Refugees welcome? (50 Viewers)

magic82ball · Sep 4, 2015

Samo said:
Well I'm sure you are tough enough to take the flack... let's hear it.

Nothing to hear. I believe we should help and certainly do our fair share in this humanitarian crisis. I have a 3 year old son and it breaks my heart to see the pictures all over the news yesterday. Just don't happen to think it makes you a racist because you have concerns about a country already at bursting point , allowing a further 800,000 people in, some of whom are not likely to be legitimate refugees but more likely immigrants.

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Gint11 · Sep 4, 2015

torchomatic said:
Funny, isn't it? No concern for people fleeing for their lives, yet move a football team 35 miles and the place is in meltdown.

Now, if only this civil war was between SISU and the FL...

Ashdown is right though. What he says is correct and is happening. In saying that, we should still help where we can.

Samo · Sep 4, 2015

torchomatic said:
Exactly. Sentences usually start "I'm not a racist but...."

and include... 'Raj in the corner shop is a good friend of mine'

magic82ball · Sep 4, 2015

torchomatic said:
Exactly. Sentences usually start "I'm not a racist but...."

That's exactly the sort of language I'm talking about. You don't want more foreigners in the country, therefore you must be a racist , no other possible explanation. End of any meaningful discussion.

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covcity4life · Sep 4, 2015

Gotta say I am pleased tly surprised eith thud thread. I was expecting 60/40 in favour of "there taking our houses and benefits" etc

I think some people can shield themselves from Compassion to people far away. I mean that's not evil.

But if brit tourist dies in Turkey then alot of people can relate to it and thus it's very sad. But when it's a family from a different country who speak a different language it's easier to shield themselves from it as they cannot put themselves in the shoes of what others are going though

So noone is a farage for saying no and noone is a hippie fir saying yes

However I do think the no camp might have some growing to do in terms of realising we are all humans no matter where in world from and all have same basic emotions too

Samo · Sep 4, 2015

magic82ball said:
Nothing to hear. I believe we should help and certainly do our fair share in this humanitarian crisis. I have a 3 year old son and it breaks my heart to see the pictures all over the news yesterday. Just don't happen to think it makes you a racist because you have concerns about a country already at bursting point , allowing a further 800,000 people in, some of whom are not likely to be legitimate refugees but more likely immigrants.

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Are we really at bursting point or do the Daily Mail claim we are? Who said we should take 800,000?
All applications should be vetted and non-refugees identified.

Nick · Sep 4, 2015

magic82ball said:
That's exactly the sort of language I'm talking about. You don't want more foreigners in the country, therefore you must be a racist , no other possible explanation. End of any meaningful discussion.

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Yet nobody can say the plan of how it will happen and be carried out? It is just let everybody in then think about it. Would we check if we were letting in thousands of criminals for example? All well and good saying we are letting this train of men in because they would die if they stayed in their country (yet have been through 7 or 8 countries before us) but what if that train contains criminals?

Of course that will be a % and not every refugee, but thats the sort of thing that needs to be checked.

torchomatic · Sep 4, 2015

1. It's not 800,000
2. We're not at "bursting point"
3. They will be chosen from camps in Syria, not those who have already tried to get here; not economic migrants.

magic82ball said:
Nothing to hear. I believe we should help and certainly do our fair share in this humanitarian crisis. I have a 3 year old son and it breaks my heart to see the pictures all over the news yesterday. Just don't happen to think it makes you a racist because you have concerns about a country already at bursting point , allowing a further 800,000 people in, some of whom are not likely to be legitimate refugees but more likely immigrants.

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covcity4life · Sep 4, 2015

Nick your issue is that they ain't English speaking

Nick · Sep 4, 2015

covcity4life said:
However I do think the no camp might have some growing to do in terms of realising we are all humans no matter where in world from and all have same basic emotions too

I think most people have emotions. I'd love for there to be no war, I'd love for there to be no murder etc.

It is all well and good saying we should let everybody into the country at risk but what about the effect it has on the country?

It is like when you see dads with young families and kids go to fight against ISIS etc. Fair play for doing what you believe, doesn't change the fact his kids are going to grow up without a dad because of it. It is the longterm effects.

KG7 · Sep 4, 2015

magic82ball said:
That's exactly the sort of language I'm talking about. You don't want more foreigners in the country, therefore you must be a racist , no other possible explanation. End of any meaningful discussion.

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Magic82ball, why don't you want any more foreigners in the country? To me, if they are willing to find a job and contribute to society in a similar way to me, they have as much right to be here as I have. Why should someone from a different country have any less right to the life that we are able to lead in this country just because they weren't born here?

covcity4life · Sep 4, 2015

Nick I understand your concerns

I also think we have too many immigrants in country. I also don't like that at my gym no one speaks English. All things that many would slate me for.

But when it comes doen to it people dying trumps all that for me. Help is needed

Nick · Sep 4, 2015

covcity4life said:
Nick your issue is that they ain't English speaking

Should have known you would have been all over it giving it race cards here and there when you know nothing at all.

Samo · Sep 4, 2015

Nick said:
Yet nobody can say the plan of how it will happen and be carried out? It is just let everybody in then think about it. Would we check if we were letting in thousands of criminals for example? All well and good saying we are letting this train of men in because they would die if they stayed in their country (yet have been through 7 or 8 countries before us) but what if that train contains criminals?

Of course that will be a % and not every refugee, but thats the sort of thing that needs to be checked.

Are you seriously expecting fans on a forum to come up with a strategy for dealing with refugees?
While you procrastinate, people are dying. I'm not saying we shouldn't plan, of course we should but action is needed now. Life is all about risk, let them in. What's the worst that could happen?

I tell you what, let's stick them in the Ricoh and move back to Northampton.

covcity4life · Sep 4, 2015

Lol shit timing with your agenda nick

Liquid Gold · Sep 4, 2015

Over the last 200 years, Britain has systematically invaded, ravaged and destabilised just about every country in the world. We’ve installed brutal dictators, hoovered up natural resources, sold arms, and started wars just to make sure that this great island stays comfortable, healthy and wealthy.
If you enjoy all the perks of living in this country - schools, healthcare, jobs, roads, nice houses, museums, flat whites - then you need to at least acknowledge that this comfort and safety comes from decades and centuries of your country being an absolute bastard.
The middle classes right now, or at least the reactionary readers of the Daily Mail and the Daily Telegraph, would want you to look after your own right now. The refugees escaping Syria and Africa are not our problem.
They are totally our problem. As a society, we’ve sat idly by while our governments have destroyed countries, and fuelled terrorism and civil wars, just so our cost of living can stay low and our standards of living can stay high. We have enough to share. We have enough space, and we have enough money. We live in one of the wealthiest countries in the world, and we’re happy to reap the benefits of our global cavorting. Now, when it’s coming back to bite us on the arse, we have to accept full responsibility for it. Donate, petition, protest. Just don’t ignore.

Nick · Sep 4, 2015

Samo said:
Are you seriously expecting fans on a forum to come up with a strategy for dealing with refugees?

No but you would think they would have an idea of what would happen surely if they feel so strongly for it rather than just let everybody in then deal with it? When asked a question on what they thing should or would maybe happen afterwards you just keep coming up with smart arse comments?

People have been dying for a long while, it's not right but theres no point acting like its a new thing all of a sudden because of bad pictures in the newspaper.

Another genuine question, is it just Europe or are Asia helping out?

magic82ball · Sep 4, 2015

Samo said:
Are we really at bursting point or do the Daily Mail claim we are? Who said we should take 800,000?
All applications should be vetted and non-refugees identified.

800,000 was just used as a comparative figure for Germany's expected influx.
Literally speaking, no, we are not full, there is still many a green belt that can be turned to concrete. But realistically when the NHS can't handle the current population, when schools are 40 pupil strong in class,, when entire communities have been eradicated through migration, when unemployment sits at 2 million and when there are not enough ready built houses to house the current population by a long chalk, then yes I would say were very close to full.
And of course all applicants should be vetted but there logistics of this when talking about the sheer number of people as we are, would take years.

magic82ball said:
That's exactly the sort of language I'm talking about. You don't want more foreigners in the country, therefore you must be a racist , no other possible explanation. End of any meaningful discussion.

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Sick Boy · Sep 4, 2015

Liquid Gold said:
Over the last 200 years, Britain has systematically invaded, ravaged and destabilised just about every country in the world. We’ve installed brutal dictators, hoovered up natural resources, sold arms, and started wars just to make sure that this great island stays comfortable, healthy and wealthy.
If you enjoy all the perks of living in this country - schools, healthcare, jobs, roads, nice houses, museums, flat whites - then you need to at least acknowledge that this comfort and safety comes from decades and centuries of your country being an absolute bastard.
The middle classes right now, or at least the reactionary readers of the Daily Mail and the Daily Telegraph, would want you to look after your own right now. The refugees escaping Syria and Africa are not our problem.
They are totally our problem. As a society, we’ve sat idly by while our governments have destroyed countries, and fuelled terrorism and civil wars, just so our cost of living can stay low and our standards of living can stay high. We have enough to share. We have enough space, and we have enough money. We live in one of the wealthiest countries in the world, and we’re happy to reap the benefits of our global cavorting. Now, when it’s coming back to bite us on the arse, we have to accept full responsibility for it. Donate, petition, protest. Just don’t ignore.

There are only 22 countries in the world that Britain hasn't invaded before.

Sick Boy · Sep 4, 2015

magic82ball said:
800,000 was just used as a comparative figure for Germany's expected influx.
Literally speaking, no, we are not full, there is still many a green belt that can be turned to concrete. But realistically when the NHS can't handle the current population, when schools are 40 pupil strong in class,, when entire communities have been eradicated through migration, when unemployment sits at 2 million and when there are not enough ready built houses to house the current population by a long chalk, then yes I would say were very close to full.
And of course all applicants should be vetted but there logistics of this when talking about the sheer number of people as we are, would take years.

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While there is so much inequality and lack of justice in the world, what do you expect people to do?

According to some the country has been full for decades. Can you detail which communities have been eradicated due to migration?

Samo · Sep 4, 2015

Nick said:
No but you would think they would have an idea of what would happen surely if they feel so strongly for it rather than just let everybody in then deal with it?

Another genuine question, is it just Europe or are Asia helping out?

Why, what difference does it make? Are you going to spit the dummy if not everyone shares nicely? Do you think Asia is as able to help? Do you not think the onus should be on the wealthiest countries in the world?

covcity4life · Sep 4, 2015

If we get more immigrants he might not be able to pre order fifa next year

Real issues at home...

Nick · Sep 4, 2015

Samo said:
Why, what difference does it make? Are you going to spit the dummy if not everyone shares nicely? Do you think Asia is as able to help? Do you not think the onus should be on the wealthiest countries in the world?

Yes, because there are no wealthy countries in Asia are there?

I am asking a question, I genuinely don't know.

Why wouldn't Asia be able to help?

KG7 · Sep 4, 2015

Nick said:
Yes, because there are no wealthy countries in Asia are there?

I am asking a question, I genuinely don't know.

Why wouldn't Asia be able to help?

They definitely should

Samo · Sep 4, 2015

magic82ball said:
800,000 was just used as a comparative figure for Germany's expected influx.
Literally speaking, no, we are not full, there is still many a green belt that can be turned to concrete. But realistically when the NHS can't handle the current population, when schools are 40 pupil strong in class,, when entire communities have been eradicated through migration, when unemployment sits at 2 million and when there are not enough ready built houses to house the current population by a long chalk, then yes I would say were very close to full.
And of course all applicants should be vetted but there logistics of this when talking about the sheer number of people as we are, would take years.

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Concrete on the greenbelt you say? Good gracious no, suddenly all those people drowning doesn't seem so bad.

ajsccfc · Sep 4, 2015

Nick said:
People have been dying for a long while, it's not right but theres no point acting like its a new thing all of a sudden because of bad pictures in the newspaper.

I don't think anybody is pretending that. It's getting people's attention because it's being highlighted, that's all. You could certainly ask why suffering is routinely lower down the list of importance than frivolous nonsense for news outlets, but that's not the fault of the audience.

Samo · Sep 4, 2015

covcity4life said:
If we get more immigrants he might not be able to pre order fifa next year

Real issues at home...

Pah, its gone down the tubes anyway.

Nick · Sep 4, 2015

covcity4life said:
If we get more immigrants he might not be able to pre order fifa next year

Real issues at home...

Pretty sure I would be able to, at least when trying to be funny actually have a point to it. It is boring.

Samo · Sep 4, 2015

Nick said:
Yes, because there are no wealthy countries in Asia are there?

I am asking a question, I genuinely don't know.

Why wouldn't Asia be able to help?

They should hopefully but your implication seems to be that if they are not shared out fairly you're not playing. Am I right? If not, why keep banging on about it?

magic82ball · Sep 4, 2015

KG7 said:
Magic82ball, why don't you want any more foreigners in the country? To me, if they are willing to find a job and contribute to society in a similar way to me, they have as much right to be here as I have. Why should someone from a different country have any less right to the life that we are able to lead in this country just because they weren't born here?

I own a business, I see other local businesses in the town who a large proportion of which are owned by Pakistani, Indian, polish etc. Some open their doors at 6am and close at 11pm. They , I assume, pay their taxes and they amongst other business owners are the backbone of this country. If we could have a scheme set up where we lose a million feckless indigenous and gain a million foreigners who work like they do I would do it in a Heart beat but unfortunately that would be way to much for any believer of a 'society' to take so would never happen. My issue is not foreigners per say, it's the extra numbers coming into the country, the ramifications of which I have outlined in a previous post.

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Liquid Gold · Sep 4, 2015

Why is there even any sort of debate. Humans are dying because of a whole load of shit situations and they need to be helped. Anything else is bullshit

Nick · Sep 4, 2015

Samo said:
They should hopefully but your implication seems to be that if they are not shared out fairly you're not playing. Am I right? If not, why keep banging on about it?

So by me asking a question it is implying it?

Maybe it has just been that the media haven't covered it but I haven't seen much mention of it so didn't know what the situation was so asked on here where people know more about it than me?

Not playing what? The try to judge the implication of things game?

Nick · Sep 4, 2015

Liquid Gold said:
Why is there even any sort of debate. Humans are dying because of a whole load of shit situations and they need to be helped. Anything else is bullshit

OK, so how do we help? What would happen? What does the UK need to do to be classed as helping?

Of course I agree people need to be helped, whether it is people dying in Syria, Africa, America or Spain. The question is how??

Samo · Sep 4, 2015

magic82ball said:
I own a business, I see other local businesses in the town who a large proportion of which are owned by Pakistani, Indian, polish etc. Some open their doors at 6am and close at 11pm. They , I assume, pay their taxes and they amongst other business owners are the backbone of this country. If we could have a scheme set up where we lose a million feckless indigenous and gain a million foreigners who work like they do I would do it in a Heart beat but unfortunately that would be way to much for any believer of a 'society' to take so would never happen. My issue is not foreigners per say, it's the extra numbers coming into the country, the ramifications of which I have outlined in a previous post.

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Endangering the greenbelt for example.

SlowerThanPlatt · Sep 4, 2015

Once you "open" football grounds to politics, then no one can complain when IS supporters start displaying banners on one side of the ground and the BNP are on the other side.

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