Front page telegraph (1 Viewer)

Breaking point

http://epaper.icmidlands.co.uk/icm/login.aspx

desperately looking for a paddle!

What does the story actually say?

What a joke sisu are.

Why dont Acl lock them out and bring it to a head. It seems stupid that Sisu are dictating what gos on when they are the tenant not the owner

Link to story




CRUNCH talks over Coventry City's future have reached breaking point with Ricoh Arena bosses calling the current situation unacceptable.

Stadium bosses Arena Coventry Ltd (ACL) have hit out as the club's unpaid Ricoh rent bill is about to reach £1million.

But Sky Blues chiefs have hit back amid growing tension between the club and the stadium.

Coventry City FC chief executive Tim Fisher, in a strongly-worded statement issued to the Telegraph, accused ACL of playing hard-ball because of its own high debt levels, and drops in stadium sponsorship and naming rights revenue.

ACL declined to comment on rumours its bank has called in external accountancy firm Deloitte to advise on restructuring its debts, due to financial difficulty and fears it will not be able to pay back a multi-million pound loan.

The football club has been refusing to pay rent since March, complaining it is too high. ACL now says the club's arrears are about to hit an unacceptable £1 million mark on Saturday.

It has also emerged months of negotiations have broken down over Sky Blues owner Sisu's bid to obtain a 50 per cent share in the stadium.

Coventry City Football Club, with multi-million pound annual losses, insists buying into the Ricoh Arena would be a vital lifeline for the future.

Confirmation of deadlock in sensitive negotiations over a lower rent arrangement with the two sides seemingly nowhere near agreement indicates hopes of any deal are now in crisis.

Mr Fisher accused ACL of pulling out of rent talks.

It follows this year's relegation to the third tier of English football, and months of speculation over the clubs liquidation.

The High Court in August confirmed Arena Coventry Ltd (ACL) owned equally by Coventry City Council and the Alan Edwards Higgs Charity have a legal right to call in arrears over the current £100,000-a-month rent arrangement.

Jacky Isaac, ACLs interim chief executive, said: "The board of ACL has worked patiently with the club and its owners, the Mayfair-based hedge fund Sisu, for nine months, to attempt to resolve the rent arrears issue.

"During this time no payments have been received. By December 1 there will be more than £1million in outstanding rent if no action is taken. That is unacceptable.

"The board of ACL is continuing discussions with Sisu to find a way in which the club can continue to operate on a sustainable basis.

"This must involve the payment of rent owed and the production by Sisu to the board of ACL of a workable business and financing plan to safeguard the future of the club, a future that is important to the city of Coventry and its residents."

Responding to questions about restructuring ACL's debt, she said: "The Ricoh Arena is a strong asset for Coventry, hosting a range of world-class business, entertainment and sports events throughout the year. The Olympics provided a huge boost to the entire city this summer and we continue to attract leading acts to play at the Ricoh. We have just announced Muse, the upcoming Florence and the Machine concert is a sell-out and our Christmas parties are nearly at capacity."

She also added: "The Board of ACL is continuing discussions with Sisu to find a way in which the club can continue to operate on a sustainable basis. This must involve it controlling all of its costs, and not blaming all of its financial problems on the stadium rent, which is only a small part of its overall difficulties."

Meanwhile, Peter Knatchbull-Hugessen, clerk to the trustees of the Alan Edward Higgs Charity, said talks had now stalled with Sisu over a deal for its 50 per cent stake in ACL. He said: "The charity has an obligation to maximise its assets and it must consider any serious offer for its stake in Arena Coventry Limited, subject to the agreement of an acceptable price and accompanying terms.

"Sisu has never provided these, and no discussions are taking place at this time."



Read More http://www.coventrytelegraph.net/co...news/2012/11/27/92746-32311591/#ixzz2DPiMr7Yf

What's the actual content?

It's fine, don't worry. We're going to hit the play-offs and all is going to be hunky dory!

Any truth in these stories in reality though and it all makes the desperate 'attempts' to sign David McGoldrick all look pretty lame doesn't it!

Not read it but I would guess it is going to say pretty much what we already know. Who has prompted the story ? TF or ACL ?

1) Rent debt now £1m - well i am not surprised ACL are angry, CCFC are not saying cant pay they are saying wont pay - there is a difference. Is that rent subject to VAT ? is CCFC liable to pay interest on unpaid rent ? and are all other amounts due to ACL up to date ? is the debt only £1m? As I understand it CCFC have been given an extension in time to sort this out and that time is almost up, after that there are decisions to make that could have serious implications for CCFC and ACL

2) ACL struggling with high levels of debt ......... well only because CCFC have taken at least £1m out of their cashflow, delayed other payments. To compound that if the rent is chargeable to VAT they would have had to pay the VAT over on money they have not received. So a reasonable estimation by TF, who has basically caused the situation and put a valuable Coventry City (NOT CCFC), asset and employer at risk. Have ACL done anything about it, can ACL do anything about it ? - perhaps we are about to find out. Do CCFC hold all the cards in their plan to drive ACL to the wall and then take over, thereby recovering their investment at least in part - maybe not but we will have to wait see on that:thinking about:

3) Talks to buy 50% break down - were they ever serious in the first place or was it going through motions (smoke & mirrors) whilst they developed their strategy to get ACL 100% on the cheap ? I think we all felt nothing was going to come of it when it all went quiet particularly from the CCFC end of things. How difficult could a proof of funds and payment plan be to provide and agree? Why wouldnt SISU /TF talk it up ? Where was the money coming from?

I am guessing but a lot of what is there we will already have guessed and there is a lot more yet to come out.

edit

Thanks for update Rich.

Doesnt look like ACL or the Charity are being unreasonable but both taking a harder line. TF seems to me to have had his face slapped (metaphorically) and is stamping his feet looking for others to blame. Bit rich complaining that ACL are playing hard ball ...... this SISU and their appointee isnt it ? ACL pulled out of rent talks .......... really what is been talked about TF when you simply say we wont pay a penny ? - hardly a concilliatory stance whilst ACL have waited 9 months to get it resolved. Why would ACL pull out of settlement talks - they want their money and have been far more patient than most landlords - at some point they have to draw a line

Everyone is supposed to believe that Deloittes coming in to look at the restructuring implies failure and imminent doom...... what if they were successful are restructuring things so that the reliance for CCFC cashflow was reduced significantly further. How happy would that make SISU and TF? How much more at risk is CCFC?

Seems to me that ACL and the Higgs Charity have been more than patient, and open to discussion ........... what they have said seems pretty reasonable

SISU have seriously overplayed their hand here... ACL looking more than reasonable now by giving the club so much time to sort it out.. SISU clearly not interested or able to do anything credible with this whole sorry fiasco - it's just embarrassing

ACL about to strike me thinks and who in all honesty can blame them..

Finally

We are back to debenture and fund account chat, I was missing this with all of the football happenings recently.

We can now get back to doing what we do best.

skyblueman said:

SISU have seriously overplayed their hand here... ACL looking more than reasonable now by giving the club so much time to sort it out.. SISU clearly not interested or able to do anything credible with this whole sorry fiasco - it's just embarrassing

ACL about to strike me thinks and who in all honesty can blame them..

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Yep it seems that they will be found out as incompetents

I,ve just been on the pompy forum and they have a 112 Page thread on ccfc and how they are getting away without paying rent

I'm sure I recall someone posting a while back that they'd spoken to Joe Elliot who'd said that something looked like it would be happening (can't remember what wording was used) at about the end of November........

oldskyblue58 said:

Not read it but I would guess it is going to say pretty much what we already know. Who has prompted the story ? TF or ACL ?

1) Rent debt now £1m - well i am not surprised ACL are angry, CCFC are not saying cant pay they are saying wont pay - there is a difference. Is that rent subject to VAT ? is CCFC liable to pay interest on unpaid rent ? and are all other amounts due to ACL up to date ? is the debt only £1m? As I understand it CCFC have been given an extension in time to sort this out and that time is almost up, after that there are decisions to make that could have serious implications for CCFC and ACL

2) ACL struggling with high levels of debt ......... well only because CCFC have taken at least £1m out of their cashflow, delayed other payments. To compound that if the rent is chargeable to VAT they would have had to pay the VAT over on money they have not received. So a reasonable estimation by TF, who has basically caused the situation and put a valuable Coventry City (NOT CCFC), asset and employer at risk. Have ACL done anything about it, can ACL do anything about it ? - perhaps we are about to find out. Do CCFC hold all the cards in their plan to drive ACL to the wall and then take over, thereby recovering their investment at least in part - maybe not but we will have to wait see on that:thinking about:

3) Talks to buy 50% break down - were they ever serious in the first place or was it going through motions (smoke & mirrors) whilst they developed their strategy to get ACL 100% on the cheap ? I think we all felt nothing was going to come of it when it all went quiet particularly from the CCFC end of things. How difficult could a proof of funds and payment plan be to provide and agree? Why wouldnt SISU /TF talk it up ? Where was the money coming from?

I am guessing but a lot of what is there we will already have guessed and there is a lot more yet to come out.

Click to expand...

Blimey OSB never thought about the VAT implications on this... Rent MUST be subject to VAT it has to be so ACl invoice CCFC £1Million plus VAT so ACL have had to pay HMRC £200k on this - CCFC never pay the bills BUT will have claimed back the £200k VAT from HMRC as they are entitled to... just gets worse & worse

In all of this, IF ACL locked the club out of the Arena, would this now mean that CCFC will have broken the terms of their contract with their season ticket holders and corporate guests and that folk would be entitled to a proportional refund if fixtures could not be fulfilled ??

The story itself adds very little new of substance-though a reminder of how much we have withheld is useful when we're all posturing for McGoldrick.

skyblueman said:

Blimey OSB never thought about the VAT implications on this... Rent MUST be subject to VAT it has to be so ACl invoice CCFC £1Million plus VAT so ACL have had to pay HMRC £200k on this - CCFC never pay the bills BUT will have claimed back the £200k VAT from HMRC as they are entitled to... just gets worse & worse

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VAT isn't my specialist subject so I'm happy to be corrected but I think that the landlord has the option to charge VAT on rent or not.

VAT in Sisu's case stands for Very Arsey Tenants.

ccfcway said:

I,ve just been on the pompy forum and they have a 112 Page thread on ccfc and how they are getting away without paying rent

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Fact is though, we are going to have to pay it. Same way as Pompey are going to have to take the 10 point deduction.

Bit rich them on about our scenario me thinks. :thinking about:

Very amateurish turds.

skyblueman said:

Blimey OSB never thought about the VAT implications on this... Rent MUST be subject to VAT it has to be so ACl invoice CCFC £1Million plus VAT so ACL have had to pay HMRC £200k on this - CCFC never pay the bills BUT will have claimed back the £200k VAT from HMRC as they are entitled to... just gets worse & worse

Click to expand...

This is often overlooked. I know of a business who went into administration as their cashflow couldn't support the position they were placed within

Otis said:

VAT in Sisu's case stands for Very Arsey Tenants.

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And there was me - after only three games - thinking it was Vengeance Against Thorn

Are SISU trying to force ACL out of business?

Thats right DTD they have the option to tax .......... thats why i phrased my point as a question because i do not know the VAT status of the property. If VAT has been charged then ACL will have had to pay it over to HMRC putting strain on cashflow and cant call it a bad debt as it stands so cant get it back yet. Could have increased strain on ACL cashflow if charged

I think if VAT has been charged then it could have implications for CCFC too......... they will have reclaimed the VAT but not paid the bill and there are mechanisms in VAT for HMRC to get that input VAT back if the debt not paid within certain time period. Wont help their cashflow either.

Mary_Mungo_Midge said:

And there was me - after only three games - thinking it was Vengeance Against Thorn

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Vile Arrogant Tossers

Rich said:

Are SISU trying to force ACL out of business?

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got to ask what are the positive ways out of this for SISU Rich............. would getting their hands on a valuable asset, with good income streams, at a knock down price if say ACL in administration, then sell it on for profit as a going concern with development rights be to SISU's advantage :thinking about:

Rich said:

Are SISU trying to force ACL out of business?

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At least put pressure on their negotiating position.

I mean, it's only the council and therefore the taxpayers of Coventry and a charity. I'm sure there's plenty of empathy for both parties in those Mayfair offices.

(Note to myself, I must stop posting with sarcasm this morning...)

Rich said:

Link to story

http://www.coventrytelegraph.net/co...news/2012/11/27/92746-32311591/#ixzz2DPiMr7Yf

Click to expand...

Three stabbed outside City nightclub?

Hardly news is it.

Do you not find it strange that TF issued a strongly worded statement to the CT but it isnt actually included in the article ?

There are comments from the acting CEO at ACL and the Clerk to the Trustees for the charity

no Nick ........ i only know he issued one because the CT article referred to it. CT article didnt quote him just referred to parts of it. You would have thought it was important to get his words out there too. If only for balance

It probably said-we're sisu,we do what we want and we're not paying ao fuck you. I wish acl would bring it to a head and lock the doors on them. Maybe then this embarrasing saga will get sorted.

Nick said:

Do you know what the statement from TF said?

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'We are being totally transparent in our completely indistinguishable stance on the matter.'