Piss off you prick. If you boo the knee, you’re a racist twat. That’s the end of the argument

Dirk Turpin · Aug 21, 2021

marcusp said:
Fuck you to you ignorant idiot. Get off your high horse and stop expecting that everyone must abide by you and your belief. We live in a free world and tour just like a few other idiots on here telling people to agree with their views. Throwing the race word about because they dont agree with your mindset. Ill support any anti racism campaign but wont clap or do anything else to satisfy you or the other idiots who think they are better than others

You are right you're free to say or think what you like and we are free to think that you are an ignorant bellend

peace ndlovu · Aug 21, 2021

MacReady said:
I haven’t got the faintest idea what you’re talking about but I’m not on Twitter or any social media platform apart from Instagram where I follow paranormal stuff. I don’t post abuse or nasty comments even if don’t agree with someone. Maybe I don’t see the bigger picture because I’m not on social media but Twitter (from what I hear) seems vile from all sides of the political spectrum so I stay away.

Fair enough - you're probably better off not being on it! It certainly doesn't seem to be a place that develops mutual understanding or empathy..
I was just pointing out that the tendency to resort to anger or insulting behaviour is not unique to any position on the political spectrum.

mark82 · Aug 21, 2021

MacReady said:
Not what I was implying. Not sure where this obsession with lefty liberal snowflake comes into it either - nothing in my comment has even mentioned that - clearly you have some thing going on that creates that in your mind and you clearly didn’t read my post post before this that points out I’m on the left too. My comment wasn’t aimed at people booing it, it was people trying to constructively explain their thoughts on it and being jumped on. I just like hearing all opinions is all. Even if I don’t always like them!

Appreciate I quoted you but my comment was more a general one.

I'm quite happy for people to voice an opinion, but it's also fine to point out why I disagree with it. Also, when people are trying to state things as fact that are inaccurate there's nothing wrong in pointing that out. Linking the origin of taking the knee to recent BLM protests is inaccurate and should be pointed out. People who refer to "trained Marxists" should probably be mocked.

MacReady · Aug 21, 2021

peace ndlovu said:
Fair enough - you're probably better off not being on it! It certainly doesn't seem to be a place that develops mutual understanding or empathy..
I was just pointing out that the tendency to resort to anger or insulting behaviour is not unique to any position on the political spectrum.

Oh absolutely pal I can well imagine. I think I looked at it once and I was so horrified at how vile everyone was I quickly jumped off it. Sorry for misunderstanding!

MacReady · Aug 21, 2021

mark82 said:
Appreciate I quoted you but my comment was more a general one.

I'm quite happy for people to voice an opinion, but it's also fine to point out why I disagree with it. Also, when people are trying to state things as fact that are inaccurate there's nothing wrong in pointing that out. Linking the origin of taking the knee to recent BLM protests is inaccurate and should be pointed out. People who refer to "trained Marxists" should probably be mocked.

Ah okay. No that’s cool. I agree - if someone states something as a fact they open themselves up to be questioned. Agree 100%.

David O'Day · Aug 21, 2021

clint van damme · Aug 21, 2021

Fairplay to Bez, taking time out from nonce hunting to like a post!

Ccfcisparks · Aug 21, 2021

clint van damme said:
Fairplay to Bez, taking time out from nonce hunting to like a post!

Must be the worlds quickest van to get up to Scotland in that time!

Sky_Blue_Dreamer · Aug 21, 2021

MacReady said:
Not what I was implying. Not sure where this obsession with lefty liberal snowflake comes into it either - nothing in my comment has even mentioned that - clearly you have some thing going on that creates that in your mind and you clearly didn’t read my post post before this that points out I’m on the left too. My comment wasn’t aimed at people booing it, it was people trying to constructively explain their thoughts on it and being jumped on. I just like hearing all opinions is all. Even if I don’t always like them!

Trouble is there are a number of people putting across a similar point to you about people 'constructively explaining their thoughts' but most of the time it's the same argument. "It's linked to BLM who are Marxist/leftie/want to defund the police".

Then others point out the players have specifically said it's nothing to do with it. But apparently the people making the gesture explaining why they're making it isn't sufficient reason.

Then you get "any other gesture and I'd be fine with it." but the fact is taking the knee was adopted by BLM because it had media attention. If players changed the gesture and it gained traction BLM would do the same again and you'd be back at the same argument.

It's pointed out taking a knee predates BLM by a long time and goes back to the early days of Civil Rights.

Is that not people 'constructively explaining their thoughts" by pointing out the holes in the argument rather than 'jumping on'?

fatso · Aug 21, 2021

MacReady said:
Not what I was implying. Not sure where this obsession with lefty liberal snowflake comes into it either - nothing in my comment has even mentioned that - clearly you have some thing going on that creates that in your mind and you clearly didn’t read my post post before this that points out I’m on the left too. My comment wasn’t aimed at people booing it, it was people trying to constructively explain their thoughts on it and being jumped on. I just like hearing all opinions is all. Even if I don’t always like them!

Great post!

MacReady · Aug 21, 2021

Sky_Blue_Dreamer said:
Trouble is there are a number of people putting across a similar point to you about people 'constructively explaining their thoughts' but most of the time it's the same argument. "It's linked to BLM who are Marxist/leftie/want to defund the police".

Then others point out the players have specifically said it's nothing to do with it. But apparently the people making the gesture explaining why they're making it isn't sufficient reason.

Then you get "any other gesture and I'd be fine with it." but the fact is taking the knee was adopted by BLM because it had media attention. If players changed the gesture and it gained traction BLM would do the same again and you'd be back at the same argument.

It's pointed out taking a knee predates BLM by a long time and goes back to the early days of Civil Rights.

Is that not people 'constructively explaining their thoughts" by pointing out the holes in the argument rather than 'jumping on'?

But if people are constructively pointing out holes in other peoples arguments then that’s great. That’s exactly what I’m saying so I don’t understand the point of your reply and all the extra stuff that was tacked on? Not being rude, just maybe we are misunderstanding each other. As I said different opinions and healthy debate are the way forwards in this world.

Samo · Aug 21, 2021

Sky_Blue_Dreamer said:
Trouble is there are a number of people putting across a similar point to you about people 'constructively explaining their thoughts' but most of the time it's the same argument. "It's linked to BLM who are Marxist/leftie/want to defund the police".

Then others point out the players have specifically said it's nothing to do with it. But apparently the people making the gesture explaining why they're making it isn't sufficient reason.

Then you get "any other gesture and I'd be fine with it." but the fact is taking the knee was adopted by BLM because it had media attention. If players changed the gesture and it gained traction BLM would do the same again and you'd be back at the same argument.

It's pointed out taking a knee predates BLM by a long time and goes back to the early days of Civil Rights.

Is that not people 'constructively explaining their thoughts" by pointing out the holes in the argument rather than 'jumping on'?

I think the real trouble is that the collective IQ on here is not high, which means it is almost impossible to have a reasonable debate without some idiots jumping all over you, as evidenced on this thread. But it is football forum so we should all temper our expectations.

fatso · Aug 21, 2021

Samo said:
I think the real trouble is that the collective IQ on here is not high, which means it is almost impossible to have a reasonable debate without some idiots jumping all over you, as evidenced on this thread. But it is football forum so we should all temper our expectations.

Exactly!

EalingSB · Aug 21, 2021

Yorkshire SB said:
I sense those booing aren’t all racists. Just the most stupid, ill informed and impressionable amongst us.

It’s the same group of people who froth about everything else, anti-vaccine, anti lockdown, hard Brexit, BBC license fee, Meghan Markle, the Union Jack being on display.

We have an obsession with Great Britain and the Empire, it’s built into the national psyche. Influential figures take advantage of that and people become warped by it. Brexit and the desire to return to former glories is the most obvious example of it, but it manifests in other ways.

Ultimately some people become nationalists, and racist as a consequence. I think with some they get there easily and with many it’s a slower path, and perhaps it’s an unconscious bias than pure racism.

Good post. I went to England’s EURO matches against Germany and Denmark and both times there were people around me booing the opposition’s anthem. I asked a lad before the Denmark game why he was doing it and he replied: “It’s just what you do.” It’s not though, is it? You’ve got to be a moron to boo an anthem just as you’re a moron if you boo a player taking the knee.

Bez · Aug 21, 2021

Ccfcisparks said:
Must be the worlds quickest van to get up to Scotland in that time!

The police never arrived!! W

Bez · Aug 21, 2021

clint van damme said:
Fairplay to Bez, taking time out from nonce hunting to like a post!

Take it you’ve never heard of passengers? It’s what happens when you have friends or family.

fatso · Aug 21, 2021

Anyone else find it ironic, that a thread about a peaceful show of respect has degenerated into such a diatribe of personal insults, disgusting foul language, and even threats of violence.
There is very little evidence of tolerance on here!

usskyblue · Aug 21, 2021

Samo said:
I think the real trouble is that the collective IQ on here is not high, which means it is almost impossible to have a reasonable debate without some idiots jumping all over you, as evidenced on this thread. But it is football forum so we should all temper our expectations.

Tobyfair, you joined the thread to announce that everything is politics. Then called people ignorant for not agreeing. You called someone a dick for suggesting that using politics in this case is to justify an anti knee view. You then said you were hiding your opinion just for fun.

So having a little pop here twisted my nipples a bit m8. Let’s face it, if you only threw in the contributions of Bez and marcusp we’re already fighting to get the IQ above negative.

Everything may be political but that’s exactly the fucking problem. Politics is designed to split the people because there-in lies the power. Divide and conquer. It’s why parties that identify as being in the middle are derided as fence sitters. Pick a side and argue the toss with the ‘opposition’ for the rest of my life? No thanks.

Politics and religion will swallow us way before the fucking sun gets here.

Tommo1993 · Aug 21, 2021

W⚓️

Hehehe, how grown up and clever…

Samo · Aug 21, 2021

usskyblue said:
Tobyfair, you joined the thread to announce that everything is politics. Then called people ignorant for not agreeing. You called someone a dick for suggesting that using politics in this case is to justify an anti knee view. You then said you were hiding your opinion just for fun.

So having a little pop here twisted my nipples a bit m8. Let’s face it, if you only threw in the contributions of Bez and marcusp we’re already fighting to get the IQ above negative.

Everything may be political but that’s exactly the fucking problem. Politics is designed to split the people because there-in lies the power. Divide and conquer. It’s why parties that identify as being in the middle are derided as fence sitters. Pick a side and argue the toss with the ‘opposition’ for the rest of my life? No thanks.

Politics and religion will swallow us way before the fucking sun gets here.

I see you have time for homework.
I would point out that the person I called ignorant had responded to my post with 'bullshit', or was it 'bollocks'? So I think calling them ignorant was fair enough, they had hardly stepped in to reasonably debate with me had they?
Sorry about your nipples.

Grendel · Aug 21, 2021

Bez said:
Take it you’ve never heard of passengers? It’s what happens when you have friends or family.

that’s what Fred west said

shmmeee · Aug 21, 2021

Did anyone boo?

Tommo1993 · Aug 21, 2021

shmmeee said:
Did anyone boo?

I heard a few. Drowned out though.

Liquid Gold · Aug 21, 2021

Very few boos and lots of cheers.

As usual loudmouths online are the minority and most people are actually decent.

Evo1883 · Aug 21, 2021

It's almost non existent , very very few now ..

torchomatic · Aug 21, 2021

shmmeee said:
Did anyone boo?

A few around me but not much. Drowned out by the applause.

Otis · Aug 21, 2021

torchomatic said:
A few around me but not much. Drowned out by the applause.

So Marxism is winning then? They train those Marxists very well don't they.

Liquid Gold · Aug 21, 2021

A so always worth reiterating that we’re still doing it with fans in the ground and the vast majority applaud.

None of this threats that we wouldn’t be able to with fans as they’d be abused. Anybody that thought that needs to get out of their right wing echo chamber.

DO NOT boo the knee (4 Viewers)

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