Kids with their own debit cards (2 Viewers)

Otis · Jul 10, 2019

Just came across something today and it had me thinking.

My daughter has her own debit card and she occasionally uses it when out shopping. But, today I noticed that she signed up for Spotify Premium for £9.99 a month and I wondered how on earth it allowed her to do that, considering she is only 14.

So, I registered myself and put 2004 as my year of birth. It took me straight to the payment page and asked for my debit card details.

So, I went back out and re-registered, this time saying I was 12 and it still, yet again, took me straight to the payment page.

That is quite worrying that 12 year olds, without their parents permission could be setting up contracts for this sort of thing and surely some kids are going to get into debt if this same thing is widespread.

Was everyone else on here already aware?

I have always tried to teach my daughter about being responsible with money and about avoiding debt etc.

Surely this is teaching kids the wrong thing, if they can sign up for financial contracts without their parents' permission.

skybluegnome · Jul 10, 2019

I'm even surprised that kids can have debit cards..Amazing and worrying too.

Otis · Jul 10, 2019

Yeah. My daughter has had one since the age of 11.

It's a Nationwide card, so not quite a debit card.

Otis · Jul 10, 2019

It's called a FlexOne account and like contactless, they can only spend £30 max on it in shops. Online though there are no restrictions.

Otis · Jul 10, 2019

Actually, looking at it, it IS a debit card. It says Visa Debit on the card.

SAJ · Jul 10, 2019

skybluegnome said:
I'm even surprised that kids can have debit cards..Amazing and worrying too.

Why is it worrying? As you can’t go overdrawn on them surely it teaches them the value of money. After all the way it’s going cash is moving towards something of the past.

Otis · Jul 10, 2019

SAJ said:
Why is it worrying? As you can’t go overdrawn on them surely it teaches them the value of money. After all the way it’s going cash is moving towards something of the past.

But this is a monthly contract. That is worrying I would say. It's not like trying to buy an item in a store and finding you don't have money. This is a monthly payment and if kids can see how easy it is to setup I can't see how that is a good thing at all.

It's a recuring monthly payment. It makes it appear more affordable, certainly to a 12 year old.

Sky_Blue_Daz · Jul 10, 2019

My daughter has a go Henry card which we can top up as she needs it
Much prefer her to use that then take money into town

Otis · Jul 10, 2019

Sky_Blue_Daz said:
My daughter has a go Henry card which we can top up as she needs it
Much prefer her to use that then take money into town

Is this the logo?

hill83 · Jul 10, 2019

Otis said:
But this is a monthly contract. That is worrying I would say. It's not like trying to buy an item in a store and finding you don't have money. This is a monthly payment and if kids can see how easy it is to setup I can't see how that is a good thing at all.

It's a recuring monthly payment. It makes it appear more affordable, certainly to a 12 year old.

It you miss a payment with Spotify it reverts back to the free version so isn’t a contract as such. Just an agreement that they will try to take the money each month.

shmmeee · Jul 10, 2019

Learning to manage subscriptions is probably a key financial skill these days TBF. Personally I wouldn’t let mine shop online until I was sure they had a solid grasp of money management. Far too easy to overspend when it’s all on a computer and doesn’t feel real.

Otis · Jul 10, 2019

shmmeee said:
Learning to manage subscriptions is probably a key financial skill these days TBF. Personally I wouldn’t let mine shop online until I was sure they had a solid grasp of money management. Far too easy to overspend when it’s all on a computer and doesn’t feel real.

I didn't know she WAS shopping online. This is the first thing she has ever bought online.

Surely though, 12 year olds shouldn't be subscribing to Spotify and suchlike and agreeing to a financial commitment without their parents' knowledge.

Nick · Jul 10, 2019

Otis said:
I didn't know she WAS shopping online. This is the first thing she has ever bought online.

Surely though, 12 year olds shouldn't be subscribing to Spotify and suchlike and agreeing to a financial commitment without their parents' knowledge.

It's not really a contract like a phone or anything, it's just a recurring payment.

Wyken Sky Blue · Jul 10, 2019

I didn't have a debit card until I was 16 and was working part time.

Until then, I mesmorised my mum's credit card and security details!

Otis · Jul 10, 2019

Nick said:
It's not really a contract like a phone or anything, it's just a recurring payment.

Yeah, that is why I changed it to financial agreement.

SAJ · Jul 10, 2019

Otis said:
But this is a monthly contract. That is worrying I would say. It's not like trying to buy an item in a store and finding you don't have money. This is a monthly payment and if kids can see how easy it is to setup I can't see how that is a good thing at all.

It's a recuring monthly payment. It makes it appear more affordable, certainly to a 12 year old.

Whilst I can see your point, legally an under 18 can’t sign a contract in the UK and it be enforceable, with a very few exceptions.

SkyblueBazza · Jul 10, 2019

Otis said:
It's called a FlexOne account and like contactless, they can only spend £30 max on it in shops. Online though there are no restrictions.

15 shops on a Saturday afternoon...enjoy!!!

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SkyblueBazza · Jul 10, 2019

SAJ said:
Whilst I can see your point, legally an under 18 can’t sign a contract in the UK and it be enforceable, with a very few exceptions.

True - but if there is an automatic overdraft of £50..? It's £50 not budgeted for.

Double-edged sword in fairness...it does help to learn about how easy debt is accumulated by various modern means. I just wonder abput about how in-yer-face & engaging the warnings are for them so young &, in general, more easily influenced ones so young are

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chiefdave · Jul 11, 2019

SAJ said:
Whilst I can see your point, legally an under 18 can’t sign a contract in the UK and it be enforceable, with a very few exceptions.

Spotify’s t&c’s say you are not to sign up if you’re under 18 so they’ve covered themselves that way.

Also debatable if it’s a contract as all you’re actually doing is paying in advance, if you don’t pay you drop down to the free tier. You’re not actually tied in to any minimum term and can’t get in arrears.

Otis · Jul 11, 2019

chiefdave said:
Spotify’s t&c’s say you are not to sign up if you’re under 18 so they’ve covered themselves that way.

Also debatable if it’s a contract as all you’re actually doing is paying in advance, if you don’t pay you drop down to the free tier. You’re not actually tied in to any minimum term and can’t get in arrears.

Yes, interesting that they are saying 18 and yet you can sign up as a 12 year old and very interesting that you can't as an 11 year old. I wished to see how low they had set the bar, so tried, 14 backwards until it would no longer allow me to sign up.

When I put 11 it said I did not meet their age criteria. So why say 18 in their T&C, but then specifically set their system to accept from the age of 12?

Badger · Jul 11, 2019

I think you should contact them, if she entered her real date of birth then surely she should get a refund if it is against their T&Cs. I would put Martin Lewis on copy too.

He has a page about under 18 cards.
Top cards for under-18s

Mr Panda · Jul 11, 2019

Money management should be cirriculum. Kids aside I know so many people my own age who are what I call financially dumb.

Otis · Jul 11, 2019

Mr Panda said:
Money management should be cirriculum. Kids aside I know so many people my own age who are what I call financially dumb.

Agree. It should definitely form part of the curriculum.

Sky Blue Pete · Jul 11, 2019

Shouldn’t be possible to use debit card for direct debits as funds may not be available

Nick · Jul 11, 2019

Sky Blue Pete said:
Shouldn’t be possible to use debit card for direct debits as funds may not be available

It isn't, it is just a recurring payment.

Sky Blue Pete · Jul 11, 2019

Ah ok yep makes sense

Nick said:
It isn't, it is just a recurring payment.

shmmeee · Jul 11, 2019

Otis said:
Agree. It should definitely form part of the curriculum.

It is. When people say this, also with political education, what they mean is “we need to fund citizenship education better and more schools need to employ specialist teachers rather than leaving it to the tutor”

School I was at used to run whole day sessions with Barclays on money management. It’s really bloody hard when kids have no real concept of it though. Like all these things people only tend to listen when they are getting a qualification or need it IRL.

Maybe the answer is a compulsory money management GCSE?

SBAndy · Jul 11, 2019

Sky Blue Pete said:
Shouldn’t be possible to use debit card for direct debits as funds may not be available

Yet if you had to have a credit card to set up direct debits that would open up a whole new world of potential trouble.

Otis · Jul 11, 2019

SBAndy said:
Yet if you had to have a credit card to set up direct debits that would open up a whole new world of potential trouble.

Yes indeed and luckily I have managed to limit my daughter to just the three credit cards and she is only maxed out on the two, so all is good.

shmmeee · Jul 11, 2019

<pedant> Direct Debits are set up with account details not cards </pedant>

rd45 · Jul 11, 2019

My kids (14, 15) have debit cards. They decide how to spend their own pocket money. If they want Spotify or clothes or to download a game or whatever, that’s their choice. They can’t go overdrawn on a kids account, and they’ve long since learned that you can only spend it once. Part of growing up, same as it was for us.

Move along please, nothing to see here.

Otis · Jul 11, 2019

rd45 said:
My kids (14, 15) have debit cards. They decide how to spend their own pocket money. If they want Spotify or clothes or to download a game or whatever, that’s their choice. They can’t go overdrawn on a kids account, and they’ve long since learned that you can only spend it once. Part of growing up, same as it was for us.

Move along please, nothing to see here.

But 14 and 15 is quite different entirely to being 12. At 14 and 15 kids are obviously a lot more mature.

If my daughter had signed up for something at 12 without my knowledge I would not have been happy at all.

Houchens Head · Jul 11, 2019

Credit / Debit cards for kids?? Jeez! My kids didn't get their 2/- pocket money until the last one came down from inside the chimney. Then I inspected it to make sure it was soot free! If there was any residue, they had to pay me 10/- as an apology! Pah! Kids today!

rd45 · Jul 11, 2019

Otis said:
But 14 and 15 is quite different entirely to being 12. At 14 and 15 kids are obviously a lot more mature.

If my daughter had signed up for something at 12 without my knowledge I would not have been happy at all.

Same age as your daughter, no?

There’s no point making stuff up just to be outraged by it.

Otis · Jul 11, 2019

Who's making stuff up?

You can sign up at 12.

Kids with their own debit cards (2 Viewers)

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