CCFC Club in Crisis (20 Viewers)
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Nick
Administrator
So people go to games to support SISU then?
I don't want it all ways, if we got promoted I wouldn't be claiming SISU have got us a finish. The same as I didn't say SISU got us to Wembley, the same as I pointed out to people that SISU didn't do the recruitment when people were praising them for that.
My issue and point was the absolute nonsense people spin about to to try and confuse it, when you have protest groups pushing boycotts to starve CCFC of income so that SISU will be harmed is a prime example. You then have a lot of people repeating it, you then have people believing it.
People are very eager to make out that CCFC is SISU when it suits for them to be able to get worked up about it.
Captain Dart
Well-Known Member
Maybe that is a partial solution now. Previously I could not see it, but since SISU have trimmed the finances to the bone and made the club profitable it is now an option, unfortunately if the club runs on no investment it will not compete well in the leagues so I still think there needs to be new money put into the club to get back to the Championship and the only way back to the Premier League is if a very wealthy owner with the ambition to get promotion takes over.
Maybe £30M demand in JR2 is SISU's opening shot on takeover negotiations with Wasps?
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skybluetony176
Well-Known Member
Like I said stop talking bollocks. I've never said people go to support SISU but let's not pretend that somehow magically SISU and CCFC aren't entwined. People including myself go to support the club not SISU. I don't debate that that isn't a fact. But let's not use that fact to try and sell the line that SISU and the club aren't entwined because they clearly are. You want us to unite. You can start by not trying to sell horse shit that SISU and the club aren't entwined. It's shit like that that drives divide and you more than anyone else deliberately drive that divide.
Nick
Administrator
No, I am saying CCFC and SISU aren't the same thing.
Pitch invasions wouldn't get SISU into trouble with the EFL, it would be the club. Which was my point.
People went on about abandoning games to get SISU fined, it would be the club that got the fine. People didn't realise that the club would get a fine.
Some people seem to think that killing/harming CCFC means killing/harming SISU. That's not the case.
People push to starve CCFC of income, ironically enough the same people shout loudest about budgets.
Being made aware, I mean the difference between things that will damage CCFC thinking it will damage SISU or things damaging SISU directly.
You could go tomorrow to SISU HQ and spray paint spunking cocks all over the front door and nobody would care (apart from that mentalist SISU have invested 5m guy), but doing stuff against CCFC thinking it's getting at SISU then people would be annoyed.
That's my point.
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skybluetony176
Well-Known Member
Beep beep beep, attention, this opinion is reversing.
Someone said SISU and the club are entwined you said that was shit. Which is it? Are they entwined or aren't they?
Nick
Administrator
Nope, it was in reply to me saying the club would get in trouble over the pitch invasions and not SISU.
I said it's shite because regardless of the link at the top whether it's Fisher or AN other it still isn't SISU going to be in trouble for a pitch invasion or pitch protest at a CCFC match but people push that so they think they will.
Intertwine or not, people will always disagree if action involves potentially harming CCFC with the thought it would get at SISU, I doubt many will if the action was directly at SISU.
Yes, you can see a line where you can go and support CCFC and you don't see it as supporting SISU. However, a lot of people can't see that.
skybluetony176
Well-Known Member
So why are you repeatedly making the comment that people support CCFC not SISU anytime anyone links the club to SISU? Not just on this thread but anytime someone mentions CCFC and SISU in the same breath. We all know people go to support CCFC not SISU why do you keep needing to bring it up if it's not to drive a divide? You're not telling anyone anything that they don't know and it only comes of as you trying to dilute SISU of responsibility. Like I said, you shout unite but spout crap like this. Even now I'm pushing you you're struggling to admit that the two are entwined by saying untwined or not. If you want the fan base to unite stop spouting decisive shit like this.
Nick
Administrator
That's why I have said that's what people should be made aware of, that's why I have said about confusion in this thread.
It's all well and good saying we go to games to support CCFC, but then on the other hand we will run on the pitch to get SISU a fine and in trouble with the football league. It doesn't work like that. The same as "Well SISU own CCFC so all the money goes to them" type comments, which again you do get.
You are also saying it isn't telling anybody anything they don't know, have a look about, have a listen to people and listen to what they say. You can't say it's telling people what they already know when quite clearly it isn't when they think a pitch invasion will get SISU in trouble with the football league (as one example).
It isn't diluting anybody of responsibility, as I said barracade the SISU office as that's SISU. The division comes in when people think punching CCFC is action that will make any difference and get SISU in trouble. The whole "that will show SISU" attitude when in reality it won't, it will get CCFC in trouble with the football league and potentially a fine for the football club.
The division was when hundreds of city fans were angry and sarcastically clapping a protest that was against CCFC. The division is fans groups calling for CCFC to be starved of revenue.
How is saying people go to games to support CCFC and not SISU going to drive a divide with anybody?
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torchomatic
Well-Known Member
I'd give up, Nick. Tony loves these kind of threads, basically the only kind of threads he posts on.
Broken Hearted Sky Blue
Well-Known Member
You're right most were there for a day out, a lot had never been to a City game and won't go again
People think hurting CCFC will cause the "asset" that is owned by SISU to become a liability - a long term strategy rather than wanting the short term football success (i.e. the game the protest is at). It's not hard to understand that thinking is it?
Im not just talking financially, but also in terms reputation. SISU may be damaged by any link to this bad publicity.
It remains debatable if the protests will / have made a difference to what SISU want to do with the club.
I'd argue that we'd still be in L2 if the fans did nothing, so in fact all the protests are at least getting media and EFL attention. It's all the fans can do.
No one on here knows what the best route is - what we as fans can do. The divide is due to the fans who feel there is nothing we can do other than support CCFC and the ones that feel we can influence this.
Im not just talking financially, but also in terms reputation. SISU may be damaged by any link to this bad publicity.
It remains debatable if the protests will / have made a difference to what SISU want to do with the club.
I'd argue that we'd still be in L2 if the fans did nothing, so in fact all the protests are at least getting media and EFL attention. It's all the fans can do.
No one on here knows what the best route is - what we as fans can do. The divide is due to the fans who feel there is nothing we can do other than support CCFC and the ones that feel we can influence this.
skybluetony176
Well-Known Member
You're the one confusing it as much as anyone else by spouting people go to support the club not SISU anytime anyone puts them together. It's an irrelevance. We know no one supports SISU but to say that they are separate from the club is misinformation plain and simple.
Who's said that running on the pitch will get sisu a fine? One, maybe two people? Strange you latch on to that and not the real reason for the pitch invasions and other protests which is to keep our plight in the public domain so as people like the FL, parliament etc aren't sweeping it under the carpet.
Yet again you're attempting to make something it isn't driving a divide while shouting unity. You can't even recognise the protests for what they stood for by repeatedly quoting the very small mental minority rather than the majority. You say unity is needed but I have trouble taking you seriously on that when A) you have no suggestion on how that can be achieved and B) you never pass an opportunity to drive a divide. Everything you say says the exact opposite of unity.
skybluetony176
Well-Known Member
You must mean the only kind of threads you read because I post on plenty of other types of threads.
Nick
Administrator
It's not confusing it though is it? It's simple, people go to games to watch CCFC play nothing more or less. I don't say that time every time somebody puts them together, I say it if people say "CCFC is SISU" or nonsense like that. You can't go to games and say you are supporting CCFC but then come home and hammer the lad controlling the CCFC Twitter because they work for "SISU". (an example, by you I don't mean you personally).
Have a look on not just here but social media and listen to what people say. There were a fair few more than one or two saying get SISU a fine from a pitch invasion and it's what I mean about being being confused.
This is a 10 second search:
Rompa18 on Twitter
I'm not making up anything, it's there to see just how many people are eager to jump on things thinking it is going to get rid of SISU without realising it's negative to CCFC and not really doing much damage to SISU.
This is what I mean by clearing up confusion, people read this and believe it. People then share it and tell their friends and people at games, it then goes to pubs pre match etc etc. I used to have a bloke in the gym every day telling me what was going on, it was like an awful game of chinese whispers.
Nobody argues the ownership structure.
skybluetony176
Well-Known Member
My mistake it wasn't one or two it was 8 out of how many who invaded the pitch? My point exactly. Concentrating on the mental minority's, deliberately missing the point of any protest and then using it like it's general consensus to drive a divide. Congratulations.
Esoterica
Well-Known Member
If ever there are pages of cyclical repetitive arguments you're in the middle of it. Grendel likes to drop bombs and enjoys the fallout but you win the SBT Pedant award by miles. It's mind numbing.
Nick
Administrator
No, because it isn't just those 8 is it? It was a quick search with one keyword and one incident. Over time and all the different things there are plenty.
The point wasn't missed, it was the ever famous "plight" word.
That's the thing, if it's a mental minitory who shout the loudest misinforming including fans groups too why not get them corrected?
skybluetony176
Well-Known Member
Is it? Seems it's just the mental minority that you pay attention to. I wasn't aware of any of those you've linked until you went out your way to promote them as the voice for all fans. You acknowledge that they're the minority at the same time just to confuse the issue further and then you concentrate on them. I don't think you take your own unity message seriously. You say nothing about the united majority and only concentrate on the small mental minority. You've been the same with any protest regardless of what that protest is. You're always looking for the negative and one of the first to do it and then use it as a sledgehammer to drive a wedge in to the divide. You don't want unity. You've never done anything proactive to promote it while proactively promoting divide.
Nick
Administrator
So because you aren't aware of things they aren't happening? You are the one telling me that things aren't being said or mentioned but what you mean is that you aren't aware of them.
You are going on about majoritys and minorities, not me. It means nothing.
Maybe if people listened to constructive feedback there would be more chance of unity, that's how it works isn't it? People listen and compromise to unite?
You have completely ignored my points about protests dividing, they have done that far more than any of my posts ever will. If protests and action are deemed to be against CCFC, that will always be the case too.
rupert_bear
Well-Known Member
Not read all the threads so apologise if I'm repeating any. This was always going to raise its head I've brought it up on here a number of times. Anyone who says the EFL doesn't have the power to do anything don't know what they are talking about to be honest. The EFL is not a dictatorship it has 72 members and it is they who decide things based on the rule book which has clear guidelines about EFL membership. Now let's take our Sky Blue specs off for a moment and put ourselves in other clubs positions in our division two of whom will finish in the bottom two positions and will be relegated into the non league, the chairmen of those clubs or any club in division 2 would be neglecting in their duties if they didn't challenge us staying in the EFL at their expense. The rule quiet clearly says clubs must have a 10 year plan as to where they play their home games there can be dispensations we had that when we went to Northampton based on "new ground" promises by chairman Tim Fisher who worryingly is still chairman so who's going to believe him again. I think we, that is ccfc, are in a more serious position than fans think, at the time these Fisher promises were made we weren't in the bottom division, we are now and I expect little sympathy from opposing chairman especially those in our division.
ccfcway
Well-Known Member
no ground after this season, League Two, approx. 2 games from some fans calling for Robins to leave, no long term academy plan, fans shouting at the chairman, fans assaulting female supporters, owners taking CCC and landlords to court, attendance more than halved since owners took us over.
Na, I'm pretty ware of how serious it is
Esoterica
Well-Known Member
You haven't a clue and are talking out your arse......
2 games. pfffffff. I'll be calling for Robins to leave on Saturday night if we fail to win again and he hasn't started Andreu in place of Kelly or Doyle
ccfcway
Well-Known Member
remind me to give this place a miss on Sat night then.
skybluetony176
Well-Known Member
If majority's and minority's mean nothing stop concentrating on the latter. You haven't given any constructive feedback, just looking for the smallest of cracks. I was aware of what some loonies were saying I just hadn't realised it was six more people than I thought it was until you went out your way to point score. I hope it was worth the effort. I know protest have devided to a small extent. People like you have made sure of that so why wouldn't I have noticed. You really shouldn't talk about unity when it's the opposite of what you do full time.
Said it before. But if I was Tim Fisher I'd love you. You would share a special place in my heart with the guy spouting that SISU have invested £5M this season.
Esoterica
Well-Known Member
Well I'm being facetious of course but how long should it be til we start asking serious questions of him? If we fail to win again on Saturday because he has again not changed his negative holding midfielder tactics then it will be consecutive failures against teams in the bottom 2.
Nick
Administrator
How do you know I haven't given any constructive feedback? Is this the same as "nobody said this" when a 10 second search showed you otherwise earlier?
No, protests and action have divided massively. Much more than I could ever do with posts on here, whether you like it or not. Maybe if you close your eyes and put your fingers in your ears just in case it upsets you you won't see that. It was there for everybody to see after that protest, a fair few fans standing up and sarcastically clapping and others shouting stuff towards the protest.
That will divide much more than me and a few posts while the action and recipient of it is CCFC.
Nick
Administrator
First one speaking nonsense constantly and pretending to be in the know, second one silent until something can kick off again the same as the Trust.
skybluetony176
Well-Known Member
Don't worry. I'm going to join your ranks. Not say fuck all about anything other than those who have something to say about Tim, Joy, SISU and anyone connected to them. That'll show them.
Nick
Administrator
Yes, because you being a hero doing your DIY at home has shown everybody and changed everything hasn't it?
This is the thing, you have achieved fuck all. In fact you achieved less than the people who go and sit quietly and watch football week in, week out haven't you?
Not too sure why you are trying to preach anything like you are a hero yourself. You could be out shouting you hate Tim Fisher 24/7 if you want and all that you will have done is waste some breath and energy and Fisher would still be there.
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skybluetony176
Well-Known Member
Snigger. DIY at home, don't go week in week out and all the usual nonsense and talk about me being a hero. Unity the Nick way by attacking the man not the point. Hope you feel better now.
Nick
Administrator
Oh dear, moaning about attacking the man not the point again when you get replies in the same tone as you post?