Time to focus on the other end of the pitch (1 Viewer)

Otis

Well-Known Member
Before I start can I say that this is not an anti Thorn thread as such.

I alluded to this in another post yesterday. The fact is that I think we are focusing on the wrong end of the pitch. It is all about defensive mistakes and I think we are missing the point.

Mistakes are going to happen at the back. It goes with the territory.

1. When you are at the bottom of the table players lose confidence and are nervous and are more likely to make mistakes.

2. The fact that we are still only scoring at an average of less than one goal a game means that even more emphasis is put on the defence to keep clean sheets and this in turn can then lead to more mistakes.

It's a Catch 22 situation. The more we try to cut out mistakes but don't score the more the likelihood we won't win and the more we don't win the more the pressure on the defence and the more the pressure on the defence, then the more chance of mistakes. Vicious circle.

If you are scoring goals a bit more freely then that takes the weight off the defence. I know we have squad and player limitations but I think we really need to have a bit more of a go and concentrate on the attack rather than trying to keep things tight all the time (the constant passing of the ball in our own half for instance).

What do we have to lose now? We are looking doomed anyway. Why not try and play 3 up front or go for a much more attacking formation? We are not creating enough chances in games and we are not scoring enough. Pretty much all our crosses come from the fullback positions and our fullbacks are not the best crossers of the ball. Hussey's reasonably good, but Christie more hit and miss and so too Wood, Clarke and Keogh.

McSheffey has got a good cross on him.

In conclusion, I suggest we try and push up a few yards, try and get the ball forwards more quickly and try and get the midfield to support the attack.

What do we have to lose? Could also make the football more exciting and a little less predictable.

I really do think that all our focus is on our defence and the stopping of us making mistakes, but that we are missing the bigger picture, which is one of us not scoring enough or creating enough at the other end, which in turn leads to more defensive errors.

As I say, I am well aware of our limitations, but we do keep leaving a goalscorer on the bench. Let's try and accommodate Cody McDonald somewhere in the team so we have a bit more firepower.

We look down and out anyway, so what do we have to lose? Let's start going for much more attacking formations for once. It's worth a try surely? We are far too cautious at present and the pressure of the bottom of the table positions we have held have induced more mistakes at the back.

We do have attacking players in our squad (Baker, McSheff, Juke, Platt, McDonald) so there is the opportunity to try out a more attacking line-up.

Just think the defensive mistakes are going to get worse the further adrift we get and with the defence knowing we don't score enough this is just compounded.
 

superskyblue

Well-Known Member
Agreed, there is definitely no harm in trying to go out and win games. Not much point in us containing so we can lose 2-1. May as well lose 4-1 and give it a proper go.
 

Otis

Well-Known Member
Yep. AT keeps talking about us not getting trounced. A lot of this is down to the fact that we retain the ball for long periods with our possession football. It's not hurting anyone though.

If we change to a more attacking formation and do end up losing a few games by 3 or 4 goals we can always revert back. If we don't give it a go though we'll never know will we.

Let's go out and try and attack teams. When we get that first goal we need to go all out into getting the 2nd. We try and keep things tight at the moment and invariably we let goes in at the other end.
 

Disorganised1

New Member
I'd like to see us getting more accurate in our approach, too many balls are lost before we get into the target area.

City 'til I die
 

shmmeee

Well-Known Member
Been saying this as long as we've been in this league.

Championship defences are generally shit. Attack is always the best form of defence.

For proof just look to what happens when we are trying to hold on and the entire team drops back to about 20 yards from goal. The pressure increases as the ball keeps coming back and invariably the other team score because our defence isn't good enough.
 

Grendel

Well-Known Member
Yep. AT keeps talking about us not getting trounced. A lot of this is down to the fact that we retain the ball for long periods with our possession football. It's not hurting anyone though.

If we change to a more attacking formation and do end up losing a few games by 3 or 4 goals we can always revert back. If we don't give it a go though we'll never know will we.

Let's go out and try and attack teams. When we get that first goal we need to go all out into getting the 2nd. We try and keep things tight at the moment and invariably we let goes in at the other end.

It is true - the game we played with any intensity and some width was the first 60 minutes against West Ham. We looked interested and could have won. If those performances were replicated in other matches against worse teams we would have more points than now. Of course this is down to motivation and tactics whichever way you cut it.
 

Houchens Head

Fairly well known member from Malvern
I've always maintained that if you don't have a goal scored against you, then you won't lose the match. You may only have a draw, but at least it's a point! So, yes, I agree, defence needs tightening up.
 

Gaz

Well-Known Member
Tbf Blackpool got out of this league by just going all out attack.
 

Otis

Well-Known Member
It would be entertaining at least even if we do still get beaten every week.
 

shmmeee

Well-Known Member
I've always maintained that if you don't have a goal scored against you, then you won't lose the match. You may only have a draw, but at least it's a point! So, yes, I agree, defence needs tightening up.

But by sitting off and dropping back you increase pressure on the defence.
 

torchomatic

Well-Known Member
I agree. It is so frustrating at home when we've done about 247 passes but actually moved the ball forward about two yards.

Another Coventry City affliction is lack of shooting, which to be fair to Thorn has been happening for years. I always remember Isaac Osbourne more or less on the goal line trying to pass it for someone else to shoot.

Players should just have a go, it if it ends up in the stand then so be it, but at least we've made the effort.

It would be entertaining at least even if we do still get beaten every week.
 

TheHellion

New Member
If we pushed on, I think it would do 2 things.

Firstly, it might actually relieve some of the pressure on the defence later on in games, therefore it might actually help cut out mistakes at the back. Not to mention it might actually give us goals?

Secondly, and possibly more importantly, it would show that there is a fighting spirit in the team. A will to go and try and win games, something that shows some inspiring effort. That in turn would lift the crowd, and you know what, even if you lose, if you've played your heart out and given it everything, then at least you can say you've given it a damn good go. What did Steve Bleasdale say? "When there's a battle, you battle!"

And yes, Torch. Me and the old gaffer have been saying as long as I can remember that nobody has a go. You'll never know if you don't have a go.
 

stupot07

Well-Known Member
The problem is torchy, we aren't the most tolerant of fans and if some has a shit shot the crowd groan and fans start shouting 'that's rubbish/your rubbish/get him off/he's useless/why didnt he pass it' (i've omitted the accompanying expletives)
 

torchomatic

Well-Known Member
Oh, I agree. The term "they are never happy" is never more apt than when applied to us. Personally, I would rather have a "shit shot" than no shot at all.

The problem is torchy, we aren't the most tolerant of fans and if some has a shit shot the crowd groan and fans start shouting 'that's rubbish/your rubbish/get him off/he's useless/why didnt he pass it' (i've omitted the accompanying expletives)
 

stupot07

Well-Known Member
Oh, I agree. The term "they are never happy" is never more apt than when applied to us. Personally, I would rather have a "shit shot" than no shot at all.

I agree....as my old footy manager used to say "you can't win the lottery if you don't buy a ticket!"
 

SkyBlue_Bear83

Well-Known Member
Meh personally that is one of the things that really annoy me, when a player takes a shot from a stupid position and it ends up further away from the goal from where he struck it.
 

WillieStanley

New Member
"We seem to live on our knees, I'd rather die on our feet"

although we're dying on our knees anyway!!

ATTACK!! ATTACK!!
 

shmmeee

Well-Known Member
Meh personally that is one of the things that really annoy me, when a player takes a shot from a stupid position and it ends up further away from the goal from where he struck it.

McShittrey is criminal for this. The guy hasn't scored from distance since 2006 but he still tries it when better options are on.
 

SkyBlue_Bear83

Well-Known Member
McShittrey is criminal for this. The guy hasn't scored from distance since 2006 but he still tries it when better options are on.
Yea I was going to single him out but decided not too. If there is a good opening and you have time to set yourself by all means have a go.
But when Sheff does it he is running at speed at an unfavourable angle, 35 yards out and a bouncing ball and he tries a shot. :facepalm:

Most of the time he just shins it out for a goal kick.
 

Nonleagueherewecome

Well-Known Member
I agree. It is so frustrating at home when we've done about 247 passes but actually moved the ball forward about two yards.

Another Coventry City affliction is lack of shooting, which to be fair to Thorn has been happening for years. I always remember Isaac Osbourne more or less on the goal line trying to pass it for someone else to shoot.

Players should just have a go, it if it ends up in the stand then so be it, but at least we've made the effort.

I can remember a good dozen Isaac shots, all from outside the area, and not a single one on target. He was always in more danger of troubling the corner flag than the goal, but he did have a go in his last few seasons.

Equally, I'd say the one player who does have a go from distance-and usually puts it in the stands-is McSheffrey. He gets nothing but howls of derision for it!
 

Nonleagueherewecome

Well-Known Member
The problem is torchy, we aren't the most tolerant of fans and if some has a shit shot the crowd groan and fans start shouting 'that's rubbish/your rubbish/get him off/he's useless/why didnt he pass it' (i've omitted the accompanying expletives)

I should have read the rest of the thread before I replied :facepalm:
 

sw88

Chief Commentator!
Tbf Blackpool got out of this league by just going all out attack.

Swansea did something similar in the way they played. Even in the Prem this yr, they arent conceding too many goals, and if you dont concede, you've got a chance of winning.

I liked the way they were set up, and Southampton tried something similar this season, and their not doing too badly.
 

Nonleagueherewecome

Well-Known Member
Swansea did something similar in the way they played. Even in the Prem this yr, they arent conceding too many goals, and if you dont concede, you've got a chance of winning.

I liked the way they were set up, and Southampton tried something similar this season, and their not doing too badly.

For the previous 2 seasons, Swansea were rock solid at the back-they just couldn't score. Rangel/Monk/Tait/Williams have been playing together for years and are a quality unit. Their problem was, they couldn't score. Sinclair massively transformed that problem along with other pacy players like Dyer-suddenly, they could play on the counter-attack, and the result was promotion.
 

SkyBlue_Bear83

Well-Known Member
Anyway not sure if going gung ho in attack is the right way, teams like Palace and Hull score a similar amount of goals to us but there brilliant defence has took them up the league. All the best teams are built on a good defence.

We have failed to keep a clean sheet in the last 9 games
In those 9 games we have only failed to score once
If we could have kept 2-3 clean sheets in these 9 games that is potentially 6 more points on the board.
 

Otis

Well-Known Member
But we don't have a good defence do we and being at the bottom of the league can only increase the nervousness amongst the back four.
 

SkyBlue_Bear83

Well-Known Member
But we don't have a good defence do we and being at the bottom of the league can only increase the nervousness amongst the back four.
We don't have a good attack either. We have had a reasonably solid defence over the last few years and that seems to be undone now.

In 6/9 last games we have conceded 2+ goals, we are never going to score 3+ goals so the best we can hope for is a point in these game if we somehow manage to score 2.
 

Otis

Well-Known Member
We don't have a good attack either. We have had a reasonably solid defence over the last few years and that seems to be undone now.

In 6/9 last games we have conceded 2+ goals, we are never going to score 3+ goals so the best we can hope for is a point in these game if we somehow manage to score 2.

Don't understand your logic. The whole point is to attack so we aren't on the defence and then there's a chance that we aren't conceding 2+ goals per game. We are conceding 2+ goals a game because we are playing deep and then giving the ball away. How do you know we don't have a good attack anyway? McDonald has hardly been given a chance yet has he. Thorn hasn't gone out to attack any team yet this season has he!

Play a system where he can be utilised and go for an attacking formation. Why not try going on the attack for once? As I said before McSheffrey is an attacking player, Baker is an attacking player, Gardner is an attacking player, so too McDonald, Juke and Platt. We have enough options to at least give it a go.
 
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SkyBlue_Bear83

Well-Known Member
Don't understand your logic. The whole point is to attack so we aren't on the defence and then there's a chance that we aren't conceding 2+ goals per game. We are conceding 2+ goals a game because we are playing deep and then giving the ball away. How do you know we don't have a good attack anyway? McDonald has hardly been given a chance yet has he. Thorn hasn't gone out to attack any team yet this season has he!

Play a system where he can be utilised and go for an attacking formation. Why not try going on the attack for once? As I said before McSheffrey is an attacking player, Baker is an attacking player, Gardner is an attacking player, so too McDonald, Juke and Platt. We have enough options to at least give it a go.
Mcsheffrey and Baker aren't consistently good enough and Gardner is only here for a month, Platt is what he is and Mcdonald is unproven although admitaedly has been given much of a chance. That leaves Juke, that is how I know we don't have a good attack, simple logic.

I know we need to offer more of a goal threat but we also need to tighten the defence considerably, if we could defend we would be ok. Teams that score a similar amount of goals to us are in the top half because they have a solid defence.

Scoring more goals isn't going to solve much if we concede 2+ goals every game.

Just saw the Pompey goals and they were absolutely appalling, if we were competent at defending we would have had at least a point from the game.
 

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