Possible Takeover (1 Viewer)

skybluetony176 · Sep 17, 2016

robbiekeane said:
Most of it, if in understand right, is in the form of "loans" from SISU/ARVO when they have been subsidising losses and when they threw a bit of money at us in the first few years. And probably some left from when they bought us

I think that they had to write off the historical debt from before they arrived as part of the agreement with the FL to transfer the golden share. Could be wrong and happy to be corrected by I believe that the current debt is all been collated since their arrival. The historical debt was in ltd and got transferred to Otium in the administration process but the FL insisted it was written off before the golden share was transferred IIRC. The only favour that the FL did the club through the whole shoddy mess.

skybluetony176 · Sep 17, 2016

shmmeee said:
What's left anyway?

I don't think a white knight is waiting, heard it too much over the years. But if there was. Worst case scenario is we lose Ryton (isn't it still mortgaged or was that paid off?). We basically sign a new team every season anyway, have no long term commitments on our ground or academy. A new owner could either start talks with Wasps/Higgs/Council or actually carry out Sisu's supposed plan and build an integrated facility. Basically what Sisu could do now if they could be arsed.

The only real issue is the debt and that's entirely up to Sisu to come up with a figure. I suspect they won't give up until every legal avenue has been exhausted, I suspect it's personal now and not about business because I can see no scenario short of the two I've mentioned to move the club forward. And Sisu clearly don't have the stomach for either negotiation or investment.

That's pretty much bang on I think.

Captain Dart · Sep 17, 2016

Bruce the Boot said:
I suppose the true value of the club is the Golden share

More than that. Goodwill (zero at present but will return with new owners), heritage (don't scoff this club has far more than most of the clubs in the Championship) , location (one of the largest cities in England, hopefully about to enter a resurgent period with inward investment from JLR & others) and POTENTIAL, a well run and adequately financed club could repeat the successes of the Jimmy Hill era. The question is how deep does the systemic rot inside the club go it needs totally new management (and I mean off field as much as the playing side).

rupert_bear · Sep 17, 2016

The thing is which ever way we look at it presently sisu are up against the cushion and behind the black ball, they have no ground in 18 months, which seriously devalues their asset, the landlord won't talk to them with these legals going on, I think both sets of heels are dug in there, the court case isn't until December I believe with the result in the New Year, if and when they do get the landlord around the table sisu are a bit at their mercy, what if the landlord wants treble the current rent and up front bearing in mind the sisu record withholding rent, think I would. That's real money sisu will have to find, but if they don't over their shoulder are Coventry United just think we could end up there, no debts and current debts stay with our owner. In my opinion we are ripe for selling.

AFCCOVENTRY · Sep 17, 2016

There is no appeal for a buyer to purchase CCFC.

Regardless of the size of this city, we are a poorly supported club. Even in the premiership we struggled to sell out every game at Highfield Rd.

We don't own our stadium or even have a decent rental agreement long term.

We are in Division 3.

Club is in debt to Sisu now. Nobody will match the debt Sisu are loading up.

Lord_Nampil · Sep 17, 2016

AFCCOVENTRY said:
There is no appeal for a buyer to purchase CCFC.

Regardless of the size of this city, we are a poorly supported club. Even in the premiership we struggled to sell out every game at Highfield Rd.

We don't own our stadium or even have a decent rental agreement long term.

We are in Division 3.

Club is in debt to Sisu now. Nobody will match the debt Sisu are loading up.

unless some one sees an opportunity, where money isnt an issue and think hummm i could also invest in the city as well! If Bristol Rovers have an owner like that why doesn't some one come and in for us.... Not having a stadium IMO isn't the problem its being able to build a new stadium within the city i'm sure there are investors out there who would be willing to do it, and also aim to take us forward! The far east arrival of owners has opened the door to money meaning nothing.......

christonabike · Sep 17, 2016

It could be the Wasps chairman has stated they havent got the cash to spend to make us a success so...
1. Wasps refuse to sign a new rental agreement which puts Sisu in a no escape scenario.
2. The person mentioned by Wasps chairman has already discussed a deal for renting the Ricoh ahead of any take over.
3. Wasps secure a tenant to share costs of the Ricoh with a possibility of buying it back from them in the future if Wasps choose to move again.
Win win but as stated it could be all pie in the sky but its gone very quiet form Joy etc recently.

rupert_bear · Sep 17, 2016

One thing for certain I think there's plenty going on behind the scenes sometimes I get the feeling the silence is deafening. The Wasp owner may just be prepared to let us rot which I doubt. That Ricoh arena with a top flight rugby team and a Premier league outfit (us) could be an absolute goldmine, I wouldn't be surprised if that scenario hasn't been put to someone. Here's one for you all, I was told by somebody in the Wasp owners company that he said about the Leicester success no reason why that shouldn't happen here !

chiefdave · Sep 17, 2016

skybluetony176 said:
I assume you mean £15M with the debt wiped clean?

Of course, the club itself when it is eventually sold will be for the infamous £1. The more important detail will be what is happening with the debt.

Although what could happen is SISU could sell the club with the debt still in place and then request payments which we aren't currently making.

Samo · Sep 17, 2016

I have thought for some time that there may be someone who has already spoken to and built relationships with CCC, Wasps, etc waiting in the wings. Maybe agreements are already in place?
I can imagine all parties releasing statements about a positive new relationship with the club after regime change is achieved.
SISU will not quietly though I fear.

skybluetony176 · Sep 17, 2016

chiefdave said:
Of course, the club itself when it is eventually sold will be for the infamous £1. The more important detail will be what is happening with the debt.

Although what could happen is SISU could sell the club with the debt still in place and then request payments which we aren't currently making.

Can't see anyone doing the latter. That would make our takeover more expensive than Wolves.

chiefdave · Sep 17, 2016

skybluetony176 said:
Can't see anyone doing the latter. That would make our takeover more expensive than Wolves.

But that's the danger with trying to push them out. It doesn't follow that they just walk away and write the debt off.

Supposing they do walk, nobody comes forward to buy so the club goes into administration. It would be a very different administration process to last time, or indeed the pseudo-administration that led to the arrival of SISU. This time it would be about maximising the return and if nobody comes forward with a proposal that SISU deem acceptable it would be a fire sale of everything we have. So Ryton would be sold, all players would be up for sale at well below their true value.

Then you're relying on a new owning coming forward with no ground, no training ground, no academy and players that nobody else wants.

That's why I think protests need to be more than just SISU Out, they need to present a viable exit strategy.

the rumpo kid · Sep 17, 2016

robbiekeane said:
Most of it, if in understand right, is in the form of "loans" from SISU/ARVO when they have been subsidising losses and when they threw a bit of money at us in the first few years. And probably some left from when they bought us

isn't that a bit like saying VW owe me 15k coz I bought a car from them ?

skybluesam66 · Sep 17, 2016

to say we have no value is ludicrous
a team 2 promotions away from the premier league, and only 1 away from the championship
West brom have just been sold for 150m+
There is a price there, my guess its around 10m exclusive of debt (ie sisu take the debt with them)

The situation as it stands cant go on for ever, so it just needs an interested party to push at the door

Grendel · Sep 17, 2016

the rumpo kid said:
isn't that a bit like saying VW owe me 15k coz I bought a car from them ?

No nothing like that.

Malaka · Sep 17, 2016

skybluesam66 said:
to say we have no value is ludicrous
a team 2 promotions away from the premier league, and only 1 away from the championship
West brom have just been sold for 150m+
There is a price there, my guess its around 10m exclusive of debt (ie sisu take the debt with them)

The situation as it stands cant go on for ever, so it just needs an interested party to push at the door

Two promotions away? easier said than done (when was the last time it happened for us?)and needs a lot of investment with no gaurantees

clint van damme · Sep 17, 2016

[QUOTE="Steve.B50, post: 1161382, member: 3568"We need to show any potential buyers that the fan base is still here and that any sort of genuine investment in the team and Manager would be supported.
I am very confident of things happening in the background but if anyone who is looking at our club would probably either go to go to a few games or send a representative to do some market research. The problem is at present what would they see?[/QUOTE]
Yep. Said all along the best way to get rid of sisu isn't NOPM its by filling the stadium and making the club an attractive proposition to potential buyers.

clint van damme · Sep 17, 2016

Ive no idea whether there is a potetial take over or not but one thing I would factor in regardless of whether we are actually an attractive proposition or not is ego.
With the 2 of the 3 Birmingham clubs now Chinese owned and the Thai owned EPL champions just up the road I would never rule out the prospect of us becoming a play thing in a South East Asian pissing contest.
These people are seriously competetive.

Brylowes · Sep 17, 2016

Malaka said:
Two promotions away? easier said than done (when was the last time it happened for us?)and needs a lot of investment with no gaurantees

But there are people out there who will try to "speculate to accumulate" if it was guaranteed
They would be falling over themselves too take us on wouldn't they, in fact if it were guaranteed
We wouldn't be talking about it because SISU would do it.

Chipfat · Sep 17, 2016

As I have been saying this is not some silly bar talk or casino gossip, something is going on and Wasps and CCC are in it up to their nuts. They also are in the know about the potential buyer, Wasps will not switch Sisu for another independent company, its a mutual partner or a party that have a bigger vision of what working together could bring. The CCC will play apart if and when this happens and will be all welcoming to new investment within the city.

Any interested party is not interested in what we are now, they are interested in what we can become and when everyone in the room is the key holder of every door you need then the picture of what you are buying becomes a different look. The club now is a sorry state and needs change off the field everyone agrees on this Sisu have to be coming to an end of a terrible investment. I know what some will say to this but I have been saying this for a long time, every party even those who do not really want Wasps around have turned away from helping Sisu.. Why? what have they been promised, extension to the current ground, development funding? anyway who knows , I have been saying it for a long time amd said before I will either be proved a liar or a conspiracy theorist.

Wyken Sky Blue · Sep 17, 2016

SBAndy said:
Firstly I should say I'm not convinced by what I'm about to share with you, but being as it's CCFC-related I thought I'd go ahead anyway, so please don't shoot me down!

Speaking to my mate last night, who was telling me about when he went to the casino last weekend and got chatting to the dealer on the blackjack table. The dealer said he'd been on the table of the Wasps chairman the night before (or something). Anyway, this dealer being a Cov fan was asking about the whole situation and whether it was true that Wasps would look to buy CCFC, to which he was told "no, not enough money to make something happen". However, he did say he knew of a potential owner waiting in the wings to take over.

As I said, I'm not sold on it, but it would be the final piece of the jigsaw explaining why SISU are being attacked from every angle.

Sent from my E5823 using Tapatalk

Deleted member 5849 · Sep 17, 2016

Captain Dart said:
More than that. Goodwill (zero at present but will return with new owners), heritage (don't scoff this club has far more than most of the clubs in the Championship) , location (one of the largest cities in England, hopefully about to enter a resurgent period with inward investment from JLR & others) and POTENTIAL, a well run and adequately financed club could repeat the successes of the Jimmy Hill era. The question is how deep does the systemic rot inside the club go it needs totally new management (and I mean off field as much as the playing side).

I agree about the intangibles but...

I'd always thought we had a pull, always discounted gates really - they ebb and flow for every club, but there's always that embedded heritage as you say.

The sheer apathy to it all however is... worrying. SISU or no SISU (and fine, blame SISU for causing the apathy, it makes little difference to the general point who's responsible) that apathy and disinterest is our biggest threat. It suggests CCC, Wasps, whoever are very possibly right to suggest the heritage, tradition and embedded nature of the club in its city don't actually matter after all, that this is the club that challenges long held theories.

And that.

Is a scary thought.

Deleted member 4439 · Sep 17, 2016

AFCCOVENTRY said:
There is no appeal for a buyer to purchase CCFC.

Regardless of the size of this city, we are a poorly supported club. Even in the premiership we struggled to sell out every game at Highfield Rd.

We don't own our stadium or even have a decent rental agreement long term.

We are in Division 3.

Club is in debt to Sisu now. Nobody will match the debt Sisu are loading up.

True, we're not the best of supported clubs, but clearly that isn't the main factor - a number of clubs have been bought that have a very average fanbase, Leicester City being one - their support has always been very similar to ours, when taken against league being played, momentum and general popularity of football.

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