General Election (46 Viewers)

[Grendel]

What like the deficit? I'm pretty sure we were supposed to have stopped losing money 2 years ago?

At least the minimum wage and tax allowance have gone up as fast as the price of items.... oh wait....

Remind me when I'm in school next week to tell the kids that it's OK they have no books or equipment - because the GDP looks good.

Well if Mr Corbyn gets in power prepare yourself for more children from the private system when fees are hiked by 20%

 

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[clint van damme]

In fairness to the Tories Ian, they have always said they have put more money into the NHS and that graph does seem to suggest that. It would be interesting to see how the "real terms" figures stack up, and WHERE that money has gone...services HAVE been cut. An elderly neighbour who was blind had a home help come twice a day - a service run by social services/NHS/council - but this was contracted out to a private company. I'd like to think the money pumped into the system is used within the system, but I woudn't hold my breath.

Would like to see the figures for other public services in that chart (eg. police, fire, armed forces, council help etc) see how much they've improved.

they would put money into the NHS by implementing the Naylor report. That's no way to go forward.

 

[Captain Dart]

Confidence in Corbyn...

Nope.

 

[clint van damme]

what annual deficit id it referring to? If it's budget deficit I don't think those figures are correct.

 

[SkyblueBazza]

Actually amazing that they get away with this..... the sheer callousness of selling weapons to a barbaric 7 century kingdom whilst knowing exactly what they are using the weapons for in Yemen, and whilst they are furthering the spread of their radical and violent form of Islam in Britain. Our great ally Trump has just flogged them 110 billion dollars worth of weapons over the next 10 years..... despite 9/11. Would Corbyn have sold them our weapons? Would he censur Trump? The report must show The Saudis in a bad light otherwise it would have been published before the election. If it gets published straight after the election, it will have been forgotten about by the next election.

I remember us selling arms to Iraq in the early 80s. I even had a chat with one of Saddam's arms buyers in London. Dead nice guy and really generous - g and ts all round. I asked him what he did for a living and he was quite open about it. That all ended in tears.

I can't vote as I live abroad, but I would vote for a party against May. She represents more of the same. Old fashioned tory policies and the island mentality of bygone generations. No, I don't see us as global Britain under May. More of a Britain desperately looking for new trade deals and having to deal with scum such as the Saudi royal family.

But 'they' aren't bothered about that. Defence industry is big bucks...and lots of export to help the economy. Money and oil matter more than anything else in the world to 'them'

Sent from my SM-G900F using Tapatalk

 

[chiefdave]

Even if you don't believe there is a different between Labour under Corbyn and under Brown & Blair its a touch misleading to compare the midst of a global financial crisis to now.

How about looking over the full labour term (1997 - 2010) against the current conservative term.

ANNUAL DEFICIT





Doesn't look so good for the Conservatives there.

NHS BUDGET

This is very much a case of what you spend it on not how much you spend. Under the Conservatives there is a staffing crisis with healthcare professionals leaving the NHS and not being replaced as increased fees and removal of bursaries make recruitment harder. So while there may be more going in a significantly larger amount is going on agency staff. But of course the high costs of agency staff don't go to the employee, they go to those at the top. A prime example of how under the conservatives the rich get richer.

The Health Commission have said:

"Pressures on NHS providers grow by around 4% every year, due to a growing and aging population as well as rising costs, expectations and prevalence of long-term conditions. At the levels of funding provided, the NHS is struggling to meet these demands and cost pressures."

“the NHS in England is currently halfway through the most austere decade in its history the lowest ever rate of funding growth over a 10 year period"



MINIMUM WAGE

That's just increased inline with inflation. The Living Wage Foundation calculates the current living wage at £8.45 outside London. The living wage from the Conservatives is £7.05 increasing to £7.50 at age 25.

TAX FREE ALLOWANCE

That has increased at above the rate of inflation under the conservatives. However the rise is pretty much consistent with the rate of increase in the couple of decades prior to the conservatives coming in.

UNEMPLOYMENT

A lower headline figure that is true however over the longer term unemployment was lower under Labour. And of course thanks to zero hours contracts and wage suppression there are now a record number of employed people in receipt of benefits and making use of food banks. Surely not a good sign.



GDP

In real terms that is a decrease, and that's before you even consider an increasing population size.

 

[chiefdave]

they would put money into the NHS by implementing the Naylor report. That's no way to go forward.

If they implement Naylor that will be the end of the NHS.

 

[Sick Boy]

It's weird that so many bang on about Corbyn and the IRA, yet are happy to vote for a party with an actual ex member of the IRA standing for election.

 

[Brighton Sky Blue]

It's weird that so many bang on about Corbyn and the IRA, yet are happy to vote for a party with an actual ex member of the IRA standing for election.

Or a Prime Minister arming a dictatorship which practices extremist Islamic ideology.

 

[chiefdave]

It's weird that so many bang on about Corbyn and the IRA, yet are happy to vote for a party with an actual ex member of the IRA standing for election.

An investigation into the foreign funding of extremist Islamist groups may never be published, the Home Office has admitted.

The inquiry commissioned by David Cameron, was launched as part of a deal with the Liberal Democrats in December 2015, in exchange for the party supporting the extension of British airstrikes against Isis into Syria.

But although it was due to be published in the spring of 2016, it has not been completed and may never be made public due to its "sensitive" contents.

It is thought to focus on Saudi Arabia, which the UK recently approved £3.5bn worth of arms export licences to.

 

[Sick Boy]

Posted that earlier.

 

[Earlsdon_Skyblue1]

If Labour don't win the election I predict a Brexit style meltdown. There are a lot of parallels.

I'm not particularly saying good or bad either way, but I'll definitely be getting the popcorn in!

 

[Liquid Gold]

If Labour don't win the election I predict a Brexit style meltdown. There are a lot of parallels.

I'm not particularly saying good or bad either way, but I'll definitely be getting the popcorn in!

What do you mean by brexit style meltdown. I don't think anybody actually expects Labour to win.

 

[Brighton Sky Blue]

What do you mean by brexit style meltdown. I don't think anybody actually expects Labour to win.

Theresa May does, it'd be a great way to keep Corbyn in charge ahead of a rout in 2022.

 

[Sick Boy]

I couldn't help but laugh when she said that Britain had the fastest growing economy in the G7...last year.

 

[Deleted member 5849]

the more votes a smaller party gets then the more chance of one of the big two adopting policies which appeal to their support base so it's not wasted.

And the more chance of it being a worthwhile vote if more actually vote that way!

 

[Kingokings204]

I didn't think May looked that bad last night. She was clear precise and to the point. It's just people who don't agree with her policies that seem to say she was rubbish.

I don't like Corbyn but thought he came across well. He simply has to much baggage to win and if labour had a leader with everyone supporting him:her then labour would do a lot better imo. You can't have most of your team resigning and attempted coups at ousting him along with his awful team of abbot and McDonnell and expect to win an election.

 

[Sick Boy]

I didn't think May looked that bad last night. She was clear precise and to the point. It's just people who don't agree with her policies that seem to say she was rubbish.

I don't like Corbyn but thought he came across well. He simply has to much baggage to win and if labour had a leader with everyone supporting him:her then labour would do a lot better imo. You can't have most of your team resigning and attempted coups at ousting him along with his awful team of abbot and McDonnell and expect to win an election.

All May has are sound bites and empty plaudits, if it was Corbyn refusing to debate her he would get torn to shreds. What baggage does he have? The Tories have an ex IRA member running for parliament, so that kind of puts that one to bed.

If May is the standard or politician you think acceptable, then fair enough I suppose.

 

[martcov]

But 'they' aren't bothered about that. Defence industry is big bucks...and lots of export to help the economy. Money and oil matter more than anything else in the world to 'them'

Sent from my SM-G900F using Tapatalk

That's the problem. We haven't taken back control of our country, nor have the Trump voters taken back their country.

We are still dependent on oil. Oil companies and oil producers.

Until people can get away from oil to some extent, we will be dominated by these people without morals.

Trump doesn't want freedom from fossil fuels. It's not good business for his people- he thinks.

May hasn't the balls to tell the Saudis to stop their countrymen funding mosques which further an extreme version of Islam. May and Trump should have made that a prerequisite of any arms deal.

We can't stop people believing in gods and holy books, but we should not assist the propagation of potentially violent versions of these beliefs by not using whatever leverage we have.

 

[torchomatic]

Fucking hell, last night's QT was a blast, wasn't it? Where did the BBC get these stripey blazered 60 plus lunatics who were creaming themselves at the thought of nuking the shit out of another country.

Trident is a deterrent, it will never be used yet these old blokes were desperate for JC to say he would press that hypotherical button.

Press it...press it...PRESS IT!!!! Kill 'em all...Theresa would do it...PRESS IT...

 

[skybluetony176]

Doesn't look so good for the Conservatives there.

You could argue the opposite given that the labour figures are based on a period of growth based on the good situation that they inherited when coming to power compared to the situation that the tories inherited when they came into power.

The only way to judge a parties performance is the state that they left the country in compared to the state that they inherited it in and on that score the last labour government is surely the worst in history. Yes I know that people are going to cry world financial crisis but the truth is that the last labour government were a big part of that problem. The decisions they and they alone with a massive majority took regarding the governance of the financial sectors made what happened almost inevitably rather than less likely. They gave the kids the keys to the candy shop.

 

[Ian1779]

if you use a deterrent then it is no longer a deterrent....

Then you had one guy banging on about North Korea nuking is - I very much doubt they could get their nuke to the bottom of their garden - never mind halfway across the world.

 

[torchomatic]

You could argue the opposite given that the labour figures are based on a period of growth based on the good situation that they inherited when coming to power compared to the situation that the tories inherited when they came into power.

The only way to judge a parties performance is the state that they left the country in compared to the state that they inherited it in and on that score the last labour government is surely the worst in history. Yes I know that people are going to cry world financial crisis but the truth is that the last labour government were a big part of that problem. The decisions they and they alone with a massive majority took regarding the governance of the financial sectors made what happened almost inevitably rather than less likely. They gave the kids the keys to the candy shop.

As you say there was a world financial crisis, it was nothing to do with Labour. You only think it is Labour's fault if you vote Tory or read the Express, the Sun, the Mail, the Star, Telegraph or listen to people like you who prepetuate the myth.

It's weird. A bit like Rudd and May banging on about the money tree. "There is no magic money tree" they cry, yet the £400bn of quantative easing and bailing out the banks would suggest otherwise. Or the double digit rise MPs have had.

Banks, not Labour, caused the crash and it is the working man, particularly those in the public sector who have paid the heaviest price. Still, easier to blame Labour. Tony, maybe you'd like to remind us all how the Tories have got on getting that deficit down ove r the last seven years. As you said judge a government on when it leaves office.

 

[clint van damme]

Fucking hell, last night's QT was a blast, wasn't it? Where did the BBC get these stripey blazered 60 plus lunatics who were creaming themselves at the thought of nuking the shit out of another country.

Trident is a deterrent, it will never be used yet these old blokes were desperate for JC to say he would press that hypotherical button.

Press it...press it...PRESS IT!!!! Kill 'em all...Theresa would do it...PRESS IT...

as someone said on Twitter - banging the table for war, but would call the police if a teenager let a firework off in their street!

 

[Sick Boy]

Fucking hell, last night's QT was a blast, wasn't it? Where did the BBC get these stripey blazered 60 plus lunatics who were creaming themselves at the thought of nuking the shit out of another country.

Trident is a deterrent, it will never be used yet these old blokes were desperate for JC to say he would press that hypotherical button.

Press it...press it...PRESS IT!!!! Kill 'em all...Theresa would do it...PRESS IT...

It was bordering on madness at times. They seemed desperate t murder as many innocent people as possible, it really is bizarre.

 

[clint van damme]

As you say there was a world financial crisis, it was nothing to do with Labour. You only think it is Labour's fault if you vote Tory or read the Express, the Sun, the Mail, the Star, Telegraph or listen to people like you who prepetuate the myth.

It's weird. A bit like Rudd and May banging on about the money tree. "There is no magic money tree" they cry, yet the £400bn of quantative easing and bailing out the banks would suggest otherwise. Or the double digit rise MPs have had.

Banks, not Labour, caused the crash and it is the working man, particularly those in the public sector who have paid the heaviest price. Still, easier to blame Labour. Tony, maybe you'd like to remind us all how the Tories have got on getting that deficit down ove r the last seven years. As you said judge a government on when it leaves office.

As Theresa May said, wee had the fastest growth of the G7 countries last year, well it's slowed to the lowest growth in the G7 this year - whose fault is that?
We are getting out stripped by countries with higher corporation tax, less wage contraction and less wage inequality.
More tory red herrings used as an excuse to steal from the working man and give it to the top 1%.

 

[clint van damme]

It was bordering on madness at times. They seemed desperate t murder as many innocent people as possible, it really is bizarre.

it was fucking embarrassing an no different to these net jobs like abu hamza or whoever that hook handed mad man was. They made me sick.

 

[Sick Boy]

As Theresa May said, wee had the fastest growth of the G7 countries last year, well it's slowed to the lowest growth in the G7 this year - whose fault is that?
We are getting out stripped by countries with higher corporation tax, less wage contraction and less wage inequality.
More tory red herrings used as an excuse to steal from the working man and give it to the top 1%.

That moment was classic haha! We are now on par with Italy and will most likely sink further. It really is a disgrace, yet it's most likely more innocent scapegoats will get the blame, as usual.

 

[Ian1779]

To be honest I'm still struggling to understand how anyone that hates SISU would even contemplate voting for the Tories... that kind of logic would put you on the writing team for the Tory manifesto.

 

[RegTheDonk]

May wasn't as self destructive as Corbyn last night IMHO.

There are many who, like a lot of us here, would debate the policies and look into the details. To the casual viewer though, the big sticking point and the one latched onto by the press and the floaters, is the nuke option. I like Corbyn's stance re. education, public services, the poorer in society - his principles are pretty sound. Unfortunately, those same principles cost him the election last night IMHO. Shame as, in reality, if it ever comes to the crunch I'm sure his cabinet would revolt and push the button anyway.

 

[Sick Boy]

That says a lot more about the country than him. They criticise him for speaking to the IRA, yet vote for a party with an ex-member as a candidate, as well. It's hypocrisy of the highest order.

 

[Ian1779]

May wasn't as self destructive as Corbyn last night IMHO.

There are many who, like a lot of us here, would debate the policies and look into the details. To the casual viewer though, the big sticking point and the one latched onto by the press and the floaters, is the nuke option. I like Corbyn's stance re. education, public services, the poorer in society - his principles are pretty sound. Unfortunately, those same principles cost him the election last night IMHO. Shame as, in reality, if it ever comes to the crunch I'm sure his cabinet would revolt and push the button anyway.

The fact that the nuclear discussion is the supposed key point over education, NHS, social care shows had bad it has become in terms of social inequality - people caring more about nukes than giving kids a fair chance in life means the elite have done really well at distracting away from the real issues.

 

[RegTheDonk]

The fact that the nuclear discussion is the supposed key point over education, NHS, social care shows had bad it has become in terms of social inequality - people caring more about nukes than giving kids a fair chance in life means the elite have done really well at distracting away from the real issues.

You know how it goes mate. Unfortunately bad news grabs headlines and starts conversations in pubs a lot more than positive spin.

 

[skybluetony176]

As you say there was a world financial crisis, it was nothing to do with Labour. You only think it is Labour's fault if you vote Tory or read the Express, the Sun, the Mail, the Star, Telegraph or listen to people like you who prepetuate the myth.

It's weird. A bit like Rudd and May banging on about the money tree. "There is no magic money tree" they cry, yet the £400bn of quantative easing and bailing out the banks would suggest otherwise. Or the double digit rise MPs have had.

Banks, not Labour, caused the crash and it is the working man, particularly those in the public sector who have paid the heaviest price. Still, easier to blame Labour. Tony, maybe you'd like to remind us all how the Tories have got on getting that deficit down ove r the last seven years. As you said judge a government on when it leaves office.

It's got nothing to do with voting tory or which paper you read. The fact is Tony Blair's government with a controlling majority chose, that word again, chose to relax the constraints of the financial sector. It's was Blair's government that allowed the banking crisis in this country, those words again, this country. It was Blair's government who allowed self certification mortgages, allowing people to borrow five times their wages etc. etc. No one forced them to do these things, they did them willingly.

Yes there was a world financial crisis, yes we would still have taken a hit but the choices that Blair and Brown made exacerbated the problem by failing to safeguard the country from all of elements of the world banking crisis. The one specific that springs to mind was the toxic mortgage debt that UK banks were allowed to buy of the US financial markets whose mortgage arrangements were even more ridiculous than ours were allowed to become. Which was a big part in the collapse of our banking sector.

It doesn't how many times I vote labour, buy the Sun or whatever. It doesn't change the facts of what Blair's government chose to do and ultimately that failed the UK banking sector.

Quite frankly it's a lazy response to say I must be a Tory Sun purchaser as a justification for why this country was hit si hard.

Also, the tories haven't handed power over yet but even if they don't win the general election the fact is that the next labour government will be starting from a better position than the last labour government left it in.

 

[Ian1779]

It's got nothing to do with voting tory or which paper you read. The fact is Tony Blair's government with a controlling majority chose, that word again, chose to relax the constraints of the financial sector. It's was Blair's government that allowed the banking crisis in this country, those words again, this country. It was Blair's government who allowed self certification mortgages, allowing people to borrow five times their wages etc. etc. No one forced them to do these things, they did them willingly.

Yes there was a world financial crisis, yes we would still have taken a hit but the choices that Blair and Brown made exacerbated the problem by failing to safeguard the country from all of elements of the world banking crisis. The one specific that springs to mind was the toxic mortgage debt that UK banks were allowed to buy of the US financial markets whose mortgage arrangements were even more ridiculous than ours were allowed to become. Which was a big part in the collapse of our banking sector.

It doesn't how many times I vote labour, buy the Sun or whatever. It doesn't change the facts of what Blair's government chose to do and ultimately that failed the UK banking sector.

Quite frankly it's a lazy response to say I must be a Tory Sun purchaser as a justification for why this country was hit si hard.

I don't think anyone can say that a Corbyn government will be anything like a Blair one.