The World Cup Thread (17 Viewers)

[Captain Dart]

I think it is time to try an alternative to Vardy now.

He did OK in the qualifiers but he if he isn't is past his peak now he will be by the time the next finals come around.

 

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[SIR ERNIE]

It's true though, people way ahead of themselves with all of the "It's coming home" nonsense

Positivity, nothing wrong with that. Don't think anyone took it too seriously.

 

[vow]

What time's kick off, CJ?

It's 3pm UK time.

 

[Otis]

Loftus Cheek has been under used in this tournament in my opinion. Forward thinking, happy to run with the ball and is so strong to go with it. Lingard and Alli are too similar and if one is ineffective so is the other so it would have been good to try and mix it up a little.

They are too similar physically too. Loftus-Cheek is much stronger.

Would definitely be expecting him to play on Saturday.

 

[Nick]

 

[I_Saw_Shaw_Score]

What’s supposedly been said!?

 

[Sick Boy]

What’s supposedly been said!?

No surrender chants, apparently.

 

[SkyblueBazza]

Don't think it's so much singing the song at the games. I think it's to the point where people are so obsessed with saying it they struggle to survive without saying it over and over and over and over and over and over.

Lot of eggs on faces

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[Covstu]

Looking back at the game tonight and Croatia stepped up to our defense massively in the second half. We looked so comfortable at the back in the first half with all the time in the world but if you watch the switch in tactic for the second half their midfielder pushed up about 15 yards right onto our back three which stopped us playing from the back. This is when we were forced to play longer balls to our small midfielders and lost possession time and time again. Tactically a great move to be honest

 

[Gazolba]

And this comment sums it up 100%


Luck of the draw. Hard group in 2014 and everyone says they're useless. Easy group and route to SF in 2018 and suddenly they're the best! A bit of realism and honestly would be nice. England are still where they've been for the past forty years, one of the top 20 teams in the world but not one of the top 10.

I'm not so sure about that, who are the 10 teams above us?
The only teams I can think of that would be certain to beat us more than we beat them would be Brazil, Germany, Italy, Spain, France and Argentina.
There are around six or so more nations we are on about the same level as.
Everyone else we would beat more often than they beat us.
So I would say we hover around 7th-12th best depending on the strength of the other teams (and us) at any particular time.

 

[Otis]

Yeah, I would say around the top 10 is about right.

 

[Otis]

So, what team tomorrow?

I would definitely give some of the rest of the squad some game time, but definitely set out to try and win the game.

Tripper will surely be out and I would drop Ashley Young.

I think we should stick with Pickford and also with Kane up front, to give him a chance of nabbing the Golden Boot.

Pickford

Stones Walker Maguire
Alexander-Arnold Rose

Loftus-Cheek Henderson Lingard

Welbeck/Rashford Kane

 

[Gazolba]

<snip>

We played well against them, but in that match-up with us they were particularly poor. Teams do have off days you know. We all know Sweden did extremely well to even qualify from the group they were in.

But just because a team plays badly in one game it doesn't mean they are a bad side. England aren't a bad side, but we looked one in that second half last night.
<snip>.

Sometimes teams don't play well because the opposition team STOPS them playing well. We stopped Sweden playing well but Croatia did the same against us in the second-half.

 

[Covstu]

I'm not so sure about that, who are the 10 teams above us?
The only teams I can think of that would be certain to beat us more than we beat them would be Brazil, Germany, Italy, Spain, France and Argentina.
There are around six or so more nations we are on about the same level as.
Everyone else we would beat more often than they beat us.
So I would say we hover around 7th-12th best depending on the strength of the other teams (and us) at any particular time.

I think we could have matched all of those teams apart from France and Brazil

 

[Sky Blue Harry H]

Sometimes teams don't play well because the opposition team STOPS them playing well. We stopped Sweden playing well but Croatia did the same against us in the second-half.

Agreed, except that is where you would like to see us adapt to solve the problem. We didn't noticably change shape or tactics when presented with their change. Again, couldn't get over the energy in e.g. Perisiic versus our flagging players. They were also more streetwise buying free kicks than our 'fair play' ethos (much as I hate seeing cheating)

 

[Gazolba]

So, what team tomorrow?

<snip>

If Kane is fit, he should play at least 45 minutes.
He deserves a chance to secure the Golden Boot, would hate to see him have to settle for the silver boot or the bronze boot (yes, they do exist).
Everyone else can switch around as far as I'm concerned.
I'd like to see at least a few new faces.
I'll be watching the 3rd place game and the final, then turning my interest to the cricket and Tour de France.

 

[Nick]

Sometimes teams don't play well because the opposition team STOPS them playing well. We stopped Sweden playing well but Croatia did the same against us in the second-half.

I don't think that was the case, we struggled to score goals from open play in previous games too.

 

[lifeskyblue]

Sometimes teams don't play well because the opposition team STOPS them playing well. We stopped Sweden playing well but Croatia did the same against us in the second-half.

Coupled to that in the first half we made Croatia look very avg by playing some quick football, having options out wide and being prepared to run beyond the strikers. We could and should have at least gone in 2 up at halftime.
Second half we increasingly dropped deep (how often do we see that) as we tried to protect a lead and tired. Croatia began to control the ball and we failed to provide an outlet. Once they scored we just didn’t have the capacity to change our style and as the momentum was with them they got stronger and stronger and we tired and started switching off.


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[Otis]

Sometimes teams don't play well because the opposition team STOPS them playing well. We stopped Sweden playing well but Croatia did the same against us in the second-half.

Agree on the Sweden one for sure. We did an excellent job of preventing them from utilising their game plan.

 

[Otis]

Very, very interesting piece here from the Beeb on the stats of England's campaign.

World Cup 2018: Were England good, lucky, or a bit of both?

 

[Otis]

England had fewer shots on target than half the teams in the competition.

11th in terms of successful passes.

8th for touches in the opposition box

Joint 24th for the amount of crosses from open play (only 3 teams with worse)

14th for shots attempted.

Harry Maguire had more touches in the opposition box than any other England player.

 

[Nick]

Very, very interesting piece here from the Beeb on the stats of England's campaign.

World Cup 2018: Were England good, lucky, or a bit of both?

That's what I was saying during games. Not creating enough, too reliant on set pieces and penalties.

Kane had one shot on target in the knockout stages, his penalty...

Think it boils down to the front 4 of Kane, Lingard, Sterling and Alli not really doing enough.

 

[Covstu]

Coupled to that in the first half we made Croatia look very avg by playing some quick football, having options out wide and being prepared to run beyond the strikers. We could and should have at least gone in 2 up at halftime.
Second half we increasingly dropped deep (how often do we see that) as we tried to protect a lead and tired. Croatia began to control the ball and we failed to provide an outlet. Once they scored we just didn’t have the capacity to change our style and as the momentum was with them they got stronger and stronger and we tired and started switching off.


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we should have killed them off in first half I agree but we didn't sit back in the second half, they stepped up and stopped us playing.

 

[Otis]

we should have killed them off in first half I agree but we didn't sit back in the second half, they stepped up and stopped us playing.

They pushed us back and that's why I was shouting at the screen asking Southgate to change it.

I think what he could have done was sacrificed Alli, who was very anonymous and put on Dier, Delph or Loftus-Cheek to counter Modric, who was afforded far too much space in that second half.

Southgate has done well, but I think he got it wrong on Wednesday with the subs and also felt he was far too loyal to some players and kept playing the same team, when changes may well have changed the dynamic for us in our favour.

Alli was poor in the tournament overall and Kane clearly wasn't getting the opportunities on goal he usually gets. As Kane is so prolific, it might well have been advisable for Southgate to focus on the tactic of feeding him as one of his number one priorities, rather than just remaining loyal to certain individuals.

 

[Covstu]

They pushed us back and that's why I was shouting at the screen asking Southgate to change it.

I think what he could have done was sacrificed Alli, who was very anonymous and put on Dier, Delph or Loftus-Cheek to counter Modric, who was afforded far too much space in that second half.

Southgate has done well, but I think he got it wrong on Wednesday with the subs and also felt he was far too loyal to some players and kept playing the same team, when changes may well have changed the dynamic for us in our favour.

Alli was poor in the tournament overall and Kane clearly wasn't getting the opportunities on goal he usually gets. As Kane is so prolific, it might well have been advisable for Southgate to focus on the tactic of feeding him as one of his number one priorities, rather than just remaining loyal to certain individuals.

Hendo got drowned out of the game due to us punting longer balls into the midfield, he needed support and Alli/Lingard wasn't that support. GS sadly didn't react and again we looked like we were playing for pens and holding our position, they were bringing on strikers at this time and when they scored it was too late to react.

shame but I think we will learn from this and be prepared for the euros.

 

[Otis]

Hendo got drowned out of the game due to us punting longer balls into the midfield, he needed support and Alli/Lingard wasn't that support. GS sadly didn't react and again we looked like we were playing for pens and holding our position, they were bringing on strikers at this time and when they scored it was too late to react.

shame but I think we will learn from this and be prepared for the euros.

I thought we now weren't allowed to play because of Brexit.

 

[Covstu]

I thought we now weren't allowed to play because of Brexit.

I think you have used that one before fella....

 

[Johnnythespider]

That's what I was saying during games. Not creating enough, too reliant on set pieces and penalties.

Kane had one shot on target in the knockout stages, his penalty...

Think it boils down to the front 4 of Kane, Lingard, Sterling and Alli not really doing enough.

That frontline is too lightweight.

 

[Otis]

I think you have used that one before fella....

Bloody old age memory loss!

 

[Otis]

That frontline is too lightweight.

Yeah, Lingard, Sterling, Alli. Lacks a bit of physical strength there and probably 3 is too much of a luxury.

Was hoping Loftus-Cheek might have got more of a look in, because he is so powerful and strong, but he wasn't great against Belgium (i think it was).

 

[tommydazzle]

Agree and that is the big thing, hopefully behind the scenes the ‘negatives’ are viewed and reviewed a lot more than the positives, so they come back stronger for the Euros.

Shame as getting that early goal and having a lot of ball in the final 3rd and that Kane chance it probably should have been finished but you play a genuine quality side they’ll make you pay.

Already seeing it on social media about Croatia 4m population argument, NZ in Rugby, Aus in Cricket & Jamaica in athletics all are/have been streets ahead with a few million, give them credit.

Not forgetting Uruguay with an even smaller population than Croatia.

 

[Nick]

Hendo got drowned out of the game due to us punting longer balls into the midfield, he needed support and Alli/Lingard wasn't that support. GS sadly didn't react and again we looked like we were playing for pens and holding our position, they were bringing on strikers at this time and when they scored it was too late to react.

shame but I think we will learn from this and be prepared for the euros.

Yep, as soon as he brought on Dier you knew it was for pens.

For all the lauding of him he tactically struggled.

 

[tommydazzle]

Best thing for me about watching England this time, after watching them for many years and being frustrated, was their commitment to playing out of defence. The England of old would never hold on to the ball and always resorted to hoofing anywhere or moving it so slow it was like death by a thousand cuts. It was like our football had never evolved - foreign coaches could never understand why we gave away the ball so cheaply. For me, I've been mightily encouraged by this - been some great high tempo passing direct from Pickford's distribution. Not sure why we stopped doing this in the second half v Croatia especially as they were chasing the game.

Southgate seems an intelligent guy and hopefully will analyse and be willing to change the things that didn't work - certainly I think his key decisions on players in the semi were poor.

 

[Otis]

Yep, as soon as he brought on Dier you knew it was for pens.

For all the lauding of him he tactically struggled.

Southgate?

Yeah, found him a little bit naive at times, but hopefully he will learn from this. There has been a lot of pleasing things about the way we have played at times and hopefully we can build on those two World Cup wins by the youngsters, with some of them now bursting through.

Foden and Sessegnon could well be the next ones to step up.

 

[Otis]

Best thing for me about watching England this time, after watching them for many years and being frustrated, was their commitment to playing out of defence. The England of old would never hold on to the ball and always resorted to hoofing anywhere or moving it so slow it was like death by a thousand cuts. It was like our football had never evolved - foreign coaches could never understand why we gave away the ball so cheaply. For me, I've been mightily encouraged by this - been some great high tempo passing direct from Pickford's distribution. Not sure why we stopped doing this in the second half v Croatia especially as they were chasing the game.

Southgate seems an intelligent guy and hopefully will analyse and be willing to change the things that didn't work - certainly I think his key decisions on players in the semi were poor.

Yep, he certainly destroyed my semi for sure.