The EU: In, out, shake it all about.... (138 Viewers)

As of right now, how are thinking of voting? In or out

  • Remain

    Votes: 23 37.1%
  • Leave

    Votes: 35 56.5%
  • Undecided

    Votes: 3 4.8%
  • Not registered or not intention to vote

    Votes: 1 1.6%

  • Total voters
    62
  • Poll closed .

skybluetony176

Well-Known Member
Tell me something, if these 'experts' are so clever, why aren't they making a fortune for themselves instead of working for someone else for a fixed wage?

The ones down the pub? It’s a bit like that bit from the Micky Flannigan stand up show where he’s down the pub talking to his mate about issues with his Mrs and his mate is giving him advice on how to sort her out and all the other divorcees were nodding in agreement.
 

Westendlad

Well-Known Member
Heard George Galloway this morning on talksport........First time i've actually heard him talk sense. Basically the horrible little losers who wish for a 2nd referendum better be aware that if that were to happen you would have thousand upon thousands of people on the streets causing mayhem.
 

Sick Boy

Super Moderator
Heard George Galloway this morning on talksport........First time i've actually heard him talk sense. Basically the horrible little losers better be aware that if that were to happen you would have thousand upon thousands of people on the streets causing mayhem.

It sounds to me that you’re becoming more and more left wing by the day. ;)
 

Sick Boy

Super Moderator
Sorry SB.....Missed a bit out lol.......Just edited !

To be fair I do agree that it would lead to a lot of anger and people becoming incredibly disillusioned with society, even more so than now. However I don’t think the government is able to deliver something that is going to work with what some have in mind.

I think the current situation is very worrying and I don’t know how the country can get through this, which is why I believe the EEA would be worth considering.
 

Westendlad

Well-Known Member
To be fair I do agree that it would lead to a lot of anger and people becoming incredibly disillusioned with society, even more so than now. However I don’t think the government is able to deliver something that is going to work with what some have in mind.

I think the current situation is very worrying and I don’t know how the country can get through this, which is why I believe the EEA would be worth considering.
- Pro-Brexit like other hard lefties
- Admiration of Galloway
- Diane Abbot fantasies

You’ll be calling people comrades by the morning
Stop it stop it i say.....I've been up 15 hrs hrs and i will not sign anything.....I wish to speak to my lawyer at once
 

Grendel

Well-Known Member
I'd rather go down on diane abbot than even think that way.....

Just picture Mr Corbyn a camper van and Dim Dianne and it’s become a reality
 

chiefdave

Well-Known Member
Heard George Galloway this morning on talksport........First time i've actually heard him talk sense. Basically the horrible little losers who wish for a 2nd referendum better be aware that if that were to happen you would have thousand upon thousands of people on the streets causing mayhem.
Surely if there is a second referendum the best idea is for everyone to get out and vote. If and when leave gets a better result than the first time round it will be hard for the remainers to claim leave is not the will of the people.
 

martcov

Well-Known Member
Heard George Galloway this morning on talksport........First time i've actually heard him talk sense. Basically the horrible little losers who wish for a 2nd referendum better be aware that if that were to happen you would have thousand upon thousands of people on the streets causing mayhem.

George Galloway on Brexit doesn’t talk sense. He doesn’t talk sense when it’s he is following Putin‘s line. As when he was trying to get Russia off the hook with the Salisbury poisonings. He can talk sense when he wants to, but he is mercenary.
 

Ian1779

Well-Known Member
Surely if there is a second referendum the best idea is for everyone to get out and vote. If and when leave gets a better result than the first time round it will be hard for the remainers to claim leave is not the will of the people.

I imagine if there is ever a people’s vote or second referendum there will be almighty battle in terms of the wording and the outcomes that can be selected.

I could see that taking a long while to get any kind of consensus on the detail.
 

martcov

Well-Known Member
Heard George Galloway this morning on talksport........First time i've actually heard him talk sense. Basically the horrible little losers who wish for a 2nd referendum better be aware that if that were to happen you would have thousand upon thousands of people on the streets causing mayhem.

Why? If the majority still want to leave, then they will vote to. If they don’t, they won’t. If remain win and thousands refuse to accept the majority vote with violence then they are making fools of themselves. Remain didn’t resort to violence.
 

Earlsdon_Skyblue1

Well-Known Member
Frankly, this conversation shows that if anyone is 'brainwashed,' it is you.

Most of my lecturers were actually on the centre-right, I had two lecturers who were on the left and neither peddled their ideologies in their lecturers or seminars. Most students are centrist and I know more people who shifted rightwards at uni than leftwards. Universities are places where you study independently and taught to engage with a variety of ideas and ideologies and come to your own conclusions.

Don't get confused by some of the more ridiculous stories from across the Atlantic in North America.

You know nothing about the university system, stop talking rubbish.

Ps. A self-professed Marxist lecturer of mine actually voted Leave. Friends of mine who are communists voted Leave too. I interacted with the idea of ‘Lexit’ (left wing exit) and ultimately disagreed with the premise of Brexit. Remain and Leave isn’t a battle between ‘left’ and ‘right’ because they’re cross-sectional — people on both sides of the political spectrum voted Remain and Leave.

About 90% of my uni were left and the lecturers were the worst of them all.

My course leader took her 12 year old daughter on a slut walk and made her carry a sign which said 'I love my twat'.

I enjoyed my uni experience but the places are badly broken.
 

Earlsdon_Skyblue1

Well-Known Member
Why? If the majority still want to leave, then they will vote to. If they don’t, they won’t. If remain win and thousands refuse to accept the majority vote with violence then they are making fools of themselves. Remain didn’t resort to violence.

No, but they've resorted to two years of project fear on steroids. Resorted to calling everyone racists, resorted to watering down Brexit so much that everyone gets disillusioned and eventually gives in.
 

Mucca Mad Boys

Well-Known Member
Heard George Galloway this morning on talksport........First time i've actually heard him talk sense. Basically the horrible little losers who wish for a 2nd referendum better be aware that if that were to happen you would have thousand upon thousands of people on the streets causing mayhem.

George Galloway also holds the opinion that May's deal is so bad, it's better to remain a full member of the EU than to leave on those terms. He's calling for a general election, which, we know a change in PM via May resigning or that of a new government won't change the negotiation position of the EU.

Listen from 8 minutes onwards, although the whole segment is interesting as I respect Galloway as an orator, without agreeing with him.

 

Mucca Mad Boys

Well-Known Member
About 90% of my uni were left and the lecturers were the worst of them all.

My course leader took her 12 year old daughter on a slut walk and made her carry a sign which said 'I love my twat'.

I enjoyed my uni experience but the places are badly broken.

What uni did you go to and what on earth did you study?
 

Earlsdon_Skyblue1

Well-Known Member
There's not a single justified argument for a second referendum. Just because it gets shouted out a lot doesn't mean anything sensible.

If Brexit did ever get overturned then it would confirm what a lot of people had thought in the first place. You're simply not allowed to leave the EU. Considering the ones on here that wax lyrical about how everyone is becoming Nazis - I'd say the above is actually exactly the kind of behaviour they'd be proud of.

Maybe as leave won, there could be another vote with a list of options to choose from, but only the winners of the 2016 referendum can vote? That can then get implemented. I guess that's fair...
 

martcov

Well-Known Member
Then your side will ignore the result again and demand a third referendum, and so on.

You'll keep demanding referendums until you get the result you want.

Really? If leave were to win now knowing what they are voting for, then the argument that nobody knew what they were voting for has gone. So it’s full speed into the brickwall.
 

martcov

Well-Known Member
There's not a single justified argument for a second referendum. Just because it gets shouted out a lot doesn't mean anything sensible.

If Brexit did ever get overturned then it would confirm what a lot of people had thought in the first place. You're simply not allowed to leave the EU. Considering the ones on here that wax lyrical about how everyone is becoming Nazis - I'd say the above is actually exactly the kind of behaviour they'd be proud of.

Maybe as leave won, there could be another vote with a list of options to choose from, but only the winners of the 2016 referendum can vote? That can then get implemented. I guess that's fair...

No it wouldn’t. It would confirm that the majority have seen the options and chosen the one they think is right... based on evidence. Hardly Nazis for having been given the chance to make an informed decision.
 

Mucca Mad Boys

Well-Known Member
There's not a single justified argument for a second referendum. Just because it gets shouted out a lot doesn't mean anything sensible.

If Brexit did ever get overturned then it would confirm what a lot of people had thought in the first place. You're simply not allowed to leave the EU. Considering the ones on here that wax lyrical about how everyone is becoming Nazis - I'd say the above is actually exactly the kind of behaviour they'd be proud of.

Maybe as leave won, there could be another vote with a list of options to choose from, but only the winners of the 2016 referendum can vote? That can then get implemented. I guess that's fair...

Answer me this.

The Brexit deal is going to be rejected in parliament. This means Brexit is on halt because it cannot be passed and therefore cannot be finalised. What is your solution? No one has answered this question.

Look, Brexiteers such as Rees-Mogg and Galloway, on the left and right of the Brexit camp reject this deal for the same reason I (a centre-left Remainer) do. May’s deal isn’t a proper Brexit because we’re tied to EU rules and regulations indefinitely. Did the British people vote to remain in all but name? No. It’s Theresa May’s largely pro-Brexit backbenchers and the DUP that is stopping this deal. Not some pro-remain conspiracy.
 

Earlsdon_Skyblue1

Well-Known Member
Answer me this.

The Brexit deal is going to be rejected in parliament. This means Brexit is on halt because it cannot be passed and therefore cannot be finalised. What is your solution? No one has answered this question.

Look, Brexiteers such as Rees-Mogg and Galloway, on the left and right of the Brexit camp reject this deal for the same reason I (a centre-left Remainer) do. May’s deal isn’t a proper Brexit because we’re tied to EU rules and regulations indefinitely. Did the British people vote to remain in all but name? No. It’s Theresa May’s largely pro-Brexit backbenchers and the DUP that is stopping this deal. Not some pro-remain conspiracy.

Yes, but that doesn't mean 'let's vote again and hopefully get remain anyway'.

Leave won the vote. The government are not honouring that with this deal. In fact, I would say 'the deal' is worse than our current arrangements with the EU.

If this does not pass through parliament, or she can not get a better deal, it should go straight to a no deal by default. Not 'let's have a chance at overturning the vote before it's been implemented'.

Most of the people that were scared of a no deal situation were remainers anyway, and that screeching has gone a long way in making this deal that's been put forward so shit 'to please everyone'.

We would have a much stronger hand if there was some unification on this rather than just stomping feet and demanding a second vote, or even worse, people like Vince Cable going to Brussels today to tell the EU not to give us any concessions.

The government have been a shambles in this, but the fact some people are still so blind when it comes to the EU and refuse to criticise them for an ounce is absolutely staggering.
 

Earlsdon_Skyblue1

Well-Known Member
No it wouldn’t. It would confirm that the majority have seen the options and chosen the one they think is right... based on evidence. Hardly Nazis for having been given the chance to make an informed decision.

No, the Nazis are the ones telling everyone else how to vote.

It is insane that the result can not be respected.
 

Mucca Mad Boys

Well-Known Member
Yes, but that doesn't mean 'let's vote again and hopefully get remain anyway'.

Leave won the vote. The government are not honouring that with this deal. In fact, I would say 'the deal' is worse than our current arrangements with the EU.

If this does not pass through parliament, or she can not get a better deal, it should go straight to a no deal by default. Not 'let's have a chance at overturning the vote before it's been implemented'.

Most of the people that were scared of a no deal situation were remainers anyway, and that screeching has gone a long way in making this deal that's been put forward so shit 'to please everyone'.

We would have a much stronger hand if there was some unification on this rather than just stomping feet and demanding a second vote, or even worse, people like Vince Cable going to Brussels today to tell the EU not to give us any concessions.

The government have been a shambles in this, but the fact some people are still so blind when it comes to the EU and refuse to criticise them for an ounce is absolutely staggering.

Jacob Rees-Mogg was right when he said the PM has lost the confidence of Parliament. The government is in a position where it cannot pass the deal of what it was elected to do. The result here is the government seeking a renewed mandate and calling a general election. However, with the timeline of the scheduled exit, that wouldn’t solve the issue completely. So, the logical conclusion would be a second referendum to sort the issue.

Leave won by a slender margin in 2016, and there was elements of deception in their campaign and promises made that couldn’t be kept. If this was an elected government, they’d be held accountable here. Regardless, in 2018 the public knows what Brexit looks like so it can either reject or accept Brexit with greater confidence than in 2016. Public opinion changes, and if it chose to change its mind in another referendum, it has the right to do so. Just as the result in 2016 was legitimate, so would the result of a second one? They’re both plebiscites. If polls are accurate, which of course they can be wrong, Remain would actually win by a larger margin than Leave did in 2016. If the public was still committed to Brexit, then so be it, the Brexiteers would be strengthened which is good for delivering Brexit. On the other hand, if the public changes its mind and rejects Brexit, it can do. The only reason to deny a referendum is people who are politically motivated Brexiteers who don’t want to risk losing. This isn’t really about following the ‘people’s will’ because if it was, the public would vote Leave again. It’s plain and simple.

Good reasons for a second referendum:

1. The government is physically incapable to deliver Brexit.
2. The 2016 referendum didn’t define what Brexit would look like. Public has the right to accept or reject the terms of any agreement.
3. Polls indicate a vote now would flip the result, by a larger margin than that ‘people’s will’ of 2016.

You’re wrong when you say there are no ‘good reasons’ for a second referendum.
 

fernandopartridge

Well-Known Member
I wasn't suggesting tarriffs would 'only' be put on EU members. The fact is a 3% tariff will be put on EU imports which is greater than the 0% currently imposed and will raise revenue for the UK treasury. How they choose to spend it is another matter.

I notice you haven't responded to the point that fewer EU nationals would qualify for "free" NHS treatment in UK hospitals?
Tariffs are irrelevant compared with non tariff barriers like licensing. The thick Brexit crowd has over simplified it again, WTO would be a distaster
 

martcov

Well-Known Member
No, the Nazis are the ones telling everyone else how to vote.

It is insane that the result can not be respected.

Who is telling everyone how to vote? There were lies told by both sides- the US backed think tanks still are providing disinformation and refusing to declare the origins of a large part of their funding. The NCA is investigating the source of the largest contribution from Banks. The methods and contents of CA and others of using social media are being scrutinised for foreign influence and the legality of Data harvesting.

Plenty of reasons to question the result without pointing out that the use of a binary option did not allow people to say what sort of leave people wanted which is why May cannot find a majority to support her version. The majority did not, and could not have voted for her deal.

I suspect that amongst the right wing supporters of leave there could well be Nazis as leave does seem to have activated the far right.
 

martcov

Well-Known Member
They're perfectly capable they just refuse to do it because they've been EU-stooges all along.

We have not had a public vote on what sort of Brexit the government should pass, or rather aim for. There are several suggestions. So how do you know what sort of deal the government is capable of getting and whether the public would back it?
 

SIR ERNIE

Well-Known Member
We have not had a public vote on what sort of Brexit the government should pass, or rather aim for. There are several suggestions. So how do you know what sort of deal the government is capable of getting and whether the public would back it?

Don’t worry mart, you’ll get your second referendum and Remain will win.
You’ll celebrate stopping Brexit but you will only have delayed it.
 

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