The World Cup Thread (36 Viewers)

CCFC88 · Jul 9, 2018

I have no bias, just providing opinions from people that understand the game more than you do.

I would suggest your view "I have just seen zero evidence that he offers enough to the team." has been largely disputed by all of the writers who understand football better than you do.

I suppose we'll agree to disagree and on Thursday morning, if he's played badly your line will be, I told you so, if he plays well you will revert back to "I'll be really happy if he scores should we get to the final"

Mucca Mad Boys · Jul 9, 2018

CCFC88 said:
So you think the opinion you have formed is more reliable and worthy than the manager that's picked him week in week out in one of the best Prem sides of all time and the England manager who's taken the national side to its first semi in 28 years?

Having you're own opinion is great, and encouraged, shouting it at people over and over again on internet forums doesn't make it correct.

This has been one of the most juvenile discussion I’ve had on here.

There’s zero acceptance of the merits Sterling brings to the team. None whatsoever. There’s an ignorance of other people’s opinions, and of the statistics put forward too. The argument reeks of arrogance too, because as you point out, @Earlsdon_Skyblue1 is essentially saying he knows better than Southgate and Pep. Plus, how patronising is the point that the only reason Southgate is selecting him is because ‘he’s not changing a winning team’, which infers he’s stupid. Evidently, he’s not and has lead England to its best World Cup campaign in my lifetime.

Deleted member 5849 · Jul 9, 2018

Mucca Mad Boys said:
@Earlsdon_Skyblue1 is essentially saying he knows better than Southgate and Pep.

Now... I think Earlsdon is slightly wrong, but see where he's coming from (now and again!). The 'manager must know better' line, though, takes away all debate about selections whatsoever!

Even the best get it wrong and, tbh, although Southgate is having a very good tournament so far, he's yet to prove himself as a top manager by having success over a sustained period, and one of his weaknesses does potentially seem to be an inflexibility to change things during a game.

As it happens(!) I'd play Sterling next game no question, but that's my opinion, and in no way influenced by whether the manager agrees with me or not. I wouldn't have played him against Sweden - turned out the manager was right and I was wrong. Great! Would rather it that way around.

But... managers make mistakes!

I_Saw_Shaw_Score · Jul 9, 2018

Croatia assistant manager sacked.

Deleted member 5849 · Jul 9, 2018

I_Saw_Shaw_Score said:
Croatia assistant manager sacked.

A semi final not good enough?

I_Saw_Shaw_Score · Jul 9, 2018

Deleted member 5849 said:
A semi final not good enough?

Something to do with an anti Russia video him and fella with the ponytail (Vida?) made after the game on Saturday.

SkyblueBazza · Jul 9, 2018

Earlsdon_Skyblue1 said:
What would it take? It would take more than just one average performance in an international tournament from a player who some have branded around as world class. All I've seen is the same shit.

I wasn't sure about Henderson, Pickford, or Maguire but they have been brilliant and I'm happy that's the case. I'm more than happy to admit maybe I've been harsh on them.

The day Sterling starts performing even half as good as some say he is I will be happy for him, and certainly happy to be proved wrong.

I've said this from the start but there is absolutely no way he's proved that this tournament. I've got zero basis to believe I'm wrong with him and if anything he has more people on his back than ever. It isn't just a conspiracy...

You dont think he distracts the opposition then? They know what damage he is capable of doing. So they watch him like a hawk in open play...that allows a little more time on the ball for others. Just like they are so busy watching Harry Kane on set pieces...& up pops Harry Macguire!

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Deleted member 5849 · Jul 9, 2018

I_Saw_Shaw_Score said:
Something to do with an anti Russia video him and fella with the ponytail (Vida?) made after the game on Saturday.

They'll be swimming with the fishes soon enough then!

I_Saw_Shaw_Score · Jul 9, 2018

Otis · Jul 9, 2018

I_Saw_Shaw_Score said:

He wasn't too bad I don't think.

Which games did he ref?

I_Saw_Shaw_Score · Jul 9, 2018

Otis said:
He wasn't too bad I don't think.

Which games did he ref?

Iran v Morocco
Nigeria v Argentina

He’s been round for years sure involved in controversy sure Chelsea v Barca game/s!? (Saying that which ref hasnt)

I_Saw_Shaw_Score · Jul 9, 2018

Does anyone know if yellow cards are wiped out after the quarters?

covmark · Jul 9, 2018

I_Saw_Shaw_Score said:
Does anyone know if yellow cards are wiped out after the quarters?

Yes they are

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Otis · Jul 9, 2018

Yep. Clean slate.

Only a red now will result in missing the final.

Covstu · Jul 9, 2018

I think one thing is for sure, Southgate hasn’t been afraid to make any changes or make some big decisions when picking his team. He clearly feels sterling and Alli are playing a key role for him and doesn’t need to change it.nhe fact that it might cause a bit of an issue on social media if he dropped him is nonsense in my opinion. If he wasn’t serving a purpose he would have dropped him

I_Saw_Shaw_Score · Jul 9, 2018

covmark said:
Yes they are

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Cheers thought it had, makes sense!

Mucca Mad Boys · Jul 9, 2018

Deleted member 5849 said:
Now... I think Earlsdon is slightly wrong, but see where he's coming from (now and again!). The 'manager must know better' line, though, takes away all debate about selections whatsoever!

Even the best get it wrong and, tbh, although Southgate is having a very good tournament so far, he's yet to prove himself as a top manager by having success over a sustained period, and one of his weaknesses does potentially seem to be an inflexibility to change things during a game.

As it happens(!) I'd play Sterling next game no question, but that's my opinion, and in no way influenced by whether the manager agrees with me or not. I wouldn't have played him against Sweden - turned out the manager was right and I was wrong. Great! Would rather it that way around.

But... managers make mistakes!

It’s pretty obvious managers make mistakes. But when most of the people who actually know their football (managers, analysts and so on) are supporting Sterling, it should at least make you see the other side of the argument and to drop the egotism. When I was 15, I held the attitude that certain players could do no good. For England, Milner was useless, Platt and Doyle could do no good for Coventry City. No one could convince me otherwise — which is clearly a dumb way to think.

My claim wasn’t so much that managers ‘can do no wrong’, but I am saying we should put faith in the manager who’s lead us to a semi final for the first time in a generation. Who’s been in the job for less than 2 years. His approach to the job has been meticulous and professional and he has a pretty clear vision of how he wants us to play. It’s not like in 2014 and 2016 where we had no idea of how we wanted to play or what system to use. So, the argument that the only reason Sterling is playing is to ‘not change a winning team’ is rather insulting and/or patronising, at least in my view. The World Cup is a knock out tournament so you don’t have time to stick with players that aren’t performing. Sterling dribbles the most in our team and we’re a team that has far less completed dribbles than France and Belgium, for example. So taking Sterling out of the team would be to the detriment of the team. Who’d his replacement be? Rashford? So, the reason we drop Sterling is because he missed a glorious opportunity and we replace him with a player who also missed a clear cut opportunity? If he misses in what is effectively a dead rubber match, how will he cope in a semi-final of a World Cup? It doesn’t make sense.

Earlsdon_Skyblue1 · Jul 9, 2018

Mucca Mad Boys said:
This has been one of the most juvenile discussion I’ve had on here.

There’s zero acceptance of the merits Sterling brings to the team. None whatsoever. There’s an ignorance of other people’s opinions, and of the statistics put forward too. The argument reeks of arrogance too, because as you point out, @Earlsdon_Skyblue1 is essentially saying he knows better than Southgate and Pep. Plus, how patronising is the point that the only reason Southgate is selecting him is because ‘he’s not changing a winning team’, which infers he’s stupid. Evidently, he’s not and has lead England to its best World Cup campaign in my lifetime.

It is only a juvenile discussion because you refuse to accept Sterling has some justified critisim.

What statistics has Sterling got that I am missing then? No goals in 23 games. Sitter miss after miss. Your argument that he brings so much to the team by having one dribble in four which scares defences is really bottom of the barrel stuff.

It is not arrogance to say I think the manager has it wrong. I think he has most things right apart from this. I was told on here by you and others that this player would be unstoppable and prove me and other doubters wrong. There has literally been fuck all evidence of this. You have nothing.

It smacks of desperate because all I'm hearing is 'he isn't in the team to score goals' and all that regular apologist shit that is coming out the woodwork now.

As I said, Sterling won't get dropped no matter how poor he is. Southgate won't change a winning team. He was average against Sweden (apparantley world class in comparison to his dismal performances in the earlier games). He was the worst player on the pitch in the first two games overall without doubt. We won them though so he wasn't dropped.

You are so keen to defend him you are blinded by it and cannot see it for what it is. It's making you look really silly.

Earlsdon_Skyblue1 · Jul 9, 2018

SkyblueBazza said:
You dont think he distracts the opposition then? They know what damage he is capable of doing. So they watch him like a hawk in open play...that allows a little more time on the ball for others. Just like they are so busy watching Harry Kane on set pieces...& up pops Harry Macguire!

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I think if a player is in a team purely to distract the opposition than you have to question why they cannot do anything else. It's like the special kid in class award or something.

At the start of the tournament people weren't telling me he was in the team to do that and this was what would win me over. They were telling me he would score plenty and assist a lot of goals.

That's not happened so now the goalposts have moved. The obsession with defending him over everything is something I worry will be our teams downfall.

We have been good this tournament, but we have ridden our luck against very average opponents.

Mucca Mad Boys · Jul 9, 2018

Earlsdon_Skyblue1 said:
It is only a juvenile discussion because you refuse to accept Sterling has some justified critisim.

What statistics has Sterling got that I am missing then? No goals in 23 games. Sitter miss after miss. Your argument that he brings so much to the team by having one dribble in four which scares defences is really bottom of the barrel stuff.

It is not arrogance to say I think the manager has it wrong. I think he has most things right apart from this. I was told on here by you and others that this player would be unstoppable and prove me and other doubters wrong. There has literally been fuck all evidence of this. You have nothing.

It smacks of desperate because all I'm hearing is 'he isn't in the team to score goals' and all that regular apologist shit that is coming out the woodwork now.

As I said, Sterling won't get dropped no matter how poor he is. Southgate won't change a winning team. He was average against Sweden (apparantley world class in comparison to his dismal performances in the earlier games). He was the worst player on the pitch in the first two games overall without doubt. We won them though so he wasn't dropped.

You are so keen to defend him you are blinded by it and cannot see it for what it is. It's making you look really silly.

No. You’re wrong. I’ve very clearly stated on numerous occasions that he should’ve done better.

Westendlad · Jul 9, 2018

If we were playing a 4-4-2 and Sterling was up front with Kane then rightly so he shouldn't be playing.

Gazolba · Jul 10, 2018

Johnnythespider said:
The thing with Sterling is it doesn't matter if he misses chances so long as we're winning, but if we are 1 down and he gets a chance to equalise in the 90th minute and misses it's a different story. It's, to a lesser degree, like Biamou last season, which is why I'm surprised to see some who called out Max last season defending Sterling.

Hopefully if we are one down toward the end of a game, Sterling will be taken off and replaced by a goal scorer.
It's all well and good 'creating space' but at some point, you need to create goals.

Westendlad · Jul 10, 2018

Well we won't be one down...Think positive

dutchman · Jul 10, 2018

The way I see it England are on a hiding to nothing.

If they win everyone will say "Well what do you expect against a lousy team like Croatia?" and if they lose everyone will say "Couldn't even even beat a lousy team like Croatia".

Gazolba · Jul 10, 2018

dutchman said:
The way I see it England are on a hiding to nothing.

If they win everyone will say "Well what do you expect against a lousy team like Croatia?" and if they lose everyone will say "Couldn't even even beat a lousy team like Croatia".

Disagree. If we win, everyone will be over the moon that we have reached the final and completely forget about Croatia.
If we lose, everyone will say we already exceeded expectations in reaching the semis.
Now if we go on to win the whole thing, some people will say, we had an easier path to the trophy than any previous winner.

wingy · Jul 10, 2018

Mucca Mad Boys said:
This has been one of the most juvenile discussion I’ve had on here.

There’s zero acceptance of the merits Sterling brings to the team. None whatsoever. There’s an ignorance of other people’s opinions, and of the statistics put forward too. The argument reeks of arrogance too, because as you point out, @Earlsdon_Skyblue1 is essentially saying he knows better than Southgate and Pep. Plus, how patronising is the point that the only reason Southgate is selecting him is because ‘he’s not changing a winning team’, which infers he’s stupid. Evidently, he’s not and has lead England to its best World Cup campaign in my lifetime.

I really don't care
It's just my opinion
Drawn from using my eyes
Not having a dialogue
You're all entitled to your opinions
I don't mind being in a sample of two on this thread

SIR ERNIE · Jul 10, 2018

Earlsdon_Skyblue1 said:
Sweden are rubbish. What did you make of them yesterday exactly?

I suggest you do what I did and watch them play in all of their internationals and come back to me with an apology. They would struggle in the championship.

Hahaha nice one, gave me a good chuckle that did, love it.

Mucca Mad Boys · Jul 10, 2018

wingy said:
I really don't care
It's just my opinion
Drawn from using my eyes
Not having a dialogue
You're all entitled to your opinions
I don't mind being in a sample of two on this thread

Ofc everyone is entitled to their opinions, but it’s annoying when my opinions are deliberately misrepresented.

I’m not bothered about team selection as long as results follow. So far, they’ve been the best in a generation and with Croatia in the semi-final, an opportunity to reach the final.

Our success hasn’t been down to tearing teams apart from open play, in fact, it’s completely the opposite with 72% of our goals coming from set-pieces. Even Harry Kane hasn’t played particularly well this tournament, half of his goals have been penalties and another a fortunate deflection from a shot he had no idea about. His best game was probably against Tunisia.

Deleted member 5849 · Jul 10, 2018

Mucca Mad Boys said:
Even Harry Kane hasn’t played particularly well this tournament

He was superb against Colombia.

shmmeee · Jul 10, 2018

Jesus some people seem to think you can look at the match stats after a game and judge everything you need to know for team selection.

Mucca Mad Boys · Jul 10, 2018

Deleted member 5849 said:
He was superb against Colombia.

It was a selfless performance, but it’s pretty fair to say he’s not been at his vintage best as he is for Spurs. He’s taking half the shots he does for Spurs and when take into account just half his shots have been penalties... That is something that Southgate has to address. We’re getting better as the tournament is progressing because we needed to be more direct against Sweden than against Colombia and Tunisia (in particular) and we did that. Next, we need to find a way to create chances for Kane.

shmmeee said:
Jesus some people seem to think you can look at the match stats after a game and judge everything you need to know for team selection.

Yeah, because who needs facts nowadays?

Earlsdon_Skyblue1 · Jul 10, 2018

shmmeee said:
Jesus some people seem to think you can look at the match stats after a game and judge everything you need to know for team selection.

In fairness my judgments have been made up and topped up over a long period of time. Stats on paper can often mean nothing anyway.

We beat Barnsley 4-3 at home a couple of seasons ago and that sounds really thrilling. The reality was it was the most boring 7 goal thrIller I have ever seen.

Earlsdon_Skyblue1 · Jul 10, 2018

Mucca Mad Boys said:
It was a selfless performance, but it’s pretty fair to say he’s not been at his vintage best as he is for Spurs. He’s taking half the shots he does for Spurs and when take into account just half his shots have been penalties... That is something that Southgate has to address. We’re getting better as the tournament is progressing because we needed to be more direct against Sweden than against Colombia and Tunisia (in particular) and we did that. Next, we need to find a way to create chances for Kane.

Yeah, because who needs facts nowadays?

I agree, Kane hasn't been at his very best, but he has still been there at the vital moment when we've needed him. Three smashing penalties and also a late header have got us to where we are now.

I think it is a bit silly to act as if Sterling has played well and constantly defend him, yet come out and say Kane needs to improve.

You've sort of answered your own question when you say we need to find a way to create chances for Kane. The main person who should be doing this is not.

Anyway, let's hope Sterling scores a hatrick tomorow and shuts me up!

wingy · Jul 10, 2018

Earlsdon_Skyblue1 said:
In fairness my judgments have been made up and topped up over a long period of time. Stats on paper can often mean nothing anyway.

We beat Barnsley 4-3 at home a couple of seasons ago and that sounds really thrilling. The reality was it was the most boring 7 goal thrIller I have ever seen.

A game where we went 2-0 up in twenty minutes V a team who hadn't won or scored many for around twenty matches
To nearly losing or drawing but for a Worldy free kick
League leaders to also rans.
From that point on the dynamic changed.

ccfchoi87 · Jul 10, 2018

I'm happy with young against either mbappe or hazard. Young is probably the only premiership full back to do a job on Salah last year. Will be interesting if we do lose to see if all the others get a run against Belgium/France or if we'll play to win.

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