If Wasps publicly declared they wanted to buy CCFC (3 Viewers)

[The Gentleman]

Interestingly I was speaking to someone this morning who works at ACL who said Wasps were getting a little concerned that the paid attendances from locals, which they seems to class as CV1 to CV6, was dropping off. Couldn't get any details on numbers unfortunately.

Hahahaha, yes of course 'someone' said that to you. Why couldn't you get details or numbers, couldn't they fit into the brown envelope?

That said, I'm sure with a nod, wink and a little tap on the nose you knew everything you needed.

 

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[The Gentleman]

I thought that 90 odd percent of their customers were supposed to be from CV postcodes? Hopefully they'll soon be bankrupt and out of the city.

With building 240 houses or selling the land to a developer, I don't think so.

 

[Mary_Mungo_Midge]

I don't agree with your stance MMM but the above is a well reasoned and well put post.

Personally, I don't see Wasps as the biggest villains either. SISU undoubtedly are but Wasps have taken advantage of our situation which along with the help of CCC, has pretty much condemned our future unless something drastic happens.

I had a long drive back from Leeds to the South Coast yesterday and was trying to thinking of an analogy to summarise my thoughts on whose to blame for our demise. I came up with the following:

* Richardson et all pretty much give us a death sentence with frivolous spending.
* Sisu euthanized us and then built a coffin.
* CCC asked Wasps if they wanted to be the ones to knock the nails into the coffin.
* Wasps obliged providing the hammer and nails.

Just my own thoughts...all of the above are to blame for our demise, probably in that order as well (in my eyes only).

WM

I like the similie. I have one of my own, but a comment first.

In trying to secure a lower rent and access to matchday revenues we all knew were needed; the football club's owners took a very hardball stance. Not only that, they overplayed it to an extent quite beyond belief (the fact they seemingly didn't learn and made many similar mistakes with the Higgs Centre is astonishing - but another story). The council, with egg on their face and a blue ribbond project failing were given a get-out-of-jail card and grasped it with both hands. If they hadn't, and Wasps had walked away and the Ricoh still empty would have been beyond consideration. So.....

...You may be familiar with the notion of 'revenge sex'? Not first-hand, I'm sure. A party who finds their partner has been cheating gets their own back by sleeping with someone else. This then often leading to a total breakdown in the relationship.

So, in my comparison; there's a boyfriend who lives at his girlfriend's house. Bit of a bad lad and he's been sleeping around. Not a bit, a lot, and lies regularly so that the girlfriend can't believe a word he says, distrusts him and resents him (read: the club's owners)

The girlfriend; she's quite attractive, but owns a lovely house in which the boyfriend lives. She's been a pain in the arse in the past by asking for high rents and wanting jobs doing around the house - but these issues could perhaps have been worked through, maybe with counselling. But she's really pissed with her cheating, lying boyfriend (read: the council as the girlfriend and The Ricoh as her beautiful house)

Some lucky bloke at work/the gym who happens to be in the right place at the right time to be the chosen partner for the revenge sex, and has now been moved in and the boyfriend's bags left packed on the pavement (read: Wasps)

So who's to blame; the boyfriend who strayed the sleeping around and cheating, the girl who's had enough and found someone better and showed him the kerb, or the fella who couldn't believe his luck and is now warming his toes in front of the fire?

 

[clint van damme]

Yes, I am sympathetic to Wasps, well spotted, what I want now is CCFC playing at The Ricoh as tenants with SISU gone and owners who can work with all parties, instead of suing them.

It would of been much better if CCFC owned (under new ownership of course) The Ricoh and Wasps were tenants, but that isn't the hand we've been dealt.

you come across as someone who hates CCFC.

 

[peeler]

you come across as someone who hates CCFC.

Just because I like Wasps, that's ridiculous.

My views about SISU, what has happened to CCFC, who is to blame & how we go about fixing it are obviously complete different to yours.

That does not make me a lesser fan that anyone else.

 

[clint van damme]

Just because I like Wasps, that's ridiculous.

My views about SISU, what has happened to CCFC, who is to blame & how we go about fixing it are obviously complete different to yours.

That does not make me a lesser fan that anyone else.

I find your attitude towards the whole thing strange. You want sisu gone but you want us to be tenants to another hedge fund with no regard for the supporters of the team they own who too have moved their club away from it's home.

The hypocrisy is breathe taking the be honest.

While been tenants to wasps under new owners is perhaps the best we can hope for, and I would begrudgingly accept it to get rid of sisu, you seem almost giddy with the idea.

 

[peeler]

I find your attitude towards the whole thing strange. You want sisu gone but you want us to be tenants to another hedge fund with no regard for the supporters of the team they own who too have moved their club away from it's home.

The hypocrisy is breathe taking the be honest.

While been tenants to wasps under new owners is perhaps the best we can hope for, and I would begrudgingly accept it to get rid of sisu, you seem almost giddy with the idea.

Not at all, in an ideal world CCFC would own The Ricoh (Not under SISU, I may add) and Wasps were tenants, but that's not the hand we have been dealt with.

The other hedge fund as you put it are investing in the playing staff, aren't taking anyone to court, do communicate correctly and respectably with their fans and are doing anything in their power to give their team a great chance of competing with the very best. The complete opposite to what SISU are doing, surely you can see that?

There's no hypocrisy involved, I don't blame Wasps one iota. I blame SISU 100% for everything that has happened.

You might see it differently, that's your prerogative, but that isn't a reason not to respect and understand other people have different views.

 

[clint van damme]

Not at all, in an ideal world CCFC would own The Ricoh (Not under SISU, I may add) and Wasps were tenants, but that's not the hand we have been dealt with.

The other hedge fund as you put it are investing in the playing staff, aren't taking anyone to court, do communicate correctly and respectably with their fans and are doing anything in their power to give their team a great chance of competing with the very best. The complete opposite to what SISU are doing, surely you can see that?

There's no hypocrisy involved, I don't blame Wasps one iota. I blame SISU 100% for everything that has happened.

You might see it differently, that's your prerogative, but that isn't a reason not to respect and understand other people have different views.

wasps moved their team 100 miles up country.

You stated the other day that any City supporter who didn't go to Sixfields was a true fan, yet you think it's fine that wasps have done the same, surely you can see the contradiction?

Or are you saying that spending money on the team and communicating with the support justifies uprooting the club to another county?

 

[Captain Dart]

I like the similie. I have one of my own, but a comment first.

In trying to secure a lower rent and access to matchday revenues we all knew were needed; the football club's owners took a very hardball stance. Not only that, they overplayed it to an extent quite beyond belief (the fact they seemingly didn't learn and made many similar mistakes with the Higgs Centre is astonishing - but another story). The council, with egg on their face and a blue ribbond project failing were given a get-out-of-jail card and grasped it with both hands. If they hadn't, and Wasps had walked away and the Ricoh still empty would have been beyond consideration. So.....

...You may be familiar with the notion of 'revenge sex'? Not first-hand, I'm sure. A party who finds their partner has been cheating gets their own back by sleeping with someone else. This then often leading to a total breakdown in the relationship.

So, in my comparison; there's a boyfriend who lives at his girlfriend's house. Bit of a bad lad and he's been sleeping around. Not a bit, a lot, and lies regularly so that the girlfriend can't believe a word he says, distrusts him and resents him (read: the club's owners)

The girlfriend; she's quite attractive, but owns a lovely house in which the boyfriend lives. She's been a pain in the arse in the past by asking for high rents and wanting jobs doing around the house - but these issues could perhaps have been worked through, maybe with counselling. But she's really pissed with her cheating, lying boyfriend (read: the council as the girlfriend and The Ricoh as her beautiful house)

Some lucky bloke at work/the gym who happens to be in the right place at the right time to be the chosen partner for the revenge sex, and has now been moved in and the boyfriend's bags left packed on the pavement (read: Wasps)

So who's to blame; the boyfriend who strayed the sleeping around and cheating, the girl who's had enough and found someone better and showed him the kerb, or the fella who couldn't believe his luck and is now warming his toes in front of the fire?

Is the old boyfriend in the spare room every other weekend. :asshat:
PS Welcome back MMM, nice to have a thoughtful posters views.

 

[peeler]

wasps moved their team 100 miles up country.

You stated the other day that any City supporter who didn't go to Sixfields was a true fan, yet you think it's fine that wasps have done the same, surely you can see the contradiction?

Or are you saying that spending money on the team and communicating with the support justifies uprooting the club to another county?

They did move their team from Adams Park where they were renting to The Ricoh which they now own the operating company. Notice the past tense, it's already happened. You can't change it so what's the point of arguing it.

That comment was directed at one individual, one of those poor souls who stood on the hill, he deserves the accolade from me.

The Wasps owners are trying to do everything they can to put them at the top of the rugby tree, apparently they nearly went bust a few years ago while playing at Adams Park. The move up north was a calculated risk sure, but it's certainly done wonders for their outlook, which now looks very positive indeed. Unlike our wonderful football team, which looks decidedly dodgy.

To sum up: Hedge fund or not, Wasps owners are doing everything right for their team, SISU are doing everything wrong and destroying their team. Of course you might think differently.

 

[clint van damme]

They did move their team from Adams Park where they were renting to The Ricoh which they now own the operating company. Notice the past tense, it's already happened. You can't change it so what's the point of arguing it.

That comment was directed at one individual, one of those poor souls who stood on the hill, he deserves the accolade from me.

The Wasps owners are trying to do everything they can to put them at the top of the rugby tree, apparently they nearly went bust a few years ago while playing at Adams Park. The move up north was a calculated risk sure, but it's certainly done wonders for their outlook, which now looks very positive indeed. Unlike our wonderful football team, which looks decidedly dodgy.

To sum up: Hedge fund or not, Wasps owners are doing everything right for their team, SISU are doing everything wrong and destroying their team. Of course you might think differently.[/QUOTE]

.

I do think differently, and will never be convinced that either move was morally correct

 

[peeler]

Is the old boyfriend in the spare room every other weekend. :asshat:
PS Welcome back MMM, nice to have a thoughtful posters views.

I can't agree more, this forum needs people who post thoughtfully and respectfully, to counteract some of the more obnoxious posters.

 

[Moff]

I can't agree more, this forum needs people who post thoughtfully and respectfully, to counteract some of the more obnoxious posters.

Do you also accept thoughtful and reasonable debate from those who differ in opinion? Its just I recall you telling a respectful and thoughtful poster 'up yours' the other day.

Perhaps we should all be thoughtful and respectful.

 

[peeler]

They did move their team from Adams Park where they were renting to The Ricoh which they now own the operating company. Notice the past tense,

To sum up: Hedge fund or not, Wasps owners are doing everything right for their team, SISU are doing everything wrong and destroying their team. Of course you might think differently.

I do think differently, and will never be convinced that either move was morally correct.

Then we'll agree to disagree like gentlemen, or would you prefer pistols at dawn on Gosford Green?

 

[clint van damme]

Then we'll agree to disagree like gentlemen, or would you prefer pistols at dawn on Gosford Green?

we'll leave the pistols, you strike me as a man who knows his way round a firearm!!

 

[peeler]

Do you also accept thoughtful and reasonable debate from those who differ in opinion? Its just I recall you telling a respectful and thoughtful poster 'up yours' the other day.

Perhaps we should all be thoughtful and respectful.

I did say that, which was wrong. I apologise.

Now read some of the disgusting comments Grendel has made to me & see if he's man enough to apologise.

 

[Skyblueweeman]

I like the similie. I have one of my own, but a comment first.

In trying to secure a lower rent and access to matchday revenues we all knew were needed; the football club's owners took a very hardball stance. Not only that, they overplayed it to an extent quite beyond belief (the fact they seemingly didn't learn and made many similar mistakes with the Higgs Centre is astonishing - but another story). The council, with egg on their face and a blue ribbond project failing were given a get-out-of-jail card and grasped it with both hands. If they hadn't, and Wasps had walked away and the Ricoh still empty would have been beyond consideration. So.....

...You may be familiar with the notion of 'revenge sex'? Not first-hand, I'm sure. A party who finds their partner has been cheating gets their own back by sleeping with someone else. This then often leading to a total breakdown in the relationship.

So, in my comparison; there's a boyfriend who lives at his girlfriend's house. Bit of a bad lad and he's been sleeping around. Not a bit, a lot, and lies regularly so that the girlfriend can't believe a word he says, distrusts him and resents him (read: the club's owners)

The girlfriend; she's quite attractive, but owns a lovely house in which the boyfriend lives. She's been a pain in the arse in the past by asking for high rents and wanting jobs doing around the house - but these issues could perhaps have been worked through, maybe with counselling. But she's really pissed with her cheating, lying boyfriend (read: the council as the girlfriend and The Ricoh as her beautiful house)

Some lucky bloke at work/the gym who happens to be in the right place at the right time to be the chosen partner for the revenge sex, and has now been moved in and the boyfriend's bags left packed on the pavement (read: Wasps)

So who's to blame; the boyfriend who strayed the sleeping around and cheating, the girl who's had enough and found someone better and showed him the kerb, or the fella who couldn't believe his luck and is now warming his toes in front of the fire?

Likewise, a good simile. So it was revenge, out of spite according to your scenario. Taking Wasps out of the equation, surely that's morally inept of a public body to act out of revenge and spite?

Especially, using your example, the bad lad had moved away to have his cake and eat for a few months but then came back. The bird was furious (rightly so) and said something along the lines of 'moving away is bad, I don't like blokes who move away'. Then she hooks up with someone who wanted to move into her area permanently (no pun intended there...).

Just a little hypocritical (very hypocritical actually) especially when the council know that SISU won't be here forever. Rightly or wrongly, they have condemned this club to a bleaker future than what it might have had once SISU are out of the way, out of spite, anger and personal agendas.

Have a good Friday MMM.

 

[Moff]

I did say that, which was wrong. I apologise.

Now read some of the disgusting comments Grendel has made to me & see if he's man enough to apologise.

Sadly I cant make that happen, but I take on board the fact you were dignified enough to apologise, as I was wrong the other day and acknowledge that fact.

We obviously agree on some issues, not on others, but I agree it is better to be respectful and polite regardless.

 

[peeler]

Sadly I cant make that happen, but I take on board the fact you were dignified enough to apologise, as I was wrong the other day and acknowledge that fact.

We obviously agree on some issues, not on others, but I agree it is better to be respectful and polite regardless.

Agreed, I was brought up to be courteous and respectful of others. Thank you.

 

[duffer]

They did move their team from Adams Park where they were renting to The Ricoh which they now own the operating company. Notice the past tense, it's already happened. You can't change it so what's the point of arguing it.

That comment was directed at one individual, one of those poor souls who stood on the hill, he deserves the accolade from me.

The Wasps owners are trying to do everything they can to put them at the top of the rugby tree, apparently they nearly went bust a few years ago while playing at Adams Park. The move up north was a calculated risk sure, but it's certainly done wonders for their outlook, which now looks very positive indeed. Unlike our wonderful football team, which looks decidedly dodgy.

To sum up: Hedge fund or not, Wasps owners are doing everything right for their team, SISU are doing everything wrong and destroying their team. Of course you might think differently.

You're right, CCFC is in a decidely dodgy financial state. But by your logic, it would be OK for SISU to move CCFC to London, or anywhere else where they could build or buy a stadium on the cheap to secure the future of the team. As long as the team survived and maybe even started to move up the divisions, that's all that matters, right?

And sure, people might complain, but there's no point in arguing it once it's done.

P.S. The 'up yours' thing made me chuckle rather than caused offence. As put downs go, that's by far the most polite one I've seen here (which is to your credit in my book at least). You'll have to try harder than that, peeler.

 

[peeler]

You're right, CCFC is in a decidely dodgy financial state. But by your logic, it would be OK for SISU to move CCFC to London, or anywhere else where they could build or buy a stadium on the cheap to secure the future of the team. As long as the team survived and maybe even started to move up the divisions, that's all that matters, right?

And sure, people might complain, but there's no point in arguing it once it's done.

P.S. The 'up yours' thing made me chuckle rather than caused offence. As put downs go, that's by far the most polite one I've seen here (which is to your credit in my book at least). You'll have to try harder than that, peeler.

I don't understand why you are so concerned about what Wasps did, rugby fans are different to football fans, there's nowhere near as much tribalism. You even get Tigers & Saints and other fans going along just to watch a game of rugby.

Could you imagine Aston Villa, West Bromwich Albion or Birmingham City fans turning up at the Ricoh to watch Coventry City just because they like football.

SISU moved the club 35 mile and ended up with gates of 1.5K how many do you think they would get if they moved it 100 miles to London?
It isn't going to happen, you can't do that with a football club and expect other fans to adopt you, mind you with SISU who knows what goes on in their world.

'up yours', was more like stuff you I can't be bothered to discuss anymore, I'm off to bed or something like that. Sorry.

 

[duffer]

I don't understand why you are so concerned about what Wasps did, rugby fans are different to football fans, there's nowhere near as much tribalism. You even get Tigers & Saints and other fans going along just to watch a game of rugby.

Could you imagine Aston Villa, West Bromwich Albion or Birmingham City fans turning up at the Ricoh to watch Coventry City just because they like football.

SISU moved the club 35 mile and ended up with gates of 1.5K how many do you think they would get if they moved it 100 miles to London?
It isn't going to happen, you can't do that with a football club and expect other fans to adopt you, mind you with SISU who knows what goes on in their world.

'up yours', was more like stuff you I can't be bothered to discuss anymore, I'm off to bed or something like that. Sorry.

No need to apologise peeler, no offence taken. Rugby fans may not be as tribal, but in my fairly long experience as a Cov RFC fan they still want to support their team on their patch. Wasps trampled all over that when they moved, and I can't forgive or forget that.

Plus it seems, forgive me, hypocritical to say that it's OK for one team to do it (Wasps), whilst being outraged at the prospect of another team doing it (Coventry), just based on the fact that Coventry are the team that we happen to support. If SISU decide to bugger off to say Kettering or Northampton for another spell, or somewhere in the hinterlands of Warwickshire or even Leicestershire or further afield permanently, because they as the owners decide it's for the best for their business, anyone who supports Wasps moving here is in a rather awkward position to my mind.

As it goes, when Cov were a fair way away, I would go and watch Brum sometimes - just to get a day out and a footy fix in. In the days when I travelled for a living, I'd go and watch whoever was nearby when I got the chance. Not all footy fans are the same, and in any case it's the owners that get to make the call according to your argument, rather than the poor sods following the team.

 

[Mary_Mungo_Midge]

Likewise, a good simile. So it was revenge, out of spite according to your scenario. Taking Wasps out of the equation, surely that's morally inept of a public body to act out of revenge and spite?

Especially, using your example, the bad lad had moved away to have his cake and eat for a few months but then came back. The bird was furious (rightly so) and said something along the lines of 'moving away is bad, I don't like blokes who move away'. Then she hooks up with someone who wanted to move into her area permanently (no pun intended there...).

Just a little hypocritical (very hypocritical actually) especially when the council know that SISU won't be here forever. Rightly or wrongly, they have condemned this club to a bleaker future than what it might have had once SISU are out of the way, out of spite, anger and personal agendas.

Have a good Friday MMM.

I have - upon many occasions - made my thoughts known on councils on this forum; living just outside Rugby, whose council has for a long time been somewhere between junta and institutionalised care environment - I had no doubt as to the stupidity, self-serving duplicity, arrogance and downright nastiness any given council is capable of.

But - and this is the bit I find it hard to see past - the club's owners have a responsibility to the football club first and foremost. My view - and it's only my view - is that they have sometimes shown a willingness to jeopardise the health of the football club to gamble on an outcome which would primarily serve their investors. In so doing, they have gone way too far, and imperilled beyond return the club's tenancy and freehold chances at The Ricoh, and now Higgs Centre too.

Rather than pay a 'fair price'; they got embroiled in schemes, sometimes in cahoots with the council (and it's interests), other times directly opposing the council - designed in cutting deals at knock-down prices to feather the nest of their exit strategy from a disastrous investment. They made enemies with every party with whom they interacted, built up mistrust animosity and manifest hatred.

They pushed the boat out so far and miscalculated the council's breaking point. The council must have wept with joy when Wasps rolled into town, as it gave them a high-profile solution to a high-profile problem. From a position of looking exposed and amateurish in from of the city's 340,000 inhabitants, they turned this to look visionary in the eyes of all-but 10K hard-core footy fans left - but that's less than 3% of the population of the city, so who cares (revert to my opening remark about councils).

The council will justify it's actions due to the behaviour described in my second paragraph, but when pressured they revert to type and behave as per my opening. The issue being that the owners did give them every chance to behave as they did - and they just shouldn't have, as they waived away their rights and interests in the very assets that the football club needs in the long term.

As such, the club's owners were the nefarious boyfriend in my scenario; and they just shouldn't have shagged Candice from the Oak and Black Dog. That's what started the road to ruin upon which we still walk...

 

[Deleted member 5849]

PS Welcome back MMM, nice to have a thoughtful posters views.

His posts are too bloody long for me to argue against when at work though!

Think he and OSB are going for verbal overdosing.

 

[Mary_Mungo_Midge]

His posts are too bloody long for me to argue against when at work though!

Think he and OSB are going for verbal overdosing.

Twat

 

[Deleted member 5849]

Twat

Better, you cock.:vulcan:

 

[Deleted member 5849]

they just shouldn't have shagged Candice from the Oak and Black Dog

Wouldn't shag anyone from the Oak and Black Dog...

 

[duffer]

Wherever anyone's synpathies lie, the sad truth is that all of the damage done by SISU, however severe, could have been repaired eventually by a more beneficial owner, but it's highly unlikely that the damage done by CCC in selling ACL to Wasps can ever be repaired

That's as elegant a summary as anything that I've ever seen hereabouts. Couldn't agree more.

 

[Grendel]

No it doesn't. They'll just have another bond issue to cover any shortfall and/or additional refinancing needs they have at the time. Of course, there'll be those on here that'll claim any such issue won't be attractive or viable; but they'll be the same people who scoffed at the original issue which turned out to be oversubscribed

Those were the days. Where is this wanker now?

 

[Broken Hearted Sky Blue]

Those were the days. Where is this wanker now?

Probably involved with the latest incarnation of the twats

 

[Sick Boy]

Captain Dart, Peeler, MMM -

 

[Evo1883]

I think many of us were at times just desperate for a solution and had had enough of years of nonsense .

I'm just glad it's over

 

[clint van damme]

You are right, there are quiet a few on this board, adamant Wasps are going to fail. I just can't see it happening myself.

Haha! What a dickhead.

 

[HuckerbyDublinWhelan]

2 year celebration of their demise next month

 

[Gynnsthetonic]

Haha! What a dickhead.

All these old names, MMM, Peeler, RFC, Italia, must be loads more