Portsmouth- what on earth (4 Viewers)

Jackoskyblue · Jul 20, 2012

Pompey on the brink of closure says on sky sports website today more redundancies are needed to survive. What a mess they are in

Astute · Jul 20, 2012

But I keep hearing on here that a club as big as us or Pompey will never fold as there will always be someone willing to pick up the pieces....

PhilWasn'tBabb · Jul 20, 2012

It happen to a club as big as Rangers ... Scottish league prejudice aside they've got a lot of fans that follow them home and away.

The same thing could happen to Portsmouth..... it almost need too now..

I'mARealWizard · Jul 21, 2012

If they do fold, surely that means one less place for relegation this season?

Our chances of staying up are improving!

mark82 · Jul 21, 2012

Portsmouth could fold but they wouldn't disappear. They would be reformed somewhere down the league system.

Sub · Jul 21, 2012

would there have to be a vote to see who would take there place if they did fold? they did the same thing when rangers went out of the SPL:thinking about:

torchomatic · Jul 21, 2012

@Tankie. Now this is what I'd call being in the last chance saloon.

mark82 · Jul 21, 2012

Sub said:
would there have to be a vote to see who would take there place if they did fold? they did the same thing when rangers went out of the SPL:thinking about:

No. I think at this late stage there would just be a team less in the division. Leagues would then have one less relegation place down to whichever league Portsmouth were readmitted to next season. Think it would be too late for them to reform this season.

hamil99 · Jul 21, 2012

mark82 said:
No. I think at this late stage there would just be a team less in the division. Leagues would then have one less relegation place down to whichever league Portsmouth were readmitted to next season. Think it would be too late for them to reform this season.

I remember reading an article a while back saying that Celtic had put themselves forward to take the place of any football club that defunct in the English football league. Could they take portsmouths place?

Stevec189 · Jul 21, 2012

mark82 said:
No. I think at this late stage there would just be a team less in the division. Leagues would then have one less relegation place down to whichever league Portsmouth were readmitted to next season. Think it would be too late for them to reform this season.

Or one extra promotion place? Surely that is a better way to go?

RichieGunns · Jul 21, 2012

Yeh but they'd still have to start from conference and work their way up. Same as Rangers are now since being dumped out of the SPL. I think they'd walk most of those leagues though. Give them a few seasons and they'd be in league 1. It would have a nasty effect on their gate receipts though for a time!

PhilWasn'tBabb · Jul 21, 2012

hamil99 said:
I remember reading an article a while back saying that Celtic had put themselves forward to take the place of any football club that defunct in the English football league. Could they take portsmouths place?

I think this is unlikely in this day and age. The big stumbling block would be FIFA (corrupt bastards that they are) They would stand in the way of any move for a cross country league. Whilst there are currently example of this they are all historic.

Jackoskyblue · Jul 22, 2012

Ben Haim's wages could liquidate the club in weeks he's on £36 k a week !! And refuses to take a pay cut or leave

skybluegod · Jul 22, 2012

http://www1.skysports.com/football/news/11719/7926264/Ben-Haim-puts-Pompey-on-brink

Who would come up and play in there place ?

RichieGunns · Jul 22, 2012

Asked when the club will fold if an agreement is not reached, Birch added: "We are two or three weeks away.

Bloody hell they wont even make the new season at this rate :/

As for which club to bring up to replace them, Cheltenham Town would probably be the most viable as they were the ones that lost the playoff final to Crewe Alexandra in may.

Still, thats crazy! I can't believe Ben Haim will be the reason Portsmouth fold. And the sad thing is, if he refuses to lower his wages, he'll end up with nothing when the club goes under!

Sub · Jul 22, 2012

thing is tho it will make ben haim a legend in southampton !!!

RichieGunns · Jul 22, 2012

Sub said:
thing is tho it will make ben haim a legend in southampton !!!

How come? Cause Southampton hate Portsmouth?

Oh and it means that all those players Portsmouth had on trial will be looking for new clubs again...still recon we could get Brian Howard? lol

Sub · Jul 22, 2012

RichieGunns said:
How come? Cause Southampton hate Portsmouth?

Oh and it means that all those players Portsmouth had on trial will be looking for new clubs again...still recon we could get Brian Howard? lol

yes for that simple point not that it is right tho

hamil99 · Jul 22, 2012

PhilWasn'tBabb said:
I think this is unlikely in this day and age. The big stumbling block would be FIFA (corrupt bastards that they are) They would stand in the way of any move for a cross country league. Whilst there are currently example of this they are all historic.

Cardiff and Swansea play cross country leagues, surely they must of switched at some point, why not Celtic?

RichieGunns · Jul 22, 2012

Sub said:
yes for that simple point not that it is right tho

I agree with you there.

I was appalled when i read a Sunderland Thread a few months back before we got relegated.

They were baying for our blood, just because we happened to be the team that managed to avoid relegation while they themselves were relegated on two seperate occassions.

Yes one of those times was the infermous Jimmy Hill event where he delayed the game by 15 minutes but the mans a legend so i don't care lol

The other time we beat Tottenham and they failed to beat Everton so they had themselves to blame for that one.

Still seeing someone turn round and say

I'll be throwing a street party when they get relegated and when they finally cease to exist im going to go and dance on their grave in celebration

And another said

Might as well bulldoze the whole city while we're at it. Its nothing to our country but a waste of space and has never been important in the slightest. I'll even drive the bulldozer

Funny that our city got specifically targetted by the Germans...i think that proves it was (and in my opinion still is) an important city in this country but tell that to those vindictive bastards!

Couldn't believe people could hold a grudge like that for 30 years though *shakes head*

blueflint · Jul 22, 2012

RichieGunns said:
I agree with you there.

I was appalled when i read a Sunderland Thread a few months back before we got relegated.

They were baying for our blood, just because we happened to be the team that managed to avoid relegation while they themselves were relegated on two seperate occassions.

Yes one of those times was the infermous Jimmy Hill event where he delayed the game by 15 minutes but the mans a legend so i don't care lol

The other time we beat Tottenham and they failed to beat Everton so they had themselves to blame for that one.

Still seeing someone turn round and say

And another said

Funny that our city got specifically targetted by the Germans...i think that proves it was (and in my opinion still is) an important city in this country but tell that to those vindictive bastards!

Couldn't believe people could hold a grudge like that for 30 years though *shakes head*

they are the scum of the country pleased to say all makems not like them

PhilWasn'tBabb · Jul 22, 2012

We've all know about the issue with tal ben haim wages for some time.

The interest note for me was that they have maximum wage for £5k a week. Richard Wood aside it would be interesting to know how that compares with ourselves.

It seam like a lot of money for a club in there position.

Sky Blues · Jul 22, 2012

RichieGunns said:
I can't believe Ben Haim will be the reason Portsmouth fold. And the sad thing is, if he refuses to lower his wages, he'll end up with nothing when the club goes under!

Or maybe the reason Pompey could fold is that they agreed a contract to pay Ben Haim and others that money. I guess if it was Coventry I'd be peeved if a player was stubbornly holding to his contract in a situation like that but, objectively, is it wrong that a player is holding a club to the contract it signed? Clubs often moan when players don't honour their contracts.

BurbageSkyBlues · Jul 22, 2012

To me, it's an example of the selfishness and greed that is ruining football today. He expects premiership wages from an insolvent club in league 1, and he is prepared to push to the limit in order to get his piece of the cake.

I wonder what this is doing to his 'employability', even on more realistic (reduced) wage, that reflects his worth.

Clearly, not a team player.

Sky Blues · Jul 22, 2012

BurbageSkyBlues said:
To me, it's an example of the selfishness and greed that is ruining football today. He expects premiership wages from an insolvent club in league 1, and he is prepared to push to the limit in order to get his piece of the cake.

I wonder what this is doing to his 'employability', even on more realistic (reduced) wage, that reflects his worth.

Clearly, not a team player.

I agree it maybe greed now, but Pompey agreed to pay those stupid wages and appears to have failed to put in relegation clauses. They were living in a fantasy premier land and reality has come back to bite them hard. Sorry, I just struggle to have any sympathy for this club. Did you see them pleading for the 2010 CVA people to help them out the other day? Incredible chutzpah!

RichieGunns · Jul 22, 2012

Agree with both points - on the one side there's the greed of the players in today's game. Unfortunately that was created when the maximum player wage was scrapped though I don't think Jimmy Hill thought at the time that it could have got so out of hand like it has.

Then there's the fact that Pompey were stupid enough to offer those wages and even stupider to not put relegation clauses on their contracts. They thought they'd stay in the premiership for ever but unfortunately that wasn't to be and now they face being folded up because of their mistakes.

As for Ben Haim I think most clubs will stay well clear of him in this country after this little fiasco. I can probably see him heading back to Europe but even then he probably won't get the money he wants...

But my question is, even faced with all these issues, whether self inflicted or through player stupidity, how can portsmouth continue to take of trialists that they realistically can't afford and continue the way they have since relegation without trying to a least instigate some of the measures SISU have at this club...?

Sky Blues · Jul 22, 2012

If that's right about £5k a week I am shocked but, given the history of the club, not surprised. Even if they squeeze more revenue out of their fans than us I'd be amazed if their finances could stretch to paying players £260,000 a year! *shakes head*

Astute · Jul 22, 2012

They need to pay their football debts to continue. Have a feeling it could be bye bye Pompey

oakey · Jul 23, 2012

Am I right in thinking that their remaining contracted players become free agents in the event of the club being liquidated?
If so why would clubs sign them now? Why not wait until the club go under?
As others have said Pompey have brought this situation on themselves but the football authorities are guilty of poorly regulating the game. They do not wish to put on a wage cap as they prefer a free Market. Yet they have brought in the new rule which limits spending. What is also needed to prevent the big clubs collecting players on ridiculous salaries is to also limit the size of squads of all league clubs. This would drive down wages in the lower leagues as out of contract players would be forced to accept realistic wages once the big clubs' squads were full. No transfers of players under 18 should be allowed without a large fee or mutual consent to waive it.

Astute · Jul 23, 2012

All of their players on high wages are available on a free. This is so they can get them off the wage bill. But players like Haim don't want to go anywhere as they wouldn't get anywhere near as much elsewhere. Haim is on 35k a week. But if they don't pay him they go out of business. Nobody wants to take them over wit a wagebill like that knowing it must be paid.

Paxman II · Jul 23, 2012

ben haim will understand that if pompey fold then he gets nothing and is out of a job. Either he finds himself a club quickly or suffers the consequencies. I suggest he would in the interim be wise to settle, stay fit, carry on playing and keep looking for a new club.

As for pompey. No club should have done what they did first time never mind a second time. This club should be liquidated. It's just a disgrace to use existing laws to bend the rules and try and stay afloat. Think they will fold b4 we start the first game.

chiefdave · Jul 23, 2012

if you read between the lines the issue with the players they're trying to offload isn't really that they won't move to another club on lower wages and more that Pompey don't want to pay the deferred wages. The players haven't been getting their full whack for a while and they want the balance when they leave. Their thinking seems to be (or at least their advisors) that should the worst come to the worst they would be classed as football creditors and would get the money directly from the PL / FL out of the parachute payments Pompey are due to get.

ccfcway · Jul 23, 2012

well that would make a lot more sense. how many more years are pompy due parachute paymemts ?

chiefdave · Jul 23, 2012

Don't know for sure but the figure of £6m is being thrown around. At the moment that's supposed to go to one of the former owners under the last CVA but the theory is the PL, FL and PFA will get together and divert that money direct to the players. Of course while Pompey are making lots of statements about players demands and refusal to take pay cuts they're not actually saying how much they're offering them. The players must think they're going to get considerably more if they hold out. Bear in mind a lot of those players won't get another big payday so there's no real incentive for them to accept a low offer to enable a move elsewhere. From the looks of things Kanu has quit and claimed breach of contract and already applied to be a football creditior for his outstanding wages.

skybluebeduff · Jul 23, 2012

Portsmouth administrator Trevor Birch has warned that the club could be liquidated within the next fortnight.

The League One club are trying to negotiate with eight senior players, but their refusal to compromise over wage demands has left Pompey on the brink of extinction.

Nwankwo Kanu has also lodged a claim for £3million in back pay and Birch says it is the players who have the future of Pompey in their hands.

"The club is heading for liquidation in just a few weeks, perhaps two weeks if these players don't leave or compromise on their wages," Birch said.

"The problem with everybody is that this club has cried wolf so often that no one believes it will happen, no one believes they will go out of business, but they will in two or three weeks."
Trevor Birch
Quotes of the week
'Portsmouth fatigue'

"We still have players like Ben Haim, Dave Kitson and Kanu on our books.

"Kanu has served the club notice that he wants to leave but before doing so he wants the money he says is owed to him by the club. These players hold the survival of the club in their hands.

"I must stress it is not their fault as the players didn't get the club into this trouble, but they do now have the ability to get the club out of this mess.

"The problem with everybody is that this club has cried wolf so often that no one believes it will happen, no one believes they will go out of business, but they will in two or three weeks.

"It is that serious now. The trouble is 'Portsmouth fatigue', but the truth is that the club is now fighting for its life."

Portsmouth- what on earth (4 Viewers)

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