Westworld (4 Viewers)
- Thread starter Otis
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RegTheDonk
Well-Known Member
Wow and borgen me indeed. No spoilers but if anyone has this on sky+ better watch it before someone blabs
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Ian1779
Well-Known Member
As soon as he said what door.... Brilliant episode
Otis
Well-Known Member
Very interesting theory being bandied about on the net about Westworld.
Will put it in a spoiler even though it is just a theory.
Will put it in a spoiler even though it is just a theory.
The suggestion is that William, Delores and Logan are in the park some 30 years previous to the man in black and the scenes with Ford and the company. They are present day.
Apparently there are clues as to the fact that William in fact becomes the man in black some 30 years later.
One apparent 'clue' is about William talking about almost living in the pages of a book and a couple of episodes ago the man in black talking about the final few pages the chapter of the book.
Have to say, the thought never, ever occurred to me at all .....well, not until now anyway.
Apparently there are a few clues. Could of course just be a red herring. The man in black also talks of the fact that 'in a sense I was born here.'
The suggestion is William becomes completely besotted and in love with Delores and then she gets her memory wiped and is reset and that is when a distraught and hurting William starts on his slippery path to the man in black.
Anyone else on here picked up on it at all?
Apparently there are clues as to the fact that William in fact becomes the man in black some 30 years later.
One apparent 'clue' is about William talking about almost living in the pages of a book and a couple of episodes ago the man in black talking about the final few pages the chapter of the book.
Have to say, the thought never, ever occurred to me at all .....well, not until now anyway.
Apparently there are a few clues. Could of course just be a red herring. The man in black also talks of the fact that 'in a sense I was born here.'
The suggestion is William becomes completely besotted and in love with Delores and then she gets her memory wiped and is reset and that is when a distraught and hurting William starts on his slippery path to the man in black.
Anyone else on here picked up on it at all?
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Sky_Blue_Daz
Well-Known Member
Gonna catch up with this later
Otis
Well-Known Member
Best one so far, besides the pilot episode I would say.
RegTheDonk
Well-Known Member
That's an interesting one and the points you put in do make sense. I suppose it's backed up by an early scene where Ed rapes Deloris and says something like "nice to see you again". If true, looks like they had a bit of bump in their relationship!
I kind of hope it's all just coincidential and they don't try to be too clever and make it too complicated...I gave up with Lost, and Twin Peaks etc. I like twists and turns, and this week was huge - but I'm a bit lazy and if I have to think too deep and try and join the dots, I usually give up.
My theory about Bernard's kid has been blown out of the water! Perhaps I should stick to my strenghs and just comment on football players, formations and tactics
I kind of hope it's all just coincidential and they don't try to be too clever and make it too complicated...I gave up with Lost, and Twin Peaks etc. I like twists and turns, and this week was huge - but I'm a bit lazy and if I have to think too deep and try and join the dots, I usually give up.
My theory about Bernard's kid has been blown out of the water! Perhaps I should stick to my strenghs and just comment on football players, formations and tactics
Sky_Blue_Daz
Well-Known Member
Flipping heck !!!
Otis
Well-Known Member
I didn't see that coming at all. Apparently there had been theories that, that was the case, but for me, I didn't spot it, though I have wondered about other characters.
Ian1779
Well-Known Member
It's funny because I finally caught up last night... And the one thing that I kept thinking about was that possibly William and the Man in Black were the same person, but didn't consider that for that to be the case you would have to have this disparity in the timeline. This was before I'd read anything on the Internet. I also think that Ford may have 'hosts' planted everywhere... Including on the board of the company.
I do have a theory that Ford is deliberately attempting to push for complete AI in the hosts so that they can punish those who come to the park for essentially some pretty depraved behaviour.
I do have a theory that Ford is deliberately attempting to push for complete AI in the hosts so that they can punish those who come to the park for essentially some pretty depraved behaviour.
Otis
Well-Known Member
Yeah, maybe.
Despite everything that has been suggested to the contrary, I still kind of think the Man in Black might be a host.
What exactly is he looking for? There is surely no answer at the end of the maze, just an insight as to how the park works.
He interacts with the hosts very much on a personal level too, as he did with Laurence. He also never questioned the boy (the young Ford) as to who he is and what he was doing there all alone in the middle of nowhere.
He also talks of coming here for 30 years, so I wonder if that is just part of his narrative.
Also not convinced that Ford himself isn't a host. The ultimate host created by Arnold.
Interesting stuff to be debated anyway.
What exactly is he looking for? There is surely no answer at the end of the maze, just an insight as to how the park works.
He interacts with the hosts very much on a personal level too, as he did with Laurence. He also never questioned the boy (the young Ford) as to who he is and what he was doing there all alone in the middle of nowhere.
He also talks of coming here for 30 years, so I wonder if that is just part of his narrative.
Also not convinced that Ford himself isn't a host. The ultimate host created by Arnold.
Interesting stuff to be debated anyway.
Philosoraptor
Well-Known Member
I dont know what episode you lot are on but waiting for episode eight to be released and all I will say is OMG! This is epic.
Ian1779
Well-Known Member
Otis
Well-Known Member
Yeah, but that is only available in the form of a host. Unless of course people are half human/half host.
Otis
Well-Known Member
Bloody hell!!
After last week's brilliant episode I found this one very confused.
Maybe it was just me, but it seemed all over the place and appeared determined to bugger us all up with its narrative and jumping and dream sequences and time switches.
I found it rather annoying and patronising. Felt like someone was deliberately trying to completely baffle the viewer.
Anyone understand all that in the episode tonight?
After last week's brilliant episode I found this one very confused.
Maybe it was just me, but it seemed all over the place and appeared determined to bugger us all up with its narrative and jumping and dream sequences and time switches.
I found it rather annoying and patronising. Felt like someone was deliberately trying to completely baffle the viewer.
Anyone understand all that in the episode tonight?
olderskyblue
Well-Known Member
I understood it all, unfortunately, my memory has been wiped since the program ended....
Otis
Well-Known Member
Sorry, did you just say something?
Otis
Well-Known Member
I got the basic jist and Maeve's historical journey and tale made sense. Delores story however I found muddled. I took that as a deliberate ploy by the makers.
Just thought there was far too much going on, far too much revelation and clue giving and far too much time jumping.
Delores was confused, but quite quite as much as the audience I don't think.
Just thought there was far too much going on, far too much revelation and clue giving and far too much time jumping.
Delores was confused, but quite quite as much as the audience I don't think.
covcity4life
Well-Known Member
fan theory is that william and delores storyline is set in past and william is the man in blacl. pretty damn creative if true!
as for maeve, i like her storyline but the maze thing makes no sense. why did it appear where MiB kille her kid?
as for maeve, i like her storyline but the maze thing makes no sense. why did it appear where MiB kille her kid?
Otis
Well-Known Member
A few things puzzling about last night's episode.
I got the MIB/William thing, but apparently it is suggested that last night Delores was in three differing timelines.
Maeve's back story is a lot more transparent.
The William thing made a bit more sense last night, cos for a moment he lost his usual kind and helpful nature and refused at first to give water to the dying confederate soldier.The onset of MIB perhaps.
Maeve's back story is a lot more transparent.
The William thing made a bit more sense last night, cos for a moment he lost his usual kind and helpful nature and refused at first to give water to the dying confederate soldier.The onset of MIB perhaps.
Just got the feeling that last night they were deliberately trying to fog everything up and throw a few confusing clues and red herrings.
I didn't quite buy the MIB 's backstory either. Seemed a rather lame excuse to his initial path of violence and hatred
I found it muddled after last week's brilliant revelation episode.
covcity4life
Well-Known Member
but why was the maze there in the sand?!
dutchman
Well-Known Member
I think he was trying to reconcile the fact that while he cared about one robot he didn't care about the other.
As for the other theory, Dolores must have done something terrible for him to want to come back, rape and murder her over and over again?
As for the other theory, Dolores must have done something terrible for him to want to come back, rape and murder her over and over again?
RegTheDonk
Well-Known Member
This has been referred to throughout the series, it pops up in buildings, in scalps, it's something of a mystery designed by one of the park's original co-creators. Even Anthony Hopkins' character wants to know what secrects it hides. It's one of those things that unfortunately keeps you guessing as to the true meaning.
I dare say, along with the maze, most things will be revealed once we get to the end of this series. Like others have said about this week, it's sometimes hard to get your head around what is happening and what the clues are...the flashbacks do explain a bit (Mave was tipped over the edge by MiB, which led her to stab him and be shifted to the whore house), but pose more questions (WTF has happened with Delores, someone killer her and left her in a river?).
Mave keeps stealing the show for me: her self awareness is now a great storyline. Laughed my head off at the two techs trying to deal with her - a second later WOW she slits one of their throats. She's turning into a powerhouse and I think the girl playing her is doing a great job. Interesting how, in a lot of TV and films lately, the girlies are portrayed as the big heros.
I'm confused about a fair few things, but am happy to still be along for the ride, enjoying how Mave, Delores and even now Teddy are developing.
Mave keeps stealing the show for me: her self awareness is now a great storyline. Laughed my head off at the two techs trying to deal with her - a second later WOW she slits one of their throats. She's turning into a powerhouse and I think the girl playing her is doing a great job. Interesting how, in a lot of TV and films lately, the girlies are portrayed as the big heros.
I'm confused about a fair few things, but am happy to still be along for the ride, enjoying how Mave, Delores and even now Teddy are developing.
Pipehitterz
Well-Known Member
Just caught up with the past 2 episodes, holy wow.
I'm fucking loving this program, so many red herrings, twists, information and head scratching moments.
I love it .
Anthony Hopkins and ed Harris are amazing, you can't look Away from the screen when they're on
Just not convinced by maiv. her power over the engineers is based on very weak story line, I wouldn't be upset if she's dumped.
Love that idea about separate timeliness that Otis mentioned.
That's a fucking brilliant spotif it turns out to be true
I'm fucking loving this program, so many red herrings, twists, information and head scratching moments.
I love it .
Anthony Hopkins and ed Harris are amazing, you can't look Away from the screen when they're on
Just not convinced by maiv. her power over the engineers is based on very weak story line, I wouldn't be upset if she's dumped.
Love that idea about separate timeliness that Otis mentioned.
That's a fucking brilliant spotif it turns out to be true
Otis
Well-Known Member
With Delores it is her looking at herself in a different timeline. She is dead and William is no longer there. From what I understand, Delores is in 3 differing timelines. There is also a possibility she is Wyatt.
Otis
Well-Known Member
I love Maeve. Best character in the show I reckon.
Though they may well need to consider changing the name of the show from Westworld to 'Thandie Newton's Bush. '
Ian1779
Well-Known Member
I found the last episode confusing - here's why.
After this weeks monologue I am even more confused by the Man in Black and his motives, other than finding the maze.
What does he really want? What is he looking for at/in the maze?
Does he want to die, so finding it is a release. Is the maze the key to the whole world, so maybe he wants to take it down for turning him into the man he is. Or does he want to become a host and live forever.
I think the 2/3 timeline thing is quite obvious now, and they've done a good job with it.
Talking of crazy theories I'm gonna put one more out there. Anthony Hopkins is a host.
What does he really want? What is he looking for at/in the maze?
Does he want to die, so finding it is a release. Is the maze the key to the whole world, so maybe he wants to take it down for turning him into the man he is. Or does he want to become a host and live forever.
I think the 2/3 timeline thing is quite obvious now, and they've done a good job with it.
Talking of crazy theories I'm gonna put one more out there. Anthony Hopkins is a host.
Otis
Well-Known Member
I think I have already suggested that on this thread haven't I?
Yeah, MIB's quest for the maze I do find a little odd.
Ian1779
Well-Known Member
That's the thing - if you have I'm so bloody confused by the episodes and our discussions about it that I don't know what anyone is suggesting!!I think I have already suggested that on this thread haven't I?
Yeah, MIB's quest for the maze I do find a little odd.
Otis
Well-Known Member
That's the thing - if you have I'm so bloody confused by the episodes and our discussions about it that I don't know what anyone is suggesting!!
One of the bits I don't get is the Delores dead in the water scenario. The blue dress appears to signify one timeline and the blouse, trousers and boots outfit, another.
If the her and William thing is in the past, some thirty years previous, then when exactly is the death in the water thing?
It sort of appears to suggest the past, but if William is there right at the start of the park's opening (sort of hinted at with him and Logan talking of investing in the park when they first arrive) then it can only be a very short time previous. If so, I wonder why the makers would do that.
William is clearly not there when she sees her own self lying face down in the river.
You sort of get the feeling that the MIB wants to maybe destroy the park (he's certainly out for some kind of revenge), but then I don't understand why he didn't just kill Ford when he had the chance at their meeting.
Hoping a bit more clarity will be forthcoming.
It sort of appears to suggest the past, but if William is there right at the start of the park's opening (sort of hinted at with him and Logan talking of investing in the park when they first arrive) then it can only be a very short time previous. If so, I wonder why the makers would do that.
William is clearly not there when she sees her own self lying face down in the river.
You sort of get the feeling that the MIB wants to maybe destroy the park (he's certainly out for some kind of revenge), but then I don't understand why he didn't just kill Ford when he had the chance at their meeting.
Hoping a bit more clarity will be forthcoming.
Otis
Well-Known Member
For all the answers tonight, I now still have lots of more questions.
Tis spoiling it a little for me, because it is so puzzle ridden and it can be hard to keep up.
One thing particularly baffling me is ...... we accept that William is the MIB, but some 30 years previous. The MIB is therefore in the present day and age.
If he's in the here and now and Charlotte is in the here and now, then surely they would both know of Arnold and that Arnold is dead and would also know what he looked like and therefore know that Bernard is therefore a host.
If he's in the here and now and Charlotte is in the here and now, then surely they would both know of Arnold and that Arnold is dead and would also know what he looked like and therefore know that Bernard is therefore a host.
Tis spoiling it a little for me, because it is so puzzle ridden and it can be hard to keep up.
dutchman
Well-Known Member
You might accept that is the case Otis, I never have.
It's also clear now that Dolores' apparent change of clothing is due to her having trodden the same path many times over the years.
It's also clear now that Dolores' apparent change of clothing is due to her having trodden the same path many times over the years.
Otis
Well-Known Member
But in the episode, when the MIB enters the church, doesn't Delores look at him and say 'William?'