New CCFC Info (1 Viewer)

A few hours before the gig? Pathetic attempt at engaging fans.

How very cheesy. Reminds me of that "newswatch " programme on the BBC in which the BBC offer to police themselves in order to fob us off .

I found the bit about utilising CRF's facilities to generate commercial income interesting.
Wonder how that works and just what opportunities are there?

wingy said:

I found the bit about utilising CRF's facilities to generate commercial income interesting.
Wonder how that works and just what opportunities are there?

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I thought that, they have put on a few of those evening meals with type things haven't they? I wonder if it's something like that.

Nick said:

I thought that, they have put on a few of those evening meals with type things haven't they? I wonder if it's something like that.

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Yeah but who becomes the Compass type entity in that arrangement?
How many have they done?
Think CRFC do pretty well on the Commercial side.
Ave attendance last season and this around 1K, turnover £1.3M ish IIRC.
Think I read or heard £600K from commercial activity.
Looks like they could give Wasps a lesson If they had the same Crowd numbers.
Us as well come to that. ;-)

wingy said:

Yeah but who becomes the Compass type entity in that arrangement?
How many have they done?
Think CRFC do pretty well on the Commercial side.
Ave attendance last season and this around 1K, turnover £1.3M ish IIRC.
Think I read or heard £600K from commercial activity.
Looks like they could give Wasps a lesson If they had the same Crowd numbers.
Us as well come to that. ;-)

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Interesting - but I find the whole idea of TF & Joy & associated companies actually funding anything like a revamp of Butts laughable, in that I can't believe it would satisfy their financial wishes in terms of outcome. Sueing whoever, plus the occasional few $M from Maddison, Wilson sell ons in the future is (I sadly suspect) their way of keeping the painful process continuing. It is the one reason I am glad the Ricoh rental period is coming to a head. They MUST do something!

so, Tim doesn't get a directors salary, doesn't get his expenses paid, doesn't have a stake in the club, and in his words, doesn't get paid if the club aren't successful

You have to ask why on earth he is here ?

ccfcway said:

so, Tim doesn't get a directors salary, doesn't get his expenses paid, doesn't have a stake in the club, and in his words, doesn't get paid if the club aren't successful

You have to ask why on earth he is here ?

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He just enjoys pissing us off.

Because he is unable to get any paid work elsewhere?

Only makes me more suspicious of the whole debacle.

No one works for nothing.

matesx said:

Only makes me more suspicious of the whole debacle.

No one works for nothing.

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no only works, but takes flack from everyone for being here.

ccfcway said:

so, Tim doesn't get a directors salary, doesn't get his expenses paid, doesn't have a stake in the club, and in his words, doesn't get paid if the club aren't successful

You have to ask why on earth he is here ?

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Is the question asked anywhere as to whether his company (is it ARVO?) gets any revenue streams from CCFC. If so, is he filling his boots via that direction (i.e indirectly). Like others have said, you and i might offer our services for nothing, as we love the club, but TF? And (if I'm honest), much as I love the club, if I was detested as much as he is for doing the job, I'd walk (so why would he stay?)

wingy said:

I found the bit about utilising CRF's facilities to generate commercial income interesting.
Wonder how that works and just what opportunities are there?

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Rooms for hire.. cheaper than Arena no doubt
http://www.coventryrugby.co.uk/conference-events/

ccfcway said:

so, Tim doesn't get a directors salary, doesn't get his expenses paid, doesn't have a stake in the club, and in his words, doesn't get paid if the club aren't successful

You have to ask why on earth he is here ?

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Look carefully at the question and the answer.

3. Has Mr. Fisher got any money invested in CCFC? If yes, can he confirm the source
of this investment?
Mr Fisher has no investment in CCFC.

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Nothing about ARVO and OTIUM and he may have shares granted to him without payment so there is opportunity to have used weasel words.
I'd be willing to bet he is due a bonus of some kind if certain targets are met, otherwise why would he remain involved?
Bottom line is that this is the wrong question there are better ones to ask.

It was the right question...but at a forum, someone would have come back with "why are you here if you aren't being paid or have a stake in the club"

Captain Dart said:

Look carefully at the question and the answer.

Nothing about ARVO and OTIUM and he may have shares granted to him without payment so there is opportunity to have used weasel words.
I'd be willing to bet he is due a bonus of some kind if certain targets are met, otherwise why would he remain involved?
Bottom line is that this is the wrong question there are better ones to ask.

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His remit will be to get the the p and l sorted out and therefore create a "turnaround". He is cutting costs successfully, but the problem is increasing revenue. If he can pull that one off, then the club could be sellable.

He may be working for a percentage of the sale price. At the moment he stands to gain nothing ( if my speculation is correct) and therefore he will stick around until the "turnaround" is complete. Pure speculation on my part.

Good that he has other projects ;-).

martcov said:

He may be working for a percentage of the sale price.

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What is 50% of nothing ?

Interesting use of a ' in their reply regarding the Trust letter as apposed to quotation marks (")?

11. Mr Fisher is quoted in the minutes of 12th October: “For the record and it is really important – you [the Sky Blue Trust] have sent a letter to SISU to offer to take control of the club...”

Please would Mr Fisher confirm the scale of that offer? In fact, were any terms proposed in the letter from the Trust to Ms Seppala?

Did the Trust actually state that it was proposing to be the Purchaser of Coventry City Football Club?

On 7 October, SISU received a letter from a lawyer on behalf of the Sky Blues Trust. In the letter the SBT requested a meeting to discuss ‘a proposition which could enable SISU to achieve an orderly exit and in turn enable conversion of the club into a fan owned entity...’

It is unclear why it is claimed, therefore, that there was no offer made for SISU to sell the club to the Trust/another fan ownership organisation, and what other agenda could possibly have existed were any such meeting to take place.


Error by the typist or not wanting to commit to quotes just yet?

martcov said:

His remit will be to get the the p and l sorted out and therefore create a "turnaround". He is cutting costs successfully, but the problem is increasing revenue. If he can pull that one off, then the club could be sellable.

He may be working for a percentage of the sale price. At the moment he stands to gain nothing ( if my speculation is correct) and therefore he will stick around until the "turnaround" is complete. Pure speculation on my part.

Good that he has other projects ;-).

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But any idiot can cut costs, you wield the axe culling staff, cut back on expenditure
In all departments and generally shrink the business, that's what he's done.
Surely to do it successfully would be to manage to cut costs but not to the detriment
Of the business, there's no plan in place to drive up revenue.
We are exactly where we would have been if any Tom, Dick, or harry with no business
Experience Had came in and done his job.
I'm not saying it's easy, but he's not upto the job.

So, I presume there must be some sort of requirement for those in charge to engage with fans ?
This is not engaging with the fans, some obscure Q & A session on a website that few read, due primarily to the fact that fans don't believe a word that comes out of TF's mouth.
I can only assume that this is some sort of premeditated manoevre by TF & crew to diarise an attempt at communicating with the fans.
Imho, more bullshit

The thread is headed, 'New CCFC info' & directs me to a site that times me out, wtf is that all about

These papers read like a diversion to me. Look here not over there. They tell you something without telling you nothing. Which does actually tell you something, albeit unintentionally.

It tells you that the pressure is working. Keep the protest going, keep drawing attention to our plight and the mismanagement of the club by SISU and TF, keep digging for any info on them and when you find it tell everyone as the attention is clearly unwelcome.

I always said it's not one protest or one piece of info that's going to break them, it's going to be a sustained attack and this tells me it's working.

I'm confused about the debt figures ( probably not the only one) as part of keeping ownership it was agreed that 61 million of debt would be wiped out. This was done in the form of a transfer to shares. Yet a couple of years later we owe 28 million to Sisu and another 6 million to Arvo or another company. How?

SkyBlueScottie said:

I'm confused about the debt figures ( probably not the only one) as part of keeping ownership it was agreed that 61 million of debt would be wiped out. This was done in the form of a transfer to shares. Yet a couple of years later we owe 28 million to Sisu and another 6 million to Arvo or another company. How?

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The £28M is never going to be paid back, that was the original failed investment, it can be considered written off as it will only be paid after ARVO debts. It just sits on the books, ignore it.
Arvo I'm sure are looking for an exit with a profit on the ~£10M they invested (£8M on books plus £2M converted to "£14M" preference shares).
I estimate their price is approx. ~£12M to emerge with a profit and Seppala's fiscal reputation intact.

"The club has agreed in principle a joint venture with CRL at BPA to generate non- match day revenues. At this time, both clubs are working through the finer detail of the operating model."

Can anyone explain what he meant by this, who are CRL?
I believe BPA is Butts Park Arena, so what the hell is he talking about?

SkyBlueRuffian said:

"The club has agreed in principle a joint venture with CRL at BPA to generate non- match day revenues. At this time, both clubs are working through the finer detail of the operating model."

Can anyone explain what he meant by this, who are CRL?
I believe BPA is Butts Park Arena, so what the hell is he talking about?

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Coventry Rugby Limited?

Am just guessing here.

As Tony says, I think the pressure is working, but also as someone else stated; it's a 'look here, not over there' too.

Player sale in Jan is inevitable. Player acquisition is a maybe. If we don't bring anyone in we are getting relegated though.

I can also see no further negotiations happening with the Ricoh, which means they will move us back to Northampton again without hesitation. In fact, i'm certain it's going to happen.

TF brilliant politician.ccfc no future.

Now we know why this came out yesterday, to deflect attention from SISU losing the JR.

Earlsdon_Skyblue1 said:

As Tony says, I think the pressure is working, but also as someone else stated; it's a 'look here, not over there' too.

Player sale in Jan is inevitable. Player acquisition is a maybe. If we don't bring anyone in we are getting relegated though.

I can also see no further negotiations happening with the Ricoh, which means they will move us back to Northampton again without hesitation. In fact, i'm certain it's going to happen.

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This club just about survived the move to Northampton, survived but has never
Really recovered, if we move again I think the game will be up.

Brylowes said:

This club just about survived the move to Northampton, survived but has never
Really recovered, if we move again I think the game will be up.

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We may not need to move for further fallout IMO
The effects of just once are still rippling through.

So what keeps TF here if he is not even paid expenses. The question printed doesn't cover all the bases does it nor does the one about investment. Has he investment in Sconset or ARVO, directly or indirectly or does he act for clients, associates who have and gets remunerated that way? Could it haver anything to do with all directors fees having been paid to third parties 2015,2014 per the accounts

Written confirmations - this is an interesting link as to their worth
http://www.onhandcounsel.co.uk/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=66:what-comfort-is-a-comfort-letter-recent-case&catid=7:doingbusiness&Itemid=29

So operational loss in 2016 for Otium is 1.7m? that still doesn't account for the interest charges. After player sales profits in 2015 the loss was 1.1m per the accounts so how did it show profits of £400k ? how can the reply be correct? Doesn't what he says indicate player trading profits in 2016 of 2.4m - was it all in cash has it all been received? was that all Maddison ?

Question 6 was about revenues not cost savings, so actually TF hasn't answered the question. Have revenues grown? If they haven't then any improvement is down to cost cutting and our biggest cost is wages.........

Mediation only works if all sides want it to, not sure Wasps or CCC want to right now - I think they prefer to tighten the screw. That said SISU/CCFC have always left things to the last minute so is it really high on their agenda? All sides playing brinksmanship for their own agendas if you ask me - mediation any time soon very unlikely

So looks like there will be players to be sold to cover the operational losses again especially if attendance targets are being missed

Not sure why the opening of just the one stand for a crowd of 1000 was queried - makes sense for the club to do exactly that - they still made a loss even so

So finally they have twigged it is possible to put on events away from the home ground. So what has stopped them doing this years ago (or even hiring space at the Ricoh ) to raise income from non match day sources? (I suspect I know the answers). Joint ventures do not give the club 100% of the income, how big can the events at CRL be and that affects the amount of cash it could provide doesn't it?

Given past history it would be quite easy to believe no alternative training ground or stadium has been identified wouldn't it

What is it at Ryton that makes it unsuitable? If they have to buy replacement before selling who bridges that finance? Do Sport England require improved or straight replacement?

I would think given the ages of the squad that we are within the SCMP budget. However is there cash available to spend given the overall budget of the club can not be being met. If cash not available then to be self sufficient means what ever the SCMP budget nothing can be spent.

Given we are losing 4 or 5 players in January and the possible need to sell to cover losses then the manager has to bring in players doesn't he ? and may have to play around with budgets to do it. It is cash being available that is key not the SCMP budget

I am curious as to why the enquiry by the Trust gets such a hostile reaction - what else is going on? it was an offer to discuss a possible way out for SISU, all they needed to say was the club is not for sale - I think TF protests too much

But what actual progress has been made with the Academy situation - seems to me none

assumption of extension is interesting given how little CCFC contribute %age wise to Wasps turnover. CCFC are no longer the must have there. Still they push the new stadium and access to non matchday income - means that Wasps have to plan future without CCFC and take anything they can get as a bonus

Strange they appear to be able to drive forward the Ryton situation but little else?

SISU seems pretty litigation based to me

So Ms Deering represents the shareholders interests - Sconset, ARVO & Brody? and is a paid employee of SISU (we knew that didn't we). Not unusual no but why do it now, why wasn't someone from SISU on the Board years ago?

The original private equity funds are no longer shareholders. If it is unlikely to be repaid in the next 12 months why is it classed as due in under 1 year? Surely the directors know that? Has the loan switched to Sconset - as I said elsewhere I would guess it sits in Sconsets books at nothing like £28m. In any case the Club never received 28m in cash from Sconset or the original funds

It makes it seem that £15m of preference shares issued is an influx of capital/ cash - it isn't it is capitalisation of existing loans/interest and the capitalisation of old debt of CCFC H that for some reason was reintroduced in to Otium - have never understood why the FL would insist on the last bit. The preference shares put a barrier up to any sale so why do it?

So no change in capital structure but there is new loans - which is it. We know of a new loan in 2015 accounts it seems there is another in 2016?

Cant help thinking that the questions were made to match the answers. It is also a useful way of not actually getting challenged on the replies isn't it

As always there is truth in the replies ....... but

and yes it is TF, yes it is analysing what he said, but he is the one running CCFC isn't he and we are CCFC fans are we not?

ccfcway said:

so, Tim doesn't get a directors salary, doesn't get his expenses paid, doesn't have a stake in the club, and in his words, doesn't get paid if the club aren't successful

You have to ask why on earth he is here ?

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Whare dose tim get his pay packet from ?