Wasps finances 2016

Discussion in 'Wasps' started by oldskyblue58, Nov 1, 2016.

  1. oldskyblue58

    oldskyblue58 CCFC Finance Director

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  2. Moff

    Moff Well-Known Member

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    Is it me, or are they underwhelming?

    Interesting to see the hype about the promotion of World Class Acts such as the MTV Crashes event, shortly followed by the admission that this event fell below expectation thus increasing operating costs.
     
  3. martcov

    martcov Well-Known Member

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    Loss doesn't seem to be too worrying.

    'A retained loss should be of concern to an investor if a company has been in business for a long period of time, since it indicates that the entity has struggled to find a consistent strategy for earning a profit. However, this is not necessarily the case for a start up company, which is expected to incur losses as it rolls out its initial products and services and attempts to gain market share. The latter situation may make particular sense if the intent is to build a product or customer base and then sell the company based on the prospects of the business, rather than its proven profitability.'
     
  4. stupot07

    stupot07 Well-Known Member

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    Losses up from £2.4m to £3.8m before additional one off exceptional items.

    Group loss of £5.3m

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    Last edited: Nov 1, 2016
  5. fernandopartridge

    fernandopartridge Well-Known Member

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    Not huge losses on that turnover though, are they?

    Do they know something we don't?

     
  6. fernandopartridge

    fernandopartridge Well-Known Member

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    Increase in average gate from 11k to 16k but ticket income only up 19%
     
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  7. Moff

    Moff Well-Known Member

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    Still losses though. What a shame ;)
     
  8. oldfiver

    oldfiver Well-Known Member

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  9. stupot07

    stupot07 Well-Known Member

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    £17.5m in wages over 216 employees (57 players) at an average of £80.6k

    3 directors renumeration £905k,

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  10. oldfiver

    oldfiver Well-Known Member

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    Losing money and paying management fees? Who would have thought it!
     
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  11. stupot07

    stupot07 Well-Known Member

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    £14.5m in admin fees, not sure what thats about.
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  12. fernandopartridge

    fernandopartridge Well-Known Member

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    £2.3m interest on the retail bond - not sure if that's full year or not, think it was only issued about a year ago wasn't it?
     
  13. speedie87

    speedie87 Well-Known Member

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    New Xtragrass pitch was installed during the summer of 2015, benefitting Coventry City Football Club and attracting the Ricoh's first England Football U21 game

    well that's just not true...............

    i note the full accounts say attracting the group's first enlgand u21 game, so i'll let them off!
     
  14. fernandopartridge

    fernandopartridge Well-Known Member

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    (This isn't a complaint) but very little mention of CCFC in the accounts, wonder if next year would mention any potential impact of no long term agreement with CCFC. It's a loss of 23 event days a year out of 139 (though I am not quite sure what the methodology is for calculating event days).
     
  15. oldfiver

    oldfiver Well-Known Member

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    Six month payment due next on 11th November
     
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  16. oldfiver

    oldfiver Well-Known Member

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    The Valuation is future income based and your note would have to be considered in a longer term view - as would the lack of a long agreement for naming rights
     
  17. stupot07

    stupot07 Well-Known Member

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    And people think that wasps will want to buy a football club who needs significant finance in order to get up and stay up in the championship.

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  18. fernandopartridge

    fernandopartridge Well-Known Member

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    It makes perfect sense!
     
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  19. NorthernWisdom

    NorthernWisdom Well-Known Member

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    If I'm honest I'd fully expect them to run at a loss for this set of accounts, maybe one or two more.

    The bigger question is whether they can turn that around with their strategy, in time.
     
  20. fernandopartridge

    fernandopartridge Well-Known Member

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    Is the naming rights that much of an issue? Or was it mentioned in the bond prospectus?
     
  21. Grendel

    Grendel Well-Known Member

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    According to Italia JLR are champing at the bit and it's only ccfc and the legal dispute that's preventing them signing.
     
  22. wingy

    wingy Well-Known Member

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    Can't pretend I understand but as Stu mentioned £14.5M admin fees?
    Did it say sports turnover under £11M, that's lower than Gloucester turned over 3-4 years back.
    Obviously naming rights is an issue and possibly is one of the factors between us.
    They get an extra £1.2M from the RFU as of next season.
    They only have £1.2M left from the bond issue to draw down.
     
  23. oldfiver

    oldfiver Well-Known Member

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    Will they get Local Authority and Development Grant Funding for this as they seem to get it for everything else?
     
  24. NorthernWisdom

    NorthernWisdom Well-Known Member

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    Interestingly my auditor friend's comment: "Bottom line is these aren't the healthiest set of accounts. That's a hefty loss as a percentage of turnover, and it's not like there are any big exceptional items in there this year. They've also massively drawn down on their cash reserves. I can't see any huge creditors that immediately suggest that this is a short term effect "

    (Bear in mind his comment about CCFC's were that the club's fucked, you're all fucked, why the fuck is the club still running?!? You can see he doesn't have a bias ;))
     
  25. NorthernWisdom

    NorthernWisdom Well-Known Member

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    Food and drink expenses of £5.6mil seems *enormous*
     
  26. Nick

    Nick Administrator

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    *This is a joke, before anybody cries!
     
  27. NorthernWisdom

    NorthernWisdom Well-Known Member

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  28. wingy

    wingy Well-Known Member

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    Is that indicative of the Compass deal?
    If so wasn't there a rumour on here that they'd bought a larger stake in IEC?
     
  29. NorthernWisdom

    NorthernWisdom Well-Known Member

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    The year before it was nearly £4mil.

    However much it costs to feed Haskell on boat trips?
     
  30. chiefdave

    chiefdave Well-Known Member

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    On face value doesn't seem great to me and certainly would lend weight to the argument that our fans should stay away from Wasps games to reduce their income. Of course I'm not an accountant, I might ask mine to take a look and see what he thinks.

    Given that they are claiming each individual area is performing well, and that occupancy of the various facilities is high, where are they going to make up the shortfall on an annual basis?
     
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  31. duffer

    duffer Well-Known Member

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    Yep, that's just about how I'd read it too. If I had one concern, it would be that I think that I don't see any really big areas of (edit) future growth on the pitch or in terms of attendance - in essence I think we're close to peak Wasps in that sense. They're pretty shrewd off the pitch in all fairness, but servicing that level of debt would worry me. If it goes wrong with that level of gearing, I fancy it might go wrong in a big way.
     
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  32. martcov

    martcov Well-Known Member

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    100000 a year at the moment and a bit of F&B from CCFC doesn't seem to be a game changer. They cannot increase our rent too much, there isn't a great deal to take from CCFC. If we go, they won't notice it in relation to turnover either. One decent concert could cover everything we contribute over a whole season and more.
     
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  33. chiefdave

    chiefdave Well-Known Member

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    Equally one underperforming event could cause issues. When we talk about losing our income we shouldn't just assume they can grab another event and it will automatically be successful.
     
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  34. martcov

    martcov Well-Known Member

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    The issues wouldn't be solved by a hundred grand from us. I see our value more as leverage for the naming rights ( we are/ could be very high profile ) and keeping CCC and the Coventry public ( voters ) on board.
     
  35. fernandopartridge

    fernandopartridge Well-Known Member

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    Wasps RFC turnover is not dissimilar to that of CCFC's as a Championship club at the Ricoh, slightly better presumably due to higher ticket prices
     
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