What is going on with the Tory leadership contest? (2 Viewers)

Grendel · Jun 17, 2019

Deleted member 5849 said:
Well hunt came across as relatively human until his summing up speach.

Based on that, of those five you'd go for Hunt or Javid though, surely? Gove's too much for set pieces, Raab's some kind of automaton loon, and Stewart ruined his chances by effectively saying don't vote for me, I know nothing and have no knowledge of all you underclasses!

Johnson is obviously going to win. Hunt may make it through to be the stooge who loses in the membership race but unless Johnson commits some suicidal faux pas it’s over.

It’s obvious why he’s wanted. He won the mayor election against all odds and he’s a lifeboat the great sinking Tory cruise liner shipmates is clinging to.

His mission is to finish the brexit party and then to game Corbyn on. Corbyn is passed his peak and he has some appeal to the masses

The other thing is mud slinging doesn’t work. Like trump he has skeletons all over the place. He’s like Tommy Cooper and his fake magic tricks - same act every time and people want more.

SkyBlueDom26 · Jun 17, 2019

Hopefully either Boris or Raab for me

clint van damme · Jun 17, 2019

SkyBlueDom26 said:
Hopefully either Boris or Raab for me

HAHA!!

rob9872 · Jun 17, 2019

All politicians masquerade as something they're not - how many of you were taken in by Tony in the late 90s and his pop star image? I know I was and I feel dirty for believing him now - particularly after Gordon then took the reins who also seemed an honourable guy but was appalling and sold off everything we had at knockdown prices. We had smarmy Cameron and there have been love-ins for Clegg (no substance all hype) and Corbyn (a fraud, terrorist sympathiser and anti-Semitist), dear old Teresa, on the face of it seems 'nice' but completely out of her depth.

Is it therefore not better that we have someone like Boris so that we KNOW he's lying? Sure he's a buffoon, but has charisma and will command some presence and profile on the world stage in the way Trump does. We will need to be out there punching, especially if we're to leave the EU with no deal.

skybluetony176 · Jun 17, 2019

Here’s my prediction of the next 6 to 10 years in politics. Boris becomes Tory leader and PM and is a complete fuck up, he does a hard brexit which is a complete fuck up, within 2 years there’s a general election which is the Tories biggest defeat ever, some sort of coalition wins the next GE, Rory Stewart becomes the next Tory leader on a manifesto of rejoining the EU, Rory Stewart wins the following GE with a huge majority and we rejoin the EU having learned the lessons we forgot from WW2 and the politics of Oswald Mosley are consigned to history for a few generations.

stupot07 · Jun 17, 2019

SkyBlueDom26 said:
Hopefully either Boris or Raab for me

James O'Brien Takes Apart Dominic Raab's Comments One-By-One

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skybluetony176 · Jun 17, 2019

stupot07 said:
James O'Brien Takes Apart Dominic Raab's Comments One-By-One

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Raab looked completely inept and out of his depth last night. I’d be gobsmacked if he gets through the next round.

Deleted member 5849 · Jun 17, 2019

skybluetony176 said:
Raab looked completely inept and out of his depth last night. I’d be gobsmacked if he gets through the next round.

Can't even see why he's there beyond a bit of pontificating, and an attempt to distance himself from current fuck-ups so he gets a job next time out.

If the Brexit Secretary can't negotiate a decent deal for Brexit, then who can?!?

stupot07 · Jun 17, 2019

Boris has chickened out of the press interviews this morning. He should be kicked out of the running for not doing any of the scheduled events.

He knows the only way to get elected is saying nothing. Jess Phillip's got it right, he believes in nothing, just what's going to curry him favour.

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skybluegod · Jun 17, 2019

Deleted member 5849 said:
Can't even see why he's there beyond a bit of pontificating, and an attempt to distance himself from current fuck-ups so he gets a job next time out.

If the Brexit Secretary can't negotiate a decent deal for Brexit, then who can?!?

It was my understanding that Raab didn't do much of the negotiation hence why he quit?

I thought that once Davis quit, May took on the main mantle of negotiations see this article- Brexit: Raab 'sidelined' as May takes control of EU negotiations
So Raab didn't negotiate it so bit of a harsh criticism.

I think he came across okay last night, just nothing spectacular, but made some good points. But in reality nobody really boosted their case... in my opinion. Boris really just needs to sit back and watch.

Deleted member 5849 · Jun 17, 2019

stupot07 said:
Boris has chickened out of the press interviews this morning. He should be kicked out of the running for not doing any of the scheduled events.

He knows the only way to get elected is saying nothing. Jess Phillip's got it right, he believes in nothing, just what's going to curry him favour.

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However 'popular' he is, surely Tory MPs and grassroots would indeed be thinking, if he can't argue convincingly to a sympathetic audience, how can he do it to a distrusting electorate?

(Well, I've answered my own question really. This is all a very bizarre 'context'. At least Corbyn put forward some policies to win his one!)

SkyBlueDom26 · Jun 17, 2019

stupot07 said:
Boris has chickened out of the press interviews this morning. He should be kicked out of the running for not doing any of the scheduled events.

He knows the only way to get elected is saying nothing. Jess Phillip's got it right, he believes in nothing, just what's going to curry him favour.

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Boris is clever, he doesn't need to get into silly arguments with all of the candidates....
His time will be when its the final 2

Deleted member 5849 · Jun 17, 2019

skybluegod said:
It was my understanding that Raab didn't do much of the negotiation hence why he quit?

I thought that once Davis quit, May took on the main mantle of negotiations see this article- Brexit: Raab 'sidelined' as May takes control of EU negotiations
So Raab didn't negotiate it so bit of a harsh criticism.

I think he came across okay last night, just nothing spectacular, but made some good points. But in reality nobody really boosted their case... in my opinion. Boris really just needs to sit back and watch.

May took it on initially because Davis was incompetent and incapable of doing so, he was so badly prepared.

If Raab had anything about him, he'd have been pushing himself to the forefront on taking the gig rather than honing his technique of looking steely eyed and muscular-jawed. He himself said there would be “full assertion of ministerial accountability.”

He's shown himself an anti-democrat with limited ability. The only 'good' thing he's doing, is making Johnson look capable in comparison! He's showing exactly why May would have done the negotiating if this was the alternative!

Grendel · Jun 17, 2019

Deleted member 5849 said:
However 'popular' he is, surely Tory MPs and grassroots would indeed be thinking, if he can't argue convincingly to a sympathetic audience, how can he do it to a distrusting electorate?

(Well, I've answered my own question really. This is all a very bizarre 'context'. At least Corbyn put forward some policies to win his one!)

Isn’t he doing the one tomorrow on BBC?

Grendel · Jun 17, 2019

skybluetony176 said:
Raab looked completely inept and out of his depth last night. I’d be gobsmacked if he gets through the next round.

Raab, Stewart and probably Javid will all be gone

skybluetony176 · Jun 17, 2019

Deleted member 5849 said:
May took it on initially because Davis was incompetent and incapable of doing so, he was so badly prepared.

If Raab had anything about him, he'd have been pushing himself to the forefront on taking the gig rather than honing his technique of looking steely eyed and muscular-jawed. He himself said there would be “full assertion of ministerial accountability.”

He's shown himself an anti-democrat with limited ability. The only 'good' thing he's doing, is making Johnson look capable in comparison! He's showing exactly why May would have done the negotiating if this was the alternative!

I had to laugh when Davis stood up in Parliament after May published the withdrawal bill questioning why certain things were in it and why it had to be that way. It’s one of the few times I’ve thought well played Mrs May when she calmly stood up and replied that her colleague knew exactly why it was in the bill and why it was that way as it was him who had negotiated that specific part.

skybluetony176 · Jun 17, 2019

Grendel said:
Raab, Stewart and probably Javid will all be gone

Most likely. Personally I’d like to see Stewart get through if for no other reason than he’ll tear Boris apart on Tuesday nights BBC’s debate. I suspect that’s why he refused the C4 debate last night.

Grendel · Jun 17, 2019

skybluetony176 said:
Most likely. Personally I’d like to see Stewart get through if for no other reason than he’ll tear Boris apart on Tuesday nights BBC’s debate. I suspect that’s why he refused the C4 debate last night.

I thought he cane across as somewhat deranged

skybluegod · Jun 17, 2019

Deleted member 5849 said:
May took it on initially because Davis was incompetent and incapable of doing so, he was so badly prepared.

If Raab had anything about him, he'd have been pushing himself to the forefront on taking the gig rather than honing his technique of looking steely eyed and muscular-jawed. He himself said there would be “full assertion of ministerial accountability.”

He's shown himself an anti-democrat with limited ability. The only 'good' thing he's doing, is making Johnson look capable in comparison! He's showing exactly why May would have done the negotiating if this was the alternative!

Doesn't really make sense, if he is benched by the PM he can't exactly go over her head and fly out to negotiate can he?

His comments around closing parliament are being taken out of proportion IMO, ( i assume this what you mean by anti-democrat?) in reality he is refusing to take anything off the table that would weaken a negotiating hand. If parliament is going to block no-deal no matter what, then that effectively takes No deal on 31st of October off the table, and so weaken the negotiating position ( I think this was his point) And i think everyone agrees taking no deal off the table weakens our position? And so hence his comments on this... (that was my understanding anyway), drawing out Brexit indefinitely is undemocratic as is closing parliament.

Either way, i agree he is not the man for the job, and as Grendel says he won't get through.

It will be Hunt VS Boris.

skybluetony176 · Jun 17, 2019

Grendel said:
I thought he cane across as somewhat deranged

Yet he was still the only one who seems to understand the details and explain them and himself. He’d tie Boris up in fact putting on a public display of Boris’ incompetence at the same time.

Maybe this deranged character is an indication of how far the Tories have fallen when he was the only one who could summon more than one round of applause from the audience with what he had to say. One of the biggest being when he said he hopes that one of the candidates here tonight wins the Tory leadership election. Ie not Boris. The Tory Party has overestimated Boris’ popularity if you ask me. An immediate GE might actually be his best bet of ever winning one. The longer he’s in office the more his frailties will come to the fore. If I was in opposition I’d be seeing Boris as a gift.

Grendel · Jun 17, 2019

skybluetony176 said:
Yet he was still the only one who seems to understand the details and explain them and himself. He’d tie Boris up in fact putting on a public display of Boris’ incompetence at the same time.

Maybe this deranged character is an indication of how far the Tories have fallen when he was the only one who could summon more than one round of applause from the audience with what he had to say. One of the biggest being when he said he hopes that one of the candidates here tonight wins the Tory leadership election. Ie not Boris. The Tory Party has overestimated Boris’ popularity if you ask me. An immediate GE might actually be his best bet of ever winning one. The longer he’s in office the more his frailties will come to the fore. If I was in opposition I’d be seeing Boris as a gift.

This to be honest is why I actually agree with Johnson to not go on the programme. It is senseless having people like Rory Stewart on there. Like Clegg and Sturgeon they always look well in these kind of environments as they can pretty much say and do what they want safe in the knowledge they will not get the gig. They always come out best but as we found out with Nicholas Clegg if you open the door slightly you let in duplicity in spades

clint van damme · Jun 17, 2019

Grendel said:
This to be honest is why I actually agree with Johnson to not go on the programme. It is senseless having people like Rory Stewart on there. Like Clegg and Sturgeon they always look well in these kind of environments as they can pretty much say and do what they want safe in the knowledge they will not get the gig. They always come out best but as we found out with Nicholas Clegg if you open the door slightly you let in duplicity in spades

I'm sure concerns about duplicity were at the forefront of johnsons mind.

Grendel · Jun 17, 2019

clint van damme said:
I'm sure concerns about duplicity were at the forefront of johnsons mind.

But in his case no one is bothered - it may be a sad indictment on society but I think he would win an election if he delivers Brexit

Like trump he has no shame and it’s difficult to deal with that. The stumbling over words and forgetting punchlines is all an act. He’s not stupid (lazy and ruthless yes) and it would be impossible for Corbyn whose own ratings are awful given the situation to compete with him.

Deleted member 5849 · Jun 17, 2019

Grendel said:
I thought he cane across as somewhat deranged

I'm amazed his answer to his weakness question was received as well as it was.

If I gave that kind of answer in an interview, I wouldn't get the job!

skybluegod · Jun 17, 2019

Deleted member 5849 said:
I'm amazed his answer to his qeakness question was received as well as it was.

If I gave that kind of answer in an interview, I wouldn't get the job!

Raab looked like a twat as well, (i'm restless- but that's a good thing), so you gave a strength then didn't you...

Deleted member 5849 · Jun 17, 2019

skybluegod said:
Raab looked like a twat as well, (i'm restless- but that's a good thing), so you gave a strength then didn't you...

Gove's answer was straight out of the interview cliche book too (I'm so impatient, I just get everything done far too quickly!)

SkyBlueDom26 · Jun 17, 2019

HAHA

clint van damme · Jun 17, 2019

Grendel said:
But in his case no one is bothered - it may be a sad indictment on society but I think he would win an election if he delivers Brexit

Like trump he has no shame and it’s difficult to deal with that. The stumbling over words and forgetting punchlines is all an act. He’s not stupid (lazy and ruthless yes) and it would be impossible for Corbyn whose own ratings are awful given the situation to compete with him.

I think he'll be a disaster for the tories, especially if Labour dump Corbyn before the next election.

Deleted member 5849 · Jun 17, 2019

The press hustings show Raab and Javid have a backbone at least...

skybluetony176 · Jun 17, 2019

Grendel said:
But in his case no one is bothered - it may be a sad indictment on society but I think he would win an election if he delivers Brexit

Like trump he has no shame and it’s difficult to deal with that. The stumbling over words and forgetting punchlines is all an act. He’s not stupid (lazy and ruthless yes) and it would be impossible for Corbyn whose own ratings are awful given the situation to compete with him.

How do you know no one is bothered if he’s not allowing the public to be bothered one way or another. I think people are bothered and he knows it. Which is why he didn’t turn up.

Deleted member 5849 · Jun 17, 2019

Bit harsh for Hunt to be advocating a cull of old people!

skybluetony176 · Jun 17, 2019

More Boris bluster coming under scrutiny Johnson's broadband plan 'needs detail'

Sky Blue Pete · Jun 17, 2019

Grendel said:
This to be honest is why I actually agree with Johnson to not go on the programme. It is senseless having people like Rory Stewart on there. Like Clegg and Sturgeon they always look well in these kind of environments as they can pretty much say and do what they want safe in the knowledge they will not get the gig. They always come out best but as we found out with Nicholas Clegg if you open the door slightly you let in duplicity in spades

What did Clegg do?

Grendel · Jun 17, 2019

Sky Blue Pete said:
What did Clegg do?

Wreck his party by lying and sleeping with the Tories?

SkyblueBazza · Jun 17, 2019

stupot07 said:
Boris has chickened out of the press interviews this morning. He should be kicked out of the running for not doing any of the scheduled events.

He knows the only way to get elected is saying nothing. Jess Phillip's got it right, he believes in nothing, just what's going to curry him favour.

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Wonder if it is part of his strategy? It is that he is working the MPs (i.e. the ones who are going to vote as-in) rather than the media? Then he will be one step ahead for stage 2 - he will have already begun canvassing the wider membership.

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