Team Leader? (1 Viewer)

The Philosopher · Aug 22, 2024

Was half expecting a “leader” type player to come in over this window.

Fadz, Kelly and even Gus and Cal were deemed to be “big voices” in the squad.

MR suggests that they are a “quiet bunch”.

Off field, AV was a strong character as too, I suspect, big Dennis Lawrence.

Just an observation, but unsure if it is better to have things this way and if it’s a deliberate strategy by DK.

Thoughts?

AJB1983 · Aug 22, 2024

I think watching all the unseen video’s I get the impression George Boateng has taken on that mantle from Adi/Dennis. To what extent the other coaches have I don’t know yet.

on the playing front there are leaders in there I think, maybe not in the same mould as Fadz, but I think there’s an element of leading by example and the way they hold themselves and work on the pitch, rather than the screaming at everyone.

Earlsdon_Skyblue1 · Aug 22, 2024

It's one of my only concerns for this season. We don't have many real leaders. When our backs are against the wall, we're going to find out I guess.

Tomh111 · Aug 22, 2024

I don't understand this 'Leadership' thing.

We have no idea what the players are really like, only what we see in clips.

I also don't agree that just shouting and being vocal is Leadership, but that seems to be what people are looking at?

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Skyblue Bangkok · Aug 22, 2024

Tomh111 said:
I don't understand this 'Leadership' thing.

We have no idea what the players are really like, only what we see in clips.

I also don't agree that just shouting and being vocal is Leadership, but that seems to be what people are looking at?

Sent from my SM-S911B using Tapatalk

I never get this leadership thing either .

Sky_Blue_Dreamer · Aug 22, 2024

Window isn't shut yet. We may still get a player of this ilk in.

Jamesimus · Aug 22, 2024

Tomh111 said:
I don't understand this 'Leadership' thing.

We have no idea what the players are really like, only what we see in clips.

I also don't agree that just shouting and being vocal is Leadership, but that seems to be what people are looking at?

Sent from my SM-S911B using Tapatalk

Yeah basically, these are the types of leader young people particularly seem to dislike / not respond well to anyway. Think people have to change their ideas about what a leader in the modern world may actually be.

clint van damme · Aug 22, 2024

Skyblue Bangkok said:
I never get this leadership thing either .

Watch the Stoke game, that should give you a clue!

Mr Panda · Aug 22, 2024

Only position I’m really bothered having a vocal leader is at the back to steady the line and keep it in shape

It’s hard to determine if we need one in the stereotypical mould we all think of when we hear the word “leader”. It depends what motivates the majority of players in the squad.

E.g. Goddens version of leadership from what I could see would have put me off personally

SAJ · Aug 22, 2024

Tomh111 said:
I don't understand this 'Leadership' thing.

We have no idea what the players are really like, only what we see in clips.

I also don't agree that just shouting and being vocal is Leadership, but that seems to be what people are looking at?

Sent from my SM-S911B using Tapatalk

The leadership thing is what both Kelly and Fadz did. They use their experience to talk the players through the closing off of games and making sure people are in the right position. They unfortunately comes from experience and tends to be more of a skill that defenders or midfield players rather than attackers have. When Fadz was here he constantly talked to everyone that at present is missing.

Mucca Mad Boys · Aug 22, 2024

Skyblue Bangkok said:
I never get this leadership thing either .

Did you miss the L1 and early championship days? Kelly and McFadz were instrumental in organising the team. Even in the 22/23 season with the superstardom of Vik and Hamer, our solid defence was the foundation.

Perennial Lurker · Aug 22, 2024

Mucca Mad Boys said:
Did you miss the L1 and early championship days? Kelly and McFadz were instrumental in organising the team. Even in the 22/23 season with the superstardom of Vik and Hamer, our solid defence was the foundation.

We were effectively playing a back 8 which helped

biggymania · Aug 22, 2024

We've got how many first team coaches now... serious but ignorant question - why do we need a leader on the pitch?

bawtryneal · Aug 22, 2024

Wait a couple of days and we may have our “leader”

Cally Fedora · Aug 22, 2024

I think age is often equated to fitting this leadership role. From what I’ve seen this year the leadership mantle seems to be adequately covered by the likes of Milan, Binks, Bidwell and Wright

StrettoBoy · Aug 22, 2024

Perennial Lurker said:
We were effectively playing a back 8 which helped

Not a patch on our current front 8.

Hincha · Aug 23, 2024

The Stoke goal and the reaction from the team to going behind, coupled with two sloppy goals conceded against a newly promoted side which nearly cost us, is enough to show that we need a dominant player/organiser/leader in either midfield or central defence.

itsabuzzard · Aug 23, 2024

StrettoBoy said:
Not a patch on our current front 8.

A sixteen man team might have me running to the bookies to put a tenner on winning the title.

ProfessorbyGrace · Aug 23, 2024

Has modern football ‘evolved’ beyond a team captain/leader?

I disagree that such a role can be shared amongst many players, as the advice and guidance may vary, instructions will also vary if one or more decides they know best and undermines the collective objective.

It does happen in a team, without a strong leadership figure.

Mucca Mad Boys · Aug 23, 2024

ProfessorbyGrace said:
Has modern football ‘evolved’ beyond a team captain/leader?

I disagree that such a role can be shared amongst many players, as the advice and guidance may vary, instructions will also vary if one or more decides they know best and undermines the collective objective.

It does happen in a team, without a strong leadership figure.

No. Leadership is the single most important thing for any team/organisation. The manager is a leader but they also need players on the pitch to act as lieutenants.

Kelly and McFadz were able to punch well above their weight for us because of this. In reality, neither player was good enough to be at Championship level.

ProfessorbyGrace · Aug 23, 2024

Mucca Mad Boys said:
No. Leadership is the single most important thing for any team/organisation. The manager is a leader but they also need players on the pitch to act as lieutenants.

Kelly and McFadz were able to punch well above their weight for us because of this. In reality, neither player was good enough to be at Championship level.

This is essentially what I was alluding to, regarding the necessity of a ‘lieutenant’ on-field - I don’t personally understand the concept of a shared leadership on-field, which has been mentioned a few times. Such a system does not work, at all.

The burning question for me, directed at those who attend more games than I do, is Sheaf an able ‘lieutenant’?

Boicey · Aug 23, 2024

biggymania said:
We've got how many first team coaches now... serious but ignorant question - why do we need a leader on the pitch?

Because we need someone on the pitch who can get around the players, giving energy, lifting heads, spreading messages, getting onto the ref, even getting the crowd going.
Someone who looks at a team perspective and motivation on the pitch rather than just doing their job.

Boicey · Aug 23, 2024

ProfessorbyGrace said:
This is essentially what I was alluding to, regarding the necessity of a ‘lieutenant’ on-field - I don’t personally understand the concept of a shared leadership on-field, which has been mentioned a few times. Such a system does not work, at all.

The burning question for me, directed at those who attend more games than I do, is Sheaf an able ‘lieutenant’?

I think Sheaf is respected but I don't think he's outgoing, vocal or overtly passionate enough to motivate enough on the pitch.

The Philosopher · Aug 23, 2024

Some good points being made here.

Personally, I’d like someone to get in amongst the other side’s bullies, be in the ear of the ref, organise the back line from free kicks and corners etc. Doyle was good in the lower leagues, Luton had Sonny Bradley on their promotion season.

When Tats gets clattered or MVE has to duck a punch or we get caught out of position in defence we could do with someone to get in the grill of the ref and person fouling, get a hard (but fair) tackle in, lift the atmosphere so the ref blows up next time.

Wilson wasn’t the best goalkeeper in the world 18 months ago but kept plenty of clean sheets. Our defence was well organised.

Our squad is far better now in terms of technical ability and quality and depth.

Maybe times have changed and Sheaf is the type of leader we need, maybe I’m old fashioned to have expected a big character to have been brought in. Maybe Lati or MVE will pick up the role in some way.

Let’s see.

Tomh111 · Aug 23, 2024

It comes down to people and personality, honestly.

But for me, if somebody is shouting and bawling at me, it will not motivate me. Leadership to me is via example - like Bidwell in training and application, like MVE in output.

I've also never known a referee in any sport or level respond to being shouted at or chased or harassed. I think that's a dated view, but again others will disagree.

At the end of it, I trust MR to make the decisions on signings and personality, but my original point was that I don't see the need for a mouthy/shouty type in the same way others do.

Also, I don't think either Oxford goal is impacted by 'organisation' to me Simms bottled the clearance worrying about giving a penalty in a 50/50 and the other we were just too open.

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Earlsdon_Skyblue1 · Aug 23, 2024

Anyone who has played football in whatever variety of standards understands the importance of having good leadership on the pitch. You can have all the talent in the world, but unless you can work as a team, it gets you nowhere. I've played in good teams where no one shouts man on, or let's you know where the opposition are, and don't dig in when you are under pressure, and I have played in a team of misfits who have beaten the best teams in the league by being organised and communicating well.

If you are taking a battering, the stronger players on the pitch take the game by the scruff of the neck and you fight and have each others back until you get back in it, or until the whistle goes. It doesn't mean moaning all the time, or bollocking someone if they make a mistake. You motivate each other, but expect the highest standard at the same time. I don't understand this concept that football is like FIFA and everyone is a robot. Leadership is massively important, and whilst I am sceptical of how much we have of that in our squad at present, hopefully under the new management regime we'll see some players step up.

edgy · Aug 26, 2024

bawtryneal said:
Wait a couple of days and we may have our “leader”

Got some knowledge BN?

Winny the Bish · Aug 26, 2024

The Philosopher said:
Was half expecting a “leader” type player to come in over this window.

Fadz, Kelly and even Gus and Cal were deemed to be “big voices” in the squad.

MR suggests that they are a “quiet bunch”.

Off field, AV was a strong character as too, I suspect, big Dennis Lawrence.

Just an observation, but unsure if it is better to have things this way and if it’s a deliberate strategy by DK.

Thoughts?

Boateng and Delaney are both former players, neither of them strike me as quiet wallflowers at all.

Sky Blue Goblin · Aug 26, 2024

To be fair leaders who can come in and drive the team are rare to come by. Assume Ben will try and slot that role as the captain.

I remember adi’s words about how Doyle drove the team on by his want to win. Wish he was free for the assistant role and not at Woking. Feel he would of been a massive influence on the touch line.

withnail · Aug 26, 2024

Dennis Wise, what a difference he made, transformed that team in to a battling unit overnight. To be fair, if he can still run, I’d have in back in the team now.

Skyblue Bangkok · Aug 26, 2024

withnail said:
Dennis Wise, what a difference he made, transformed that team in to a battling unit overnight. To be fair, if he can still run, I’d have in back in the team now.

If you go by shouty types , Roy Keane brilliant player but average manager . Don't think that type of thing works anymore.

The Philosopher · Aug 26, 2024

It’s about balance. WRT Keane and Doyle, IMHO they would make excellent assistant managers to more tactical / cerebral / encouraging / supportive type managers.

In my lifetime, our purple patches have been managed by Sillett / Curtis and Robins / Vivash. Briefly (and I’ll stand by this) the brief period where Eric Black was supported by Archie Knox was a purple patch and would have flourished had it been allowed to.

Some players need nurturing, some a bit of focus and discipline, many a combination of the two.

I also think that in the field you need a bit of a leader to stick up for certain players, to direct players whose effort levels have dropped, encourage belief when heads drop, calm players if overly fired up.

These are just my views as an outsider.

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