Haskell / ACL / Trust / CCFC Administration (10 Viewers)

Nick · Aug 6, 2020

So after finding out that Roger Ellis and David Johnson were involved with the Wasps / Hoffman takeover stuff (while publicly Wasps were "negotiating" a deal with Dave Boddy to rent) I thought things were a bit parallel to the whole Haskell thing. David Johnson was often talking about a Phoenix Club being allowed to play at the Ricoh but people like CJ wanted to ignore this and play it down.

ACL plan to force admin, think they are going to control how it works, use their Administrator and appoint a new CCFC owner in Preston Haskell. (As told to the press at the time). A forced regime change that backfired.

So when you look back at things at the time of Haskell, it's interesting to see that when ACL were forcing admin on the club that the Trust were plotting with ACL / Hoffman a Phoenix Club then as well.

What a load of sly, backstabbing pricks. More than happy to see the club die to get a bit of self importance and a spinny chair in a board room.

Skyblueweeman · Aug 6, 2020

For those of us who haven't had the total understanding of every single detail Nick or who can't keep up with all the names in our sorry saga, what are you in saying in simple terms?

Skyblueweeman · Aug 6, 2020

Sorry, I've just re-read your post. So you're saying that whilst Wasps were in discussions with DB to get us back, ACL and the Trust were in cahoots with Hoffman and the council (and likely Wasps), about forcing CCFC into administration which might have brought on liquidation, thus resulting in a new Phoenix club being formed that that lot would've had some control over, led by Gary Hoffman?

Nick · Aug 6, 2020

Skyblueweeman said:
For those of us who haven't had the total understanding of every single detail Nick or who can't keep up with all the names in our sorry saga, what are you in saying in simple terms?

That Hoffman and the Trust have been complicit in trying to fuck the club over, twice now.

Grendel · Aug 6, 2020

Skyblueweeman said:
Sorry, I've just re-read your post. So you're saying that whilst Wasps were in discussions with DB to get us back, ACL and the Trust were in cahoots with Hoffman and the council (and likely Wasps), about forcing CCFC into administration which might have brought on liquidation, thus resulting in a new Phoenix club being formed that that lot would've had some control over, led by Gary Hoffman?

It’s always been the aim since the Haskell fiasco

Nick · Aug 6, 2020

Skyblueweeman said:
Sorry, I've just re-read your post. So you're saying that whilst Wasps were in discussions with DB to get us back, ACL and the Trust were in cahoots with Hoffman and the council (and likely Wasps), about forcing CCFC into administration which might have brought on liquidation, thus resulting in a new Phoenix club being formed that that lot would've had some control over, led by Gary Hoffman?

Yeah while Wasps were discussing the rent with Boddy, Wasps were also plotting with Hoffman and his Consortium (and people from the Trust) about forcing a takeover. It's convenient isn't it?

Coventry Hornets with Roger Ellis and David Johnson from the Trust on the board? It was always strange how David Johnson was gloating that a new club could easily play at the Ricoh. Almost like it had been discussed already with Wasps.

Why do we think they were all so eager for the "Golden Share" to be taken away and CCFC to go the same way as Bury did?

Skyblueweeman · Aug 6, 2020

Got ya both, thanks for clarifying.

Shocking really.

Genuinely, I really wish that a wider portion of our fan base understood this. I think it would make a massive difference in public opinion as well as put more pressure on Wasps, CCC and the Trust.

Nick · Aug 6, 2020

Skyblueweeman said:
Got ya both, thanks for clarifying.

Shocking really.

Genuinely, I really wish that a wider portion of our fan base understood this. I think it would make a massive difference in public opinion as well as put more pressure on Wasps, CCC and the Trust.

It was obvious at the time with Wasps that they would be in with Hoffman.

Is this whole thing a Haskell Mk2?

By no means fact and just an observation, I will point that out first. It's not based on anything other than taking a step back and looking at things playing out. Last time we saw ACL / Council / Haskell try to force a change of ownership and it backfired. People have acknowledged that Wasps...

www.skybluestalk.co.uk

It was no coincidence that people involved with the Trust were rubbing their hands together at the thought CCFC couldn't file their accounts with no ground confirmed. They were counting down thinking they would have to hand the club over to Hoffman.

Skyblueweeman · Aug 6, 2020

Mark/Pete...apologies but my memory isn't what it once was. Do you have any meetings planned with the Trust?

Or what about with local media...Gilbert, Reid, Leach etc?

It feels like there's lots of pieces of a jigsaw puzzle on the table and bar a number on here, it's hard for people like me to put those pieces together to understand exactly what has gone on (although I got it, just not in the detail that others have).

It would be great if those 3 journos above did some sort of expose. 12 months ago I would've said there's not a chance that that would happen but the tide appears to be turning. What's the chances....

Nick · Aug 6, 2020

Anybody remember when Supporter's Direct were working with the Council's PR company for a "media assault" on Joy / SISU?

Who do we know that might have access to a Supporter's Direct email address?

Board and National Council - Football Supporters' Association

The FSA's structure features a National Council which embeds within it fan representatives from clubs at Premier League, Championship, League One and League Two, and National Game (non-league) level. Six individual fans are also elected and, in addition to this, supporter-owned clubs have their...

thefsa.org.uk

Scroll though this page and see which names stand out.

This link is interesting too:

MINUTES: Supporters Consultative Meeting, Wednesday 12 October 2016, 6.00pm

Read all the minutes from the latest SCG meeting, including CCFC Chairman Tim Fisher...

www.ccfc.co.uk

Nick · Aug 6, 2020

Skyblueweeman said:
Mark/Pete...apologies but my memory isn't what it once was. Do you have any meetings planned with the Trust?

Or what about with local media...Gilbert, Reid, Leach etc?

It feels like there's lots of pieces of a jigsaw puzzle on the table and bar a number on here, it's hard for people like me to put those pieces together to understand exactly what has gone on (although I got it, just not in the detail that others have).

It would be great if those 3 journos above did some sort of expose. 12 months ago I would've said there's not a chance that that would happen but the tide appears to be turning. What's the chances....

I posted a link to that image months ago, Simon G said he asked Hoffman and he denied it and that was that.

cc84cov · Aug 6, 2020

scum bags

better days · Aug 6, 2020

Rod Liddle wrote a good ar

Skyblueweeman said:
Mark/Pete...apologies but my memory isn't what it once was. Do you have any meetings planned with the Trust?

Or what about with local media...Gilbert, Reid, Leach etc?

It feels like there's lots of pieces of a jigsaw puzzle on the table and bar a number on here, it's hard for people like me to put those pieces together to understand exactly what has gone on (although I got it, just not in the detail that others have).

It would be great if those 3 journos above did some sort of expose. 12 months ago I would've said there's not a chance that that would happen but the tide appears to be turning. What's the chances....

Rod Liddle (forget his politics) in the Sunday Times wrote the best article I've seen on our situation in June last year
Cut and pasted again below

Stung again — spare a thought for homeless Coventry City as Wasps row rumbles on

It is 18 years since Coventry City last played in the Premier League, during which time they have come close to extinction, played in the lowest tier for the first time since 1959 and generally had a fairly awful time of it.

Last season gave fans a few reasons for optimism — manager Mark Robins had assembled a decent squad and a late run took them close to a place in the League One playoffs. But now, this. For the second time in the past 18 years, the Sky Blues are without a home of their own and will be playing next season’s home fixtures at St Andrew’s, in Birmingham, 21 miles away.

The club’s owners, the London hedge fund SISU, have failed to strike a deal with Wasps rugby union team, who play at — and own — the Ricoh Arena. Back in 2013-14 City played their home games at Sixfields stadium, home of Northampton Town, more than 32 miles distant. They had hoped those bad old days were gone. The decision to play at St Andrew’s was again a last-ditch attempt to prevent the club being expelled from the Football League on account of having nowhere to play.

Feeling blue: Coventry fans will once again have to make a long journey to watch their beloved sideMARC ATKINS
A spokesman for SISU said “we are incredibly disappointed and frustrated” that no deal could be struck over the Ricoh Arena. Not as frustrated as the EFL — which agreed to the ground share with Birmingham City only with great reluctance — or, of course, the benighted fans. Last season Coventry City were the fifth best supported club in League One, with an average home attendance of 12,362, an improvement on the previous season’s average of 9,255. They will be very lucky to achieve half of that number next season: their average home league attendance while playing at Northampton’s ground was scarcely over 2,000.

The problems are myriad and complex. A long-standing row over the sale of the Ricoh Arena to Wasps rumbles on and is coming before the European Commission. City believe the ground was grossly undervalued when it was sold, to the tune of about £28m. But that is only the half of it.

Wasps are, on the face of it, an extremely successful rugby union club. They finished eighth in the Gallagher Premiership last season with an average attendance of 17,975 — a figure beaten only by Leicester Tigers. But their financial position is far more perilous than that of Coventry City and, frankly, they will be fortunate if they are in existence by the this time next year. Their debts, for a rugby club, are astonishing — £55.8m at the latest count after their pre-tax losses last season more than doubled to £9.7m.

The total owed to their Irish owner Derek Richardson, who six years ago rescued them from bankruptcy at the last minute, rose to £18.6m, which some estimate to be at least a third of the chap’s worth.

Worse still, Wasps now face a serious inquiry into alleged financial shenanigans, involving suggestions of grossly overstated profits, a breach of covenants regarding bonds and effectively lying about a million quid or so which Wasps marked down as capital revenue when actually it was another bung from the uniquely generous Richardson.

Meanwhile, hanging over them is the legal action that insists they got the Ricoh on the cheap. If I were a Wasps fan I would be looking at the relatively stable Coventry City with a degree of envy: City’s latest losses were less than £2m, which is around about what you might expect for a decent sized club in the third tier.

The Sky Blues supporters are, of course, beside themselves with fury that they will not be able to watch their team play in their home city and have been apt to blame the owners, as is so often the case.

This seems to me a bit harsh. Without the intervention of the hedge fund monkeys, Coventry City would not exist at all and SISU have put an awful lot of money into the club, without seeing very much in the way of a return.

Again one is tempted to ask why they have done this, but as they are all financial experts I suppose they must know what they are doing.

League One is rapidly becoming a sanctum of the lost and the dispossessed, given the travails of poor Bolton Wanderers.

There was a time, fairly recently, when Coventry City had the longest unbroken spell in the top tier of any club, Arsenal and Everton excepted — 34 years of pleasant over-achievement that included a memorable FA Cup final win over Tottenham Hotspur in 1987, participation in the Inter-Cities Fairs Cup and a two-legged tie against Bayern Munich, and a top-six finish. And that delightful goal off a free kick scored by Ernie Hunt after Willie Carr’s illegal flick-up, which we all tried to copy in the playground.

Sentimentalists such as me, then, rather hope that Coventry’s problems come to an end very quickly. There is the suggestion now that City’s owners may attempt to build a new ground somewhere in the environs of Coventry. In which case, what on earth will happen to the Ricoh Arena if Wasps go bust? Or even if they don’t? It seems a little bit profligate in these straitened times.

Skyblueweeman · Aug 6, 2020

Nick said:
I posted a link to that image months ago, Simon G said he asked Hoffman and he denied it and that was that.

If I asked some storage manager at Beirut Port if he was storing a chemical safely and he said yes, I'd probably take him at his word.

Using the jigsaw analogy, if Mark/Pete/ANOther put those pieces in front of Gilbert and helped him put the puzzle together, things might look different?

Skyblueweeman · Aug 6, 2020

Actually, re-reading my last post, the Beirut bit might be considered poor taste. Soz.

Nick · Aug 6, 2020

Oh don't get me wrong, this isn't a "SISU ARE INNOCENT" comment. This is "SISU are pricks but so are these people, if not worse as they have been parading about as caring for CCFC when they would have no issue in killing it"

Nick · Aug 6, 2020

Skyblueweeman said:
If I asked some storage manager at Beirut Port if he was storing a chemical safely and he said yes, I'd probably take him at his word.

Using the jigsaw analogy, if Mark/Pete/ANOther put those pieces in front of Gilbert and helped him put the puzzle together, things might look different?

Pretty sure Gilbert has all of those pieces in front of him but chooses not to play Jigsaw.

Skyblueweeman · Aug 6, 2020

better days said:
Rod Liddle wrote a good ar

Rod Liddle (forget his politics) in the Sunday Times wrote the best article I've seen on our situation in June last year
Cut and pasted again below

Stung again — spare a thought for homeless Coventry City as Wasps row rumbles on

It is 18 years since Coventry City last played in the Premier League, during which time they have come close to extinction, played in the lowest tier for the first time since 1959 and generally had a fairly awful time of it.

Last season gave fans a few reasons for optimism — manager Mark Robins had assembled a decent squad and a late run took them close to a place in the League One playoffs. But now, this. For the second time in the past 18 years, the Sky Blues are without a home of their own and will be playing next season’s home fixtures at St Andrew’s, in Birmingham, 21 miles away.

The club’s owners, the London hedge fund SISU, have failed to strike a deal with Wasps rugby union team, who play at — and own — the Ricoh Arena. Back in 2013-14 City played their home games at Sixfields stadium, home of Northampton Town, more than 32 miles distant. They had hoped those bad old days were gone. The decision to play at St Andrew’s was again a last-ditch attempt to prevent the club being expelled from the Football League on account of having nowhere to play.

Feeling blue: Coventry fans will once again have to make a long journey to watch their beloved sideMARC ATKINS
A spokesman for SISU said “we are incredibly disappointed and frustrated” that no deal could be struck over the Ricoh Arena. Not as frustrated as the EFL — which agreed to the ground share with Birmingham City only with great reluctance — or, of course, the benighted fans. Last season Coventry City were the fifth best supported club in League One, with an average home attendance of 12,362, an improvement on the previous season’s average of 9,255. They will be very lucky to achieve half of that number next season: their average home league attendance while playing at Northampton’s ground was scarcely over 2,000.

The problems are myriad and complex. A long-standing row over the sale of the Ricoh Arena to Wasps rumbles on and is coming before the European Commission. City believe the ground was grossly undervalued when it was sold, to the tune of about £28m. But that is only the half of it.

Wasps are, on the face of it, an extremely successful rugby union club. They finished eighth in the Gallagher Premiership last season with an average attendance of 17,975 — a figure beaten only by Leicester Tigers. But their financial position is far more perilous than that of Coventry City and, frankly, they will be fortunate if they are in existence by the this time next year. Their debts, for a rugby club, are astonishing — £55.8m at the latest count after their pre-tax losses last season more than doubled to £9.7m.

The total owed to their Irish owner Derek Richardson, who six years ago rescued them from bankruptcy at the last minute, rose to £18.6m, which some estimate to be at least a third of the chap’s worth.

Worse still, Wasps now face a serious inquiry into alleged financial shenanigans, involving suggestions of grossly overstated profits, a breach of covenants regarding bonds and effectively lying about a million quid or so which Wasps marked down as capital revenue when actually it was another bung from the uniquely generous Richardson.

Meanwhile, hanging over them is the legal action that insists they got the Ricoh on the cheap. If I were a Wasps fan I would be looking at the relatively stable Coventry City with a degree of envy: City’s latest losses were less than £2m, which is around about what you might expect for a decent sized club in the third tier.

The Sky Blues supporters are, of course, beside themselves with fury that they will not be able to watch their team play in their home city and have been apt to blame the owners, as is so often the case.

This seems to me a bit harsh. Without the intervention of the hedge fund monkeys, Coventry City would not exist at all and SISU have put an awful lot of money into the club, without seeing very much in the way of a return.

Again one is tempted to ask why they have done this, but as they are all financial experts I suppose they must know what they are doing.

League One is rapidly becoming a sanctum of the lost and the dispossessed, given the travails of poor Bolton Wanderers.

There was a time, fairly recently, when Coventry City had the longest unbroken spell in the top tier of any club, Arsenal and Everton excepted — 34 years of pleasant over-achievement that included a memorable FA Cup final win over Tottenham Hotspur in 1987, participation in the Inter-Cities Fairs Cup and a two-legged tie against Bayern Munich, and a top-six finish. And that delightful goal off a free kick scored by Ernie Hunt after Willie Carr’s illegal flick-up, which we all tried to copy in the playground.

Sentimentalists such as me, then, rather hope that Coventry’s problems come to an end very quickly. There is the suggestion now that City’s owners may attempt to build a new ground somewhere in the environs of Coventry. In which case, what on earth will happen to the Ricoh Arena if Wasps go bust? Or even if they don’t? It seems a little bit profligate in these straitened times.

I mean, some might say that that's a bit one sided for the SISU camp but I agree with all of it. When you compare this piece to the 'Sisu out' pieces then it's in an obvious minority. What more needs to be done to get more 'balanced' pieces like this out there...particularly to our own fanbase, as opposed to the wider football family in the first instance.

Skyblueweeman · Aug 6, 2020

Nick said:
Pretty sure Gilbert has all of those pieces in front of him but chooses not to play Jigsaw.

Hence my bit about Pete/Mark meeting with him. Force him to pick up the pieces and put them in the right place ;-)

Nick · Aug 6, 2020

Skyblueweeman said:
Hence my bit about Pete/Mark meeting with him. Force him to pick up the pieces and put them in the right place ;-)

Because he isn't bothered about digging into that.

Skyblueweeman · Aug 6, 2020

Well then there needs to be a continued effort into working with the media in generally, rather than just shouting at them 'looook legohead....it's OBVIOUS'.

No offence to you or Gilbert there ;-)

Fergusons_Beard · Aug 6, 2020

Did it for me when the Trust asked for administration and gleefully backed it, like kids in a sweet shop.
One person who is EXTREMELY quiet at the mo (& surely a co conspirator) is @ashbyjan Jan chair/leader/mouthpiece of the Trust most of the way through & now backing away quietly through the back door....

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro

Nick · Aug 6, 2020

Skyblueweeman said:
Well then there needs to be a continued effort into working with the media in generally, rather than just shouting at them 'looook legohead....it's OBVIOUS'.

No offence to you or Gilbert there ;-)

After years of pointing things out, it's obvious they have no interest It's much easier for them to create fake accounts and say anybody pointing things out works for SISU.

Nick · Aug 6, 2020

Fergusons_Beard said:
Did it for me when the Trust asked for administration and gleefully backed it, like kids in a sweet shop.
One person who is EXTREMELY quiet at the mo (& surely a co conspirator) is @ashbyjan Jan chair/leader/mouthpiece of the Trust most of the way through & now backing away quietly through the back door....

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro

Yep that was on TV wasn't it? I remember that, Late Kick Off or something. They were all sat round a table excited at the thought of the club going into administration.

I think Jan is a fully fledged Wasps fan now though.

Grendel · Aug 6, 2020

Nick said:
Yep that was on TV wasn't it? I remember that, Late Kick Off or something. They were all sat round a table excited at the thought of the club going into administration.

I think Jan is a fully fledged Wasps fan now though.

Sick Boy · Aug 6, 2020

Go on, Nick!!

Mucca Mad Boys · Aug 6, 2020

Skyblueweeman said:
Actually, re-reading my last post, the Beirut bit might be considered poor taste. Soz.

It was in poor taste, but I got your intention and it makes sense.

Of course Hoffman would deny those charges. Not like any of the local media were going to look at any of this, at least at that time anyway!

tisza · Aug 6, 2020

ACL were fairly open about a regime change at CCFC even before Wasps arrived (but whilst they were negotiating with them)
"Make no mistake, now is the time for Sisu to pay up or sell up and get out of Coventry."
"If the club directors can't or won't follow through on the agreement they participated in creating, then we suggest to them that the time has come to consider offering ownership of CCFC to an outside buyer better placed to run the club's financial operations."

In context this was when SISU thought they bully ACL & CCC into various situations.

Nick · Aug 6, 2020

Yeah ACL put out a press release bigging Haskell up. It was in the media at the time that it was a forced regime change.

Quote from the Telegraph, the article has since been deleted funnily enough.

This could force out Mayfair-based hedge fund owner Sisu, which has ploughed more than £40m into the club and had hoped to acquire a stake in the Ricoh.

Potential American investors have been to the Ricoh Arena on two occasions, one being last week’s Colchester game, and understood to have been given a tour by ACL interim chief executive Jacky Isaac.

However, although ACL have seized the initiative to force a change of ownership, Sisu could turn the tables as the apparent end game plays out.

Liquid Gold · Aug 6, 2020

When we were getting relegated to league two it was these people calling for us to be shut down and a Phoenix created. Now we're back in the Champ they're life long Coventry fans who want MR to be given support.

None of the fuckers should ever be allowed near anything serious again. Fans working to shut down the club is disgusting, I hope the whole story comes out some time and those in the trust, and CCC are never able to show their faces again.

Colin Steins Smile · Aug 6, 2020

tisza said:
ACL were fairly open about a regime change at CCFC even before Wasps arrived (but whilst they were negotiating with them)
"Make no mistake, now is the time for Sisu to pay up or sell up and get out of Coventry."
"If the club directors can't or won't follow through on the agreement they participated in creating, then we suggest to them that the time has come to consider offering ownership of CCFC to an outside buyer better placed to run the club's financial operations."

In context this was when SISU thought they bully ACL & CCC into various situations.

I’m not sure there is a a load of interested investors with enough spare cash to make SISU an offer that meets their expectation of an appropriate return.

Nick · Aug 6, 2020

Colin Steins Smile said:
I’m not sure there is a a load of interested investors with enough spare cash to make SISU an offer that meets their expectation of an appropriate return.

That's why they have tried to force it a couple of times. It backfired the first time.

Colin Steins Smile · Aug 6, 2020

Nick said:
That's why they have tried to force it a couple of times. It backfired the first time.

Exactly - currently the CCFC asset is increasing in value

mark82 · Aug 6, 2020

Skyblueweeman said:
Hence my bit about Pete/Mark meeting with him. Force him to pick up the pieces and put them in the right place ;-)

Talking to Simon Gilbert on a fairly regular basis at the moment. We're kind of pushing for the same things at the moment but he generally has a bit more clout being in the media.

Senior Vick from Alicante · Aug 6, 2020

Skyblueweeman said:
Got ya both, thanks for clarifying.

Shocking really.

Genuinely, I really wish that a wider portion of our fan base understood this. I think it would make a massive difference in public opinion as well as put more pressure on Wasps, CCC and the Trust.

The Trust is not fit for purpose. It's top table have only ever represented party's other than the club. It has never held all party's involved equally to account.

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