Wasps complete 100% purchase of Ricoh (1 Viewer)

[mattylad]

Why is the donation of 50p per ticket and the renaming so wrong?

The attitude of WASPS towards the charity (and others from what I can see) is considerably more collaborative and beneficial than the attitude of SISU towards them. (Taking the charity to court over a £29k bill they refused to pay etc etc)

The fact you don't know that it was Higgs that took CCFC to court for £29,000 kind of negates your point of view to me but to also answer the question, we don't know what was in the CCFC bid so we can't say whether the offer was more or less far reaching in working with the charity can we.

 

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[SkyBlue_Bear83]

SISU don't have a business case for CCFC. Unless you count using the club as a tax write off a business plan.

And as of now, if they pull the plug, what happens? Who in their right mind would be interested in taking over? There's nothing to buy.

Unless, of course, the council and wasps have played a blinder and wasps take over the club as well. Because I cant see where sisu go from here.

Unfortunately the council don't care about the club and Wasps most certainly don't, can't see any Wasps takeover.

 

[jimmyhillsfanclub]

Cheshire Sky Blue wrote:

Why is the donation of 50p per ticket and the renaming so wrong?

The attitude of WASPS towards the charity (and others from what I can see) is considerably more collaborative and beneficial than the attitude of SISU towards them. (Taking the charity to court over a £29k bill they refused to pay etc etc)

WASPS website states.....

Our Community was has been defined as being from our Training Ground in Acton, West London to Chipping Norton RFC (westwards) and Brighton RFC (southwards).

However.....WASPS attitude to "their community" is "fuck em...we're off to carpet bag a distressed stadium management company 84 miles north.....see ya...losers"

 

[Cheshire Sky Blue]

Even if they managed to increase the value of ACL to 20m and sold half that is about two years wages in the rugby premiership and they are now only going to get half of the revenue stream each year to support its ongoing wages. They will not sell simple as that.

The wages of WASPS and or CCFC will / should be funded from revenue not the sale of assets. IF CCFC owned 50% of a business that has two major revenue streams the outcome is broadly the same is if they owned a stadium on their own

 

[SkyBlue_Bear83]

The fact you don't know that it was Higgs that took CCFC to court for £29,000 kind of negates your point of view to me but to also answer the question, we don't know what was in the CCFC bid so we can't say whether the offer was more or less far reaching in working with the charity can we.

You're right, then the club tried to counter claim against the Higgs for 290k didn't they?

 

[chiefdave]

And as of now, if they pull the plug, what happens? Who in their right mind would be interested in taking over? There's nothing to buy.

It would depend on how they pull the plug. If they liquidate (can they do that without putting the club up for sale first?) then that would be it, I'm not sure after all this a large enough proportion of the fanbase have the energy left to get a phoenix club off the ground.

If they just stop paying the bills and we go into admin or they put the club up for sale then you would find interested parties. The key will be how much of the debt gets written off. If someone can come in on a similar deal to that which SISU got then you're in real terms starting back at zero and have at least a slight chance of success, come in with a huge debt still in place and we'll struggle to get out of the downward spiral.

Even if SISU walk away today and don't want a penny back we've still got problems. It's hard to see things getting significantly better in the short to medium term.

 

[Bennets Afro]

So wasps lost £7m last year

Paid less than £6m for the Ricoh

Took on the payments of a £14m mortgage

How many bums on seats is that for them to break even or even make a profit. Anyone hazard a guess?

 

[Cheshire Sky Blue]

The fact you don't know that it was Higgs that took CCFC to court for £29,000 kind of negates your point of view to me but to also answer the question, we don't know what was in the CCFC bid so we can't say whether the offer was more or less far reaching in working with the charity can we.

Yep, I was aware of that detail just worded it poorly. But they still went to court over 29k they knew they had welched on and that for me was a turning point in my attitude towards SISU.

You are correct we don't know what CCFC's bid was, I can judge later when we know the facts about the CCFC offer, but my question was why was the 50p offer and the renaming so bad? I thought it demonstrated good faith, but it made you sick apparently.

 

[mattylad]

It would depend on how they pull the plug. If they liquidate (can they do that without putting the club up for sale first?) then that would be it, I'm not sure after all this a large enough proportion of the fanbase have the energy left to get a phoenix club off the ground.

If they just stop paying the bills and we go into admin or they put the club up for sale then you would find interested parties. The key will be how much of the debt gets written off. If someone can come in on a similar deal to that which SISU got then you're in real terms starting back at zero and have at least a slight chance of success, come in with a huge debt still in place and we'll struggle to get out of the downward spiral.

Even if SISU walk away today and don't want a penny back we've still got problems. It's hard to see things getting significantly better in the short to medium term.

The Bings and Haskells of this world will not be back now the Ricoh is off the table.

 

[SkyBlueScottie]

Understanding is it's £2.77million each in cash and they takeover the remainder of the £14.4million loan from the council agreed with ACL in January 2013

Is the tax payer still liable for the loan if Wasps/ ACL cant keep up payments?

 

[mattylad]

Yep, I was aware of that detail just worded it poorly. But they still went to court over 29k they knew they had welched on and that for me was a turning point in my attitude towards SISU.

You are correct we don't know what CCFC's bid was, I can judge later when we know the facts about the CCFC offer, but my question was why was the 50p offer and the renaming so bad? I thought it demonstrated good faith, but it made you sick apparently.

To have a stand named after a principle party in this whole debacle is sickening to me yes.

 

[Deleted member 4232]

Best news i've heard all day.

 

[vincy]

People also said they'd never go to sixfields

Agreed, wouldn't put anything past the cu**s. who'd have thought they would have moved us to Northampton? (In the end I never thought we'd play in Cov again)

That said, if the stupid bitc* goes ahead and builds her new stadium, then It's got to be curtains for CCFC hasn't it???? How much to build a new stadium??? On top of the 30/40/50/60 mil debt?????, Also how many do they expect to turn up to service the costs????

 

[mattylad]

Is the tax payer still liable for the loan if Wasps/ ACL cant keep up payments?

Yes it will default back on the Council if not paid.

 

[mustaphasbeard]

Break out the guillotine

 

[chiefdave]

Is the tax payer still liable for the loan if Wasps/ ACL cant keep up payments?

You would hope that there is a clause that if the loan isn't paid the lease reverts back to the council or something along those lines. Of course who knows if anyone had the foresight to actually think about that scenario.

 

[jimmyhillsfanclub]

So wasps lost £7m last year

Paid less than £6m for the Ricoh

Took on the payments of a £14m mortgage

How many bums on seats is that for them to break even or even make a profit. Anyone hazard a guess?

Dunno.....But heres hoping its a lot lot more than they actually get.....

 

[Cheshire Sky Blue]

To have a stand named after a principle party in this whole debacle is sickening to me yes.

So you will be truly sickened by the Joy Sepalla stadium then.

 

[Cheshire Sky Blue]

Yes it will default back on the Council if not paid.

Do you know that for sure? It would be normal for the debt to appear on the companies balance sheet and for any default to be dealt with by administration. But you have obviously seen the contract and TOC's

 

[mustaphasbeard]

"So you will be truly sickened by the Joy Sepalla stadium then."

Don't even say that in jest

 

[mattylad]

So you will be truly sickened by the Joy Sepalla stadium then.

As if that would ever happen. Kepp some level of credibility please.

 

[Sick Boy]

As if that would ever happen. Kepp some level of credibility please.

He appears to be a council lap dog, what do you expect?

 

[mattylad]

Do you know that for sure? It would be normal for the debt to appear on the companies balance sheet and for any default to be dealt with by administration. But you have obviously seen the contract and TOC's

It has already been stated in other parts of the media that the loan from CCC remains unchanged other than the 1m off the top. So if ACL stop paying CCC who do you think is as it has not been resecured against anyone else.

 

[Sick Boy]

You may believe that, but I'm pretty sure you don't understand in what respects these offers differed, it is far too simplistic to look at a headline number.

Yet more hypocrisy.

 

[skybluetony176]

So wasps lost £7m last year

Paid less than £6m for the Ricoh

Took on the payments of a £14m mortgage

How many bums on seats is that for them to break even or even make a profit. Anyone hazard a guess?

I wonder how much the naming rights will be worth? They're up next year IIRC, JLR could clear the mortgage with the JLR stadium.

 

[Jack Griffin]

You may believe that, but I'm pretty sure you don't understand in what respects these offers differed, it is far too simplistic to look at a headline number.

I still think building a new stadium is a madness, so where does that leave us? Somewhere between a rock and a hard place I guess.

As you say, we are in a very bad place as it is. Taking us down a route of adding to the debt by 10's of millions is surely a fruitless excerise.

If we were to build any stadium it would surely be over 10 years before we would see any good come from it and with it most likely being a distance outside of Coventry, the most likely outcome is the loss of a few more thousand City supporters to boot.

A new stadium will take something like 10 years to build, even if SISIU are genuine in their statements about building a new stadium I don't think CCFC will be playing anywhere other than the Ricoh till at least 2020.

 

[tisza]

Fisher said it would take 18 months to build a stadium once they started actually building - Using the Rotherham template.

 

[Cheshire Sky Blue]

As if that would ever happen. Kepp some level of credibility please.

Which bit, building a stadium or calling it the JS stadium?

 

[CCFC PimpRail]

Yes it will default back on the Council if not paid.

At which point SISU (if they are still going) take CCC to court for illegal use of state aid / funding / whatever to try to distress them for picking it up on the cheap.

Another point, are Wasps allowed to sell ACL outright, or have to offer first dibs to CCC...? The biggest mistake ever made was CCFC being allowed to sell their share in ACL all those years ago, and should have been told to rein in their spending after selling Highfield Road. But that would have firmly placed them as a Championship team, and not liable to a takeover by sisu with their plan 'A' of returning to the premiership...

 

[Covstar]

And that ladies and gentleman completes a great week for the history of this football club. First, losing at home to a non league side in the first round of the FA Cup, then couple of days later finding out CCFC selling old Leicester city t-shirts as their own and now this wonderful news about a rugby club in London getting hold of the Ricoh arena in Coventry. It really cannot get better than this can it? Good job its the weekend to celebrate this historic week.

 

[Jack Griffin]

Fisher said it would take 18 months to build a stadium once they started actually building - Using the Rotherham template.

Physically building one isn't a long process, getting land and the planning permission, that takes the time. That is what I meant, the whole process, sorry if I wasn't clear.

 

[oldfiver]

Not a cat in hell's chance they will build a stadium.

You might find cats can live in hell

 

[oldfiver]

A new stadium will take something like 10 years to build, even if SISIU are genuine in their statements about building a new stadium I don't think CCFC will be playing anywhere other than the Ricoh till at least 2020.

three years

 

[Sick Boy]

I wonder how much the naming rights will be worth? They're up next year IIRC, JLR could clear the mortgage with the JLR stadium.

It doesn't matter as long as the council and especially the charity got the amount of money they wanted. That's all that's really important here.

 

[oldfiver]

Do you know that for sure? It would be normal for the debt to appear on the companies balance sheet and for any default to be dealt with by administration. But you have obviously seen the contract and TOC's

It is probably covered within the lease that in the event of a default or the tenant becoming insolvent the lease reverts back to the freeholder

The loan should also be secured by a charge on the lease

It all means that the City of Coventy has funded the deal