Tory Monopoly (2 Viewers)

cloughie · Sep 12, 2015

So Corbyn is the death of democracy ? Amazing I suppose cameron and osbourne are true democrats are they

yet the Tory majority relies on the antiquated British political system, which was designed for aristocrats to lord over us. There are very few other countries in the world where getting a little more than one third of the vote gets you 51% of the seats
No-one dares mention the fact that that there was an enormous swing against the government. This is a government whose main policy was austerity and which ran solely on its economic record. The swing against the last austerity government was the biggest swing against any government in the entire period since the end of the World War II.

Terry Gibson's perm · Sep 12, 2015

cloughie said:
So Corbyn is the death of democracy ? Amazing I suppose cameron and osbourne are true democrats are they

yet the Tory majority relies on the antiquated British political system, which was designed for aristocrats to lord over us. There are very few other countries in the world where getting a little more than one third of the vote gets you 51% of the seats
No-one dares mention the fact that that there was an enormous swing against the government. This is a government whose main policy was austerity and which ran solely on its economic record. The swing against the last austerity government was the biggest swing against any government in the entire period since the end of the World War II.

Wether he he is the right choice or not he has been elected democratically and was overwhelming chosen by the party, I hope he surrounds himself with correct people like Andy Burnham and rids the party of people like Ed Bollocks and his repulsive wife.

cloughie · Sep 12, 2015

Terry Gibson's perm said:
Wether he he is the right choice or not he has been elected democratically and was overwhelming chosen by the party, I hope he surrounds himself with correct people like Andy Burnham and rids the party of people like Ed Bollocks and his repulsive wife.

Correct not sure he will prove to be the right choice but he has been elected democratically.

Terry Gibson's perm · Sep 12, 2015

cloughie said:
Correct not sure he will prove to be the right choice but he has been elected democratically.

Very true there must be a lot of labour employees who are worried for their futures he doesn't strike me as somebody who has a lot of time for new labour and any of the spin doctors.

dutchman · Sep 12, 2015

Terry Gibson's perm said:
I hope he surrounds himself with correct people like Andy Burnham

Yeah, right!

"I'll get you you bastard!"

Terry Gibson's perm · Sep 12, 2015

dutchman said:
Yeah, right!

"I'll get you you bastard!"

I still think he will in time but he does looked a bit pissed off in that picture where as Mrs ed bollocks is hanging on hoping to keep a job for her and the old man.

Jack Griffin · Sep 12, 2015

Terry Gibson's perm said:
I still think he will in time but he does looked a bit pissed off in that picture where as Mrs ed bollocks is hanging on hoping to keep a job for her and the old man.

Ha ha, Coopers old man was a big part of the last Labour defeat, Shadow Chancellor and couldn't even hold on to his seat, that is how highly he is regarded by the electorate.

Terry Gibson's perm · Sep 12, 2015

Jack Griffin said:
Ha ha, Coopers old man was a big part of the last Labour defeat, Shadow Chancellor and couldn't even hold on to his seat, that is how highly he is regarded by the electorate.

Dont know what it is about her an her old man but I can't stand either of them.

skybluetony176 · Sep 12, 2015

I have a cousin who's involved in the Tory party and he's declared it's the first time they've won two elections in one year. He's convinced they've won the 2020 general election already. Cocky but he may well have a point.

Personally I think it's a knee jerk reaction (Corbyn winning). There was alot of talk about UKIP taking conservative votes which I'm sure they did, however most if not all the people I know who voted UKIP were traditional Labour voters.

Either way Labour won't have to pretend to be in opposition anymore. Could be good for the country because the blurred lines between New Labour and the Conservatives have gone in one day.

M&B Stand · Sep 12, 2015

skybluetony176 said:
I have a cousin who's involved in the Tory party and he's declared it's the first time they've won two elections in one year. He's convinced they've won the 2020 general election already. Cocky but he may well have a point.

Personally I think it's a knee jerk reaction (Corbyn winning). There was alot of talk about UKIP taking conservative votes which I'm sure they did, however most if not all the people I know who voted UKIP were traditional Labour voters.

Either way Labour won't have pretend to be in opposition anymore. Could be good for the country because the blurred lines between New Labour and the Conservatives have gone in one day.

Never thought I'd say it, but that's a good post

M&B Stand · Sep 12, 2015

Jack Griffin said:
And Labour select a Muslim London Mayoral candidate at the same time, London apparently has 12.5% Muslims. Scares the shit out of little old atheist me!

Peaceful & Tolerant religion. So dont know what you're worried about Jack.

skybluetony176 · Sep 12, 2015

M&B Stand said:
Never thought I'd say it, but that's a good post

You're welcome

Deleted member 5849 · Sep 12, 2015

Terry Gibson's perm said:
Will be an interesting few weeks now, he was the overwhelming choice over party members as the figures show. Not my choice as I don't believe he is electable but should be a total pain in the arse for Cameron.

He's shown himself more capable of winning elections than any of his rivals for the job...

Deleted member 5849 · Sep 12, 2015

skybluetony176 said:
Could be good for the country because the blurred lines between New Labour and the Conservatives have gone in one day.

Yup, and it will be fascinating to watch.

If it fails, it'll be like Menzies Campbell, he'll be bogged off in a couple of years and all will be forgotten.

However...

It will be nice to have on the agenda, and discussed at least, issues such as raising taxes, public service, and out position in the world - at the very least, a spot of reflection in Britain is probably needed instead of the haughty, arrogant steamrollering over its people.

It will hopefully engage people to vote and realise there's a point to voting. At the moment we have a jaundice because come an election, it's hard to actually tell what any of the major party's policies actually are - if the electorate is engaged, either for or against, then that is a good thing.

With Tom Watson elected as deputy then here's a brutish campaigner who can hopefully add a spot of energy to the politeness.

And if Corbyn *does* fail, then perhaps it ought to be a lesson to the Labour Party not to take its roots for granted.

Deleted member 5849 · Sep 12, 2015

Oh and as an aside, the choice of Shadow Cabinet will be fascinating. Personally, I hope that despite the kneejerk reaction from some of the spoilt children, that we have a broad church across the shadow cabinet. Political parties should, in my view, embrace the spectrum of their beliefs rather than try to split into them and us... otherwise what is the point of them being in the same party in the first place?

Johnnythespider · Sep 12, 2015

Deleted member 5849 said:
Oh and as an aside, the choice of Shadow Cabinet will be fascinating. Personally, I hope that despite the kneejerk reaction from some of the spoilt children, that we have a broad church across the shadow cabinet. Political parties should, in my view, embrace the spectrum of their beliefs rather than try to split into them and us... otherwise what is the point of them being in the same party in the first place?

The biggest part of this that bothers me are those that have quit their shadow cabinet positions, they have shown once again that they have no interest in democracy, and that they think they know better than the membership of their party. It is of course all about their career for some, not the greater good. I haven't voted labour for the last 2 elections because it simply hasn't represented what I believe are labour values, they stand a much better chance of getting my vote next time with Corbyn at the helm. Politics should not be about power at any cost.

skybluetony176 · Sep 12, 2015

Deleted member 5849 said:
Yup, and it will be fascinating to watch.

If it fails, it'll be like Menzies Campbell, he'll be bogged off in a couple of years and all will be forgotten.

However...

It will be nice to have on the agenda, and discussed at least, issues such as raising taxes, public service, and out position in the world - at the very least, a spot of reflection in Britain is probably needed instead of the haughty, arrogant steamrollering over its people.

It will hopefully engage people to vote and realise there's a point to voting. At the moment we have a jaundice because come an election, it's hard to actually tell what any of the major party's policies actually are - if the electorate is engaged, either for or against, then that is a good thing.

With Tom Watson elected as deputy then here's a brutish campaigner who can hopefully add a spot of energy to the politeness.

And if Corbyn *does* fail, then perhaps it ought to be a lesson to the Labour Party not to take its roots for granted.

Agreed. What made Ed Milibands opposition party so week was that they weren't really opposing. They had nothing to offer in opposition at the general election either the minute they admited they weren't reversing anything that the coalition did. On top of that there was the whole fear of the English electorate getting a SNP/Labour coalition. They were doomed from the start looking back.

I'm traditionally a Tory voter but I can see the benefit of strong opposition, the Tories won't get an easy ride from the opposition bench anymore, they're going to have to work hard to justify what they do and that's good. It stops half baked policies and the electorate actually gets a better understanding of what's happening and why.

I think he'll stay until the next election and be more successful than Ed Miliband especially north of the border where they'll give the SNP a run for their money and may even win some seats back. I don't think they'll win the election as they won't win the marginal seats bit I think they'll strengthen their strongholds as their traditional voters return.

I can see it being a good turnout in 2020 as politics is about to get interesting again.

Grendel · Sep 12, 2015

Deleted member 5849 said:
He's shown himself more capable of winning elections than any of his rivals for the job...

No he's electable to the crackpots that joined the party to elect him.

90% of the MP's did not want him. I haven't voted Tory for 33 years but sure as hell I will now.

I'm sure Jezza will make many Tory voters from the last election defect to him.

The bottom line is Britain doesn't want the archaic failed socialist tripe he supports. He will be gone before you know it.

Deleted member 5849 · Sep 12, 2015

Grendel said:
No he's electable to the crackpots that joined the party to elect him.

He got 49.6% of the vote from the longer serving party members too.

That's hardly a disastrous first round showing that demonstrates he is an unpopular choice in the Labour Party.

121,751 votes out of 245,520 possible from party members.

Over twice that of his closest rival, more than Burnham and Cooper put together.

I'd say he has a mandate from his party.

Johnnythespider · Sep 12, 2015

Grendel said:
No he's electable to the crackpots that joined the party to elect him.

90% of the MP's did not want him. I haven't voted Tory for 33 years but sure as hell I will now.

I'm sure Jezza will make many Tory voters from the last election defect to him.

The bottom line is Britain doesn't want the archaic failed socialist tripe he supports. He will be gone before you know it.

I await your " if labour win the next election I'm leaving the country " post with baited breath

Terry Gibson's perm · Sep 12, 2015

Some of his ideas are perfect for opposition but not really possible, it would be good to stop things being sold off and re-nationalising things but where would the money come from to do it, I am sure the shareholders at edf aren't going to give up their nice little profits for nothing.

good luck to him and I hope he bloody Cameron's nose everyday (well everyday they are in which isn't that often).

Grendel · Sep 12, 2015

Johnnythespider said:
I await your " if labour win the next election I'm leaving the country " post with baited breath

Anyone earning more than 40 grand a year would leave. Actually everyone would leave once the IMF declare is bankrupt.

Anyway pretty much every political observer knows this Marxist dinosaur will be re-buried well before the next election.

Terry Gibson's perm · Sep 12, 2015

Deleted member 5849 said:
He's shown himself more capable of winning elections than any of his rivals for the job...

We will have to wait and see if the Great British public agree though, I hope I am wrong and he wins as almost anything is better than this awful lot of old Etonians.

Deleted member 5849 · Sep 12, 2015

Terry Gibson's perm said:
Some of his ideas are perfect for opposition but not really possible, it would be good to stop things being sold off and re-nationalising things but where would the money come from to do it, I am sure the shareholders at edf aren't going to give up their nice little profits for nothing.

It happened before.

Privitisation is one of the biggest curses of Thatcherism - it's the short term cash boost that ends up costing the economy more as it ends up with double cost. A well run public company can be an asset to the treasury. Indeed, even a poorly run one can be if it takes people off DSS benefits.

And this is a prime example of where a Corbyn led opposition might be helpful, in re-programming things that a Labour Party has been scared to say for decades, allowing views that nationalisation is bad to hold sway without challenge. It's worth pointing out that even though it was moderated, such follys were continued under Blair and Brown under privitisation-lite. PPPs see money flow out to private companies that could be used elsewhere.

Unfortunately,the electorate is inherantly short termist and that is indeed a battle that may be hard to win.

Johnnythespider · Sep 12, 2015

Grendel said:
Anyone earning more than 40 grand a year would leave. Actually everyone would leave once the IMF declare is bankrupt.

Anyway pretty much every political observer knows this Marxist dinosaur will be re-buried well before the next election.

There are many in this country who can only dream what 40 grand a year would be like

Terry Gibson's perm · Sep 12, 2015

Deleted member 5849 said:
It happened before.

Privitisation is one of the biggest curses of Thatcherism - it's the short term cash boost that ends up costing the economy more as it ends up with double cost. A well run public company can be an asset to the treasury. Indeed, even a poorly run one can be if it takes people off DSS benefits.

And this is a prime example of where a Corbyn led opposition might be helpful, in re-programming things that a Labour Party has been scared to say for decades, allowing views that nationalisation is bad to hold sway without challenge. It's worth pointing out that even though it was moderated, such follys were continued under Blair and Brown under privitisation-lite. PPPs see money flow out to private companies that could be used elsewhere.

Unfortunately,the electorate is inherantly short termist and that is indeed a battle that may be hard to win.

It may surprise you but I agree 100% on things coming back into national control it would be fantastic to take things back that belonged to us before that evil old witch got her hands on things and created a mass of false and short term wealth. Many of the things sold off have paid for themselves dozens of times over now, the recent give always of Lloyds shares is the latest example. Also stupid Brown continued it on when he gave away the gold.

cloughie · Sep 12, 2015

Grendel said:
Anyone earning more than 40 grand a year would leave. Actually everyone would leave once the IMF declare is bankrupt.

Anyway pretty much every political observer knows this Marxist dinosaur will be re-buried well before the next election.

Well you won't be missed would be a blessing you leaving

Grendel · Sep 12, 2015

Johnnythespider said:
There are many in this country who can only dream what 40 grand a year would be like

The opportunity is available to far more in this country than the odious dictatorships Mr Corbyn worships.

skybluetony176 · Sep 12, 2015

Grendel said:
Anyone earning more than 40 grand a year would leave. Actually everyone would leave once the IMF declare is bankrupt.

Anyway pretty much every political observer knows this Marxist dinosaur will be re-buried well before the next election.

Why would anyone earning more than £40K a year leave?

Grendel · Sep 12, 2015

skybluetony176 said:
Why would anyone earning more than £40K a year leave?

Mr Corbyn has interesting taxation plans. One is to add 7% tax in NI contributions to anyone above the higher tax threshold.

Tgere are far deeper problems however.

Corbyn associates himself with many anti British terrorist organisations. He has openly stated his beliefs on such matters and that he considers the U.S. as an enemy,

The leader of the opposition is normally allowed to be briefed on matters of state that have international implications. In my view Mr Corbyn is an enemy within and potentially presents a clear and present danger to national security if this information is afforded to him. This protocol must cease immediately.d

rupert_bear · Sep 12, 2015

Grendel my dear, have you been to a Corbyn rally ? probably not, I've been to two one in Cov one in Nuneaton I was not an avid Jeremy Corbyn supporter, in fact like most and proberly yourself had hardly heard of him so I went to see what he is about. One thing for certain he is not the usual fire brand type associated with the left, far from it. What has happened is unique in a month or so he has awakend a sleeping giant thousands of youngsters will join the party from all over the country, the first test will be the London mayor election and I believe Labour will win a landslide there then watch the Tories wriggle. Anyway Back to Corbyn he is no fire brand, no raving looney as the press try to tell us, he is going to surprise us all.

skybluetony176 · Sep 12, 2015

Grendel said:
Mr Corbyn has interesting taxation plans. One is to add 7% tax in NI contributions to anyone above the higher tax threshold.

Tgere are far deeper problems however.

Corbyn associates himself with many anti British terrorist organisations. He has openly stated his beliefs on such matters and that he considers the U.S. as an enemy,

The leader of the opposition is normally allowed to be briefed on matters of state that have international implications. In my view Mr Corbyn is an enemy within and potentially presents a clear and present danger to national security if this information is afforded to him. This protocol must cease immediately.d

Do you not think that paying taxes justifies your income?

Who are these "many" anti British terrorist organisations you talk about? I know he met with members of Sinn Fein long before the piece process was even conceived but they're a political party not a terrorist organisation.

Grendel · Sep 12, 2015

skybluetony176 said:
Do you not think that paying taxes justifies your income?

Who are these "many" anti British terrorist organisations you talk about? I know he met with members of Sinn Fein long before the piece process was even conceived but they're a political party not a terrorist organisation.

Read up on his friends in the Middle East and his views on Kosavo. I'm not doing the research for you.

Oh and when pressed even by the free thinking left wing press on the Provisional IRA Mr Corbyn cannot even offer any condemnation for their slaughter of innocent British citizens.

dutchman · Sep 12, 2015

Grendel said:
Anyone earning more than 40 grand a year would leave. Actually everyone would leave once the IMF declare is bankrupt.

That's the housing shortage solved then!

Bernie Sanders is hoping to emulate Corbyn by winning the US Democrat party nomination for Presidential candidate.

https://www.google.co.uk/search?hl=...=en&gl=uk&authuser=0&tbm=nws&q=bernie+sanders

skybluetony176 · Sep 13, 2015

Grendel said:
Read up on his friends in the Middle East and his views on Kosavo. I'm not doing the research for you.

Oh and when pressed even by the free thinking left wing press on the Provisional IRA Mr Corbyn cannot even offer any condemnation for their slaughter of innocent British citizens.

I'll start by asking you my first question again that you sidestepped. Do you not think that paying taxes justifies your income?

Not aware on his views on Kosovo so I'll look that up.

His friends in the middle east? I assume that you're referencing his association with the Palestine solidarity campaign? If you are it's not a terrorist organisation by any stretch of the imagination. Even yours.

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