Rent (2 Viewers)

[wingy]

Unless people start paying for tickets they will not be able to turn it around.
Although they average 16kish, which is over double what they got at wycombe, ticket sales are only up by 19%.

Is that monetarily, IE cheaper tickets on greater numbers?
Lad I used to work with shells £500 for his ST near the tunnel
On old data from Gloucester it equates roughly to a Million per thousand average through the gates, If they're not hitting £16M for this season they're giving it away or doing something wrong.

 

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[dongonzalos]

After his 2nd post it appears it's me who maybe mistaken, and if that is the case
I 'like you do not share his optimism that SISU will do the right thing.:emoji_thinking:

In our situation if the club were not requesting talks now.
After the way the first rent talks went.
After the way trying to buy ACL went.
I should know better but I just imagine anyone to be that nuts to take the same ridiculous approach.

 

[shmmeee]

Pathetic, what possible reason could there be to refuse mediation unless they don't want us to stay at the Ricoh on a fair deal.

At least he's been caught out lying, and not for the first time, although I'm sure the usual suspects will be along shortly to defend him.

From this:

That is not, as far as we are concerned, an issue which requires mediation as we are open to an approach

Sounds like he's calling Sisu's bluff.

Sounds like a reasonable position. Sisu want mediation for something they haven't started negotiation on. Mediation was always a red herring to buy them time and give them an out.

Yet again: no one but Sisu has a responsibility to us, to everyone else we are just a business under the same rules with no special treatment. That's life, no point crying about it.

We chose to go homeless. We chose a short term deal. We decided this whole route was best for the club. We can't bitch when it turns out it was a stupid move, literally no one made us do it.

 

[Grendel]

From this:



Sounds like he's calling Sisu's bluff.

Sounds like a reasonable position. Sisu want mediation for something they haven't started negotiation on. Mediation was always a red herring to buy them time and give them an out.

Yet again: no one but Sisu has a responsibility to us, to everyone else we are just a business under the same rules with no special treatment. That's life, no point crying about it.

We chose to go homeless. We chose a short term deal. We decided this whole route was best for the club. We can't bitch when it turns out it was a stupid move, literally no one made us do it.

Have you read any of the thread?

 

[stupot07]

From this:



Sounds like he's calling Sisu's bluff.

Sounds like a reasonable position. Sisu want mediation for something they haven't started negotiation on. Mediation was always a red herring to buy them time and give them an out.

Yet again: no one but Sisu has a responsibility to us, to everyone else we are just a business under the same rules with no special treatment. That's life, no point crying about it.

We chose to go homeless. We chose a short term deal. We decided this whole route was best for the club. We can't bitch when it turns out it was a stupid move, literally no one made us do it.

Why would he be calling sisu's bluff? It was wasps not sisu that pulled out of talks. I'm sure the club would be more than willing to do another 2+2 year deal on reasonable terms.

Perhaps he's telling porkies about the naming rights being on shedule and they need the club to stay?

You're also forgetting, that even on the current deal wasps are gaining around £250k+ pa for just 23 days use of the bowl, an empty bowl generates no money, and they do have a £3m black hole to fill.

Given it was wasps who called talks off, and I'd put money on that being a board decision, IMO Eastwood should have emailed, phoned, written to the club inviting them to talk about renewing the deal, but wasps do like to do their talking through the papers.

Sent from my SM-G930F using Tapatalk

 

[SkyBlueZack]

More PR by Wasps. Perhaps they don't want mediation as they want an unreasonable amount? Thing is, Wasps called talks off citing legal noise. Everyone lapped it up. Now there saying there is no problem, the club just need too talk to us. People again lapping it up, Wasps are being reasonable, SISU are being themselves. I personally would prefer mediation, minuted too. Would be best for all concerned, would allow judgements to be made on what happened rather than what may have happened.

 

[ccfcway]

surely all the club have to do its talk to them then ?

As soon as it becomes apparent that the deal is too high / not suitable, the club could call for mediation, citing unreasonable terms

Why would wasps want medication for something that hasn't happened.

 

[Captain Dart]

More PR by Wasps. Perhaps they don't want mediation as they want an unreasonable amount? Thing is, Wasps called talks off citing legal noise. Everyone lapped it up. Now there saying there is no problem, the club just need too talk to us. People again lapping it up, Wasps are being reasonable, SISU are being themselves. I personally would prefer mediation, minuted too. Would be best for all concerned, would allow judgements to be made on what happened rather than what may have happened.

Clearly the best strategy for SISU is to not talk at all and tell the EFL the club is moving elsewhere till someone gives them what they want. Does this make you happy?

 

[6 Generations]

surely all the club have to do its talk to them then ?

As soon as it becomes apparent that the deal is too high / not suitable, the club could call for mediation, citing unreasonable terms

Why would wasps want medication for something that hasn't happened.

I think we all need medication after how the last 9 years have panned out!!!

 

[ccfcway]

I think we all need medication after how the last 9 years have panned out!!!

id change that autocorrect, but I like it, it works

 

[oldskyblue58]

Firstly aren't face to face talks rather than mediation better? Mediation is intervention in a dispute in order to resolve it. What is in dispute at the Ricoh between Wasps/ACL and CCFC? Its a contract negotiation isn't it? The fact that they are saying a slightly more conciliatory "we are willing to talk" edges things forward doesn't it, if only half a step.

That aside I find the timing interesting. We have had statements from TF about having to find other solutions because of impasse at the stadium, a letter from the EFL saying mediation on going with all parties, progress with BPA and Council etc (ie they got behind what they were told by TF) ....... all painting a picture of a club forced to take decisions/actions that they don't want to but have a plan ....... then we have this latest from Wasps Nick Eastwood saying in effect "CCFC do not have to go we are willing to talk" so attempting to dispel the immediate need to leave (countering TF statement and version to EFL) ............. of course in May there is a EFL board meeting followed by the EFL AGM in June where such things will be discussed. ....... pressure not to permit a move away?

all posturing of course ................ but absolutely nothing new or unusual in that :facepalm:

 

[SkyBlueZack]

Or perhaps given the history of the Ricoh saga. All parties could get round a table with a mediator present, minute the meeting and try to come to a fair conclusion for the football club. That would make me happy, yes.

Not sure why people think it's unreasonable to suggest that.

Edit. No dispute but negotiations stopped due to a legal dispute?

 

[chiefdave]

As soon as it becomes apparent that the deal is too high / not suitable, the club could call for mediation, citing unreasonable terms

You only have to look at this thread to see why that's a bad idea. Wasps apparently changed their stance on talking to the club, didn't inform the club, but somehow its Fishers fault for not contacting them. MP wants to assist to help a deal get done, club says yes, Wasps refuse, nobody has a problem with it.

If they started talking and a deal wasn't done as Wasps were being unreasonable they wouldn't get any of the blame.

Get someone neutral in there and then we'll where we really stand.

 

[Deleted member 5849]

medication

We all need that after supporting CCFC...

But take some perspectives, too. Let's look at both POVs.

Wasps stop talks because of legal noise. Not unreasonable from their POV. Even though it's affecting a partner, it's all about building relationships. There'll be some distrust of the aggressor anyway.

CCFC find talks stopped. Not unreasonable for them to feel aggrieved, from their POV. It's not legal action against Wasps as such, talks can go on regardless, other issues make CCFC distrustful. Is it really unreasonable to be distrustful of a shift that even the Coventry Telegraph can expose as not 100% accurate in how it was represented by Wasps in the form of Eastwood?

So what's wrong with a mediator? Wasps seemed to reject that option. Why? What's wrong as a concept with someone working with parties to to try and resolve conflicts and find a position workable to all?

If only we'd had some mediation when the original dispute blew up eh, instead of people reverting to entrenched positions...

 

[SkyBlueZack]

Also strange that people are desperate for MP's to be involved in stopping the club moving but not help negotiate a fair deal for the club to stay? Almost as if people want the club to be held to ransom by Wasps.

 

[martcov]

Or perhaps given the history of the Ricoh saga. All parties could get round a table with a mediator present, minute the meeting and try to come to a fair conclusion for the football club. That would make me happy, yes.

Not sure why people think it's unreasonable to suggest that.

Edit. No dispute but negotiations stopped due to a legal dispute?

Apparently not.

 

[ccfcway]

You only have to look at this thread to see why that's a bad idea. Wasps apparently changed their stance on talking to the club, didn't inform the club, but somehow its Fishers fault for not contacting them. MP wants to assist to help a deal get done, club says yes, Wasps refuse, nobody has a problem with it.

If they started talking and a deal wasn't done as Wasps were being unreasonable they wouldn't get any of the blame.

Get someone neutral in there and then we'll where we really stand.

Assuming your correct and they changed their stance, surely that means the club should now contact them ?

I don't disagree that mediation (ideally streamed on here) would be best for the club, but wasps are playing the game and we aren't.

 

[martcov]

Also strange that people are desperate for MP's to be involved in stopping the club moving but not help negotiate a fair deal for the club to stay? Almost as if people want the club to be held to ransom by Wasps.

Why should MPs be involved in negotiations between hedge funds? If both sides walk away, you could justify asking for a mediator. But that is not the case. All Tim has to do is pick up the phone... but he is 'swamped' and we are waiting for Joy's new CEO. There is no one at CCFC to talk to the mediator at the moment anyway if we even had one...

 

[oldskyblue58]

It is not unreasonable to suggest mediation to solve a dispute. It is not a compulsory process. If all parties do not buy in to the process or see merit in it and are not prepared to go with it fully it wont work. Doing it with everyone in one room isn't going to get it done. You have to identify each individual conflict and the parties involved and deal with each in turn.

What is disputed between Wasps and CCFC at the Ricoh?

Did negotiations stop because of a legal dispute or was it taking a position to put pressure on CCFC and finding an excuse to cover it. The latter I think

Mediation will facilitate talks nothing more, it is not a process that finalises a negotiation. CCFC have just been invited to talk - at least at face value it looks that way. So get together somewhere neutral, and private and talk in good faith about a potential solution at the Ricoh either short medium or long term. Where is the wrong in short circuiting the mediation and talking direct if that is what both parties really want?

What is a fair deal for CCFC

and for it to work what is a fair deal for Wasps

personally never been desperate to have politicians involved in any capacity...... would rather someone who could bang a few (all) heads together and after years of dispute get it solved so CCFC has a solid future (just dreaming I know)

 

[Deleted member 5849]

Where is the wrong in short circuiting the mediation and talking direct if that is what both parties really want?

If you were Eastwood or Fisher, would you blame either for being distrustful of anything the other said, and finding private talks a waste of time as they'd both be spouting bullshit at one another?

I'd want a neutral party there to keep things on track, and not digress into who can spin the biggest yarn!

 

[SkyBlueZack]

Between CCFC and Wasps? I imagine the rent they want paid, the length of the deal, break clauses, access to matchday revenue, the mark up on hospitality.

You're right it was to put pressure on, worked too. Everyone shouting for JR to be dropped, CET running a petition, Hoffman 'agreeing' a deal to play there. All this despite it being pointed out it was brinkmanship.

Mediation, I would hope, would stop both CCFC and Wasps wriggling and making excuses, enough of that has happened in the past. There is too much distrust on both sides, understandably.

A fair deal for CCFC would be similar to what they had when they moved back, maybe a bit better. Certainly not any worse.

Fair deal for Wasps, something that is completely unfair for the club. At an impasse, again.

 

[oldskyblue58]

So apparently CCFC, SISU, CRFC, WASPs, CCC, even SB Trust have all been invited to take part in the mediation. Really think that details of a deal at the Ricoh between CCFC and Wasps would be discussed in front of the rest of the parties ........ or would they yes lets talk but not here. It might include the mediator but I think it would suit both sides not to given their agendas

 

[Nick]

Why would anybody be against any form of mediation to get it all sorted out? An independent in the middle who won't fall for either side's shit.

Haven't read many threads in the last few days but it's not surprising. People have said from the start that the legal noise stuff was a pressure / negotiating tactic.

They really seem to be able to play some people like fiddles.

 

[Captain Dart]

Or perhaps given the history of the Ricoh saga. All parties could get round a table with a mediator present, minute the meeting and try to come to a fair conclusion for the football club. That would make me happy, yes.

Not sure why people think it's unreasonable to suggest that.

Edit. No dispute but negotiations stopped due to a legal dispute?

You clearly have no idea what mediation is. At this stage all they have to do is talk like adults, there is no dispute it is just a contract negotiation,

Anyway, didn't Anderson try talking and get nowhere, I suspect he was not negotiating on behalf of SISU but on behalf of his comnsortium.

 

[Nick]

Clearly the best strategy for SISU is to not talk at all and tell the EFL the club is moving elsewhere till someone gives them what they want. Does this make you happy?

Give it a break, just making things up and saying "is this what makes you happy"?

What would make people happy is having them all in a room and their heads banged together and nobody letting them out until something is sorted one way or another with an independent there to see just who is being a prick about it and having them called out on it.

 

[Nick]

You clearly have no idea what mediation is. At this stage all they have to do is talk like adults, there is no dispute it is just a contract negotiation,

Anyway, didn't Anderson try talking and get nowhere, I suspect he was not negotiating on behalf of SISU but on behalf of his comnsortium.

Yes, that was when Wasps were saying they couldn't talk and people were lapping it up as the right thing to do to "show SISU".

Now suddenly Wasps have done a U Turn and it is just about "contract negotiations"

Couldn't make it up.

Why on earth would anybody be against mediation / independent involvement? It's almost as if they are worried about what might come out from it.

 

[martcov]

Yes, that was when Wasps were saying they couldn't talk and people were lapping it up as the right thing to do to "show SISU".

Now suddenly Wasps have done a U Turn and it is just about "contract negotiations"

Couldn't make it up.

Why on earth would anybody be against mediation / independent involvement? It's almost as if they are worried about what might come out from it.

Maybe because there is no dispute yet? Maybe they can come to an agreement themselves? If not, then ask for mediation.

 

[ccfcway]

Why on earth would anybody be against mediation / independent involvement? It's almost as if they are worried about what might come out from it.

the two parties most against mediation seem to be ccfc and wasps

 

[Nick]

Maybe because there is no dispute yet? Maybe they can come to an agreement themselves? If not, then ask for mediation.

There has been a dispute for the past how many months where Wasps were refusing to talk which was disproved at the start with the fact they started talks and now they have done a U Turn.

There is no harm at all in having somebody independent in there, if for anything it stops either side from reeling shit out about it which is obvious to anybody with eyes what will happen.

 

[SkyBlueZack]

You clearly have no idea what mediation is. At this stage all they have to do is talk like adults, there is no dispute it is just a contract negotiation,

Anyway, didn't Anderson try talking and get nowhere, I suspect he was not negotiating on behalf of SISU but on behalf of his comnsortium.

I know what mediation is, hence why I think it's a good idea. For reasons I have given. Clearly they struggle to talk like adults, both sides. There is a dispute, Wasps are holding the club to ransom and CCFC fans are drooling over it.

Yeah, Anderson tried and got nowhere because Wasps wanted more money and everything stacked in their favour. Wasps then said SISU, everyone got angry, they got/get away with it.

 

[SkyBlueZack]

Maybe because there is no dispute yet? Maybe they can come to an agreement themselves? If not, then ask for mediation.

Didn't Anderson try that but Wasps threw out some bullshit about legal noise?

 

[Nick]

the two parties most against mediation seem to be ccfc and wasps

CCFC have already been speaking with that bloke haven't they? Might be worth asking him what CCFC have said to him...

 

[SkyBlueZack]

the two parties most against mediation seem to be ccfc and wasps

CCFC called for mediation? Wasps refused mediation.

 

[hutch1972]

28,500 paid full price against Saracens last week.
They make a small fortune in hospitality on top of that.
Will be even more against Leicester.

On the contrary, 10 and under were free , schools and clubs still got their weekly ration of giveaways.
It is also important to remember that you cannot rely on play offs or European cup knockout games to plan finances.
With what is being shelled out on wages etc it's little wonder that certain projects have stalled.

 

[Nick]

Didn't Anderson try that but Wasps threw out some bullshit about legal noise?

Yes, both parties said negotiations were underway and going well then Wasps pulled the plug and everybody got angry at CCFC and SISU.

It's the same as the random MP woman who pops up every so often demanding that CCFC can't live the city but she didn't mention Wasps refusing to talk.

Everybody should be focused about getting all of the pricks in the same room and getting something sorted one way or another.

Scenarios.

1. A deal is made
2. Wasps want something silly
3. CCFC want something silly
4. Parties don't turn up or refuse it.

If that happens, you know who to be angry at / pressure.

It won't be as simple as that though, it will just be put out as "SISU" and then everybody will be frothing while other parties can do what they want. It's so predictable.