The EU: In, out, shake it all about.... (32 Viewers)

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As of right now, how are thinking of voting? In or out

  • Remain

    Votes: 23 37.1%

  • Leave

    Votes: 35 56.5%

  • Undecided

    Votes: 3 4.8%

  • Not registered or not intention to vote

    Votes: 1 1.6%
  • Total voters
    62
  • Poll closed .
M

martcov

Well-Known Member
Grendel said:
Highly unlikely for the majority of the country for 2 reasons

1. Most labour areas voted leave. The poll I suspect is distorted by the London impact

2. More critically the only reason labour succeeded beyond expectation at the election was the collapse of the ukip vote and the transfer to labour of that vote

You gov also did a poll on intelligence of voters and entirely based intelligence on having a degree. So a media studies 3rd class degree student at Cumbria university is deemed more intelligent than someone say in their 50's whose running a business employing hundreds of people.
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How could anyone do a poll on intelligence? Any poll is based on academic qualifications because there are no records on intelligence and any way of measuring intelligence would be disputed anyway. It would be interesting to know how people running their own business in their 50s or 60s voted. I'll start... I am in my 60s running my own business and I would have voted remain if I had been allowed to vote. Count me in with the people holding a degree or some form of higher education.
 
NorthernWisdom

NorthernWisdom

Well-Known Member
Grendel said:
Also my guess is he'll be renting when he leaves to live in the EU zone
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Renting in itself isn't the issue of course, more how it's set up for short term lets, and buy-to-let private enterprise at the expense of social housing.

If we addressed the fact that it's cheaper to pay a mortgage than rent the same house often (if you have the income to be accepted on a mortgage, of course!) then there'd be less of a rush to buy at all costs.

And that might be no bad thing, either.
 
Captain Dart

Captain Dart

Well-Known Member
Astute said:
So how does that graph answer my question? Graphs don't build houses.
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It isn't an answer, but it shows house building trends over a substantial period.

What is doesn't show is the shrinkage of social housing stock caused by right to buy, I think that policy should end or at least require a commercial purchase price now till the stock is replenished.
 
Astute

Astute

Well-Known Member
Captain Dart said:
It isn't an answer, but it shows house building trends over a substantial period.

What is doesn't show is the shrinkage of social housing stock caused by right to buy, I think that policy should end or at least require a commercial purchase price now till the stock is replenished.
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I would say that every penny raised from sales should go into building new homes. This way people get to buy their own home and the social housing stock doesn't disappear.
 
Astute

Astute

Well-Known Member
Sick Boy said:
So immigrants are now to blame for poverty in London. Yet another new low for this forum.
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You say that you and your partner work. You say you pay 1k a month for a 1 bed flat in Brighton. You say that people are moving from London to Brighton because it is cheaper. You say that immigrants mainly work in lower paid jobs. So how the fuck are they supposed to pay the average London rents?

Yes they have to live in the cheapest areas and a lot of them share a house. The cheapest houses are in the worse areas. Look at Grenfell tower. They were offered immunity if they came forward. Why bother offering it if none of them lived there?

Your bullshit is starting to get to me now. All you can do is twist everything. You slam people for mentioning certain media outlets then mention them yourself. You contradict yourself frequently. You don't care how much bullshit you come out with if it means defending the EU.

I can see why most have given up on trying to have a debate on here with you now.
 
Sick Boy

Sick Boy

Well-Known Member
Astute said:
You say that you and your partner work. You say you pay 1k a month for a 1 bed flat in Brighton. You say that people are moving from London to Brighton because it is cheaper. You say that immigrants mainly work in lower paid jobs. So how the fuck are they supposed to pay the average London rents?

Yes they have to live in the cheapest areas and a lot of them share a house. The cheapest houses are in the worse areas. Look at Grenfell tower. They were offered immunity if they came forward. Why bother offering it if none of them lived there?

Your bullshit is starting to get to me now. All you can do is twist everything. You slam people for mentioning certain media outlets then mention them yourself. You contradict yourself frequently. You don't care how much bullshit you come out with if it means defending the EU.

I can see why most have given up on trying to have a debate on here with you now.
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When have I said that immigrants tend to work in lower paid jobs? I've consistently said they benefit the economy. As usual you're making it up as you go along and twist everything to attack the EU and working migrants.

The irony of your post is not lost though.
 
S

SkyblueBazza

Well-Known Member
Sick Boy said:
What are you going on about? Both Farage and Johnson are nothing other than self-serving bastards. Johnson isn't even a true Brexiteer and has gone in that direction for self-interest. The less said about Farage the better.
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What politician isn't a self serving bastard? The fabulously wealthy ones with impractical ideals!

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S

SkyblueBazza

Well-Known Member
Astute said:
That is some 'what if'

Could you imagine us sending in thousands of police to attack Scottish people who only wanted to vote?

I am all for people deciding for themselves. Of course there will always be winners and losers. But what other way can we do it other than the majority deciding?

Scotland wanted a referendum. They were given the right to vote. They voted to remain a part of the UK. In the EU vote they voted to remain, but as they are a part of the UK the vote was to leave. The English vote was over the 52%. But when it came down to the UK vote that was what it came down to.

The Scottish didn't want a second vote. But maybe they will want one now we have voted to leave the EU. And I can't see us being like Spain and attacking their people to get what the English want. They would get their vote. That is what democracy is all about.
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"I am all for people deciding for themselves. Of course there will always be winners and losers. But what other way can we do it other than the majority deciding?"

U-f**king-reka!!!

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S

SkyblueBazza

Well-Known Member
martcov said:
How do you get 33%? If... Merkel forms a government it will be around 53%, but it won’t alter the constitution. To do that she needs over 60% ( or two thirds of the Bundestag- not sure which). A simple majority is not enough to alter the constitution. A government is put to reelection every 4 years. Brexit is a major change and there is no option to change after 4 years. A major decision like that should have had 60 or maybe 66% behind it. 52% on the day is not a decisive victory- as Farage said before the vote.
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Now you appear to be manipulating figures. You said earlier that 33% voted for Merkel. That cannot become 53% overnight

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S

SkyblueBazza

Well-Known Member
martcov said:
I saw through this bollocks the first time I saw Farage. I wrote to UKIP and told them they were talking BS at the time. My brother worked for UKIP in Brussels - before he got sacked for discovering the MEPs corruption. His boss landed in nick and my brother sent the info to Private Eye. My brother helped Labour Leave ( he hates labour) at the referendum. We don’t talk to each other now - not because of Brexit, although that doesn’t help.
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Ermmm...good for you

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M

martcov

Well-Known Member
SkyblueBazza said:
Now you appear to be manipulating figures. You said earlier that 33% voted for Merkel. That cannot become 53% overnight

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To form a government she has to have a coalition. The liberals and greens have over 20% between them. There are also a few % from the CSU. If they agree to form a government they have more than 50% and Merkel is chancellor - which is likely. If not it’s new elections.
 
Grendel

Grendel

Well-Known Member
martcov said:
The problem is supply. Demand is there but the government doesn’t build social housing anymore.
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Which is paid for by whom?
 
M

martcov

Well-Known Member
SkyblueBazza said:
"I am all for people deciding for themselves. Of course there will always be winners and losers. But what other way can we do it other than the majority deciding?"

U-f**king-reka!!!

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Yes, great, all for that. But. When the vote is around 50:50 for a major change and is based on false information, then we have a problem. Referenda are paradise for populists. We have a parliamentary system which should debate and decide. And something as crucial as EU membership should be decided by a clear majority- say 60% or a two thirds majority to show a national consensus. What we have is a divided country and a total cock up as regards Brexit.
 
M

martcov

Well-Known Member
Sky-bluer1 said:
Would we let anyone back in once they had made the decision to become an EU citizen I would hope not
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There are loads of people becoming EU citizens- including Farage‘s children. Many of them students and people with something to offer such as scientists. The UK cannot afford to lose such people. The leavers - example which Bazza quoted „ Chatham postal workers „ - are chomping at the bit for Brexit. Crazy really. Let’s hope Britain is not relying on the postal workers from Chatham to pull us through. Nothing against the postal workers, but we need qualified people to keep our standard of living.
 
S

SkyblueBazza

Well-Known Member
martcov said:
To form a government she has to have a coalition. The liberals and greens have over 20% between them. There are also a few % from the CSU. If they agree to form a government they have more than 50% and Merkel is chancellor - which is likely. If not it’s new elections.
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Ahhh...so she did only get 33% then?

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S

SkyblueBazza

Well-Known Member
martcov said:
Yes, great, all for that. But. When the vote is around 50:50 for a major change and is based on false information, then we have a problem. Referenda are paradise for populists. We have a parliamentary system which should debate and decide. And something as crucial as EU membership should be decided by a clear majority- say 60% or a two thirds majority to show a national consensus. What we have is a divided country and a total cock up as regards Brexit.
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In some people's view yes. The silent majority might not think it a cock up but just have more faith in the civil servants that work on the strategy of gaining the best possible deal for the country. Given that the nation decided by vote or abstinence to leave the EU.

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