SISU/Otium (13 Viewers)

Moff · Dec 6, 2016

GaryPendrysEyes said:
You buy a season ticket or turn up and buy a home ticket, you are giving £££ to Sisu and TRUSTING them with what they do with it (despite them being a failed/disintegrating organisation, with no plan and utterly untrustworthy individuals like Fisher).
I think I have good grounds for not trusting them an inch and will not give them my money.

I take it as a supporter of the club (at least you say you are) that once SISU go you still want a club?

If that's the case then what you suggest I do re keeping my kids interested in the club? Due to their sports we don't get to as many games as we used to, but they want to see some, they also want kit and CCFC merchandise etc. Buying it them keeps them interested in the club, and they are the fans of the future, but if I followed your suggestion, I shouldn't bother and they will probably end up like their other glory supporting mates supporting other clubs.

On one hand as much as I hate SISU I am supporting the fans of the future, who will be there for the club when SISU eventually bugger off, on the other hand I have people like you and others suggesting don't give them a penny and thus the club will lose these fans.

I am all for people doing what they think best, but I am fucked if I will have people telling me what to do, and that I shouldn't do everything I can to keep my kids interested. Lets hope some of us still have kids who give a shit when SISU are gone.

rd45 · Dec 6, 2016

Moff said:
I am all for people doing what they think best, but I am fucked if I will have people telling me what to do, and that I shouldn't do everything I can to keep my kids interested. Lets hope some of us still have kids who give a shit when SISU are gone.

Was talking to my son last night about the Crawley game - saying I'm not sure I can be bothered with it after we schlepped all the way to Cambridge on Sunday - but he set me straight. Now, we're both going on Wednesday. Fair play to anyone who's decided they've had enough, but am I going to tell a 12 year old kid that he's wrong & it's not worth the aggravation? No chance.

rd45 · Dec 6, 2016

Moff said:
I am all for people doing what they think best, but I am fucked if I will have people telling me what to do, and that I shouldn't do everything I can to keep my kids interested. Lets hope some of us still have kids who give a shit when SISU are gone.

Was talking to my son last night about the Crawley game - saying I'm not sure I can be bothered with it after we schlepped all the way to Cambridge on Sunday - but he set me straight. Now, we're both going on Wednesday. Fair play to anyone who's decided they've had enough, but am I going to tell a 12 year old kid that he's wrong & it's not worth the aggravation? No chance.

blueflint · Dec 6, 2016

Nick said:
How is it lining SISU's pockets though? If all that money is going to SISU, how are the players etc being paid?

That's the bit I don't get.

because they set the budget anything over that budget they can use for themselves i.e. madisons fee
im not saying they have used his fee but they haven't spent it on players have they

Grendel · Dec 6, 2016

blueflint said:
because they set the budget anything over that budget they can use for themselves i.e. madisons fee
im not saying they have used his fee but they haven't spent it on players have they

I wouldn't know - do wages count?

Nick · Dec 6, 2016

blueflint said:
because they set the budget anything over that budget they can use for themselves i.e. madisons fee
im not saying they have used his fee but they haven't spent it on players have they

Do clubs only have outgoings of transfer fees now then?

blueflint · Dec 6, 2016

Grendel said:
I wouldn't know - do wages count?

wages are in the budget i was making a point on other stuff also club merchandise will be part of that budget
if they sell enough shirts etc they then put nothing in

oldfiver · Dec 6, 2016

Sky Blue Kid said:
Errrmmmmm HE DID!

Then he was wrong
Otium is CCFC but SISU is a different Company

blueflint · Dec 6, 2016

Nick said:
Do clubs only have outgoings of transfer fees now then?

see my reply to grendel and stop sticking up for sisu

blueflint · Dec 6, 2016

its the kids who want to follow city i feel for as they may never see success at least i did

torchomatic · Dec 6, 2016

blueflint said:
see my reply to grendel and stop sticking up for sisu

Yeah he's SISUs bitch.

oldfiver · Dec 6, 2016

blueflint said:
because they set the budget anything over that budget they can use for themselves i.e. madisons fee
im not saying they have used his fee but they haven't spent it on players have they

Ask OSB ?

peeler · Dec 6, 2016

Nick said:
how are the players etc being paid?

In peanuts if Saturday is anything to go by.

Sky Blue Kid · Dec 7, 2016

oldfiver said:
Then he was wrong
Otium is CCFC but SISU is a different Company

skybluetony176 · Dec 7, 2016

oldfiver said:
Then he was wrong
Otium is CCFC but SISU is a different Company

Otium is CCFC and they are a separate company. But if otium are the head SISU are the neck and as the neck they turn the head. The two are intrinsically connected.

Sky Blue Kid · Dec 7, 2016

skybluetony176 said:
Otium is CCFC and they are a separate company. But if otium are the head SISU are the neck and as the neck they turn the head. The two are intrinsically connected.

THIS!!!.... SISU/Otium/CCFC are one in the same.... Thanks Tony mate. It seems some people like splitting hairs.

oldfiver · Dec 7, 2016

Sky Blue Kid said:
THIS!!!.... SISU/Otium/CCFC are one in the same.... Thanks Tony mate. It seems some people like splitting hairs.

"Connected" not the "same" !

skybluetony176 · Dec 7, 2016

oldfiver said:
"Connected" not the "same" !

It's worse. It means ultimately they have control over an entity they don't give a fuck about. People keep saying SISU aren't the club like somehow it makes it better. It doesn't. It would be better for the club if they were. Let's face it, they've written of the CCFC investment a long time ago. Anything that they can take from it now is a bonus and as they're not the club I doubt that they give a flying one how they achieve that, what damage that process does to the club or how it effects the fan base.

Sky Blue Kid · Dec 7, 2016

oldfiver said:
"Connected" not the "same" !

NO! the same ya condescending nob!

torchomatic · Dec 7, 2016

skybluetony176 said:
Otium is CCFC and they are a separate company. But if otium are the head SISU are the neck and as the neck they turn the head. The two are intrinsically connected.

So presumably we all support SISU and Otium then as well as CCFC?

Godiva · Dec 7, 2016

Sky Blue Kid said:
NO! the same ya condescending nob!

CCFC is the trade name of Otium. So Otium and CCFC is one and the same.
SISU owns most of the shares in Otium and is a separate company.
If CCFC/Otium is liquidated then SISU lives on - they take a hit on the value of Otium/CCFC they have in their books, but if that value is very low, the hit is very low too.
If SISU goes bankrupt Otium/CCFC lives on - the administrator/liquidator of SISU will then sell the shares in Otium/CCFC to the highest bidder.

SISU and CCFC is NOT the same. They are connected.

skybluetony176 · Dec 7, 2016

torchomatic said:
So presumably we all support SISU and Otium then as well as CCFC?

I'm not even sure what point you're trying to make there. Like I said if CCFC is the head SISU are the neck. What SISU do effects CCFC. What CCFC do doesn't really effect SISU. Surely you can see that. It's not a two way relationship. It is complicated but to say that SISU isn't CCFC is only a half truth.

torchomatic · Dec 7, 2016

skybluetony176 said:
I'm not even sure what point you're trying to make there. Like I said if CCFC is the head SISU are the neck. What SISU do effects CCFC. What CCFC do doesn't really effect SISU. Surely you can see that. It's not a two way relationship. It is complicated but to say that SISU isn't CCFC is only a half truth.

Just pointing out if you support CCFC then you must also support the owners as they are "connected". We can't have it both ways, can we?

skybluetony176 · Dec 7, 2016

torchomatic said:
Just pointing out if you support CCFC then you must also support the owners as they are "connected". We can't have it both ways, can we?

We don't have it both ways. At the risk of repeating myself what SISU do effects CCFC. What CCFC do doesn't really effect SISU. Surely you can see that?

skybluebeduff · Dec 7, 2016

Moff said:
I take it as a supporter of the club (at least you say you are) that once SISU go you still want a club?

If that's the case then what you suggest I do re keeping my kids interested in the club? Due to their sports we don't get to as many games as we used to, but they want to see some, they also want kit and CCFC merchandise etc. Buying it them keeps them interested in the club, and they are the fans of the future, but if I followed your suggestion, I shouldn't bother and they will probably end up like their other glory supporting mates supporting other clubs.

On one hand as much as I hate SISU I am supporting the fans of the future, who will be there for the club when SISU eventually bugger off, on the other hand I have people like you and others suggesting don't give them a penny and thus the club will lose these fans.

I am all for people doing what they think best, but I am fucked if I will have people telling me what to do, and that I shouldn't do everything I can to keep my kids interested. Lets hope some of us still have kids who give a shit when SISU are gone.

Kids always follow what their parents do, mine have learned how nasty SISU are, they're 5 and 7, they don't mind waiting until SISU go for a new kit, instead they got England ones. I know for a fact my kids will grow up CCFC fans, subliminally implanted at birth!

Godiva · Dec 7, 2016

skybluetony176 said:
We don't have it both ways. At the risk of repeating myself what SISU do effects CCFC. What CCFC do doesn't really effect SISU. Surely you can see that?

So starving CCFC isn't really hurting SISU?

Sky Blue Kid · Dec 7, 2016

Godiva said:
So starving CCFC isn't really hurting SISU?

So starving SISU doesn't really hurt CCFC.

skybluetony176 · Dec 7, 2016

Godiva said:
So starving CCFC isn't really hurting SISU?

Doesn't that dispel the myth that SISU aren't the club?

torchomatic · Dec 7, 2016

Godiva said:
So starving CCFC isn't really hurting SISU?

Don't you'll tie them up in knots.

It hurts the team, not SISU. They don't give a fuck though, I don't think.

Grendel · Dec 7, 2016

skybluetony176 said:
Doesn't that dispel the myth that SISU aren't the club?

That's not the question he asked - answer the question he asked

dongonzalos · Dec 7, 2016

I don't do NOPM. However I am not going sit and pretend I can't see the logic in it. It makes total sense.
What happens with club certainly affects SISU both in terms of the negative national media exposure. Also financially hence this obsessive drive for break even point and the continual selling of players.

In my opinion SISU want breakeven and the ability to choose when to sell a player not having to sell them in desperation.

With the model we have set up, breakeven will probably mean if we are lucky mid table division 3. If we are really lucky a play off challenge, unlucky relegation to division 4.

To achieve breakeven SISU make cuts and sell players. This at the same time lowers income (crowds) and we never get to breakeven and the cycle continues.

There is a cut off in every business where if you realise breakeven is not obtainable you will let go of that business.

We are heading to that point very slowly, sales of Wilson, Maddison, Vincelot. Pay off for Christie have just prolonged it.

The NOMP people probably believe they will just speed up the club getting to that point. I believe they are right.

Yet as I say despite that I can't quite bring myself to do it.

Grendel · Dec 7, 2016

dongonzalos said:
I don't do NOPM. However I am not going sit and pretend I can't see the logic in it. It makes total sense.
What happens with club certainly affects SISU both in terms of the negative national media exposure. Also financially hence this obsessive drive fior break even point and the continual selling of players.

In my opinion SISU want breakeven and the ability to choose when to sell a player not having to sell them in desperation.

With the model we have set up, breakeven will probably mean if we are lucky mud table division 3. If we are really lucky a play off challenge, unlucky relegation to division 4.

To achieve breakeven SISU make cuts and sell players. This at the same time lowers income (crowds) and we never get to breakeven and the cycle continues.

There is a cut off in every business where if you realise breakeven is not obtainable you will let go of that business.

We are heading to that point very slowly, sales of Wilson, Maddison, Vincelot. Pay off for Christie have just prolonged it.

The NOMP people probably believe they will just speed up the club getting to that point. I believe they are right.

Yet as I say despite that I can't quite bring myself to do it.

If it makes sense why have clubs such as Blackpool and Blackburn - who have managed to effectively reduce gates through boycotting - failed to have any impact on their owners?

skybluebeduff · Dec 7, 2016

torchomatic said:
Don't you'll tie them up in knots.

It hurts the team, not SISU. They don't give a fuck though, I don't think.

Kinda like the owners not giving a fuck about replacing out of contract players, or better still, offering them a fucking deal to stay. And how many years has that been going on for? NOPM to blame for that too?

skybluetony176 · Dec 7, 2016

Grendel said:
That's not the question he asked - answer the question he asked

Sir yes sir. Fuck off you little knob.

skybluetony176 · Dec 7, 2016

torchomatic said:
Don't you'll tie them up in knots.

It hurts the team, not SISU. They don't give a fuck though, I don't think.

SISU don't have to make up the shortfall then?

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