Sisu will not drop JR appeal (11 Viewers)

MusicDating · Jul 14, 2014

Tim on Friday - 'We know we haven’t done enough to communicate with you. We want this to change. We promise to share as much as we can about what is going on.'

Tim on Monday - 'Whilst the complicated legal discussions take place, we are unable to give a running commentary...'

That's some speedy promise breaking, even by their standards...

Hobo · Jul 14, 2014

MusicDating said:
Tim on Friday - 'We know we haven’t done enough to communicate with you. We want this to change. We promise to share as much as we can about what is going on.'

Tim on Monday - 'Whilst the complicated legal discussions take place, we are unable to give a running commentary...'

That's some speedy promise breaking, even by their standards...

They want to change it but can't for legal reasons...come on poor old SISU lol

spider_ricoh · Jul 14, 2014

What's the longest timeframe for the court of appeal to reject SISU's case (i.e. when they run out of realistic legal road) ?

wingy · Jul 14, 2014

spider_ricoh said:
What's the longest timeframe for the court of appeal to reject SISU's case (i.e. when they run out of realistic legal road) ?[/QUOT

Up to around six months IIRC.

spider_ricoh · Jul 14, 2014

Damn it!!!

Kingokings204 · Jul 14, 2014

covcity4life said:
nothing fisher says there is wrong really. lets hope acl/council do their bit now.

Obviously a joke.

chickentikkamasala · Jul 14, 2014

Add your feelings to that photo in this thread.

olderskyblue · Jul 14, 2014

Unfortunately, very little of what Tim Fisher says carries any weight whatsoever. He is a puppet. As Chief Executive, he has the responsibility, but none of the Authority. And...we all know it.

I had faint hopes that talks could start, but they are even fainter now. I'm struggling to see how they could be productive.

Otis · Jul 14, 2014

Kingokings204 said:
The man lives in cloud cuckoo land but we already knew this. Correct me if I'm wrong but he wants to do a deal with a company he currently is taking to court and proceeding with further action on a stupid appeal.

“The legal action is a totally separate issue and we have a right to appeal. But this does not, and should not, prevent us from discussing a return with all of the interested parties.”

FFS what have us fans deserved to be run by a complete bunch of half wits.

Surely a return to court will result in very much disinterested parties won't it?

spider_ricoh · Jul 14, 2014

olderskyblue said:
Unfortunately, very little of what Tim Fisher says carries any weight whatsoever. He is a puppet. As Chief Executive, he has the responsibility, but none of the Authority. And...we all know it..

Didn't the FL have a rule which prevents clubs being controlled by 3rd parties, and disallows clubs having "shadow directors" like Joy??? She has admitted being in charge so it is an open & shut case for a FL rules break. Expect severe sanctions against the club from the FL any time.....oh wait...

Deleted member 5849 · Jul 14, 2014

olderskyblue said:
I had faint hopes that talks could start, but they are even fainter now. I'm struggling to see how they could be productive.

I'd suspect the chance of them being productive has always been minimal!

However...

The biggest issue is nobody even talks atm. At least if they start, even if it's to complain about the price of petrol and how the Golden Cross has gone downhill recently, it's a start...

play_in_skyblue_stripes · Jul 14, 2014

lamtara2006 said:
Of course the Legal Action matters, Tim. Nobody in their right mind negotiates 'with a gun to their head'. The court proceedings have been shown to be hopeless and failed in the High Court, Mr Justice Hickinbottom's ruling left no room for doubt. Yet Sisu plan to continue with an appeal (if given leave) that will drag Coventry City Council and ACL through more time-wasting with costs incurred.
The whole approach of the current owners and directors of Coventry City Football Club has been one of confrontation. At a minimum, they should commit to suspending the appeal process with a commitment to dropping it if agreement on a return to the Ricoh is achieved. Otherwise, it is difficult to see how reasonable people can possibly deal with them against the background of such pointless aggression.

I'm totally anti SISU.

if they want to continue their appeal let them. Its unlikely they will win. By all accounts the 590k has been deposited with FL.
Lets have talks and get back home for August. Surely that is the most important thing.

I could be being really naïve here as we know what a ruthless organisation SISU are.

Astute · Jul 14, 2014

Oh the shock of it.

As I said in the other thread if SISU refuse to stop the litigation there will be some on here trying to defend them. They are not interested in building bridges. Operation distress ACL is still ongoing. But yes it is all the fault of CCC and ACL. And getting our club home without SISU stopping the litigation will be easy

So nothing has really changed then. Just a nice statement the day before the march. Another season in Northampton ahead. And it seems that we will be no closer to coming home. SISU have raised money by selling players that should keep our club going for another season. ACL have had some money and will get more. This will pay the interest for at least a year.

What about us for once?

Voice_of_Reason · Jul 14, 2014

What are the chances of a leave to appeal be granted by Justice Hickinbottom now that on two occassions SISU'S appeals have failed miserably ?

Cityfan1 · Jul 14, 2014

lamtara2006 said:
Of course the Legal Action matters, Tim. Nobody in their right mind negotiates 'with a gun to their head'. The court proceedings have been shown to be hopeless and failed in the High Court, Mr Justice Hickinbottom's ruling left no room for doubt. Yet Sisu plan to continue with an appeal (if given leave) that will drag Coventry City Council and ACL through more time-wasting with costs incurred.
The whole approach of the current owners and directors of Coventry City Football Club has been one of confrontation. At a minimum, they should commit to suspending the appeal process with a commitment to dropping it if agreement on a return to the Ricoh is achieved. Otherwise, it is difficult to see how reasonable people can possibly deal with them against the background of such pointless aggression.

If as you say in the first instance that the appeal has no chance of being upheld, then there will be no additional costs to be incurred, so what stops ACL meeting with SISU to discuss the possibility of the club coming home. From my understanding of the appeal process, it cannot be put on hold, it has to be registered, or withdrawn, so if SISU withdrew the appeal they then could not reinstate it if they couldn't reach an agreement with ACL.

spider_ricoh · Jul 14, 2014

Voice_of_Reason said:
What are the chances of a leave to appeal be granted by Justice Hickinbottom now that on two occassions SISU'S appeals have failed miserably ?

Well I think TF has dismissed the chance of being granted leave to appeal, but if/when this is refused then the next step is already clear - they can/will escalate this to the court of appeal where 3 judges look at it. That whole process could take us another 6 months to conclude.

Kingokings204 · Jul 14, 2014

spider_ricoh said:
Well I think TF has dismissed the chance of being granted leave to appeal, but if/when this is refused then the next step is already clear - they can/will escalate this to the court of appeal where 3 judges look at it. That whole process could take us another 6 months to conclude.

3 senior judges at that lol the man really is an arse.

What they haven't contemplated is what if the court of appeal throw out the case then that have to accept the verdict. Shame.

blueflint · Jul 14, 2014

torchomatic said:
No different really from ACL a year ago saying they loved the club, wanted them to stay but then rejecting the CVA. Still, as long as it's sorted out in the end I don't really care who takes who to court.

quite a big difference really as ACL didn't tell us porkies didn't take us out of cov i would have rejected the CVA as would 99% of any sane businesses

Deleted member 5849 · Jul 14, 2014

blueflint said:
i would have rejected the CVA as would 99% of any sane businesses

That must make PWKH insane then...

Warwickhunt · Jul 14, 2014

spider_ricoh said:
Well I think TF has dismissed the chance of being granted leave to appeal, but if/when this is refused then the next step is already clear - they can/will escalate this to the court of appeal where 3 judges look at it. That whole process could take us another 6 months to conclude.

I read that the last time this happended the appeal was heard by the 3 Judges in less than 2 weeks, so there is still hope that they also tell SISU to go away in fast jerky movements sooner rather than later. They only go through the points of law and not all the other trash that was bought up

Grendel · Jul 14, 2014

blueflint said:
quite a big difference really as ACL didn't tell us porkies didn't take us out of cov i would have rejected the CVA as would 99% of any sane businesses

Why would you - for what purpose?

olderskyblue · Jul 14, 2014

Deleted member 5849 said:
I'd suspect the chance of them being productive has always been minimal!

However...

The biggest issue is nobody even talks atm. At least if they start, even if it's to complain about the price of petrol and how the Golden Cross has gone downhill recently, it's a start...

Yes, but Tim keeps spouting off, and he carries no weight. If Joy just sacked him and also ML, and then said she wants to talk (even with all the other stuff going on) I would have a little more hope of talks being productive, even if they ultimately failed due to 1 sides, or the others, demands.

Tim just keeps getting in the way.

(of course, the most likely scenario is that he has been instructed to say all of this as part of the SISU end game, and that they are not interested in talks, just trying to deflect blame at ACL. I await ML's next press release or interview where he blames everything on ACL. It will make a change from it being CCC)

Deleted member 5849 · Jul 14, 2014

olderskyblue said:
(of course, the most likely scenario is that he has been instructed to say all of this as part of the SISU end game, and that they are not interested in talks, just trying to deflect blame at ACL. I await ML's next press release or interview where he blames everything on ACL. It will make a change from it being CCC)

Which makes their decision not to call their bluff utterly baffling, surely.

Ann Lucas has worked out you need to play the game...

Warwickhunt · Jul 14, 2014

Grendel said:
Why would you - for what purpose?

They rejected it on the grounds that they wanted an invstigation into the administration process cos if they had accepted it then it would have been closed.That way they can still get hold of the Money with regards to what thconditions that the FL imposed on SISU, (The attitude was fuck CCFC who gives a shit about the 10 point deduction)however the company is still not liquidated as far as I know

olderskyblue · Jul 14, 2014

Deleted member 5849 said:
Which makes their decision not to call their bluff utterly baffling, surely.

Ann Lucas has worked out you need to play the game...

You have a point, but then all we will get is a discussion about the Golden Cross.....

Astute · Jul 14, 2014

Cityfan1 said:
If as you say in the first instance that the appeal has no chance of being upheld, then there will be no additional costs to be incurred, so what stops ACL meeting with SISU to discuss the possibility of the club coming home. From my understanding of the appeal process, it cannot be put on hold, it has to be registered, or withdrawn, so if SISU withdrew the appeal they then could not reinstate it if they couldn't reach an agreement with ACL.

It is only SISU that seems not to want to make a deal to return our club. We can put pressure on CCC if the negotiations don't go well because of them and ACL. SISU on the other hand will just ignore us.

Deleted member 5849 · Jul 14, 2014

olderskyblue said:
You have a point, but then all we will get is a discussion about the Golden Cross.....

tbf, it *has* gone downhill!

blueflint · Jul 14, 2014

Grendel said:
Why would you - for what purpose?

because i still believe it was flawed and as such not worth considering

blueflint · Jul 14, 2014

there are more stabs in the back in this saga than in game of thrones

spider_ricoh · Jul 14, 2014

If I was ACL I would wait it out until SISU legal action fails. Presuming I could afford to do so, of course. SISU's only chance now appears to rest on ACL getting desperate to get the club back immediately as the legal process drags on, CCFC stay in Northampton and ACL have to shell out for lawyers (even if SISU lose and have to pay costs, these won't be paid for some time yet).

dongonzalos · Jul 14, 2014

Can Chris Robinson and Tim Fisher not give each other a call. Why does this have to be played out in the media?
Is it likely a deal will be struck this way?

dadgad · Jul 14, 2014

dongonzalos said:
Can Chris Robinson and Tim Fisher not give each other a call. Why does this have to be played out in the media?
Is it likely a deal will be struck this way?

Quite.

My guess is - because Sisu do not want a resolution.

spider_ricoh · Jul 14, 2014

dongonzalos said:
Can Chris Robinson and Tim Fisher not give each other a call. Why does this have to be played out in the media?
Is it likely a deal will be struck this way?

They are like 2 boxers sparring - trying to put pressure on each other. ACL want SISU to call of the legals to provide some breathing space for negotiation - SISU want to keep the pressure up so are appealing and also dragging out the process which harms ACL (and CCFC of course). SISU saw the public demand for talks on Saturday - they now think that if they sound open to talks without calling off the appeal, ACL can be painted as a baddie for insisting on the end of the appeal as a pre-condition to negotiation.

My other big worry is a section in today's statement that has not been commented on: "Suggestions the club could not leave Sixfields in time for next season were also dismissed by Mr Fisher.He said: “Of course we built in break clauses. We are committed to play at Sixfields for three years with a rolling option for a further two years whilst the new stadium is built.
[FONT=PT Sans, sans-serif]“Of course, the break clause is accompanied by a penalty payment.”
[/FONT]
I take this to mean that when it comes to negotiation, SISU will say "It will cost us £xx (let's say £100k for the sake of argument) to pay the break clause if we return right away to the Ricoh, ACL should pay this if they want us back, or it should be deducted from the rent we pay" - pure nonsense of course, as SISU chose to go to Northampton and were not forced out, but negotiation is all about going in looking like you want to earth, giving away things you're not bothered about as "concessions" and walking away with the deal you really wanted whilst looking like you have compromised.

lamtara2006 · Jul 14, 2014

Cityfan1 said:
If as you say in the first instance that the appeal has no chance of being upheld, then there will be no additional costs to be incurred, so what stops ACL meeting with SISU to discuss the possibility of the club coming home. From my understanding of the appeal process, it cannot be put on hold, it has to be registered, or withdrawn, so if SISU withdrew the appeal they then could not reinstate it if they couldn't reach an agreement with ACL.

Unfortunately, no party in a court proceeding of this nature ever recovers all of their costs. Even if they eventually get back the majority of solicitors' and barristers' fees, the indirect costs of the Council and ACL / Higgs officers time costs are unlikely to be recompensed. The leave to appeal has to be contested, if an appeal is granted there will be further time spent - all of which is a drain on the defendants.

There will be a time-window between the initial consideration by Mr Justice Hickinbottom and the matter coming before the Court of Appeal. It should be possible to 'call a truce' during that period in order to hold initial discussions.

CCFC PimpRail · Jul 14, 2014

I think SISU are waiting to fail or drop the appeal, then when damaged are awarded they can say "drop those, and we'll return at £200k plus pie money".

ACL- don't give in and dont even get back to the negotiating table until every penny due to you has been paid.

Sisu will not drop JR appeal (11 Viewers)

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