mr_monkey
Well-Known Member
This 100%
I’m not clouded by anything... do I believe SISU misjudged the situation and tried to string arm a deal to get the stadium for a bargain Price, yep. And before I knew the full facts I blamed them 100% for the situation we were in when moved to Northampton. Now I know that CCC we’re trying to sell the stadium to wasps without even giving OUR football club, who that stadium
Was built for & that our club invested in, the chance to bid for it! I believe that all CCC we’re interested in was fucking over SISU & not giving a shit that the football club would suffer because of it, yep I’m afraid so... it’s with a big sore lump in my throat that I have to say the only people that have seen the light and decided to do the best thing for CCFC after this fiasco is the owners. They have backed robins & helped get us two promotions in 3 years. While CCC have attempted at every junction to keep fucking us over. No communication back on potential sites, no help brokering a peace deal for the Ricoh return etc etc
I just wish the owners had been more transparent & seen the light earlier and maybe we would now own half our stadium and not have suffered even more as fans in recent years... but the club is now trying, which is more than I can say for the council of this city.
Im afriad if anyone is blinded here it’s you, with your obvious unwavering hatred for the owners
If I remember rightly, didn’t SISU say if the 250 year lease was up for the same price they’d have been interested? (Whether you believe them is another matter)I’m not clouded by anything... do I believe SISU misjudged the situation and tried to string arm a deal to get the stadium for a bargain Price, yep. And before I knew the full facts I blamed them 100% for the situation we were in when moved to Northampton. Now I know that CCC we’re trying to sell the stadium to wasps without even giving OUR football club, who that stadium
Was built for & that our club invested in, the chance to bid for it! I believe that all CCC we’re interested in was fucking over SISU & not giving a shit that the football club would suffer because of it, yep I’m afraid so... it’s with a big sore lump in my throat that I have to say the only people that have seen the light and decided to do the best thing for CCFC after this fiasco is the owners. They have backed robins & helped get us two promotions in 3 years. While CCC have attempted at every junction to keep fucking us over. No communication back on potential sites, no help brokering a peace deal for the Ricoh return etc etc
I just wish the owners had been more transparent & seen the light earlier and maybe we would now own half our stadium and not have suffered even more as fans in recent years... but the club is now trying, which is more than I can say for the council of this city.
Im afriad if anyone is blinded here it’s you, with your obvious unwavering hatred for the owners
Victim complexMe sitting back watching someone else get a kicking for not towing the forum line:
Victim complex
Who's not towing the forum line?Deluded.
*ToeingMe sitting back watching someone else get a kicking for not towing the forum line:
Who's not towing the forum line?
I'm still trying to figure out how allowing one of the biggest supermarkets in Europe to open there and take the majority of the revenues of rentals from the Arena Park will help with the regeneration of that part of the City.
Anyone who doesn’t post performative virtue signalling about how evil the council/Wasps are and how Sisu would’ve definitely bought the stadium despite repeatedly saying they wouldn’t.
Because their money paid for the project. Rental income was never the driving force behind regeneration, that doesn’t even make sense unless you think the landlord would live in the local area. Whether it worked or not regeneration is about turning round bits of the city that are run down and not providing employment, not increasing rental income.
Who? Which poster? Which post?
Surely the regeneration of that part of the City comes from people who want to live near a successful sports team in a stadium and and not a huge supermarket.
I wonder what the state of other retail parks and their footfall in the local area is after these huge economies of scale moved in.
Also, the once local shops.
This can easily be turned round - whenever someone suggests that the council are unreasonable you wade in.Really? SBD posts some reasonable disagreement with the idea Sisu should’ve/could’ve bought the stadium, which goes against the groupthink on here that CCC are evil overlords hell bent of destroying CCFC by refusing to sell them the Ricoh and is met with around ten posters wading in accusing him of stuff like “being blinded by your hatred of the owners”.
Then when it’s pointed out the site admin decides to white knight any criticism of this response.
Then I wrote this post.
Really? SBD posts some reasonable disagreement with the idea Sisu should’ve/could’ve bought the stadium, which goes against the groupthink on here that CCC are evil overlords hell bent of destroying CCFC by refusing to sell them the Ricoh and is met with around ten posters wading in accusing him of stuff like “being blinded by your hatred of the owners”.
Then when it’s pointed out the site admin decides to white knight any criticism of this response.
Then I wrote this post.
The regeneration comes from the fact that were there was a wasteland with huge cleanup costs not being used for anything there is now housing and employment. If you want to rail against supermarkets pushing out the little man go ahead but not sure what it’s got to do with this topic. And no, people would not rather live by a stadium than a supermarket, that’s insane.
What about people like pwkh and higgs?I could give you a long list of the things to blame for where we presently are
Bryan Richardson and other directors for all but bankrupting us on several occasions. The over spending, vanity and egos
CCC for the sharp practice to do with the stadium build & since, the failure to create a viable lease with at least 100 years term. The lack of understanding
SISU for their failure to do their due diligence and to break the lease when they bought in. Their management style. The endless court cases and legal actions. The risk they have put CCFC at
Then there is wasps, charity, personalities, EFL, The FA, the media etc etc etc
the list goes on
The well being of CCFC and the community it represents deserved better from all of them. None of them get excused because the manager has got the team heading in the right direction.
But a lot of what happened and has been put in the public domain as some sort pointing finger, and done to death on this forum is frankly window dressing. It makes clicks online, it winds the fans up, it hides or clouds the real issues. It doesnt actually join the dots up and if anything just entrenches opinion.
I have to query a couple of things
Firstly the move to Northampton, which was an entirely different scenario to the move to Birmingham. It was engineered to break the lease there was no other purpose or reason. It worked in doing that, it was a clever use of legal process, it very nearly worked completely ............. apart from the big wasp in the ointment. Yes CCC are to blame for a lot of things, and they have helped reduce things to personalities which was never going to be helpful to CCFC, but the Northampton move was a financial plan to gain control of the stadium for the benefit of the SISU investors. The plan of gaining control of the stadium cheaply was never to retain it but to flip it on to AEG and to make profit for the investors
Secondly this backing of Robins. Yes SISU have in the sense that they have let him and his management team get on with the business of running the team. That is not a bad thing, infact i would argue that is a good thing going forward so long as MR and his management team/structure stay in place
However i think many, even the majority of fans see backing as an owner putting money in to the club and specifically the team. Simply hasnt been the case under MR's tenure. Since his appointment 06/03/2017 SISU have made loans of £500K of which £254k has been withdrawn and repaid (i think it is fair to ignore the loans and repayment of loans (net £388k) in the 31 May 2017 accounts MR had only been here 2 months and no transfer market available to him). On top of the net £246k (2018 & 2019) the 2019 accounts disclose that the owners paid out £1.48m of the interest owed to them. During his tenure total debt has grown to 50.1m by 31/05/2019. So during his tenure SISU have taken a minimum net £1.2m out of the club
SISU are in terms of backing the bank of last resort certainly to 31/05/2019 - it is in their interest to do so because if they dont their investment goes down the tubes
The "backing" has been by SISU not taking all of the net proceeds of player sales & trading by the football club because the club has survived only because of those sales and until 2019 there was little left over to pay the owners. Any player purchases have been self generated by the club selling other players. To keep the club operating day to day has meant selling players. That is the model we work to
Now the 2019/20 figures may by necessity of the health crisis require some funding from SISU but we shouldnt forget the sales already concluded in that financial year McCallum, Bayliss etc. The financial model isnt based in normal times on funding and increased capital debt from the owners. People will point to the recent signings, but it is highly unlikely we have paid out the full amounts in the press and what we have paid has most likely been from accumulated player sale funds.
ACL could apply all they like but they were never in control of the process that started back in April 2011. Even if they had got their application through SISU entities would have controlled any administration or appointment of administrator
Wont ever know about AEG but perhaps they would have been.
I mean it wouldn’t matter who the administrator was anyway would it? Even if ACL succeeded it would have been the best offer for the creditors - the majority being held by SISU. They presumably made the biggest offerI didn't say they were in control, just that the lease would have broken with the administration either way?
Quote:
The eleventh-hour move was intended to prevent ACL succeeding in its High Court bid to force the Sky Blues into administration over £1.3million rent arrears – a hearing that is still set to take place today in some form.
ACL, in applying to the High Court for an administration order on the football club, had said the move could force a takeover of the club – forcing out its hedge fund owners Sisu.
ACL – jointly owned Coventry City Council and the Alan Edward Higgs Charity – had lined up Brendan Guilfoyle, of Sheffield-based P&A Partnership to take over the running of the club but the club has now appointed Rubin & Partners as its administrator instead
End quote
Why did they have an administrator lined up if they wouldn't have had control of it? Strange.
A lot of focus on the breaking the lease but there's never much mention on what ACL were planning to do.
Did pwkh and the higgs have no say over all of that? Maybe they were bitter because it backfired?
You would think AEG would do a bit better than wasps, surely?
So why did ACL apply for administration then? Break the lease and bring in a rugby team?I mean it wouldn’t matter who the administrator was anyway would it? Even if ACL succeeded it would have been the best offer for the creditors - the majority being held by SISU. They presumably made the biggest offer
Your guess is as good as mine. Maybe they misjudged the whole thing thinking they were the major creditorSo why did ACL apply for administration then? Break the lease and bring in a rugby team?
Surely not, 1 seasons rent of which they took a load from the escrow anyway.Your guess is as good as mine. Maybe they misjudged the whole thing thinking they were the major creditor
They tried to force admin to force a takeover to bring Haskell in with Hoffman and the trust all backing it. They even said that to the press.Your guess is as good as mine. Maybe they misjudged the whole thing thinking they were the major creditor
Surely not, 1 seasons rent of which they took a load from the escrow anyway.
The only thing I can guess is that they possibly didn’t want to administrator to acknowledge the debt to SISU.They tried to force admin to force a takeover to bring Haskell in with Hoffman and the trust all backing it. They even said that to the press.
It backfired, hence the trust whinge about admin and the golden share because they didn't get a spinny seat.
Also why that rat pwkh was so annoyed.
They picked an administrator they wanted to run it and Haskell was paraded as the new owner.The only thing I can guess is that they possibly didn’t want to administrator to acknowledge the debt to SISU.
probably argue that it was owed by Sky Blue Sport and Leisure and not CCFC ltd.
SISU's bid couldn't be accepted because they wanted Higgs to work with them on community projects? What laws prevent a charity working on community projects in line with their stated aims?
They stated there were conditions on the bid that they couldn't legally agree to. I've no idea what they were. Neither do you. There may have been things about community projects in there. Doesn't make those the things they couldn't legally agree to.
performative virtue signalling
Alexa...... "Please translate into plain English"
I realised I knew nothing about the Wasps' bond. So I did some research. It matures in December 2022 and is currently trading at 46.7 - meaning that it yields over 13% as the coupon is 6.5% (based on a price of 100). At that price it's a junk bond - the City expects them to default. It fell as far as 24.8 in March.
I'd need to know much more to know if SISU buying the bond is a good idea. But given their interests in the Ricoh (upon which the bond is secured), it sounds on paper as if it might be a good idea. If they had bought at the nadir (and the fact that it bounced back so quickly implies that someone bought it), they'd quadruple their money in 2022 if it Wasps paid out in 2022 as planned. And if they didn't, I think they could force liquidation and settlement for bond holders. Interesting...
WASPS FINANCE PLC WAS1 Stock | London Stock Exchange
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