Duffer...can you do us a favour...sign up and post that on their forum. The don't have a clue. One guy suggested we could come back on 3 assumptions - no Sisu, 500K rent and no access to F+B money.
Absolutely deluded...
Stay at St Andrews Fuck the Ricoh off
Once and for all build the stadium we will all have the final laugh when wasps are bust & the council are left with that empty ground
They're just not getting it on the Wasps forum, are they? Unless I've completely misunderstood the club agreed to cease legal action, but the complaint to the EU cannot be dropped.
The sticking point then became Wasps insistence on an indemnity clause, in case Coventry City Council were found to have acted incorrectly in their sale to Wasps.
Let me just say that again, because I can't believe that anyone should be able to misunderstand this, or support it.
Wasps want CCFC to cover the costs of the Council's maladministration, should they be found by a completely independent arbiter to have acted incorrectly.
To me, that's akin to buying a stolen car from somebody, being obliged to hand it back or pay proper value, and then expecting the original owner to refund you for your losses because he reported the crime.
If wasps have nothing to hide then they shouldn’t be botheredDon’t really want to get into this again, but that’s not quite accurate. Sisu agreed to stop legal action against Wasps, Wasps wanted all legal action aimed at reversing the Ricoh sale stopped, that was one reason. The talks started because Wasps thought Sisu had agreed to the latter but hadnt. The indemnity was another reason.
It’s my belief that the indemnity isn’t for the costs recovered by the council either. State aid cases aim to restore the market to how it was, not punish anyone. Any resolution that put Wasps out of business wouldn’t meet that aim, similarly surely any resolution would take into account such an indemnity otherwise its pointless.
I believe it’s about indemnity from future action against Wasps that a successful state aid case might open up. A subtle difference. One that may not make a difference to your opinion of the request, but still.
Again, why so reckless? We’re still in a delicate position.
I’ll be honest the biggest hope is the land. I couldn’t see where we could’ve built and believe me I’ve looked.
But it’s still Sisu. Warwick will be taking them on their word just like anyone else. Sisus record of partnerships isn’t exactly spotless. They’ve still got a lot to prove. Warwicks presence doesn’t really change that, it’s not like they’ve got some superpower if due diligence previous organisations that have partnered with them were lacking.
Logic and reason went out the window some time ago. All emotions now.
Again, why so reckless? We’re still in a delicate position.
I don't know how common the surname Maton is in Coventry. I had an uncle Arthur Maton (long since dead) who married one of my mum's sisters before or during WW2. I hope that I'm not related to this councillor clown.
Speedy recovery!Can only make a these comments
Encouraging words from the club. But nothing more. They haven't even formed the partnership yet. The descriptions cover all the good concepts don't they. Sorry for being cynical. that said a stadium would be great.
Why now. Can't help thinking careful timing
Still yet to be convinced it is the financial panacea put forward by the club. They go on about incomes but ignore the costs.
Sounds to me like uni will own freehold and club group will build the stadium and own the bricks and mortar. No problem with that
Have made comments before that building a stadium capable of being expanded meanings the ground works (the expensive part) has to be based on the largest size envisaged. £30m seems light to me, build in capital finance costs and restricted incomes until built I would have thought cost to be over £50m for a basic stadium. Put in other elements and costs increase. Not going going to do more detailed analysis I am recuperating from major operation for next couple of weeks.
Why doesn't the uni build the additional student accommodation? Then take the income? The uni can access cheap finance
The travel plans are good but what's the timeline for that let alone the stadium. The travel stuff will happen nothing to do with the stadium project really but it would certainly help. So no cost to the club. Looks good on press release though
I don't share the notion that the announcement has got to be more valid because the uni put their name to it. Reality is the uni isn't damaged if it does or if it doesn't happen. The proposal requires follow through from our owners and that cannot be provided until tangible evidence is provided. Clearly the uni want to develop the site but there are options and they are prepared to consider this one.
I think this means next season at least in Birmingham
Don't misunderstand this is positive news and to be welcomed but right now it far too vague and early for me to be excited by it ...... even if I could almost walk to it !
That's me lot doctors orders
Don’t really want to get into this again, but that’s not quite accurate. Sisu agreed to stop legal action against Wasps, Wasps wanted all legal action aimed at reversing the Ricoh sale stopped, that was one reason. The talks started because Wasps thought Sisu had agreed to the latter but hadnt. The indemnity was another reason.
It’s my belief that the indemnity isn’t for the costs recovered by the council either. State aid cases aim to restore the market to how it was, not punish anyone. Any resolution that put Wasps out of business wouldn’t meet that aim, similarly surely any resolution would take into account such an indemnity otherwise its pointless.
I believe it’s about indemnity from future action against Wasps that a successful state aid case might open up. A subtle difference. One that may not make a difference to your opinion of the request, but still.
Duffer...can you do us a favour...sign up and post that on their forum. The don't have a clue. One guy suggested we could come back on 3 assumptions - no Sisu, 500K rent and no access to F+B money.
Absolutely deluded...
AwfulModular stadium makes me think of below. Here in the US. This is the $60million USD stadium Miami built as their temporary home in Fort Lauderdale until they can build their long term stadium in Miami proper
View attachment 15974
I don't know how common the surname Maton is in Coventry. I had an uncle Arthur Maton (long since dead) who married one of my mum's sisters before or during WW2. I hope that I'm not related to this councillor clown.
We’d really, really struggle to compete at Championship level with St Andrews crowds.Stay at St Andrews Fuck the Ricoh off
Once and for all build the stadium we will all have the final laugh when wasps are bust & the council are left with that empty ground
We’d really, really struggle to compete at Championship level with St Andrews crowds.
We’d really, really struggle to compete at Championship level with St Andrews crowds.
But less jam if they put the transport links in. That's crazy! ;-)Yeah I agree. It’s another promise of jam tomorrow after six+ years of broken promises. But come on, enjoy the speculation for what it is.
But with the stadium announcement and whatever the reason is why we aren't at the Ricoh don't you think more people would go than last season (especially with the bigger games)
Fair point, but two things to add here.
The complaint to the EU was and is not legal action, and it cannot be dropped,
I'd never picked up that Wasps were asking for indemnity against future legal action on the back of a successful complaint. I'm not saying you're wrong, but I'd be genuinely interested to see where you got that from?
It’s supposition though a good question to ask if anyone from wasps would answerDon’t really want to get into this again, but that’s not quite accurate. Sisu agreed to stop legal action against Wasps, Wasps wanted all legal action aimed at reversing the Ricoh sale stopped, that was one reason. The talks started because Wasps thought Sisu had agreed to the latter but hadnt. The indemnity was another reason.
It’s my belief that the indemnity isn’t for the costs recovered by the council either. State aid cases aim to restore the market to how it was, not punish anyone. Any resolution that put Wasps out of business wouldn’t meet that aim, similarly surely any resolution would take into account such an indemnity otherwise its pointless.
I believe it’s about indemnity from future action against Wasps that a successful state aid case might open up. A subtle difference. One that may not make a difference to your opinion of the request, but still.
I'm sure that is a factor and I hope the Uni isn't a pawn in this grand game of chess.Well it means the EFL will let us play at a ground for a few more years outside Coventry I guess
Fair point, but two things to add here.
The complaint to the EU was and is not legal action, and it cannot be dropped,
I'd never picked up that Wasps were asking for indemnity against future legal action on the back of a successful complaint. I'm not saying you're wrong, but I'd be genuinely interested to see where you got that from? To me, indemnity is a cover against possible costs, and that's different from a promise not to take further legal action.
I'm also not sure if it would make much difference to my opinion, but it's a fair question. My gut feel is still along the lines that if Wasps suffer financially because of the Council's incompetence, and there's a case to answer in the courts, then that case should be heard and it isn't for Wasps to try to put a stop to it.
The announcement is written words, the only step we’ve taken with new stadiums is gaining an organisation’s signature, That’s it. When, if, construction starts and people actually have something to believe, you’ll see more bums on seats in Birmingham. Shouldn’t matter anyway, we should be back at the Ricoh short or long term, and ‘Stans’ (cringe) a thing of the past.
Sorry think I’m not explaining well.
Two points broke down negotiations:
1)“The legals”. Wasps agreed to ignore the state aid complaint and made it a prerequisite of negotiations that Sisu agree to stop and future legal action *related to reversing the sale* (not the state aid complaint but anything going forward). Sisu sent a letter that seemed to promise that and talks started. However there was confusion and what Sisu were agreeing to was to not have any legal action *against Wasps* (not ruling our action against say the council or anyone else). Wasps weren’t happy with this loophole. Sisu weren’t willing to give up the opportunity for future legal recourse (describes by them in their statement as “limiting the clubs legal rights” or something, Wasps go into the detail)
2) “The Indemnity”. According to Sisu Wasps asked to be indemnified against future legal claims that may result from the successful state aid complaint. As I said that’s not direct as the EC will know about any indemnity and take it into account. It’s my understanding that’s about potential future claims off the back of a successful state aid complaint. Basically an extension to the previous request to not do any more legal action to reverse the sale of the Ricoh (as technically that wouldn’t be about reversing the sale but recompense for it it wouldn’t be covered by 1)
Wasps don’t mention 2 in their statement, possibly because they view it as part of 1, possibly because they think it’ll look bad, possibly because Sisu made it up. Choose your weapon based on your stance in this argument I guess.
Mate, do you really believe that sisu made up the indemnity... Jesus fucking Christ you have said some whopers on here before but that is the best bar none
If it didn't exist wasps would have said so, end of story
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