Jail for Woman who took abortion pills (1 Viewer)

Deleted member 5849 · Jun 15, 2023

Outrage at jail sentence for woman who took abortion pills later than UK limit

Mitigation plea signed by medical groups was sent to judge, while BPAS chief executive said sentence was ‘shocking and appalling’

www.theguardian.com

Cross-party calls for the laws to be looked at and amended.

I... dunno. I'm worried about coming across a bit Southern American hick but, the time she took those pills is a bit close to murder isn't it. The baby could survive if born naturally, and Mrs Wisdom is about that time of pregnancy atm, and it kicks her (and me occasionally!) to buggery, it would feel a lot like killing an actual being now.

And yes, I do appreciate she seems to have had extenuating circumstances with her own issues.

I dunno... anybody able to give me another perspective as to why this sentence is harsh?

fernandopartridge · Jun 15, 2023

I thought the sentence was harsh but the baby was 33 weeks, clearly viable. I'm sorry to say though it sounds a bit like the lockdown contributed insofar as she was able to request the termination remotely where perhaps an in person visit might have established that she was further into the pregnancy than she had said.

David O'Day · Jun 15, 2023

i'll back the bpas verdict on the sentence

skybluetony176 · Jun 15, 2023

Unfortunately it only takes one. Baffling thing is she knew she was pregnant 5 months earlier and had months to come to the decision.

Can’t work it out myself, I’m with NW on this one.

shmmeee · Jun 15, 2023

Funny time and it was another man’s baby wasn’t it? Clearly a crime, but you’d feel there’s a fair few extenuating circumstances.

Otis · Jun 15, 2023

Yeah, I am also in the not sure department.

My missus thinks the punishment is too harsh.

skybluetony176 · Jun 15, 2023

shmmeee said:
Funny time and it was another man’s baby wasn’t it? Clearly a crime, but you’d feel there’s a fair few extenuating circumstances.

I can’t help but wonder if there is mental health issues involved. The judge accepted she was remorseful and haunted by the experience. Doesn’t sound like the behaviour of someone who did it for kicks or the desire to take a life.

shmmeee · Jun 15, 2023

the other thing is obviously two kids now don’t have a Mum got however long. And it’s not like locking her up would prevent her doing it again, unless we have another lockdown, so you’ve got to question the value of a custodial sentence.

Sky Blue Pete · Jun 15, 2023

Jail not an appropriate punishment for me it serves no useful purpose

Clearly the law has been broken and the baby if born would have survived

OffenhamSkyBlue · Jun 15, 2023

There was a woman from BPAS being interviewed about this on the radio earlier in the week, which i thought was a mistake. BPAS clearly had a MAHOOSIVE conflict of interest in this case - they provided her with advice and the prescription (as i understand it) - but they didn't provide sufficient advice telling her she would be breaking the law if she took the tablets beyond 24 weeks. They are potentially complicit in her "crime".
She then claimed that GB has some of the most "Draconian laws" relating to abortion, anywhere in the world. HORSESHIT! I was recently in the southern USA and while we were out there, South Carolina's Governor signed a law outlawing any form of abortion in any circumstances illegal beyond 6 weeks. (NB - this decision was blocked two days later by the state Supreme Court pending a review). Oklahoma has a total ban other than in "some cases" or rape or incest. It's fucking barbaric!

I think our laws are quite liberal - many want the limit to be brought down to 20 or even 16 weeks because of advances in medicine which can mean that survival is possible before 24 weeks. I don't agree - any baby born before about 26 weeks has HUGE ongoing lifelong medical issues in the rare event that they survive.

As for the sentence, it isn't the law itself but the sentencing guidelines that are at fault if we think it is too harsh. I can't help feeling that a community order would have been more appropriate.

Still, a terribly sad case.

clint van damme · Jun 15, 2023

Woman gets abortion in lock down, jail.
Woman embezzles tens of millions in lockdown, sits sipping champagne on her yacht.

clint van damme · Jun 15, 2023

OffenhamSkyBlue said:
There was a woman from BPAS being interviewed about this on the radio earlier in the week, which i thought was a mistake. BPAS clearly had a MAHOOSIVE conflict of interest in this case - they provided her with advice and the prescription (as i understand it) - but they didn't provide sufficient advice telling her she would be breaking the law if she took the tablets beyond 24 weeks. They are potentially complicit in her "crime".
She then claimed that GB has some of the most "Draconian laws" relating to abortion, anywhere in the world. HORSESHIT! I was recently in the southern USA and while we were out there, South Carolina's Governor signed a law outlawing any form of abortion in any circumstances illegal beyond 6 weeks. (NB - this decision was blocked two days later by the state Supreme Court pending a review). Oklahoma has a total ban other than in "some cases" or rape or incest. It's fucking barbaric!

I think our laws are quite liberal - many want the limit to be brought down to 20 or even 16 weeks because of advances in medicine which can mean that survival is possible before 24 weeks. I don't agree - any baby born before about 26 weeks has HUGE ongoing lifelong medical issues in the rare event that they survive.

As for the sentence, it isn't the law itself but the sentencing guidelines that are at fault if we think it is too harsh. I can't help feeling that a community order would have been more appropriate.

Still, a terribly sad case.

You do realise the world is a lot bigger than the UK and a few red neck states in America?

David O'Day · Jun 15, 2023

Isn't the issue that people are talking about is the age of the law she was charged under.

Evo1883 · Jun 15, 2023

Surely at that stage you'd have to give birth to the baby still ?

If this is correct , then she could have given the baby up for adoption ..

She deserves her sentence

OffenhamSkyBlue · Jun 15, 2023

David O'Day said:
Isn't the issue that people are talking about is the age of the law she was charged under.

Possibly, but should it have qualified as the common law offence of infanticide???

Deleted member 5849 · Jun 15, 2023

Sky Blue Pete said:
Jail not an appropriate punishment for me it serves no useful purpose

Clearly the law has been broken and the baby if born would have survived

You see, maybe it's current personal circumstances, but I see 'law being broken' as a massive understatement. I do see it as akin to infanticide. I may not have done a few months ago, I dunno. I hear she showed remorse, but apparently if she'd pleaded guilty earlier, the sentence would have been able to be suspended. So somewhere, there was an opportunity for this case to avoid a jail sentence.

I also see issues with her, but then I look at the sentencing of the kid who was drowned to death. Mother clearly a victim of coercive control, but that doesn't affect her culpability in that case. And yes, there's a bit of false equivalence and how can you compare, but somewhere she's ended a child's life.

I guess I'm on the wrong board(!) but maybe a woman's perspective would give some insight.

Evo1883 · Jun 15, 2023

She gives birth 3 weeks later and kills the baby at home she's given longer than 28 months..

Why is a 3 or 4 week timespan preventing her from being branded a horrible bastard ..because she is

David O'Day · Jun 15, 2023

OffenhamSkyBlue said:
Possibly, but should it have qualified as the common law offence of infanticide???

Doesn't seem to

A prison sentence does no one any good here, even the judge admits that

TomRad85 · Jun 15, 2023

Evo1883 said:
She gives birth 3 weeks later and kills the baby at home she's given longer than 28 months..

Why is a 3 or 4 week timespan preventing her from being branded a horrible bastard ..because she is

I think when you have lost pregnancies you desperately wanted to keep, as I and my wife unfortunately have, it makes things like this seem even more awful.
Should have got longer imo.

Sent from my SM-G973F using Tapatalk

CJ_covblaze · Jun 27, 2023

On the face of it she has got off lightly in terms of her sentence. The evidence is pretty damming. My youngest came 10 weeks early last year and look at him now. There were 23 and 24 weekers in ICU with him who are doing brilliantly now. This and what others have said above (heart really does go out to them) brings it home what she did. That child appears to have been healthy and up to a month further along than him & much further along than a lot of others that go on to live normal lives when she did what she did.

Jail for Woman who took abortion pills (1 Viewer)

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